Philosophy Tube / Oliver Lennard / Oliver "Olly" Thorn / Abigail Thorn - Breadtube's Patrick Bateman.

[Cabbage Farmer]

Internet Famous on Internet Famous violence.
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Huh, so chyoob is getting cancelled for this take? I thought this was actually the most current school of thought in genderland, that you don't need gender dysphoria to be trans and relying on the presence of dysphoria is bigoted. And I thought "transtrender" was a bigoted concept? I mean contra did a whole video on this years ago

Perhaps so many people have started taking on a genderspecial label that the SJWs are starting to get gatekeepy about it?

 

[AssignedEva]

Chube is usually so careful to be uncontroversial I have no idea why he didn't realize he was playing with fire with his take on gender dysphoria.

I really wonder what he thought the reaction to this was going to be

He's so blasé about dropping this gender dysphoria take because he's gotten away with saying milder versions of this unchallenged. Someone on his sub pointed out this was basically said in his NHS video (I don't know if that's true or not; it was so rambling, it took me multiple sittings to get through and I think my brain has insulated itself against it as a defence mechanism).

While some of the REEE is because he's saying the quiet part out loud, I think a lot of it is also that he's undermining personal narratives - both people who genuinely have dysphoria and a bunch of regretful transitioners who tell themselves "no, I didn't make a mistake, I had dysphoria and I would have killed myself if I hadn't done this".

Huh, so chyoob is getting cancelled for this take? I thought this was actually the most current school of thought in genderland, that you don't need gender dysphoria to be trans and relying on the presence of dysphoria is bigoted. And I thought "transtrender" was a bigoted concept? I mean contra did a whole video on this years ago

Perhaps so many people have started taking on a genderspecial label that the SJWs are starting to get gatekeepy about it?

"You don't need dysphoria to be trans" is something shared in social justice spaces - partially as a cope to reassure people they're "trans enough" but also intended in the sense that you're not less trans if you don't have e.g. bottom dysphoria (i.e. someone like Choob who likes having his choob and doesn't have any inclination to get an amhole). There's also the sense that if you want to become a they/them and live outside the binary, that can be more a philosophy than a medical issue.

Very few people openly connected the dots from there. EverydayFeminism posted about this almost a decade ago, bigging up how "transmedicalisation" undermined the right to self determination and self expression blah blah blah. It's a common talking point that the diagnostic pathways for trans people result in barriers or long delays for medical treatment (which is Literally Killing Trans People). I've heard some radical firebrands argue that if we successfully "destroy gender" then gender dysphoria will stop existing.

But pretty much the only people I've seen openly state "you should be able to medically transition if you just fancy a bit of a change" are Helen and Michael Webberly, the GP and gastroenterologist couple behind GenderGP:

Unfortunately, this deliberate and erroneous definition, binding trans identity to having gender dysphoria, has had profound consequences for many trans people. NHS pathway services still require a formal diagnosis of gender dysphoria for trans people to be able to access care, excluding many trans people from their support.

Trans people, those who experience gender dysphoria and those who don’t, have a right to access gender-affirming support, and should not have to defend who they are, especially not according to arbitrary and unfounded criteria.

At GenderGP we believe that you are who you say you are – we are not the gatekeepers of your identity and experience. Instead, we are here to help you explore your identity and how you best want to express it, living as yourself without judgment or artificial obstacles.

(They would say that. They've both been struck off because they were giving out testosterone no questions asked to teenage girls, which they were making money hand over fist out of).

Ollie has gone one step further in saying that there's no such thing as gender dysphoria. I think the argument is that his reason for transition is gender euphoria, in that he wanted to transition and transitioning makes him happy. But in that sense we're back to what I've been sperging about - there's plenty of women who feel like they'd be happier with a breast augmentation, but that's not a reason for the NHS or private insurance to fund it, and maybe that's what a trans person has transitioned into; a woman who would like a boob job but isn't getting one for free. And on top of that if there's no pressing psychiatric need for HRT, then the NHS has no rationale for funding it either and gumming up their services with frequent blood tests, liver function tests etc etc.

Ollie isn't a pragmatist in this sense. Whether it's because of misplaced anger towards his doctor parents or just because he struggles with being told no (see: the failed book adaptation that I'm pretty sure is Nabokov's Ada) he can't conceptualise needing to work within the limitations of the system and is insulated from how dire the system has become (Ukranian refugees have been horrified at the NHS waiting times we put up with).

He wants something and his transition has given him a narc high - how dare you tell Ollie "no" or even "yes but we just need to make sure you actually need it first" - he wants something. Give it to him. Don't you dare question the princess, pleb cissie.

 

[Traummaschine]

While some of the REEE is because he's saying the quiet part out loud, I think a lot of it is also that he's undermining personal narratives - both people who genuinely have dysphoria and a bunch of regretful transitioners who tell themselves "no, I didn't make a mistake, I had dysphoria and I would have killed myself if I hadn't done this".

Trans activists have spent a lot of time and effort to build up "gender dysphoria" as something so innate that trannies would kill themselves if they didn't get to medically and socially change to another gender. Any tranny who says otherwise threatens to break that illusion.

Why Olly is taking this route is a good question. I think he's speaking from his own experience here. He didn't have gender dysphoria, and he's too far up his own ass to keep quiet about it. I also think he realizes that "gender dysphoria" isn't the most robust concept to rely on. It sounds more like mental illness than something inborn. And importantly for Olly, it sounds like something you can somewhat measure.

Either way I don't think he's helping his cause nor the trans activists cause with this. That being said, I'm not sure what his cause is at this point. He's got the money for any hormones or surgeries he want, and I doubt he cares about anyone else. He's content as long as he gets the attention he craves.

 

[The Jackal]

Much as Olly deserves a good shellacking, this cancellation seems to be mostly on Twitter and Reddit for now. Neither his Patreon nor YouTube subs have declined at all and if it doesn't affect his money, it's just chatter that bruises his enormous ego.

What a year for Choob: trooning out to skinwalk Contra, becoming a playwright of an (online open voted) award-winning play, a red carpet premier attended by dozens for free in NYC (max occupancy under 100), successfully demanding his paypigs pony up for the highest Patreon income he's ever had and now, his very first lefty cancellation. Bet he feels like a real influencer now.

As far as I can see most of the criticism can be placed into two categories: (1) people saying Olly is an idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about, and (2) people saying Olly is a creepy, skinwalking stalker who may or may not have raped Contra and has transitioned in order to cover his own ass and/or to indulge his narcissistic AGP fetish. He'll never get cancelled over (1). He could get cancelled over (2) if enough people jump on the bandwagon. These outrage mobs function as a kind of contagion. If enough people catch it and pile on then it starts to snowball because everyone wants to be part of the hot new virtue-signalling trend and you get a full-on cancellation.

Will it happen this time? Probably not. But the stink will linger over Olly's public presence and next time he says or does something which some SJW somewhere finds objectionable, it'll be that much easier to tip the balance.

He's got the money for any hormones or surgeries he want, and I doubt he cares about anyone else. He's content as long as he gets the attention he craves.

No attention is ever enough attention. He doesn't care about anyone else, but he wants to be worshipped as a TRA secular saint, like the Gandhi or Mandela of troons. He may even harbour political ambitions. Just look at how much he loves this shit:



He has a fantasy in his head of being the ultimate sexy trans girlboss award-winning writer, actor and champion of human rights, and he's very determined to make it happen.

(see: the failed book adaptation that I'm pretty sure is Nabokov's Ada)

On the subject of Nabokov, it occurred to me that if he is the mystery author, another possibility is that the book Olly has in mind is Pale Fire, which apparently he's also read:



It's a much better novel than Ada and perhaps more easily-adaptable, and plays with the sort of double identity themes which would appeal to a pretentious troon.

 

[Pube Dandruff]

@AssignedEva - another superb laser-tongued lashing through the Ol' Chooby façade. When you said he "... likes having his choob and doesn't have any inclination to get an amhole" it reminded me:

I've actually been anticipating a full chop for our ruddy dumpling, not for something as pedestrian as dysphoria no, but just to win at something against Contra.

Poor Tubular Balls has to hustle so hard for a fraction of the admiration and respect that flows freely for Contra and his two videos per year. What better way to have the fickle internet finally recognise that the crown belongs with the Princess and not the Mother?

 

[Tryphine]

Will it happen this time? Probably not. But the stink will linger over Olly's public presence and next time he says or does something which some SJW somewhere finds objectionable, it'll be that much easier to tip the balance.

You're spot on with this. I think the criticism of him will gradually build up until it reaches a critical mass and he gets cancelled. Most people seem to dislike him, but there aren't enough receipts on him for people to voice that. It's bad optics to speak out against a trans content creator unless he's done something problematic. The next time he offends troons, they can add "said gender dysphoria isn't real" to his list of sins. I don't think he'll be truly cancelled until people who know him start sharing personal anecdotes, though. He has to have done some grimy shit at uni.

It's a much better novel than Ada and perhaps more easily-adaptable, and plays with the sort of double identity themes which would appeal to a pretentious troon.

Do you think? Pale Fire is definitely the better novel, but it would be harder to adapt the format. I think it'd also be a harder sell to Wylie; Pale Fire would have been Nabokov's magnum opus if he hadn't written Lolita. It makes more sense to adapt Ada because it's less famous and has a more traditional format, even aside from it being Hontra's favourite book. Not that Olly would care about adapting a book well. He'd adapt anything if he thought Hontra would notice him.

 

[Nigor]

He's dug himself a hole here that he's really going to struggle to lift himself out of.

Olly appeared in this podcast recently by the way. Too cringe-inducing for me to listen to, but there may be some interesting titbits in there somewhere.

I've been getting some "highlights" of this recommended to me on Instagram for some reason, only comment I have is that at some points his agp smirk is so strong you'd swear he was having a stroke

 

[Peenix]

He takes the opportunity to bring out his gold play button apropos of a question bringing one up.
This gives some glimpses of his recording room in the reflection if you feel like being autistic and analyzing some decor.

Other than that I only bothered to watch and clip the topic I thought sounded the most interesting.

Olly on how to tell if a person is intelligent:

Tl;dw:
Spends most of the time talking about the most intelligent person he knows (An actor (feminine?) ) and how they're abusive.
His answer to the question is that if you make plans and are strategic about life you're probably intelligent.

 

[The Jackal]

You're spot on with this. I think the criticism of him will gradually build up until it reaches a critical mass and he gets cancelled. Most people seem to dislike him, but there aren't enough receipts on him for people to voice that. It's bad optics to speak out against a trans content creator unless he's done something problematic. The next time he offends troons, they can add "said gender dysphoria isn't real" to his list of sins. I don't think he'll be truly cancelled until people who know him start sharing personal anecdotes, though. He has to have done some grimy shit at uni.

What would really get the ball rolling is if Contra came out and publicly accused him of doing something shady. The fact he hasn't already is actually what makes me sceptical about the whole "Olly raped Contra" rumour - Contra loathes Olly these days, and also isn't the 'forgive and forget' type so I see no reason why he wouldn't take the opportunity to publicly point the finger. It's now confirmed that they had some kind of relationship and presumably had consensual sex. So if I had to hazard a guess, if Olly crossed a line then it's a little blurrier than that. Probably they were both wasted. Maybe Olly tried to do something Contra had told him he didn't want to do; maybe after they broke up, Olly, characteristically unable to handle rejection, tried to force himself on Contra (but was rebuffed).

The other possibility is that Olly has some kind of dirt on Contra which is forcing Contra to keep shtum.

Do you think? Pale Fire is definitely the better novel, but it would be harder to adapt the format. I think it'd also be a harder sell to Wylie; Pale Fire would have been Nabokov's magnum opus if he hadn't written Lolita. It makes more sense to adapt Ada because it's less famous and has a more traditional format, even aside from it being Hontra's favourite book. Not that Olly would care about adapting a book well. He'd adapt anything if he thought Hontra would notice him.

It would be harder if not impossible to adapt faithfully, yes, because the form the narrative takes is so elaborately contrived and allusive. Certainly impossible to make it into a commercially-viable film. But you could take the basic outline of the plot and transform it into a film, with scenes taking place in Zembla and scenes taking place in New Wye.

I think we can at least be certain that Olly would definitely not be interested in adapting Bend Sinister as he and people like him are the object of the satire.

I've been getting some "highlights" of this recommended to me on Instagram for some reason, only comment I have is that at some points his agp smirk is so strong you'd swear he was having a stroke

While we're on the subject of sexual assault and AGP smirking, when I skipped through the video a couple of days ago I landed on this :

 

[Swimminglanes]

In the third clip provided by Peenix he spends 2 minutes talking in a very surprised tone about his mother being intelligent. So all sorts of people can be intelligent he tells us.

Dear god. What an absolute arse.

 

[Dr. Butt]

The way the pro-trans types are freely discussing the Contra-versy on places like like Reddit and Twitter isn't a good sign for Ollie boy.

I think they might also be looking for a scapegoat on whom to blame Contra's unravelling since to decry his massive smack habit would be wrongthink for the baizuos.

ETA: My personal guess as to what happened between them is that Olly, having fallen in love with Contra's tube, was taking him on dates to gay/men's bars or gay men's SJW/pride events and generally happily acting like a faggot who's found a mincier faggot to be his arsewife. Olly's mask off gayness drove Contra the deluded HSTS away, and then Olly trooned out because in his mind, that solves the problem Contra had with their relationship, which was "no i don't want to be two men kissing eugh". Now, I'm not a man or a gay man and generally stay far away from both those things, so I could be completely wrong, but I'm fairly confident that as a random internet stranger, I understand both of these people's lives well enough to justify what I've typed.

 

[AirdropShitposts]

Chube is usually so careful to be uncontroversial I have no idea why he didn't realize he was playing with fire with his take on gender dysphoria.

I really wonder what he thought the reaction to this was going to be.

The man's such a narcissist and self-proclaimed intellectual I would assume he simply doesn't know this is one of the biggest and most heated disagreements in the troonsphere. There's even some troons and troon-aligned people who might agree with his position but are smart enough to see the second order effects of redefining it as not medically necessary. Public health care budgets the world over need to desperately cut costs anywhere they can, justifying not paying for things that aren't necessary is a layup. Even most "left" parties will have trouble arguing to keep it. Despite the ongoing genocide it might last longer in the United States and Canada because of how decentralized the systems are.

Oliver is simply too big brained and always correct to consider any of this.

 

[scathefire]

What would really get the ball rolling is if Contra came out and publicly accused him of doing something shady. The fact he hasn't already is actually what makes me sceptical about the whole "Olly raped Contra" rumour - Contra loathes Olly these days, and also isn't the 'forgive and forget' type so I see no reason why he wouldn't take the opportunity to publicly point the finger. It's now confirmed that they had some kind of relationship and presumably had consensual sex. So if I had to hazard a guess, if Olly crossed a line then it's a little blurrier than that. Probably they were both wasted. Maybe Olly tried to do something Contra had told him he didn't want to do; maybe after they broke up, Olly, characteristically unable to handle rejection, tried to force himself on Contra (but was rebuffed).

The rape theory is totally a schizo theory, I don't think many people outside of /tttt/ crazies actually believe that. However it would still be funny if the schizos were right and this actually happened:

 

[LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV]]

Perhaps so many people have started taking on a genderspecial label that the SJWs are starting to get gatekeepy about it?

Even in hell there are hierarchies

 

[narcissistic injury]

The rape theory is totally a schizo theory, I don't think many people outside of /tttt/ crazies actually believe that. However it would still be funny if the schizos were right and this actually happened:
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I believe it

 

[AfghanBlue]

@AssignedEva - another superb laser-tongued lashing through the Ol' Chooby façade. When you said he "... likes having his choob and doesn't have any inclination to get an amhole" it reminded me:

I've actually been anticipating a full chop for our ruddy dumpling, not for something as pedestrian as dysphoria no, but just to win at something against Contra.

Poor Tubular Balls has to hustle so hard for a fraction of the admiration and respect that flows freely for Contra and his two videos per year. What better way to have the fickle internet finally recognise that the crown belongs with the Princess and not the Mother?

It could be argued he trooned to get out of troon-related foot-in-mouth missteps before; I can see him getting the chop to double down on his trans cachet even.
Which would be fucking hillarious. He clearly thinks he knows it all, and that lifelong world of hurt would be extremely poetic.

 

[Cr1ms0n_&_C10v3r]

ETA: My personal guess as to what happened between them is that Olly, having fallen in love with Contra's tube, was taking him on dates to gay/men's bars or gay men's SJW/pride events and generally happily acting like a faggot who's found a mincier faggot to be his arsewife. Olly's mask off gayness drove Contra the deluded HSTS away, and then Olly trooned out because in his mind, that solves the problem Contra had with their relationship, which was "no i don't want to be two men kissing eugh". Now, I'm not a man or a gay man and generally stay far away from both those things, so I could be completely wrong, but I'm fairly confident that as a random internet stranger, I understand both of these people's lives well enough to justify what I've typed.

Contra is definitely not a HSTS. Contra is an AGP just like The Toob. My take on it is that for Contra, having a "Chad" partner was a great affirmation of his femininity and "womanhood". For Choob he liked being with Contra because he is a GAMP and is infatuated with him. Him trooning out completely ruined the validation Contra got for being with a "Chad" and the creepy skin walking aspect of it was just the cherry on top of the shit sundae.

 

[Kars den Karb]

No attention is ever enough attention. He doesn't care about anyone else, but he wants to be worshipped as a TRA secular saint, like the Gandhi or Mandela of troons. He may even harbour political ambitions. Just look at how much he loves this shit:

Great Scott, someone put a tiara on the Geico caveman.

Contra loathes Olly these days, and also isn't the 'forgive and forget' type so I see no reason why he wouldn't take the opportunity to publicly point the finger. It's now confirmed that they had some kind of relationship and presumably had consensual sex. So if I had to hazard a guess, if Olly crossed a line then it's a little blurrier than that. Probably they were both wasted. Maybe Olly tried to do something Contra had told him he didn't want to do; maybe after they broke up, Olly, characteristically unable to handle rejection, tried to force himself on Contra (but was rebuffed).

Contra has a pretty good reason not to publicly accuse Choob: it would damage the trans movement. Lefties never pull the trigger on one of their own right away. They save it until they need a big online pick-me-up, until their jealousy of the target's success grows too intense, or until the cancellation is already set in motion and they need to jump on the trend for clout.

Also, those alternative scenarios still meet the definition of rape in lefty world.

 

[AfghanBlue]

Great Scott, someone put a tiara on the Geico caveman.



Contra has a pretty good reason not to publicly accuse Choob: it would damage the trans movement. Lefties never pull the trigger on one of their own right away. They save it until they need a big online pick-me-up, until their jealousy of the target's success grows too intense, or until the cancellation is already set in motion and they need to jump on the trend for clout.

Also, those alternative scenarios still meet the definition of rape in lefty world.

There’s probably not that much there to pull the trigger on, outside of general relationship stuff that’s difficult to formally criminally pathologise into a meaningful complaint.

WHat contra Is doing by not saying anything, and letting worse rumours fly than what likely went down, is about the worst that could happen for tube.
It wzould be sO easy for contra to put speculation to bed with even one friendly tweet reply- but it’s not forthcoming lmao

Tube is clearly desperate for that..this and other skeletons probably explain his hyper sensitivity about the risk of cancellation

 

[DDR Yoga]

@The Jackal

Charles Kinbote of Zembla is a madman, living in a fantasy world, obsessed with another man and deluded enough to think that man is also thinking about him at all times.

Remind you of anyone?