Not Just Bikes / r/fuckcars / Urbanists / New Urbanism / Car-Free / Anti-Car - People and grifters who hate personal transport, freedom, cars, roads, suburbs, and are obsessed with city planning and urban design

Might as well add ">Europeans" to the title of the thread too at this point.


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These people have such a warped fucking view of the suburbs it's insane. I can't even fathom what reality they're living in, maybe I'm the crazy one and my own experience with suburbs is the weird one. But it's so outrageously different from everything I know that I doubt any of these people actually grew up in real suburbs.
 
Might as well add ">Europeans" to the title of the thread too at this point.




These people have such a warped fucking view of the suburbs it's insane. I can't even fathom what reality they're living in, maybe I'm the crazy one and my own experience with suburbs is the weird one. But it's so outrageously different from everything I know that I doubt any of these people actually grew up in real suburbs.
You’re talking about people whose only socialization is if they are forced almost literally at gunpoint - transit, dorms, communal shitting.

The idea of talking to someone in real life terrifies them, especially in the suburbs where they might encounter a trump voter!
 
You’re talking about people whose only socialization is if they are forced almost literally at gunpoint - transit, dorms, communal shitting.

The idea of talking to someone in real life terrifies them, especially in the suburbs where they might encounter a trump voter!
That thing about community meals made me think of something.

What if I told them that there were places in America where there are community meals, efficient living spaces, shared facilities, a diverse community, no car required, and it's paid for by those filthy suburbanites?

Would I get any volunteers?
 
Would I get any volunteers?
I seem to recall an article that unironically was suggesting that prisons (of course the perfect angelic Norwegian ones) were a model to be emulated for all - and I'm not entirely against the concept of replacing cash welfare with generic no-security "prisons" that you can leave at anytime lol.

In other news, PRERELEASE! Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters! (a)

It is amusing to peruse hackernudes (a) on it; half the (not parisians) are fuckcars pontificating:
I wonder if there have been any social studies done regarding the apparent sense of entitlement that comes with operating any kind of vehicle. E-scooters are an absolute menace nearly everywhere I've seen them being used, with their operators weaving between pedestrians and cars alike, and littering the kerb when unused. But the same is often true for bicycles, especially the fast electric kind, and it's certainly true for many cars. Only, cars have been given a special kind of kerb where they can take up space.
For some reason, we've come to accept the dominant position of cars and the absolute entitlement (and douchebaggery!) that comes with it. But we seem to be unwilling to accept the same from bikes or scooters.

I'm happy to accept the scooter menace if it means fewer cars on the road. And given how much of a nightmare traffic is in Paris, I'm surprised that Parisians don't seem to agree. But then I guess thes ones who voted against this probably feel entitled to their preferred mode of transport over all others ... ?
various responses complain it's a shared spaces issue, etc - but what's this? Later someone FROM PARIS chimes in?
Parisian here, for context I've been cycling to work for about 10 years now (before Paris transformed into a cycle-friendly city).
There are a lot of speculations and hypothesis from people who don't live in Paris and try to apply their experience in a different city to Paris, so allow me to offer the experience (obviously I'm biased) of someone living there.

The first big misconception is that this ban is only due to elderly going to vote. While the 90% percentage is indeed skewed, recent polls from before the vote showed that about 60% of the population approve of this ban. It's not as overwhelming, but still a majority.

People are fed up with rental e-scooters, but why? Not because they are littered everywhere. It's not longer the case. There are dedicated e-scooters parking spots, that are overall used properly (though they are often on the floor due to wind or being knocked down). The article talks about "tightening regulations", I'm pretty sure there are rules enforcing that.

The real reason is that anytime you see someone egregiously disregarding rules in a way that endanger others, it's more often than not a rental e-scooter, with rental e-bikes coming behind. They are perceived as dangerous, plain and simple. And it's not a lack of cycling infrastructure. While it's not up to Netherlands-level of bike-friendliness yet, it's quite good lately overall.

Now a last misconception is that this ban is bad because people will revert to cars. No they won't. In the first place, people riding rental e-scooters do not replace a car trip by a rental e-scooter trip, they don't even own one for the most part (or even have a driving license). What is replaced is a subway, bus, bike, or walking trip. Perhaps on some rare occasions a taxi/Uber. Apart from that last rare occasion, all other alternatives are MORE eco-friendly than the e-scooters.
So the problem was people all along. Someday society is going to realize that to have a nice society you need actually unreasonable punishments for certain things, because you really need to scare people into being "nice".

Later we learn that e-scooters are going to kill pubic transit (actually pretty reasonable take) and the standard replies occur (it's helping! It's providing the last mile! It's reducing the burden! Remember these e-scooter companies are mainly YC-style startups.

Ah, here we go! e-scooter problems are NOTHING until we fix cars!

> The real reason is that anytime you see someone egregiously disregarding rules in a way that endanger others, it's more often than not a rental e-scooter, with rental e-bikes coming behind. They are perceived as dangerous, plain and simple. And it's not a lack of cycling infrastructure. While it's not up to Netherlands-level of bike-friendliness yet, it's quite good lately overall.
Parisian too, but with reality in mind. We should first reduced by 95% the amount of cars and ban taxis :

Cars, Taxis and Motorcycle killed thousands of people in Paris due to there toxic gases. https://www.francebleu.fr/infos/transports/a-paris-la-pollut...

More than 95% of people killed on the road are due to Cars, Taxis, Trucks or Motorcycle. https://www.drieat.ile-de-france.developpement-durable.gouv....

More than 95% of serious injuries are caused by Cars, Taxis, Trucks or Motorcycle. https://www.onisr.securite-routiere.gouv.fr/sites/default/fi...

50% of the streets are congested with cars and car parking. https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs/article/2016/11/30/a-pa...
50% of things designed for vehicles are congested with vehicles! What do!? I absolutely love the "reduce traffic by banning taxis" considering taxis are a form of directionalized public transit by any reasonable measure (fun fact: many smaller cities could replace their entire bus system with a fleet of free government owned taxis at a significant total cost savings).

And much of the issues of safety can be fixed by properly grade-separating traffic as necessary; nobody seems to object to the trains being protected from pedestrians.

> There are a lot of speculations and hypothesis from people who don't live in Paris and try to apply their experience in a different city to Paris, so allow me to offer the experience (obviously I'm biased) of someone living there.
So you're saying, compared to other cities, Paris' problem is parisians? And e-scooter don't work because parisians can't be bothered to be civil?
As we say in France, the problem with Paris are the Parisians.
heh someone gets it
Here in Tel Aviv, they'll never get rid of them for at least one reason: they're the only form of at-least-semi-public transportation available on the weekend (Shabbat) and Jewish holidays, when the law forbids buses and trains from running.
Meet a date at 10 PM on Friday night? Scoot. Catch the Saturday 5 AM tour bus to a day-hike that's meeting on the other side of town? Scoot.

They've also helped boost demand for better bike-lane infrastructure, which has gotten much better in the last 5-10 years.

I rarely use them, but I'm glad they exist.
evil nazi carbrain ... jews confirmed?

I could go on but I wonder when this will pop up in the various fora - ah, who am I kidding it'll be ignored because Europe is perfect and only America does silly carbrain things.
 
I seem to recall an article that unironically was suggesting that prisons (of course the perfect angelic Norwegian ones) were a model to be emulated for all - and I'm not entirely against the concept of replacing cash welfare with generic no-security "prisons" that you can leave at anytime lol.

In other news, PRERELEASE! Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters! (a)

It is amusing to peruse hackernudes (a) on it; half the (not parisians) are fuckcars pontificating:
YES. France actually being slightly based for once. E-Scooters, I see these Lime shitters around all the time:
lime-electric-scooters.jpg
And these things migrate, including to where I'm at! They look like shit after a few months, prone to vandlization and scrapping for copper, and I tell you what, my urge to plink one with .22LR is real. Have not done it of course, but these pieces of shit that get used and abused, look like Cyberpunk trash, fills me with anger. And let's not get started on people watching their phones and driving, you can't tell me it doesn't happen. Also no snow ability. Why they brought these pieces of junk to Utah confuses me to no end.
 
Why they brought these pieces of junk to Utah confuses me to no end.
techbros gotta tech; those companies are so inflated on batshit venture capital it's not even funny. the idea might even have merit in some way, but it's probably not at all economical

fun photos for you:

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(I think something reasonable could be done with these pieces of shit, but mainly they seem to show that the tragedy of the commons is real and that even high-class white Utahs are one damn escooter away from turning into feral niggers, it's the "return the shopping cart" problem all over again)
 
techbros gotta tech; those companies are so inflated on batshit venture capital it's not even funny. the idea might even have merit in some way, but it's probably not at all economical

fun photos for you:

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View attachment 4966184

(I think something reasonable could be done with these pieces of shit, but mainly they seem to show that the tragedy of the commons is real and that even high-class white Utahs are one damn escooter away from turning into feral niggers, it's the "return the shopping cart" problem all over again)
Vehicles are weird here. On one hand, many people buy trucks and things that can deal with snow, even specialized vehicles for snow, like tracked Polaris's
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On the other hand, there's so many Teslas rolling around. I don't know how they make it through every winter when you're one winter away from killing your 12V in your car (like mine!)
 
What if I told them that there were places in America where there are community meals, efficient living spaces, shared facilities, a diverse community, no car required, and it's paid for by those filthy suburbanites?

Would I get any volunteers?

Like these assholes would ever enlist.

Someone advocates for shared toilets and kitchens:
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Commieblocks! Because nothing beats having to share kitchens and bathrooms with total strangers.

Now i don't mind communal living for the people who can handle it. Hell, if you can live with strangers without killing them over toilet cleaning schedules, more power to you. This asshole would never give us a choice however, it would be "resource efficiency" and "cost effectiveness" until we reach the full misery of the Soviet Union or DPRK.

Fuck these people.
 
YES. France actually being slightly based for once. E-Scooters, I see these Lime shitters around all the time:
View attachment 4966062
And these things migrate, including to where I'm at! They look like shit after a few months, prone to vandlization and scrapping for copper, and I tell you what, my urge to plink one with .22LR is real. Have not done it of course, but these pieces of shit that get used and abused, look like Cyberpunk trash, fills me with anger. And let's not get started on people watching their phones and driving, you can't tell me it doesn't happen. Also no snow ability. Why they brought these pieces of junk to Utah confuses me to no end.
i honestly do not understand at all why these things are a fucking rental service.
i could understand owning one of those, they seem easy to pick up and charge in the house overnight, then you use them like you would a bicycle, for short trips without lots of cargo. with how small they are you could even ride it to work and then just pick it up and take it inside your office with you, so no worries about it being stolen outside, could even recharge it at work (if the company is ok with you driving up their electric bill lol)

but why the fuck would you rent this shit? that just seems super inconvenient and impractical.
 
i honestly do not understand at all why these things are a thing as a fucking rental service.
i could understand owning one of those, they seem easy to pick up and charge in the house overnight, then you use them like you would a bicycle, for short trips without lots of cargo. with how small they are you could even ride it to work and then just pick it up and take it inside your office with you, so no worries about it being stolen outside, could even recharge it at work (if the company is ok with you driving up their electric bill lol)

but why the fuck would you rent this shit? that just seems super inconvenient and impractical.
Totally agree. Sharing these things is just going to wear them out, burn out the batteries, and be a general drain on City resources as they have to not only replace them, but track them down when they get stolen. That's a lot of lithium and copper scrap money in there. Not to mention people leave them in weird ass places.
 
i honestly do not understand at all why these things are a fucking rental service.
i could understand owning one of those, they seem easy to pick up and charge in the house overnight, then you use them like you would a bicycle, for short trips without lots of cargo. with how small they are you could even ride it to work and then just pick it up and take it inside your office with you, so no worries about it being stolen outside, could even recharge it at work (if the company is ok with you driving up their electric bill lol)

but why the fuck would you rent this shit? that just seems super inconvenient and impractical.
Owning scooters is impractical because they are expensive and easily stolen. They only make sense for recreational trips or for people with very short commutes whose boss is cool with them storing it at their desk and who can afford a second means of transportation for non-commute trips.

If you park one outside a store there is a very real chance that it won’t be there when you’re done shopping. Rental scooters partially avoid the theft problem because they can only be turned on from an app and they have an obvious livery that makes it clear they’re tracked. Users also don’t have to carry their scooter everywhere, they can just grab any available one.

Rental scooters are still unprofitable and dependent on VC money; thieves just destroy them for fun instead of stealing them for resale or parts. Replacing all the scooters dumped in waterways is expensive.
 
Owning scooters is impractical because they are expensive and easily stolen. They only make sense for people with very short commutes whose boss is cool with them storing it at their desk and who can afford a second means of transportation for non-commute trips.

If you park one outside a store there is a very real chance that it won’t be there when you’re done shopping. Rental scooters partially avoid the theft problem because they can only be turned on from an app and they have an obvious livery that makes it clear they’re tracked. Users also don’t have to carry their scooter everywhere, they can just grab any available one.

Rental scooters still unprofitable and dependent on VC money; thieves just destroy them for fun instead of stealing them for resale or parts. Replacing all the scooters dumped in waterways is expensive.
the theft problem also exists with bicycles (and to a lesser extend with mopeds, motorcycles, and cars of course) and people still own those, they just use locks and keys to try and deter theft

i don't know, i just find the whole idea of "just pray that there happens to be a random scooter near you whenever you want to go anywhere" to be extremely retarded. like, what are you supposed to do when there is no scooter? stay home until someone randomly decides to leave one at your door? you can't plan for anything like that, seems fucking retarded
 
the theft problem also exists with bicycles (and to a lesser extend with mopeds, motorcycles, and cars of course) and people still own those, they just use locks and keys to try and deter theft

i don't know, i just find the whole idea of "just pray that there happens to be a random scooter near you whenever you want to go anywhere" to be extremely retarded. like, what are you supposed to do when there is no scooter? stay home until someone randomly decides to leave one at your door? you can't plan for anything like that, seems fucking retarded
With a bike, they have to get through a bike lock, which yes, a 4 1/2 inch cordless grinder with a cutoff wheel
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or bolt cutters can get through, but it's better security than a scooter which is nothing.

And yes, the whole hoping a scooter is in your area is wishful thinking. At least with a Taxi or Uber, the car is there and secure, you get in and go. You're SOL if you can't find a scooter because someone dropkicked the nearest one into a garbage truck.
 
but it's better security than a scooter which is nothing.
you can just put a bike lock on the scooter and get the same level of protection
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maybe the lock has to be built a bit smaller/tighter than standard bike locks, otherwise you can simply slide the scooter out of it without even opening the lock, but in principle it's the same idea and it should work just as well as it does for bikes
 
the theft problem also exists with bicycles (and to a lesser extend with mopeds, motorcycles, and cars of course) and people still own those, they just use locks and keys to try and deter theft

i don't know, i just find the whole idea of "just pray that there happens to be a random scooter near you whenever you want to go anywhere" to be extremely retarded. like, what are you supposed to do when there is no scooter? stay home until someone randomly decides to leave one at your door? you can't plan for anything like that, seems fucking retarded
the scooter idea (and it kinda works, somewhat, if you ignore the details when looking through VC glasses) is that it replaces walking, which can be a big boon to pubic transport

like take a metro system (because bus suck, ignore bus) - here's one from 2014 from what looks to be washington, dick country:

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The colored areas (lol colored) are the places that are within half a mile walk to the train. That's about a ten minute walk; and that's pretty reasonable; most people will walk ten minutes rather than driving unless they need to carry stuff, etc, etc. Infinite scooters everywhere should in theory increase that limit to about a mile or a bit more; making the circles above much larger in area.

The PROBLEM is that if you are scootering to your metro connection, you now have to carry that damn scooter with you on the train, and that's a bitch; but if there's infinite rental scooters you just leave it at the station and grab another one at your destination.

That's the idea, anyway, and it kinda somewhat works in that people USE the stupid things, but once you remove the VC subsidy and make them mostly niggerproof, they're heavy, ungainly, expensive, and so you have to charge too much and people will stop using them.

And even if you hire people to clean them up, you still have the problem of needing it when you step outside your house/work/etc, and if the one you brought there is gone, now you're walking to the scooter collection somewhere, and maybe it would have been quicker to just walk to the bus/train/whatever anyway.

thus is summed up the idea behind the shit. maybe it could work as a subsidized part of the transit authority itself

everyone of these idiots (and us too, probably) needs to step back and realize that what we have here is a TRANSPORTATION QUESTION and people actually don't give much of a shit about what method they USE beyond getting from point A to B safely, quickly, affordably, and comfortably. Cars win on that in a bunch of cases but you can at least make the other options not suck absolute donkey dick, but that requires being turboracist nowadays apparently. Imagine subway stations that looked like Moscow's, but in Niggertown, USA:

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how fast would it deteriorate to New York? And half the damage visible here isn't even caused by feral urban yooths:

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you can just put a bike lock on the scooter and get the same level of protection
the problem really isn't securing the device, it's the amount of time you're fucking around with it

if you have a 10/20 minute bike ride, it's worth the minute or so at the end to fuck around with the lock, because in 20 minutes you've gone much further than you could have walked

but a ten minute scooter ride, if you have to fuck with a lock for a minute on one or both ends, screw it, just walk; the extra minute or so almost makes up the difference

(note, if you are a massive landwhale like the average american, this calculus may change)
 
(note, if you are a massive landwhale like the average american, this calculus may change)
these scooters look so flimsy and fragile, can they even be used by fat people at all?
i get the feeling like they might just break down under the weight, or the motor would straight up fail because it can't put out enough power to move such heavy loads
 
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As far as scooters go, I was downtown in the city (very blue of course) and in addition to seeing one tucked away under a highway ramp (underpasses are basically homeless camps now), some douchebag on one blew a stop sign right in front of me (very common occurrence, I'd imagine) and given that the downtown is on a river, I'm sure that there's a number of them sleeping in the watery abyss.

It is amusing to peruse hackernudes (a) on it; half the (not parisians) are fuckcars pontificating:

One common thread between fuckcars types/cycloids is the "cyclists dindu nuffin" train of thought. There is no group on the roadways more arrogant, least respectful of rules, and demanding that infrastructure caters to them than cyclists, bar none.

Yeah... thats a good idea.
Adam Something might be a good enough lolcow for his own thread, but this thread is mostly about awful takes on urban planning (of which Adam Something has no short supply of, but other commie stuff is off-topic).
 
you can just put a bike lock on the scooter and get the same level of protection
View attachment 4966917
maybe the lock has to be built a bit smaller/tighter than standard bike locks, otherwise you can simply slide the scooter out of it without even opening the lock, but in principle it's the same idea and it should work just as well as it does for bikes

the problem really isn't securing the device, it's the amount of time you're fucking around with it

if you have a 10/20 minute bike ride, it's worth the minute or so at the end to fuck around with the lock, because in 20 minutes you've gone much further than you could have walked

but a ten minute scooter ride, if you have to fuck with a lock for a minute on one or both ends, screw it, just walk; the extra minute or so almost makes up the difference

(note, if you are a massive landwhale like the average american, this calculus may change
Locks may be possible, but the time to lock it, coupled with the incentive for someone to break it because free copper, makes locks a poor option in the first place. The area itself needs to be low crime. And yes, the landwhale issue. A bike can support a fatty, I would see a scooter smoking at a 500 pound whale.
View attachment 4967282

Yeah... thats a good idea.
Great, now the billionaires leave, and now we're poor. Great idea
 
The average "urbanist" cannot comprehend the fact the shit they want only works in a very high trust society. They don't even know what that is. They have no concept of why niggers and white trash would ruin all this shit in seconds, they cannot handle the idea of others not playing along to their little utopian plan. You can tell from how they NEVER mention urban decay, crime and poverty affecting any of their ideas. They just do not understand this shit at all.
 
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