Sony hate thread

augment said:
It depends on the project. "Just fine" doesn't work for your grand thefts, or your big ass studio movie-like non-game.
Sure, stuff like Katamari came out during the PS2 and that proved successful enough.
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Ibanez RG 350EX said:
It ought to. This idea that certain games MUST be technological showpieces and selling themselves on that is what's killing the industry.

How many of these mega-hyped games with the most cutting edge tech end up actually making the most money and having the greatest longevity? I don't think there's any particular correlation at all.

In recent years, I always think about Cyberpunk 2077. Massive, world-shattering hype and GPU-melting graphics. And after the initial clowning on it for being buggy, it just faded into total irrelevance.
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But it is their fault, isn 't it? The industry has been going on about the graphics this and photorealistic that for 20 years now. They trained the audience that getting the most real graphics was king, even if the game looks nearly colorless and ugly. Art style and art direction was mocked relentlessly as yesterday 's tech and a crutch for inferior hardware while graphics that looked bleeding edge at the time were hailed as the Holy Grail. Now, the former games are treated with love and respect even by those who never gave them a second look at the time (way too late if you ask me) and the latter look like shit.
 
Leaf Wage Slave Jr said:
The decision to switch to PC Gaming once this console Gen winds down is becoming easier and easier - least I can backlog shit on Steam then be set for however long that holds me over.
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Considering the state of gaming, not just backlog. I've been revisiting classics myself. FF9 with Moguri-Memoria has been a blast so far.
SSj_Ness said:
I'm far from an expert, but the expected Switch version of 4k is some fake 4k, upscaled or something, which supposedly while not being a true 4k display is close enough for many people.

I also think 4k probably isn't necessarily that taxing for Nintendo type games that aren't pushing realistic, top of the line graphics. If companies dial back the graphical fidelity in some other ways I'm guessing 4k is achievable. But I'm just talking out my ass based on what I hear.
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The resolution marketing really bit everyone in the ass. The notion that it's a surface area ends up flying over people's heads. A 2x square must be twice the size of a 1x square, right? Wrong, it's 4 times bigger. Apply that to the amount of pixels on screen, and you end up with a case where we're actually struggling to push around that much data in a timely fashion.

Not even big names in gaming tech are optimistic about it, since resolutions that big aren't trivial. 'member 3 years ago when there were rumors of a Switch Pro, that'd do AI upscaled 4K with DLSS? That's still not an easy proposition with current PC GPUs. Upscaling from 1080p to 4K takes up so much of the frame generation time that 30fps is the only feasible performance target. Depending on implementation, it'll probably look a tad blurry, smeary, or have other artifacts from something in the rendering pipeline on top of it (looking at you T-AA, you ghosting fuck).

Imma take simple 1080p and let my display stretch that to 2K.
 
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Does anyone know a easy way to dump ps3 isos into the ps3 hard drive via usb?
 
SSj_Ness said:
I'm far from an expert, but the expected Switch version of 4k is some fake 4k, upscaled or something, which supposedly while not being a true 4k display is close enough for many people.
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No games other than 2d stuff or ports/remasters of old stuff actually runs at native 4k, its all either upscaled from the area around 1440p or its checkerboard rendering where it renders half the pixels one frame and then the other half the next and blends the two together. The problem with dropping back to 1080p is that the abysmal 'technique' TAA looks (more) horrendous at 1080p, it only looks tolerable at 4k but even then still blurs it enough to make 4k look like 1440p.

6th gen era games still hold up very well, they could push enough polygons that you didn't have amorphous blobs representing objects anymore, but not high enough poly that textures become irrelevant. All the detail in that era comes from texture work, they give the games a handmade painted look, in the sense that every texture serves a purpose and has shading embedded in the texture, it gives the graphics a very rough and grungy feel that went away when graphics moved to PBR rendering and all the imperfections got removed from textures and put into roughness and normal maps instead. With PBR you feed everything to the lighting model instead, which unless you are path tracing everything at full res you aren't going to get as defined surfaces because of the limitations of shadow mapping. But even with raytracing now, the entire technique relies upon temporal accumulation and upscalers, so all the grunge and detail gets washed away into blur and DLSS makes everything look like clay.

In my opinion, the low resolution textures are part of the 6th gen aesthetic, those hd texture packs or remasters add too much detail to the textures and it breaks the illusion. Nothing really compares to seeing those games running on a good CRT, maybe I'm just nostalgic but I think they look so much better than games now.

Here is a random screenshot of Xenosaga 3 I took, just something about it looks so good.
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SSj_Ness said:
I can understand a few early games going hard to show off the hardware, it can make things memorable, it certainly helped FFX stand out. I think we're past that though thanks to diminishing returns.
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Exactly right. Games like Metal Gear Solid 2 or Final Fantasy X were a big deal because they represented a huge graphical leap that was evident to even the normiest normie.

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But nowadays? I'd really have to look hard to see any difference at all between eighth and ninth-gen games. And I'm a nerd who's into this kind of shit.
 
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SiccDicc said:
I wish it was standard that modern TV's had a CRT filter as an option.
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That would add input lag as it's very resources intensive. That's why you see a Game Mode option on modern TVs, where it disables a lot of image post processing and other unnecessary stuff to reduce the delay on your inputs.

TrinityReformed said:
Damn, thanks for answering though.
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If you want to emulate the old look of a CRT still, there are devices that do that while upscalling the picture to your TV like the Framemeister, but they don't come cheap. Just beware as I said, they could also add input lag to the game.
 
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SSj_Ness said:
Majora's Mask is praised now but was one of the first divisive Zelda games, and it didn't do much to push the series ahead outside of some gimmicks. Personally I like it more in theory than in actuality, the time limit shit just sours everything and I'm not alone in thinking that. I think that stuff effected sales. The fanbase is pretty finicky, Wind Waker is praised now too but all it took to turn people off at the time was the art.
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I've had the Wind Waker discussion with a lot of people. What isn't really talked about online that I've had in conversations with them is the fact that it wasn't necessarily the art but the fact that you were playing as a kid. They didn't feel as strongly in regards to Majora's Mask on this issue because it was a sequel to OOT and there is continuity there for Link to be a kid. But Wind Waker came out at the days of edge and playing as Kid Link I could see being a turn off.
 
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TrinityReformed said:
Would an OLED work close enough?
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To further elaborate. To match a 60hz CRT display you would need around 1000hz on a sample and hold display because of how the phosphors on a CRT work. Also you need a high resolution, 4k or above, 8k is the ideal, in order to properly render a simulation of the slot mask and phosphors. Simulating a CRT properly is no easy task and its also GPU intensive.

If you really want to play your games the way they were intended then try and find a CRT, they are pretty cheap if you aren't looking for one of the meme ones that all the redditors are after because of that stupid digital foundry video. The motion clarity on a good CRT is still unrivaled even compared to OLEDs.
 
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Dojima's Dragon said:
Does the same work ps2 isos converted into ps2 classics pkgs?
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You need to install the PKGs, so as long as you can find the file on MultiMan you should be good. It's been a while but I recall having trouble with converted ps2 classics because you need a license file for the PKG, I think I ended up using something else instead of converted PKGs but I cant remember.
 
Soggy Floppa said:
To further elaborate. To match a 60hz CRT display you would need around 1000hz on a sample and hold display because of how the phosphors on a CRT work. Also you need a high resolution, 4k or above, 8k is the ideal, in order to properly render a simulation of the slot mask and phosphors. Simulating a CRT properly is no easy task and its also GPU intensive.

If you really want to play your games the way they were intended then try and find a CRT, they are pretty cheap if you aren't looking for one of the meme ones that all the redditors are after because of that stupid digital foundry video. The motion clarity on a good CRT is still unrivaled even compared to OLEDs.
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Retrotink 4k is currently the gold standard if you're using actual game hardware. I'm sure someone is working on an 8k version if you thought $750 was too cheap.
 
Gamepads said:
Imma take simple 1080p and let my display stretch that to 2K.
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Sounds good. I remember the original 3DS looking adequate, and that was only 240p (though I used a real N3DSXL recently and the screen was atrocious, worse than I remembered, maybe because it was a N3DSXL instead of a basic 3DS, idk). I like good graphics as much as the next guy but I can't believe how much it matters to people. I would even watch videos on the thing when the TV was in use, no problem.

Soggy Floppa said:
Here is a random screenshot of Xenosaga 3 I took, just something about it looks so good.
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Is that a prerendered background? I love those, they always look awesome.

Ibanez RG 350EX said:
But nowadays? I'd really have to look hard to see any difference at all between eighth and ninth-gen games. And I'm a nerd who's into this kind of shit.
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Same. In fact, if you cherry pick the best looking 7th gen games such as FF13 and compare them to modern shovelware AAA games (even from the same company like, something like Forspoken) you might even think the former looks better at a glance. Here's some reddit fags talking about that idea. If it got a proper remaster it may not look too out of place in current gen.

Green Kitbash said:
I've had the Wind Waker discussion with a lot of people. What isn't really talked about online that I've had in conversations with them is the fact that it wasn't necessarily the art but the fact that you were playing as a kid. They didn't feel as strongly in regards to Majora's Mask on this issue because it was a sequel to OOT and there is continuity there for Link to be a kid. But Wind Waker came out at the days of edge and playing as Kid Link I could see being a turn off.
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Yeah, good point. The overall tone is also something to consider too, it was a lot more cartoonish, especially in its reveal trailer so there was some tonal whiplash after seeing the epic, realistic tech demo showing Adult Link vs Ganondorf.
 
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