Warhammer 40k

I've been reading the Horus Heresy recently as my first entrance into 40k stuff outside of the general internet osmosis things you pick up randomly. One of those things you can't avoid is obviously Horus betraying the Emperor and while I knew it did happen, I didn't know why or how and figured it would probably be some big tragic thing. So, I am near the beginning of Galaxy in Flames, having read the previous two and now finding out how Horus turned... is he just stupid? It's really making the Primarchs seem like a joke if the chosen favorite is like "Hey Erebus, I know you were lying to me and showing illusions and set up the circumstances that got me in this near death state but I'm just gonna do what you wanted me to anyway, lul". I understand Horus is very prideful, but I would think it would take way more than that stupid display to make him completely turn him from his centuries long duty. Maybe more will be explained as things go on, but right now it just seems like Horus is retarded and maybe he's also right because if he can turn on such a dime maybe the Emperor is also retarded for trusting him.

It sounds like I'm shitting on the books but I am quite enjoying everything around this situation, really invested in how Loken is going to have to deal with it considering his loyalty to Horus.
Horus betrayal has three motivations:
1. He is an ambitious prick and wants the Imperium for himself.
2. Being a Primarch he probably realized the vision of the future is true rather than a lie (of couse you'd think he'll realize it was the future if he lose).
3. What happens to the marines post war is a big question pretty much everyone is afraid to ask. The possible answer from pure cope "we'll get equal rights" (Ultrmarines), slight optimism "become constant garrison duty" (Death Guard), and resignation "we're all going to be culled" (World Eaters).
 
Horus betrayal has three motivations:
1. He is an ambitious prick and wants the Imperium for himself.
2. Being a Primarch he probably realized the vision of the future is true rather than a lie (of couse you'd think he'll realize it was the future if he lose).
3. What happens to the marines post war is a big question pretty much everyone is afraid to ask. The possible answer from pure cope "we'll get equal rights" (Ultrmarines), slight optimism "become constant garrison duty" (Death Guard), and resignation "we're all going to be culled" (World Eaters).

Which would have ironically been a hilariously bad move the moment the Nids and Crons show up and kick the regular humans into paste with ease.

Ragdan were one thing, Crons are a whole other level of "thing" that atomises you most of the time even with Spesh mehreens.
 
GW just absolutely nuked a huge swathe of the AOS range. Think I'm going back into hobby stasis for a while. Beasts of Chaos were one of my favorite armies.
Well on the one hand, I'm laughing pretty hard here. A Sigmarine player who bought into the starting army for Soul Wars just found the models they started on are fucking dead competitively only two editions later.

The older players only have themselves to blame. After all, they allowed this shit to happen by accepting AoS over Fantasy. Not so fun when the faction you invested into gets wiped from existence, is it? Now they might know how Tomb Kings/Bretonnians felt at the onset.

On the other hand, what a rotten hand Warcry's been dealt. Those unique Chaos warbands were one of the better designs and draws of Warcry, along with the ability to use them in AoS, and now they're gone too.
 
Yeah saw pretty much 3/4 of my Stormcast nuked. I started playing during soul wars and there are models from 2022 in that list. This will come to 40k, you fucking bet. Chaos got butchered too, there were some great models there.

You know the drill, vote with your wallet. My partner asked me because I was pissed and they said "thought you love Warhammer". My response which a load of people say I love the creation but I hate the company.
 
Where have you been they nuked all non primaris marines.
Thinking about selling my Genestealer Cult. Don't get me wrong, they're my second favorite army after Nurgle Daemons (are they still unplayable?), but I see which way the wind is blowing.
 
GW just absolutely nuked a huge swathe of the AOS range. Think I'm going back into hobby stasis for a while. Beasts of Chaos were one of my favorite armies.
I was stunned when I clicked the article and saw how much they were purging. They might as well have had a giant banner on there saying "LOL FUCK YOU STORMCAST PLAYERS, GIVE US MORE MONEY" in neon letters. Skaven getting a range refresh is the only thing that made sense considering how old those kits are.
 
Thinking about selling my Genestealer Cult. Don't get me wrong, they're my second favorite army after Nurgle Daemons (are they still unplayable?), but I see which way the wind is blowing.
Genestealer Cult might finally be getting a refresh with a kill team set but who knows if it’ll wipe out the entire range. I think in general 40k might just be seeing itself update through Kill Team units but I’m pulling this out of my ass. The latest edition is essentially using a KT template for units…

Hopefully that means a DKOK army refresh
 
Yeah saw pretty much 3/4 of my Stormcast nuked. I started playing during soul wars and there are models from 2022 in that list. This will come to 40k, you fucking bet. Chaos got butchered too, there were some great models there.

You know the drill, vote with your wallet. My partner asked me because I was pissed and they said "thought you love Warhammer". My response which a load of people say I love the creation but I hate the company.
Eventually they're going to purge the rest of the Firstborn Marines. Move them all to legends. It's literally only a matter of time. After all, "those are horus heresy models, not 40k."
 
Started painting my doomsday ark yesterday, going for an obnoxious color scheme since none of my army matches. Been getting pre-painted second hand models so my deep lore is that they're the remnants of destroyed dynasties banding together.
20240404_093041.jpg
 
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I can't express how butthurt I am. They could have added more primaris lieutenants, but this hit me harder than girly marines would have, the buttmad level is defcon 40. I am not even mad, I just don't really get excited for it anymore. It is like the Last Jedi on 40k different steroids.

Those are things you can ignore, but removing all cool armours, squads, tanks... putting that all back in is impossible.

In the end, it was not sigmarxism or trannies that did this, just GW wanting to force everyone to rebuy their marine armies. Almost poetic, and we can expect them to pull this again and again. Who knows if Primaris Lieutenants won't be all culled in 10 years for.. Secondaris Staff Sergeants?
 
Well on the one hand, I'm laughing pretty hard here. A Sigmarine player who bought into the starting army for Soul Wars just found the models they started on are fucking dead competitively only two editions later.

The older players only have themselves to blame. After all, they allowed this shit to happen by accepting AoS over Fantasy. Not so fun when the faction you invested into gets wiped from existence, is it? Now they might know how Tomb Kings/Bretonnians felt at the onset.
I'm not sure how they "allowed" AoS to happen... they didn't exactly have a choice in GW tossing out WHFB and replacing it with AoS.

That being said... no one was playing the shit or buying anything. GWs stock price started a huge climb once the generals handbook for AoS finally dropped so the game had some actual rules. "Peachy"(former GW employee turned youtuber) explained on the painting phase podcast he only ever saw the same 2 people occasionally playing WHFB at warhammer world for years. There's the rumor that supposedly the tactical space marine squad box was outselling the entire WHFB range. Of course I can't say I recall ever seeing anyone playing WHFB at the game store for years before AoS launched, and there definitely weren't people playing it after AoS even though it isn't like GW crept into their homes in the night to steal their rules(even if a couple people ree'd and torched their WHFB armies and posted pics and video on reddit).

Didn't see anyone dusting off their WHFB armies to play that during the years long lead up to the release of "The Old World". I've seen stores sell out and re-stock TOW products, seen people buy them in person, seen people show off painting some of their stuff on discord, seen various youtube channels painting the occasional tomb kings skeleton or whatever here and there to make a tutorial video for some content because GW sent them free shit or they're chasing the algorithm. But... I've never seen anyone actually playing it other than the occasional youtube video about it. If I were to guess, The Old World will be dead in a couple of years, which makes the realization that GW sent the beastman army from AoS back to the WHFB shadow realm kinda funny.
 
Just got into painting again after trying my hand at it for a brief period many years ago. I had excitedly bought a bunch of models to paint on spec after completing my very first one (a Helbrute) and finding out I was pretty decent as a straight up beginner, and thought I saw some real potential there...but then Real Life abruptly happened, and I ended up giving all of my 40k stuff away to the people at my LGS before departing for good, at least I thought at the time.

Well I am picking the hobby back up and Really looking forward to improving. After nearly finishing the painting on my first minis in years I can feel that a "level up" in skill is coming soon, so to speak...just need a bit more practice. If that makes any sense. I figured, a post in the 40k thread of my favorite forum might provide some good advice from people who are good at this.

Here is my first attempt, still a work in progress (need to finish painting a few spots and then Stormhost Silver edge highlight all the metal):
wipterminators.png

The hardest part was the captain guy and his shield:

wiptermcpt.png

shield.png

yeah pls forgive the bright flash and chipped/unfinished parts on the minis, I am still workin on these guys.

But anyway, what do you think? I don't particularly like the "grimdark" looking painting style I have naturally. I would like my minis to look a lot more vibrant and comic book/gundam-like, not like those model cars and tanks that people weather to look like real life machines. I had this exact same problem with the couple Imperial Knights and the Gorkanaut I painted last time...they just looked super dark and way too "realistic".

Thank you for any input and advice for a mini painter starting out (again)
 
p1138 said:
I'm not sure how they "allowed" AoS to happen... they didn't exactly have a choice in GW tossing out WHFB and replacing it with AoS.

That's not true - the option of boycott is always available, and a concerted and sustained effort would have certainly made GW reconsider its stance. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that GW had carefully considered and evaluated the likelihood of it before terminating the line.

The reality is that GW has a near-uncontested foothold in their industry, and 3D printing is not simple enough for casual players to adopt nor was it back then. That and with the fanbase being completely pliable as it is, they would have to relaunch 40K with the Space Marines as Pride Parade Pronoun Marines for any real damage to occur. Since relaunching Space Marines as Primaris, terminating WHFB and continuous price hikes hasn't done much, I'm sure this latest kerfuffle is barely an issue for them.
That being said... no one was playing the shit or buying anything. GWs stock price started a huge climb once the generals handbook for AoS finally dropped so the game had some actual rules. "Peachy"(former GW employee turned youtuber) explained on the painting phase podcast he only ever saw the same 2 people occasionally playing WHFB at warhammer world for years. There's the rumor that supposedly the tactical space marine squad box was outselling the entire WHFB range. Of course I can't say I recall ever seeing anyone playing WHFB at the game store for years before AoS launched, and there definitely weren't people playing it after AoS even though it isn't like GW crept into their homes in the night to steal their rules(even if a couple people ree'd and torched their WHFB armies and posted pics and video on reddit).

There was nothing stopping GW from doing more with WHFB besides nuking it from orbit, mind you. The stagnation was entirely due to them.

If I were to guess, The Old World will be dead in a couple of years, which makes the realization that GW sent the beastman army from AoS back to the WHFB shadow realm kinda funny.

As much as I like TOW, I don't think you're wrong on that one. The game still requires larger armies to be assembled than AoS, requires more complicated mixes of plastic, resin and metal, does not get prettier updated models, and intentionally has some favourite armies locked away in legacy. The only practical way it could compete would be to offer the older range at much cheaper prices than their AoS counterparts due to lower quality, but I think we all know that GW would never go for that.
 
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Finally finished Harrowmaster. God, that eventually turned into a hateread for me. Looking at it at the store I thought how bad can you make an Alpha Legion book, and turns out it's really fucking bad.

The absolute worst thing is making the Alpha Legion being insanely mary sue-ish, and I read plenty of 40k books and never felt it going that hard. Basically every one of them is stronger than Primaris (even when the entire point of the book is them reacting to the Primaris being stronger), constantly go "according to plan" and farting out plot convenient get out of jail free card. The only ones allowed to beat one in the book is another alpha legionnaire. And the book has the gall to call out the shitty writing meme for this legion as if it's subverting anything.

Then there's the plot holes and people being fucking retarded for plot sake. Like not noticing a space hulk with shiny new weapons, or that space hulk with bootstrapped engines somehow taking evasive actions. Or maybe the sassy unsactioned psyker helping the legion who can do ridiculous OP shit, with no risk to herself, but she's totally not chaos infected, because that would actually make her an interesting character. Also can't forget having Mechanicus skitarii not having chaos in their databases.

The book tries to make some moral point summarized as Imperium Bad but it's basically whatsaboutism - "yeah we murdered tens of thousands of people for nothing, but those Imperium taxes sure are bad".

The reason why the Night Lords and Space Bearers books were good is because they didn't pretend to be good guys, yet still gives the characters some humanity. This book has characters speak like it's a modern Marvel film and be cardboard cutouts.
 
So with the Beastmen being gutted from AoS, and thrown into TOW does that mean the Ogre Kingdoms are at risk too? I guess that would depend if it is true that they don't want models to cross between games.
 
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That's not true - the option of boycott is always available, and a concerted and sustained effort would have certainly made GW reconsider its stance.
Aside from the fact online boycott's rarely, if ever, work, you do realise you're arguing that the way to stop GW shitcanning WHFB due to no-one buying it, was for no-one to buy it, right?
 
That's not true - the option of boycott is always available, and a concerted and sustained effort would have certainly made GW reconsider its stance. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that GW had carefully considered and evaluated the likelihood of it before terminating the line.
AoS wasn't announced a year in advance with preorders or anything. There wasn't anything to be boycotting. WHFB already weren't buying product. Once AoS launched, GW wasn't going to reverse course and immediately bring back WHFB. AoS brought in a massive influx of new players, with a lot of the older ones initially not bothering for the first year or so till the generals handbook came out due shit like not having points, abilities based on people yelling the loudest and other dumb crap(nagash's stupid hand of dust thing is still in the game for 4.0... fucking ridiculous).
The reality is that GW has a near-uncontested foothold in their industry, and 3D printing is not simple enough for casual players to adopt nor was it back then. That and with the fanbase being completely pliable as it is, they would have to relaunch 40K with the Space Marines as Pride Parade Pronoun Marines for any real damage to occur. Since relaunching Space Marines as Primaris, terminating WHFB and continuous price hikes hasn't done much, I'm sure this latest kerfuffle is barely an issue for them.
The part about 3d printing is absolutely true. It is its own hobby and mess that most people simply don't have the time for, regardless of how many "maker" youtube channels might try to have people believe otherwise. I have a resin and FDM printer, hate using both of the damned things for a variety of reasons. We're still years off from truly plug and play 3d printing. As far as relaunching models and price hikes not doing much, I'd say their stock value shows the opposite as the skyrocket began even before covid.
There was nothing stopping GW from doing more with WHFB besides nuking it from orbit, mind you. The stagnation was entirely due to them.
There was also nothing stopping people from playing it. Buying things, sure if GW wasn't releasing anything worth a shit to consider buying that's on GW. But even with the massive gap in the market, no one really managed to truly fill that gap. Conquest, ASOIAF, Kings of War, etc. have gained some traction, but nowhere near as much as WHFB would make you think it should have been. Considering the stagnation in the player base, and lack of playing, lack of ability for GW to onboard new customers for WHFB, etc. I really think it was just a shift in the market that had occurred. Look at the other that have seen a rise and fall in popularity since, or launched since WHFB died SW Legion/Shatterpoint, x-wing, Infinity, Marvel Crisis Protocol, Malifaux, Battletech, Warmachine/Hordes, Bolt Action, it just goes on and on. None of them are/were a rank and flank game. Warlord Games has Black Powder in addition to Bolt Action, but it has a fraction of the playerbase that Bolt Action does. A lot of these are also more skirmish oriented games as well with fewer required units, not necessarily a lower bar to entry but a lower bar to owning an army and having a variety of most of the units for it.
As much as I like TOW, I don't think you're wrong on that one. The game still requires larger armies to be assembled than AoS, requires more complicated mixes of plastic, resin and metal, does not get prettier updated models, and intentionally has some favourite armies locked away in legacy. The only practical way it could compete would be to offer the older range at much cheaper prices than their AoS counterparts due to lower quality, but I think we all know that GW would never go for that.
The brettonian and tomb kings boxes for TOW are already at a much lower price point per model(even before factoring in a cost for the books and other items in those boxes) than the rest of GWs product line, and people still bitch about how expensive they are. The tomb kings box? 93 models for $290 is an average of $3.11 per model. The brettonian box is $3.35 per model, again ignoring the larger centerpiece models, books, etc. For 40k to hit that pricing, you'd need a $160 combat patrol to have 50 models in the box. Yet people were still claiming at launch that those TOW boxes were just too expensive. Even other companies aren't trying to hit anything close to $3 a model in a starter/army box.
 
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