Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

@Overly Serious
That's another reason why I hold Star Wars over Star Trek. The technology is modular, functional, and best of all, logical. They don't adapt futuristic tech just because it looks pretty, they adapt something because it works. It really shows how a galactic civilization can function by having parts that can work on different starships.

You've got yahoos like Han Solo flying around in what is an obviously outdated junk freighter, and instead of using his cash to swap out for a newer ship, Han Solo sticks with the Falcon, because despite the fact that it's a piece of shit, it's is his piece of shit, and it's a tough old bird that's seen him through thick and thin. The Alliance starfighters similarly give off that vibe of a used car that still goes strong because of how robust and well-built they are. They've been through a lot, but they're still functional because the design is solid.

Meanwhile, the newer Imperial designs in the OT look strong, powerful. You look at a Star Destroyer and think that hulking juggernaut could probably perforate an enemy warship by ramming them with the pointy end at the front like a Roman-era Trireme. The wedge shape allows the guns near the end of the ship's "equator" to be able to fire at the enemy alongside the guns at the front. The TIEs look sleek, but deadly, while also being functional. They sport solar panels that can increase their energy output by soaking in solar energy from the sun, and the wings look like they can be swapped out, so you can take the same cockpit and slap the wings of a TIE Fighter or a TIE Interceptor on it. Even the Death Star takes more focus towards function over form, since it's basically a giant flying pillbox with a superlaser dish. It needs to be big enough to carry fighters and support craft because it's basically glorified artillery; and artillery can't function alone.

On the flipside, the Trek ships do change just for the sake of looking high-tech, changing their functional bridge controls for holograms just because holograms look cool and futuristic.

And even with the aesthetic of the Trek ships, they inspired the sleek Ipod look that Steve Jobs would later go for. Which again, shows that they take form over function. They prefer the flashy over the sturdy just because it looks high-tech. It's a pretense towards being advanced, rather than actually being advanced. Especially when computer consoles blow up in the bridge whenever something overloads or the ship gets hit. Trek tech looks advanced from the outside, but it's so poorly designed to the point where things that happen far away from the bridge can still injure or kill a bridge crew member!

Someone like Steve Jobs would probably get blacklisted by the Republic Senate and have his assets seized by the Jedi Order after more than a few people die from his design choices. If he's lucky, the worst they'll do is break up his corporate assets and sell them to other companies like the Techno Union or the Trade Federation. That's if he lived in the Republic era. If he lived in the Imperial era, he'd probably get executed by the Sith after his designs fail them. That, or he'd get thrown in a dungeon to be tortured at Palpatine's expense. With the rate that Apple products fail, Steve Jobs would get strangled by Vader faster than you can say "the Force is strong in him."

Just as a reminder, Steve Jobs didn't let his kids use Iphones or Ipads. The man knew his products were akin to drugs, and he didn't want his kids taking a proverbial sniff.
 
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I can't believe people wasted 8 hours on this terrible-ass show in the vain hope that it would get better.

The Aristocrats Modern Star Wars!

I'd like to disbelieve it, but these are people who are still consooming after over a decade of being shit on at this point.

I think Gundam is one of the few series that remains free from this curse, and it's because the authors still have some leeway and freedom in writing their stories.
Thats because Gundam is highschool weeb trash that usualy makes as much sense as any other weebstory.
But putting everyting in capsule means sometimes the weeb trash isn't completely awfule.

And I can already see the paypigs forming a line to be the first to slurp it up declare it "C+".

They'll be back when the Acolyte comes out.
They won't last that long.
They'll be back by Thanksgiving. If they had any willpower or spine it wouldn't have taken them till now

View attachment 5390463
Sorry but these uniforms are the most kino in sci-fi, beat only by the Imperial officers in Star Wars.
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You attached the wrong picture.
 
There must be a level of common standards and maturity that evolved over thousands of years. And for really good in-universe reasons.
Data transfer hardware standards are stable, too. It's standard across 30+ years between droids and computers.
 
But in TCW and Rebels, we see time and again the good guys breaking their agreements and committing war crimes because.........they're the good guys? From the Jedi ordering flamethrowers to be used against living beings, to Kenobi and Anakin faking surrenders, to the Jedi using mind-rape as a form of interrogation, to Phoenix Squadron literally carrying out terrorist attacks in the middle of civilian gatherings, to Ezra threatening to have Governor Pryce devoured by wolves, and Ahsoka implying that she used "enhanced interrogation" on Morgan Elsbeth to get her to cough up the location of the star map to Thrawn, Filoni's heroes commit so much war crimes that, if you removed the context of protagonist vs. antagonist, Filoni's heroes would wind up getting tried at the Hague. It's funny that in the post-9/11 world, Filoni's heroes have committed both terrorist actions and enhanced interrogation.
What's ironic is in the first season of TCW, Ahsoka got reprimanded by Luminara Unduli for basically threatening Nute Gunray with torture during interrogation. And in Rebels, Saw Guerrera was considered an "extremist" by the Rebel Alliance despite the attacks they had done against the Empire. In the business, we call it having your cake and eating too.
 
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I think the modern trend is simply capitalism.

Buy cheaper, easier to break, less well made, give more shekels now now now.

The general SW approach simply is realising that such a method is unsustainable. Like good old soviet refrigerator, you want it ugly, working, and long lasting.
Star Wars has capitalism up the ass. Luke's family own their private tract of land and have their own business as moisture farmers, Lando owns a private company for Tibanna gas mining centered around a floating city of his own, many enterprising self-employed warriors serve as mercenaries or lawmen for hire in the form of bounty hunters, and you've got giant space corporations with their own fleets and private armies like the Trade Federation, the Techno Union, the Banking Clan, the Corporate Alliance, and the Commerce Guild. The idea of having your own business and property is ingrained in Star Wars, to the point where the Empire nationalizing commerce in the central systems, as Biggs told Luke, was a cause for war.

I'd say Star Wars capitalism is just smarter; they build products that last because they want to keep their customers happy. Whereas modern capitalism in the real world builds cheap shit that needs to be replaced in a month because their customers are blind goobers who will always line up to buy the next product anyways.

Meanwhile, in Star Trek, they fucking hate capitalism, everything looks like an Ipod, it's designed by one group that sees themselves as visionaries and wants everyone to see things their way, (Federation Starfleet) and the stuff they make is so poorly designed that it breaks easily, like how consoles on the bridge can explode and hurt/kill bridge crew members even if the enemy hits a part of the ship that's far from the bridge. If Thrawn and Picard fought in a battle of wits, with the Enterprise vs. the Chimaera, Thrawn would end up unwittingly hospitalizing or killing half of Picard's bridge crew when the Chimaera hits parts of the Enterprise far from the bridge. By the time Picard surrenders, half his bridge crew would be in stitches or dead, and Thrawn would wonder why, since his attacks didn't even hit the bridge. I can see it now.

Pre-Battle: *Picard's Federation fleet meets Thrawn's fleet in battle, as Thrawn's fleet enroach upon Federation territory, both the Chimaera and the Enterprise single each other out and prepare to engage one-on-one as the other ships on both fleets size each other up.*

Picard: "Tell your Emperor that the Federation will never bend to his will! We are ready for friendship, with anyone, and any time, but we will not kneel before you!"

Thrawn: "That's a fool's errand, captain. My fleet has yours outgunned five-to-one, and we're not even the biggest fleet in the Empire. If you won't surrender now, then the most I can do for you is to end this quickly, to mitigate casualties and minimize suffering. ALL UNITS, FIRE AT WILL!"

Post-Battle: *The Federation fleet lies in tatters, Thrawn's fleet suffered minor casualties. The Federation flagship is hailing Thrawn for a surrender, and Thrawn's fleet halted its attack.*

Picard: "ENOUGH! We surrender. Please, let my men live. Your Emperor can have our allegiance. Just please.....no more."

Thrawn: "Glad to see you've come to your senses, captain. We welcome you into our fo-wait, why is your bridge on fire? What is half your bridge crew doing on the floor? I never hit your ship's bridge! You need to get that looked at. Who designs your ships like that?"

Picard: "The Federation Starfleet."

Thrawn: "Whoever designed those ships, you need to fire them immediately! Out of a cannon, if necessary! Even the most rag-tag rebel or pirate force we've faced doesn't design ships that badly! Here, we'll let you borrow an old Dreadnought-class cruiser from the Old Republic's former Katana fleet so you can patrol this sector for us while I sort this out!"

*Thrawn seeks out the designers for Federation Starfleet vessels and has them thrown out of an airlock.*

What's ironic is in the first season of TCW, Ahsoka got reprimanded by Luminara Unduli for basically threatening Nute Gunray with torture during interrogation. And in Rebels, Saw Guerrera was considered an "extremist" by the Rebel Alliance despite the attacks they had done against the Empire. In the business, we call it having your cake and eating too.
Ahsoka gets reprimanded, but no one holds Ki-Adi-Mundi's feet to the fire for using flamethrowers on sapient beings, nor does the Jedi Council hold Anakin and Obi-Wan responsible for breaking the flag of truce with fake surrenders, which would logically lead to Republic soldiers and Jedi in other situations getting slaughtered by the Seps when they try to surrender, because the Seps would think they're faking it.

Then you have Jedi Ezra Bridger using wolves to threaten Governor Pryce; he threatens to have the wolves eat her unless she cooperates. Even though this is the kind of shit that caused Mon Mothma to burn bridges with Saw Gerrera.

Seriously, TCW Tarkin trying to remove the Jedi from the military would've probably been for the best.

Data transfer hardware standards are stable, too. It's standard across 30+ years between droids and computers.
Way more than that. Even droids that are 4000 years old can still work with tech that comes out new, if HK-47's shenanigans in Star Wars Galaxies is any indication.

@Ghostse
Thats because Gundam is highschool weeb trash that usualy makes as much sense as any other weebstory.
But putting everyting in capsule means sometimes the weeb trash isn't completely awfule.
I disagree. Some Gundam stories like Zeta can give Game of Thrones some serious competition. And the early UC cartoons were pretty realistic and grounded in their tech.......99% of the time.

And I can already see the paypigs forming a line to be the first to slurp it up declare it "C+".
Do you expect anything less? It's a tradition at this point.
 
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What if Lucas had made Star Wars "hard SF" instead?
  • set in only one solar system
  • no hyperdrive
  • the empire the rebels fight spans the solar system
  • "slugthrowers" and high-powered lasers instead of blasters
  • no known use of "The Force"
:thinking:

It'd be something like Children of a Dead Earth, and maybe more boring than the SW of this timeline.
 
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They were banking so much on Ray Stevenson's character being able to sell a continuation to this story, then he dies. That's a real case of bad luck.

What if Lucas had made Star Wars "hard SF" instead?
  • set in only one solar system
  • no hyperdrive
  • the empire the rebels fight spans the solar system
  • "slugthrowers" and high-powered lasers instead of blasters
  • no known use of "The Force"
:thinking:

It'd be something like Children of a Dead Earth, and maybe more boring than the SW of this timeline.
Lucas didn't have the taste for that. Hard sci-fi is very limited in the amount of tropes and stories it can tell. No mystic battles, cowboy adventures, or large, galaxy-wide consequences.

Even Mass Effect and Mobile Suit Gundam had mystic stuff and energy blades.
 
Star Trek tries to appear as "hard science fiction",
TOS just adapts the kind of sci-fi stories you'd find in old pulp mags into a TV show, with the later shows (STD onwards doesn't count) staying true to that concept. The real world feasability of the science itself doesn't fucking matter so long as the tech itself was protrayed with a reasonable level of consistancy, which it was in the vast majority of cases, so this is nothing more than hollow shitflinging at another franchise born from some rivalry that was probably invented by a journalist looking to stir up shit in the same vain as Prog vs Punk back in the 70s.
That's why TLJs arching turbolasers and dropped bombs made fans angry.
The arcing turbolasers are a complete non issue and you can easily say the guns are using some kind of adjustable galven coil designed to allow ships to fire around obstacles that would otherwise be used as cover. The bombers, however, were a contrived way to make Poe look bad by having the universe contort itself into giving him the worst possible scenario to make some kind of point about how reckless heroism is bad despite his decision being immediately vindicated the moment that the chase began, though the design itself was absolutely fine considering what it was supposed to be.
 
TOS just adapts the kind of sci-fi stories you'd find in old pulp mags into a TV show, with the later shows (STD onwards doesn't count) staying true to that concept. The real world feasability of the science itself doesn't fucking matter so long as the tech itself was protrayed with a reasonable level of consistancy, which it was in the vast majority of cases, so this is nothing more than hollow shitflinging at another franchise born from some rivalry that was probably invented by a journalist looking to stir up shit in the same vain as Prog vs Punk back in the 70s.
That was not the case with Trek. At best, TOS kept it simple, since it was just Twilight Zone in space, but TNG onwards, they made it technobabble central, which just meant that the science stuff was just one big fat fucking joke of the actors just making up science babble words to explain how they fix things. As opposed to Star Wars, where we know what an ion cannon does, what a lightsaber does, what a blaster does, they don't need to invent science babble words for that, they leave that shit to Curtis Saxton or whoever's stuck writing the tech manuals for the movies.

The ideological shift in Star Trek from TNG onwards would ironically make the TOS crew be more welcome in the Star Wars universe than in the Star Trek universe. Someone like James T. Kirk and his cowboy antics would've gotten his ass chewed out by the TNG-era Federation, especially considering they've got a rat up their bums about rules like the Prime Directive, a rule that Kirk has no problem breaking. But Kirk would be welcome in the Rebel Alliance or the Republic where he'd probably become fast friends with Han Solo or Anakin Skywalker. Certainly, Kirk's more aggressive ways of negotiating would ingratiate him well with Princess Leia or Chancellor Palpatine. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he became an Alliance general or a Republic admiral rather quickly because of his aggressive tactics.

I can also imagine Spock being a very good Jedi, what with Vulcans being psychics who suppress their emotions. That's the kind of shit that would get Mace Windu and Master Yoda to ignore Spock's age and get him into the Order. It'd be fucking hilarious to see Anakin flip out when Spock gets a seat in the Jedi Council AND the Master rank before him despite spending less time than Ani as a Jedi.

The arcing turbolasers are a complete non issue and you can easily say the guns are using some kind of adjustable galven coil designed to allow ships to fire around obstacles that would otherwise be used as cover.
I'm sure they would've just used guided torpedoes for that, especially when turbolasers are supposed to be line-of-sight weapons that fire straight like lasers.

The bombers, however, were a contrived way to make Poe look bad by having the universe contort itself into giving him the worst possible scenario to make some kind of point about how reckless heroism is bad despite his decision being immediately vindicated the moment that the chase began, though the design itself was absolutely fine considering what it was supposed to be.
If those bombers were heavily-shielded, that would've made up for their large shape and their slow speed. Also, have them launch their torpedoes instead of just hovering above the enemy ship to drop bombs. They should've made these bombers into slow, but large space siege weapons, where it's clear that once they've targeted your ship and fired their torpedoes en-masse, it's game over. Almost like a ship that's designed to be an ISD-killer.
 
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Someone like James T. Kirk and his cowboy antics
Kirk wasn't particularly cowboyish save for his tendency to beam him and his command staff down to a planet, he was actually pretty reasonable and by the book in the vast majority of cases and if there's any character that would properly represent him it would likely be Rebellion-era Bail Organa, especially with how his role as a mediator between Mon Mothma and Garm Bel Iblic mirrors his relationship with Spock and McCoy; who, now that I think about it, was suspiciously absent from your post...
 
Kirk wasn't particularly cowboyish save for his tendency to beam him and his command staff down to a planet, he was actually pretty reasonable and by the book in the vast majority of cases and if there's any character that would properly represent him it would likely be Rebellion-era Bail Organa, especially with how his role as a mediator between Mon Mothma and Garm Bel Iblic mirrors his relationship with Spock and McCoy, the latter of which was suspiciously absent from your post..
I wasn't sure who to relate McCoy to. Luke Skywalker, perhaps? Since he's the heart of the team while Spock was the brains? Also, Bail's less Kirk and more Spock, he's far less daring than Kirk, and he's the ideas guy behind the Rebellion; it was his brainchild, Mon Mothma just provided the troops while Bel Iblis was supposed to provide the fleet. Ackbar and the Mon Calamari shored up that need when Bel Iblis left.
 
If those bombers were heavily-shielded, that would've made up for their large shape and their slow speed. Also, have them launch their torpedoes instead of just hovering above the enemy ship to drop bombs. They should've made these bombers into slow, but large space siege weapons, where it's clear that once they've targeted your ship and fired their torpedoes en-masse, it's game over. Almost like a ship that's designed to be an ISD-killer.
New Republic graft somehow is worse than Imperial graft. Sienar might make fragile fighters relative to old Clone Wars fighters, but they made them by the millions. Whoever makes New Republic vehicles can't even make high capacity shield emitters for their slow bombers.

Also, according to TFA, TIE fighters are future-proofed into being able to use missiles and hyperdrives. That is perfect design in a military industrial complex sense.
 
New Republic graft somehow is worse than Imperial graft. Sienar might make fragile fighters relative to old Clone Wars fighters, but they made them by the millions.
That, and they were usually flying alongside ISDs or other well-armed ships, so the TIEs only had to worry about the small fry 90% of the time. And we've seen from ANH that they have more than enough firepower to take out shielded starfighters and deal serious damage to freighters like the Millennium Falcon.

Whoever makes New Republic vehicles can't even make high capacity shield emitters for their slow bombers.
Indeed. I suppose Rian Johnson wanted to make them look rag-tag, but it just made them look stupid. Say what you will about the NR, but even I know they're not this haphazard with their pilots. Their strategy is usually the opposite; smaller numbers of elite starfighters with better hardware.

Also, according to TFA, TIE fighters are future-proofed into being able to use missiles and hyperdrives. That is perfect design in a military industrial complex sense.
First Order TIEs are practically TIE Defenders in TIE Fighter form, which makes sense considering the FO had a manpower shortage and less turf to patrol, but they had tons of resources to drill from the worlds they conquered far from NR reach. Which meant that the FO could afford to splurge more value for each pilot's craft, as opposed to the Empire where they had a long line of pilot applicants and a larger area to patrol, which meant that they had to go with larger numbers of cheaper starfighters.
 
All this talk of Thrawn and TIE Fighters reminds me of a certain gem.........

I gotta say, Zaarin had massive balls the size of Death Stars to be fighting against Vader, Thrawn AND the Emperor at the same time. Not even the Rebels would survive that triple threat from the Empire. And kudos to the game for building up a good way to kill him off with the scene where Thrawn and some dude talk about the cloaking device. Most capeshit plots would've just had Thrawn pull out a Deus Ex Machina against Zaarin from out of nowhere, kill him with it, and say something along the lines of "just as planned!"
 
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Data transfer hardware standards are stable, too. It's standard across 30+ years between droids and computers.
Yep. The Star Wars galaxy has, what, 20,000 years of recorded post-FTL history? It gets a bit fuzzy after the first 10,000 and apart from species like the Devaronians and Duro most life was still planet-bound or else belonged to species that are mostly extinct by this point but nonetheless, that's a lot of time for technology and standards to mature.

And that can explain how Star Wars seems to lean a lot more on the hardware side of things than the software as well. Imagine software and OSs aren't the rapidly-changing things they are today but are fairly stable and standards of interaction between systems very mature. You'd focus most resource and improvement on the hardware side. If file systems weren't all competing like NTFS vs FAT32 vs. Ext4 vs. ReFS vs. ZFS vs. Btrfs and not only between them but new versions every few years, then what you could do is move the implementation of them more into hardware than software and get far better performance and reliability. And you could extend that across the board. We're even seeing nascent steps towards that today - AMD have ethernet cards that largely incorporate the protocol and caching and DNS into hardware and are blisteringly fast (want a 100Gb/s ethernet card anybody?). That gives you an in-universe explanation why "hacking" isn't much of a thing and when you see people fixing things they're more usually fiddling with hardware than typing on a keyboard. Not many zero-day exploits left to find when the OS has been out for 90 years. Oh, later on some writers have tried to introduce "slicing" into the setting and there are elements of it. But really Star Wars is a "hardware" universe and it makes sense that it is, for the most part.

Look at droids - we rarely see droids downloading or transferring their minds because they're not a program that can run on generalised hardware. Their brain is their, ah, brain. C3-P0 has had his memory wiped at least twice that I can think of, three if you include the first time he's activated. But even when he can't remember anything, you turn him on and he's still 3P0, with the same personality and quirks and knowledge of over 1,000,000 forms of communication. Because whilst data may be written, "programs" (functionality) in Star Wars is largely built. When you assume highly mature and stable protocols and processes, implementing them in hardware is logically more efficient and robust than in software.
 
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That gives you an in-universe explanation why "hacking" isn't much of a thing and when you see people fixing things they're more usually fiddling with hardware than typing on a keyboard. Not many zero-day exploits left to find when the OS has been out for 90 years. Oh, later on some writers have tried to introduce "slicing" into the setting and there are elements of it. But really Star Wars is a "hardware" universe and it makes sense that it is, for the most part.
You could consider R2 "accessing" the Death Star info slicing / hacking. I know the Empire was vain, and the Death Star was a secure site, but even then, prisoner info isn't just going to be something that any grunt with access to a terminal, especially a public terminal near a docking / freight area, should be able to access, just by plugging in and pulling up the info. R2 was doing something to get that info, even if the terminology for what was happening, didn't exist until... Dark Force Rising?

That said, your explanations in universe are great, and explain why Han could punch the Falcon bulkhead, and somehow get it to fire up.

IRL in the 70s when the OT came out, computer programs were written much closer to the hardware, rather than abstracted layers and languages commonly used now, and slapping something like a CRT sometimes could (sometimes) get the picture to come in clear.
 
You could consider R2 "accessing" the Death Star info slicing / hacking. I know the Empire was vain, and the Death Star was a secure site, but even then, prisoner info isn't just going to be something that any grunt with access to a terminal, especially a public terminal near a docking / freight area, should be able to access, just by plugging in and pulling up the info. R2 was doing something to get that info, even if the terminology for what was happening, didn't exist until... Dark Force Rising?
To be fair, R2 wasn't really hacking so much as just accessing data, and most, if not all droids on the Death Star are Imperial, to the point where Stormtroopers even assumed that Artoo and Threepio were on their side when the latter pretended to be shocked from a rebel attack. The Death Star's computers were just under the working assumption that all droids that were cleared to enter were Imperial. They're practically treated as furniture, even as early as ANH.
 
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