Coming Out to Friends as a Transphobe

[sperginity]

I'm in a dilemma. My daughter has a very close friend and they are inseparable. This friend was using they/them pronouns for a while. I don't know whether she still is.. but she spread the mind virus to my child (believing in gender identities, not having one). I get on well with her mother and I think she's a sane person, but I suspect her older daughter (about eighteen YO) has been feeding the family and by extension, my daughter a line of bullshit about "gender identities", etc.

Anyway, my gut feeling is that this mother has reservations... I want to just email her a PDF of "Irreversible Damage" but my wife thinks I need to be more subtle. Like, maybe go to the pub with my wife and her and her boyfriend and after a few beers I could work in the subject of sterilising children being a bit dodgy.. I dunno. I'm no good at subtlety. Thoughts?

idk if this is over with already, but you're doing this in a very round-about way, trying to improve someone elses kid so they are a better influence on your kid via the other kids parents. You should work on your kid, that is where you have the most influence. discuss the idea of troonery and figure out what she thinks, ask some questions that are hard to answer, not in a confrontational way. If I were going to say anything to the other parents, it would just be that I suspect their child is on the internet unsupervised & letting them know in case they are not okay with it. that's my 2 cents.

 

[CorporateMemphis]

idk if this is over with already, but you're doing this in a very round-about way, trying to improve someone elses kid so they are a better influence on your kid via the other kids parents. You should work on your kid, that is where you have the most influence. discuss the idea of troonery and figure out what she thinks, ask some questions that are hard to answer, not in a confrontational way. If I were going to say anything to the other parents, it would just be that I suspect their child is on the internet unsupervised & letting them know in case they are not okay with it. that's my 2 cents.

I was really worried when I first spoke to my daughter about this a few months ago. She was totally indoctrinated and said that people could have both "genders" or neither. Since then, we've spent a lot of time looking at age appropriate books explaining the human body, etc, and talking about it and she has now totally changed her tune.

The other day, I asked her how many sexes there were and she said two. I asked her if she'd accept me as a woman if I put on a dress and some make-up and she thought that was hilarious. She even brought up the topic of people using "they" pronouns and said how silly it was and how it sounds like they're a group of people! I told her I'd be very interested to hear if they start teaching her any gender ideology at school and she promised to tell me.

I'm 95% sure her friend is getting it from her 18 year old sister, who has had a "trans" friend since high school. I still haven't brought it up with her parents..

 

[Chromeo]

has a glass of milk with dinner, while drinking through a mask.

I'm focusing on the wrong thing here, I know that, but I have to ask; were they wearing a mask at dinner and drinking with a straw under the mask, moving it to sip from the glass, or were they just holding the cup up to their masked mouth and drinking through the fabric???

 

[Jaded Optimist]

drinking with a straw under the mask

This one

 

[Otterly]

Think I may have put my foot in it somewhat. Bumped into someone I haven’t see in a while in Waitrose. Asked how her kids were. She has one girl who is 12. Oh she’s really into archery.
That’s great, I said, fun hobby, bit different, wouldn’t mind trying that with mine, where do you do it blah blah.
She then says her kid is a furry and ‘exploring gender.’ Oh dear. She presses me if mine are doing similar. I say no, there’s a lot of unpleasant and negative messages to both sexes in the gender ideology and didn’t we both just spend the last few decades insisting that girls can be tomboys and boys can like ballet?
She looked like she was chewing a wasp. Another tomboy funnelled down the sacrificial pipe to moloch.
I felt very sad. She’s a nice kid, always been a tomboy, and now she’s in with furries and the gender crowd. She’s probably harrumphing to the fellow mums that otterly is a filthy TERF.

 

[Fapcop]

I was really worried when I first spoke to my daughter about this a few months ago. She was totally indoctrinated and said that people could have both "genders" or neither. Since then, we've spent a lot of time looking at age appropriate books explaining the human body, etc, and talking about it and she has now totally changed her tune.

The other day, I asked her how many sexes there were and she said two. I asked her if she'd accept me as a woman if I put on a dress and some make-up and she thought that was hilarious. She even brought up the topic of people using "they" pronouns and said how silly it was and how it sounds like they're a group of people! I told her I'd be very interested to hear if they start teaching her any gender ideology at school and she promised to tell me.

I'm 95% sure her friend is getting it from her 18 year old sister, who has had a "trans" friend since high school. I still haven't brought it up with her parents..

Bullet dodged!

You really need to have a word with her parents though.

Start out by asking whether they are aware at all about the “they” pronouns, since they may not be, and take it from there.

Parents need to have each others back regarding this nonsense. If they feel you’re overstepping, they’ll let you know.

 

[Marble Jack]

The number of parents who reframe a lack of guidance and genuine disdain towards their children as "kids exploring gender and furry fandoms" blows my mind.

 

[Convallaria majalis]

The number of parents who reframe a lack of guidance and genuine disdain towards their children as "kids exploring gender and furry fandoms" blows my mind.

There is a lot more you can do to monitor and limit what your children access online than when Gen X/Millennials were online. It's a combination of people not giving enough of a shit to do it, being ignorant about the technology they're giving their children and feeling it's more important for their kids to have the same access as their peers. The most well-balanced children I come across have limited access to the Internet, and have a variety of offline hobbies and activities.

 

[Chromeo]

There is a lot more you can do to monitor and limit what your children access online than when Gen X/Millennials were online. It's a combination of people not giving enough of a shit to do it, being ignorant about the technology they're giving their children and feeling it's more important for their kids to have the same access as their peers. The most well-balanced children I come across have limited access to the Internet, and have a variety of offline hobbies and activities.

Despite all of us adult Millennials pining for the days of the wild west internet, we all probably got way too much exposure to it at a young age and that skewed our perception on what is/isn't a healthy amount of internet to consume. I don't know a single Millennial who wouldn't say "yeah I saw some fucked up shit when I was like 11 and I'm probably worse off for it." I'm at a point where I feel like children just should not be online at all until their late teens.

 

[sperginity]

The number of parents who reframe a lack of guidance and genuine disdain towards their children as "kids exploring gender and furry fandoms" blows my mind.

i think the crunchy moms thread has some of the "radical unschoolers" whose children seem to disproportionately become furries by age 14. it is worse than neglect because they *know* their kids are accessing this shit but they think having a conversation about it undoes the harm. they egg each other on to "trust" their kids, which is dumb as hell for anyone who remembers being a kid.

Despite all of us adult Millennials pining for the days of the wild west internet, we all probably got way too much exposure to it at a young age and that skewed our perception on what is/isn't a healthy amount of internet to consume. I don't know a single Millennial who wouldn't say "yeah I saw some fucked up shit when I was like 11 and I'm probably worse off for it." I'm at a point where I feel like children just should not be online at all until their late teens.

I think some very cautious whitelisting is ok. It also seems like a good idea to tell kids about times when the internet ruined peoples lives, how little it takes for things to go badly so they have some sense of the dangers involved. before jim sterling trooned out he got sued by a crazy person for badmouthing a video game, things like that, cautionary tales.

part of me also wonders at what point the internet will be so saturated with bots (that are indistinguishable from humans) that it will be pointless to post on it anymore. it seems kind of soon? I am happy I was a part of the old internet at all, considering. it may never happen again.

 

[Georgio Cocklord]

Despite all of us adult Millennials pining for the days of the wild west internet, we all probably got way too much exposure to it at a young age and that skewed our perception on what is/isn't a healthy amount of internet to consume. I don't know a single Millennial who wouldn't say "yeah I saw some fucked up shit when I was like 11 and I'm probably worse off for it." I'm at a point where I feel like children just should not be online at all until their late teens.

I agree, I got "access" to the internet at 18, reddit and YouTube mainly and I pretty much got sucked in. It's not a healthy experience considering how addicted I am to the farms now and how I should learn to do stuff away from the computer/phone screen but it's a much better experience than being a minor on the internet. When I was a kid I was on Miniclip and Pokemon indigo, nowhere else and I never chatted with anybody, it was just playing mmos or flash games in a bubble. Now I'm trying to get away from it all with little success but it is really scary to me how many kids have unrestricted internet access considering the things you learn as an adult about opsec and other stuff.

 

[Fabio Socialist]

I agree, I got "access" to the internet at 18, reddit and YouTube mainly and I pretty much got sucked in. It's not a healthy experience considering how addicted I am to the farms now and how I should learn to do stuff away from the computer/phone screen but it's a much better experience than being a minor on the internet. When I was a kid I was on Miniclip and Pokemon indigo, nowhere else and I never chatted with anybody, it was just playing mmos or flash games in a bubble. Now I'm trying to get away from it all with little success but it is really scary to me how many kids have unrestricted internet access considering the things you learn as an adult about opsec and other stuff.

I realize it's because of my somewhat advanced age, but as I've grown fond of telling people, I didn't have access to the Internet until I was in high school (actually just after), and if I could wait that long then so can today's kids.

Thread tax: One of my two goddaughters turns 21 this year and while she does have a recent lip piercing and a sadly chronically absent father (there are all kinds of issues with him, not to mention his relationship with his ex), she seems to be turning out pretty good so far - certainly a hell of a lot more well adjusted than I was at that age. I did have a brief period of concern when she dyed her hair a bright and aposematic blue, but that was in grade school and thankfully didn't stick and she's currently a lovely young woman dating what appears to be a relatively normal young man, as far as these things go.

In retrospect, there was an amusing but 'too close for comfort' incident where we were driving around, with she and a friend in the back seat and her dad and I in front - I think this was when she was in junior high or early high school. Her friend was/is a neurotic buzzcutted vegan type, and the two of them were looking at pictures on her phone and giggling, My goddaughter comments on one picture, sounding somewhat resigned and mildly irritated: "I look like a boy." Her friend responds, in a very positive and outright enthusiastic tone: "You look like a SEXY boy!"

As it turned out, in my opinion, the picture made her look like a young Justin Bieber. There's more to this anecdote which makes it even more amusing and potentially horrifying, but I'm already doxxing myself on the minute chance that she or anyone who knows me stumbles across this thread.

 

[FiveStarAce]

I was really worried when I first spoke to my daughter about this a few months ago. She was totally indoctrinated and said that people could have both "genders" or neither. Since then, we've spent a lot of time looking at age appropriate books explaining the human body, etc, and talking about it and she has now totally changed her tune.

The other day, I asked her how many sexes there were and she said two. I asked her if she'd accept me as a woman if I put on a dress and some make-up and she thought that was hilarious. She even brought up the topic of people using "they" pronouns and said how silly it was and how it sounds like they're a group of people! I told her I'd be very interested to hear if they start teaching her any gender ideology at school and she promised to tell me.

I'm 95% sure her friend is getting it from her 18 year old sister, who has had a "trans" friend since high school. I still haven't brought it up with her parents..

I think a healthy way to go against identity politics is to Apply a "your life is what you do" philosophy. The constant arguing of what you are is bound to fry your mind, because you simply are who you are. A lot of IP scoffs at the idea of things having a "nature" and lets be real that's just wrong.

 

[Not A Bunny]

I think a healthy way to go against identity politics is to Apply a "your life is what you do" philosophy. The constant arguing of what you are is bound to fry your mind, because you simply are who you are. A lot of IP scoffs at the idea of things having a "nature" and lets be real that's just wrong.

I mean, I've been having a think about this lately, and for all the "genderspecial" content that finds its way across my path, I never really see an Asian "genderspecials". I wonder how much of that is culture, or how it follows the path of strong family structure, Tiger parenting, the constant push for identity and value through education and profession. Asian kids don't have time for navel-gazing and wondering if they're not what they were "assigned" at birth, because they have a fucking busy schedule and gender reassignment surgery would get in the way of educational excellence.

 

[CorporateMemphis]

I mean, I've been having a think about this lately, and for all the "genderspecial" content that finds its way across my path, I never really see an Asian "genderspecials". I wonder how much of that is culture, or how it follows the path of strong family structure, Tiger parenting, the constant push for identity and value through education and profession. Asian kids don't have time for navel-gazing and wondering if they're not what they were "assigned" at birth, because they have a fucking busy schedule and gender reassignment surgery would get in the way of educational excellence.

What about this psycho who murdered someone and put a cat in a blender? Tavistock alumni.. No one is immune to the indoctrination if they grow up in a culture where they're stewing in bullshit.

 

[Roland TB-303]

A lot of my friends lately have been coming out in their own ways as being sick of tranny shit and woke shit in general. It’s always the friends who are pregnant or already have young children who are questioning the most, almost like they’ve got a future to think of. The ones with doggos as surrogates for children are the most outspoken and insufferable wokescolds I’ve ever met. One of my good mates is like this and was sending me pro-abortion memes even though my wife is pregnant, I had words with him and he stopped sending me memes altogether.

Today I had lunch with a mate who out of nowhere said he’s getting sick of woke shit at work, especially the acknowledgement of land performative bullshit he has to do before every meeting. I maybe agreed with him too much, I usually keep my online opinions to myself but it was refreshing to chat in meatspace about that shit.

The wife and I also had her best friend and her husband over for dinner a few weeks ago and they went into an anti-tranny rant out of nowhere about this kid at her daughters school who identifies as a cat and whose parents are forcing the school to let them use a litterbox. Parents are up to their necks with this shit and people are starting to speak out, even in my country where we’re all apathetic about politics and don’t like to talk about it.

 

[Not A Bunny]

What about this psycho who murdered someone and put a cat in a blender? Tavistock alumni.. No one is immune to the indoctrination if they grow up in a culture where they're stewing in bullshit.

I said "I never really see". What I meant was that I don't actively seek out content, but when I find it (and admittedly, I'm probably going to start liberally using "not interested" on any media that gives me an option for this shit, there aren't really Asians. In fact, they're mostly white, some black, no Asians or Indians. The fact that there are so few makes me wonder why.

almost like they’ve got a future to think of.

In my fantasies of having kids, I often thought that if one came home with some of this social bullshit, whether it be genderspecialness or communism, or whatever, I'd have told them: "get back to me on all of this shit when you're paying a mortgage".

 

[CorporateMemphis]

I said "I never really see". What I meant was that I don't actively seek out content, but when I find it (and admittedly, I'm probably going to start liberally using "not interested" on any media that gives me an option for this shit, there aren't really Asians. In fact, they're mostly white, some black, no Asians or Indians. The fact that there are so few makes me wonder why.

You may be right. My wife thinks it's predominantly a "white person" problem. There's a mixed race boy at my daughter's school who's a "they" though.

 

[S.C.U.D.]

I'm a pussy coward who avoids personal conflict so I've never "come out" (which I interpret as sperging out and troonhate dumping) as transmisic to anyone who I'm not sure would take it well. I have over several years iced out all of the loudest pro-tranny friends and family I know, including one who unfortunately trooned out (which looking back, was not surprising). The friends and family left are ones who either just really don't talk about gender shit and all I have to do is not sperg out in front of them unsolicited and our relationship is fine, or ones who hate trannies like me. My strategy is to cautiously probe someone if I'm not sure, when we both realize the other one is sane it deepens the friendship so much. All my best friends hate trannies. I'm still friends with people who don't have strong feelings, you don't need everyone in your life to perfectly align with you politically. It's OK to let stuff go, if the other party isn't a freak or overly argumentative.

You may be right. My wife thinks it's predominantly a "white person" problem. There's a mixed race boy at my daughter's school who's a "they" though.

I would say it's a first world, white culture problem. It does predominately affect white people because that's who comprises most of first world white culture, but not all. Troon bullshit only happens when a liberal society has nothing important to worry about like war or famine, so they start worrying about dumb shit like "maybe I am I true and honest woman???"

There's also a lot of youngsters who will say they're enbie or genderfluid or queer, but then you actually see how they act around others and they're a normal heterosexual boy or girl. Actions speak louder than words.

 

[Not A Bunny]

I would say it's a first world, white culture problem. It does predominately affect white people because that's who comprises most of first world white culture, but not all. Troon bullshit only happens when a liberal society has nothing important to worry about like war or famine, so they start worrying about dumb shit like "maybe I am I true and honest woman???"

It's definitely a first world problem.

If you're someone with issues, you're not left with tons of time to wonder something as dumb as whether or not you get to play victim if you decided biology is something that you don't need to accept. Which is what this really comes down to. Transgenderism (and whatever the fuck being non-binary is; it's not really being trans, but it is deluding yourself in a similar way that you get to dictate other people's perceptions to them) is magical thinking, and at this point, no one will convince me otherwise.

To say nothing of the idea that white people are "left out" on the victim lottery. I have a theory that a lot of the "coming out as trans" thing is more that people want to be trans than they want to be the thing that they demand people say they are.

There's also a lot of youngsters who will say they're enbie or genderfluid or queer, but then you actually see how they act around others and they're a normal heterosexual boy or girl. Actions speak louder than words.

I don't have a nonbinary person in my direct personal life. I do know someone who "came out" that I used to see all the time, but not anyone I see on a regular basis. If I did, and couldn't find cause to dissociate and I were confronted about why I use the wrong pronouns, it's because I want someone to demonstrate to me that there is something genetically distinct about them that isn't based in X and Y chromosomes. If there isn't, and there's nothing but feelings involved in calling yourself that, I would suggest strongly that this person keep it to him or herself.

There is no other way I will accept the concept of "non-binary". Most people are distinctly male or distinctly female, not just in looks, but behaviors, and demanding people think they should believe it with you is narcissism.