I hate the Internet and the people who own it

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bepples said:
How is KiwiFarms "the infamous place where skids are born"? And the 'proof' they gave is just a ping check. It sounds like they're taking credit for the downtime so they can peddle whatever shitty DDoS script they grabbed from github to idiots on Telegram.
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This dude is a gigantic fucking retard and a faggot troon. There are very few hackers or even "skids" here and even of those that are, they don't generally talk much about it.

Also nobody gives a flying fuck about troonout at this point.
 
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Troon Faggotress 2 said:
Wasn't sure if this should be posted in the Facepunch/Knockout.chat thread or here because it kind of covers both, but one of their admins, a guy named Wauterboi who has had a presence on the internet for probably over 20 years at this point, has updated their thread on the whole drop Kiwifarms thing.

He's posted two images in particular that are quite curious. I can't exactly upload them via OrNET as the upload form doesn't work, but I'll post links:

1. Apparently the source of the current DDoS attack isn't troons, but is actually a DDoS provider who decided to "make an example of us" as a way to advertise their services.
2. Apparently the entire ST TLD wasn't being affected by the DDoS attacks according to an unnamed source.

I don't believe these troons for a second given their two screenshots there don't really provide any info on who is saying these things. They've censored crucial information.
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This sounds like absolute bullshit.
You don't advertize your "1337 HAXX0R ddos ski11z" by attacking an already heavily-degraded target that does not have access to industry standard tools and services.
Imagine raytheon advertizing their latest Anti Tank Guided Missle by firing at a school bus hulk in a junk yard.
 
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Legal Kiwis: Is Cogent committing a crime here, or at least some kind of civil offense? The idea that a giant-ass natural monopoly like a tier 1 ISP can lean on their customers to tell them who they can and can't do business with is bonkers to me.

Or does this fall under the general provision of "fuck you, try to sue us bitch"?
 
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Lord of the Large Pants said:
Legal Kiwis: Is Cogent committing a crime here, or at least some kind of civil offense? The idea that a giant-ass natural monopoly like a tier 1 ISP can lean on their customers to tell them who they can and can't do business with is bonkers to me.

Or does this fall under the general provision of "fuck you, try to sue us bitch"?
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I'm not a lawyer, but i'm seeing the following low hanging fruit:
1 - Breach of contract (Termination of service that does NOT violate their AUP, the failure to do due diligence on abuse reports that caused that)
2 - Defamation claiming violation of their AUP to other parties when no violation exists.
3 - Tortious interference with third parties (likely malicious)

The problem is funding the lawsuit.
I personally would take a 4 figure USD haircut to help, but that alone won't fund it.
At least 50 or 60 other kiwis of my financial disposition and furious desire to buttfuck big tech would need to be organized by Null then actually step up.
I honestly think that number of kiwis exists, but it would require formal organization.

The first step to all of this is formal assessment of feasibility of legal action.
 
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Solid Hyrax said:
That's kinda fucked and, ironically, open for abuse itself.
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Cognet is not a serious company, people only use them becasue their transit is insanely cheap.
Cognet sales are known for harassing any person whose information they were able to get, often scraped from technical websites like PeeringDB.
I'm aware of people who got called on their personal numbers by Cognet sales trying to sell their "product" despite never asking for it.

If you tell one of them to fuck off, another one will start doing the exact same thing to you. If Cognet was an European company, they would get sued into oblivion.
To top it off, they advertise themselves as a "Tier-1" network even though its a lie. They lack IPv6 peering with Hurricane Electric.
 
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dumbledore said:
Cognet is not a serious company, people only use them becasue their transit is insanely cheap.
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Their transit is insanely cheap because they're trying to "disrupt" (corpo speak for consume and control) the market. They pretty much run at cost and claw back profit through myriad supplementary charges that are never mentioned in their marketing.

They use the threat of route nulling and lawfare to extort peering agreements from other networks, which they then exploit to the hilt and manipulate with further routing bullshittery, in order to make their network a keystone that can't be routed around. Cogent is actively malicious; its corporate culture is rotten from the top down. It needs to be destroyed.
 
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I haven't experienced any interruptions on .st this whole time. Cox Communications has been incredibly based because I've been able to access the clearnet throughout many instances where others have had to use Tor.

affectionate.png

This is affectionate. You guys are awesome. 🇸🇹
 
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dumbledore said:
They lack IPv6 peering with Hurricane Electric.
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And fuck those guys, too.
Let's say I paid someone to put signs up around my town pointing out where the local tourist attractions are, then one day the company who put in those signs comes in and removes all the signs for a business they don't like, and their claim to why they're allowed to do it is that they put the signs up in the first place. It's not a perfect metaphor, but it's kind of like what Hurricane Electric is doing right now.
 
Baraka Obama said:
Want to run something by people more into this than I am:

Is it possible to front KiwiFarms on clearnet with tor routing?

For example:
  1. Create a service which forwards to known tor sites by incoming Host header, ideally via whitelist given the shit that's on tor.
  2. cname something.kiwifarms.net / st to point to this service (can't use tld for cname) in DNS
  3. Access kiwifarms via tor via easy access at something.kiwifarms.net
The tor fronting service would need to be sufficiently divorced from kiwifarms to not piss off the usual suspects but it seems like if you could make that hands off enough you could even stick that behind Cloudflare or maybe DDOSGuard to protect that origin.
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there are several problems:
1. the "frontend" or whatever you're using to masquerade as KF would need to be vouched by josh - otherwise anyone could do it and freely MITM traffic
2. if it was vouched by josh, it'd just be added to the complaint list. you'd also be losing whatever cloudflare/ddosguard accounts in the process.

routing doesn't really work like that either, if you're on clearnet you'll always need either an IPV4 or IPV6 to connect to (ideally both). they'd just concentrate on taking that down and the chain is broken. using reverse proxies achieves the same thing, the first layer goes down but it has the same effect because the backend isn't reachable.

the main problem isn't just "how to keep the site online", it's "how to keep the site online but also publicly viewable". josh could sort out 99% of the problem by making the site require a login for everything, but then growth would stagnate. plus more importantly, the site is legal and hell or high water, it's going to stay online and public - it's a matter of principle. there aren't really any hacks to get around it. the farms is in the unique position of not just being blacklisted, but also being legal, blacklisted and constantly ddos'd at the same time.
 
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skunt said:
otherwise anyone could do it and freely MITM traffic
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Appreciate the reply; I deleted my comment when I realized the proxy would need to break HTTPS and either have the origin keys or re-wrap the request thus breaking security with a MITM.

But thinking on it more I wonder if TLS SNI could be used instead of the Host header. That way it could be proxied to KiwiFarms origin via Tor without needing to compromise security. Would probably require an extension to OpenSSL to the point that it makes this non-viable.

Plus the other things you bring up, the entire service just getting blackballed by insane troons.

Edit: not an original idea

Domain fronting is a technique of replacing the desired host name in SNI with another one hosted by the same server or, more frequently, network of servers known as Content Delivery Network. When a client uses domain fronting, it replaces the server domain in SNI (unencrypted), but leaves it in the HTTP host header (which is encrypted by TLS) so that server can serve the right content. Domain fronting violates the standard defining SNI itself, so its compatibility is limited (many services check that SNI host matches the HTTP header host and reject connections with domain-fronted SNI as invalid). While domain fronting was used in the past to avoid government censorship,[8] its popularity dwindled because major cloud providers (Google, Amazon's AWS and CloudFront) explicitly prohibit it in their TOS and have technical restrictions against it.[9]
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Baraka Obama said:
Appreciate the reply; I deleted my comment when I realized the proxy would need to break HTTPS and either have the origin keys or re-wrap the request thus breaking security with a MITM.

But thinking on it more I wonder if TLS SNI could be used instead of the Host header. That way it could be proxied to KiwiFarms origin via Tor without needing to compromise security. Would probably require an extension to OpenSSL to the point that it makes this non-viable.

Plus the other things you bring up, the entire service just getting blackballed by insane troons.

Edit: not an original idea
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It wouldn't work. The client would still send a packet with kiwifarms.net in the header. That packet would get blackholed. The SNI can only be spoofed on the server side to offuscate outgoing traffic back to the client. Not really helpful if users can't reach the server in the first place.
 
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Just imagine if Dave Schaeffer got or gets his way (archive) under his terms. He's well known and hated within the industry for advocating the idea that it would be a lot cheaper, easier and better to roll all forms of information/data transfer into one type of network. (mainly the internet) Phone, internet and cable/TV. Imagine a Cognet now cutting off phone, TV and internet services all at once, threatening smaller service providers to exile and de-person or else! He sure makes a really good argument for why even normal people wouldn't want that. At least without the net becoming a protected service like phone, power etc. (which it should anyway.. net neutrality is just the start)

His actions here on this totally undermine his ideas.
 
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The newest casualty of Cloudflare fuckery: A Nigerian forum called Nairaland with over 3 million users. Tl;dr it's a general forum where Nigerians converse with each other (usually in a very humorous form of Pidgin English).

https://twitter.com/seunosewa/status/1736900974394921280 (A)
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No clue what the issue was (could be a myriad of things, my tentative guess is copyright), but still the fact that they suspended Nairaland and are stalling the lifting of the suspension even after they deleted the "offending content" is very worrisome. I think this is a case of sheer incompetence on CF's part, although the way they seem to be trending it's anyone's guess why they're doing this.
 
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