- Joined
- Jun 18, 2019
I never circumcise my firearms. Every inch counts.
Mega Rad Gun Thread
- Thread starter The Hunter
- Start date
mister fireworks
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2022
Its so hard to kill someone with a pistol. even if you do a shit ton of target practice, no flinch, and your wrists/hands can manage a larger caliber bullet, its incredibly tough to shoot someone unless you're like a hitman or something and can get them when they arent looking. cant believe im saying this but @Null you should get a vest and plates and a bullet proof hat like 50 cent lol. Its funny but im not really joking. Keep a rifle in the car and a shotgun at home. No signs warning people that you own a gun. CCTV that isnt connected to a cloud. Owning your own business causes your mind to really wander about the fun stuff you could do with home security. If i had the money and the time, I would have a fully pressurized system which, if breached, would trigger discharge saran gas.
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2016
it's already been mentioned that 6.5 Creedmoor is not 6.8x51mm CC (.277 Fury), and while many have pointed out various options, the reality is that @Null is a target for unhinged retribution and at least one of those unhinged people may have enough wherewithal attack him while wearing armor and carrying a reasonably capable fighting rifle.
from a legal perspective, at the federal level (18 USC sec. 921(a)(17)) it is legal to purchase, sell, possess, and use armor piercing ammunition. it is forbidden to manufacture or import them without specific permits (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7)). some ammunition is defined as armor piercing by legislative fiat, regardless of their actual armor piercing capabilities, and other ammunition is defined as armor piercing based on their specific construction, regardless of their actual armor piercing capabilities. armor piercing handgun ammunition is illegal to purchase, sell, possess, or use.
note that some states might have some specific legislation regarding ammunition types and their possession or usage, as well as legal firearms configurations or carry requirements (permits, caliber, et c). always consult an attorney in your state for specifics and advice. sometimes states have no additional laws or very minor changes (NV, AK, et c) while others are quite onerous (NY, CA, HI, et c).
manufacturers (Nammo for example, who manufactures M993) are forbidden from selling to individuals or delivering the ammunition to individuals. they can only sell to dealers or agencies. dealers cannot sell ammunition except to agencies or another authorized individual (dealer, collector), and the transfer is treated like any other firearms sale with a record entry in the FFL's paperwork. notably a licensed collector can purchase or possess armor piercing ammunition following the same rules as a dealer and making an entry in their documentation on both acquisition and it's disposition if shot or transferred or destroyed.
the old school cheap AP solution is to ensure your engagement range was under 20 meters and have an AKM with M43 (or Norinco copper washed steel core from a spam can or yellow cardboard box. a magazine shot on target inside 20 meters will 100% break apart and penetrate Level IV armor. the NIJ test is for single shots and slow fire only. because OA made a 7.62x39mm handgun, M43 and others in that vein are now "handgun" armor piercing cartridges as defined in the 1994 Clinton Crime Bill. this also includes 7.62x51mm/.308 because handguns for that cartridge exist.
the only ammunition currently defined with a specific exemption from armor piercing regulation is SS109 projectiles, the M855 cartridge, and the M2 .30-06 cartridge. these are the safest to acquire and use as armor piercing ammunition. M855 is not actually armor-piercing but it is light-barrier penetrating.
i have worn and shot at people who have worn body armor, and i sell body armor as well these days, even been shot while wearing armor. if your opponent is wearing legit rated NIJ IV plates and not a knock off or doing doubled up NIJ III plates, then your options are extremely high powered initial shot (.300 Win Mag or .50 BMG for example) or repeat hits with appropriate AP ammunition (.30-06 M2 AP). alternately M855 can work against level IV armor but it would take half or more of a magazine at close range from a carbine barrel to achieve it, closer to a full 30 round magazine if they have even a little barrier in addition to the bare plate, like a soft armored carrier.
in other experiences, a rifled 1oz slug will dump enough energy to severely discourage an armored person from standing up, often breaking bones and buying a second or two enough to kill with head or groin shots. this is incredibly stressful and messy and if you're doing this then things are very bad - the one time i was in this situation was using an Benelli M2 with a slug, then 000 buck in the rest of the tube.
in more salient experience that i've had multiple times, M855 takes about a half mag from inside 100 meters from an M4A1 to overcome 6B5 vests worn by iraqi republican guards they had some homegrown hardened steel plates with some kind of epoxied nylon/kevlar like material inside (about 5mm thick, front and back). M855A1 is a significant improvement over M855 and i kinda wish i had it back then. another good "AR" round for soviet surplus armor is just straight up M80 ball from a short rifle; G3K and shorty FALs like the OSW are very mean fighting rifles that have a lot of energy to dump, you can get a sear for them with enough cash, and NIJ IV plates aren't going to eat 20+ rounds of M80 without cracking open like a baked crab.
from a legal perspective, at the federal level (18 USC sec. 921(a)(17)) it is legal to purchase, sell, possess, and use armor piercing ammunition. it is forbidden to manufacture or import them without specific permits (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7)). some ammunition is defined as armor piercing by legislative fiat, regardless of their actual armor piercing capabilities, and other ammunition is defined as armor piercing based on their specific construction, regardless of their actual armor piercing capabilities. armor piercing handgun ammunition is illegal to purchase, sell, possess, or use.
note that some states might have some specific legislation regarding ammunition types and their possession or usage, as well as legal firearms configurations or carry requirements (permits, caliber, et c). always consult an attorney in your state for specifics and advice. sometimes states have no additional laws or very minor changes (NV, AK, et c) while others are quite onerous (NY, CA, HI, et c).
manufacturers (Nammo for example, who manufactures M993) are forbidden from selling to individuals or delivering the ammunition to individuals. they can only sell to dealers or agencies. dealers cannot sell ammunition except to agencies or another authorized individual (dealer, collector), and the transfer is treated like any other firearms sale with a record entry in the FFL's paperwork. notably a licensed collector can purchase or possess armor piercing ammunition following the same rules as a dealer and making an entry in their documentation on both acquisition and it's disposition if shot or transferred or destroyed.
the old school cheap AP solution is to ensure your engagement range was under 20 meters and have an AKM with M43 (or Norinco copper washed steel core from a spam can or yellow cardboard box. a magazine shot on target inside 20 meters will 100% break apart and penetrate Level IV armor. the NIJ test is for single shots and slow fire only. because OA made a 7.62x39mm handgun, M43 and others in that vein are now "handgun" armor piercing cartridges as defined in the 1994 Clinton Crime Bill. this also includes 7.62x51mm/.308 because handguns for that cartridge exist.
the only ammunition currently defined with a specific exemption from armor piercing regulation is SS109 projectiles, the M855 cartridge, and the M2 .30-06 cartridge. these are the safest to acquire and use as armor piercing ammunition. M855 is not actually armor-piercing but it is light-barrier penetrating.
i have worn and shot at people who have worn body armor, and i sell body armor as well these days, even been shot while wearing armor. if your opponent is wearing legit rated NIJ IV plates and not a knock off or doing doubled up NIJ III plates, then your options are extremely high powered initial shot (.300 Win Mag or .50 BMG for example) or repeat hits with appropriate AP ammunition (.30-06 M2 AP). alternately M855 can work against level IV armor but it would take half or more of a magazine at close range from a carbine barrel to achieve it, closer to a full 30 round magazine if they have even a little barrier in addition to the bare plate, like a soft armored carrier.
in other experiences, a rifled 1oz slug will dump enough energy to severely discourage an armored person from standing up, often breaking bones and buying a second or two enough to kill with head or groin shots. this is incredibly stressful and messy and if you're doing this then things are very bad - the one time i was in this situation was using an Benelli M2 with a slug, then 000 buck in the rest of the tube.
in more salient experience that i've had multiple times, M855 takes about a half mag from inside 100 meters from an M4A1 to overcome 6B5 vests worn by iraqi republican guards they had some homegrown hardened steel plates with some kind of epoxied nylon/kevlar like material inside (about 5mm thick, front and back). M855A1 is a significant improvement over M855 and i kinda wish i had it back then. another good "AR" round for soviet surplus armor is just straight up M80 ball from a short rifle; G3K and shorty FALs like the OSW are very mean fighting rifles that have a lot of energy to dump, you can get a sear for them with enough cash, and NIJ IV plates aren't going to eat 20+ rounds of M80 without cracking open like a baked crab.
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74164978231
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Aug 4, 2022
You wont be penetrating their armor with 5.56 ap(assuming you had some stuff its very rare) as legit lvl4 armor is rated to stop it.
No. Lvl4 body armor is rated to stop 30-06 AP at least 2 or 3 times.
If armor is a consideration, aim right for the wait belt. No lvl4 armor there and taking a 5.56mm round from self defense ranges in the pelvis is basically a death sentence along with instant disable.
Exactly.
Greatest example of this is look at Kyle Rittenhouse and Jacob Blake shootings.
Blake took 12 or so iirc hollow points point blank center mass and lived.
Rittenhouse put a single round of 5.56mm into the chest of skaterboy and he was dead within 15 seconds.
Rittenhouse put a single round into the top part of Grosskreutz's right elbow. Completely blew all the flesh on the underside of his elbow off to the bone, instantly disabling him right there.
Always go with a rifle for self defense when its an options.
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- Joined
- May 29, 2024
The most pragmatic home/community defense weapon in the US is a 5.56 AR-15 shooting 62gr+ soft points or OTMs. Level 4 armor will stop any ammo anyone will have, so discussing "armor piercing" rounds is pointless. If your assailant is wearing a plate carrier, you should assume they're wearing level 4 plates and shoot for the pelvis, as has been mentioned several times already. Once they're on the ground, follow-up shots to the gut or head become much easier.
Also, some of you guys are making the mistake of underestimating your enemy, saying things like "antifa doesn't have armor." Level 4 plates can be purchased for ~$350 a pair. They rarely have decent guns, but a $400 PSA rifle is easily obtainable and usually runs just fine. There's been no shortage of mass shooters with very cheap rifles and very little (if any) previous shooting experience killing 10+ people in a very short amount of time, so making assumptions about poorly equipped and poorly trained leftist nutcases is stupid. Having just one or two of these guys attacking your home would already be a serious problem. Imagine if it was a 3 or 4 man team.
Also, some of you guys are making the mistake of underestimating your enemy, saying things like "antifa doesn't have armor." Level 4 plates can be purchased for ~$350 a pair. They rarely have decent guns, but a $400 PSA rifle is easily obtainable and usually runs just fine. There's been no shortage of mass shooters with very cheap rifles and very little (if any) previous shooting experience killing 10+ people in a very short amount of time, so making assumptions about poorly equipped and poorly trained leftist nutcases is stupid. Having just one or two of these guys attacking your home would already be a serious problem. Imagine if it was a 3 or 4 man team.
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2019
You paint a very vivid picture and I appreciate that comparison.
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2016
rule of thumb for NIJ plates is repeat hits "no longer guarantee protection". that's up to the plate construction, the carrier or vest, and if you're doing shit like doubling up or have some alien tech going on. that being said the pseudo NIJ III plates (inside an OTV which is IIIA soft armor) i had in iraq and aghanistan could get away with 5 or more hits of 7.62x54mm N13 AP (i think?) from a couple hundred meters out before becoming useless, they'd knock you down though.
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- Joined
- Dec 3, 2019
@Null The solution to your problem of a potentially well-armored, well-armed, well-trained tranny storming your home is to be better trained, armed, and armored. As discussed, there's few realistic options for dealing with Level IV plates directly, especially within the domicile. However, with training, you won't have to.
The body's movement is centered around the pelvis. Basically no pelvic armor protects against rifle rounds. Any rifle rounds taken in the pelvic girdle instantly takes even a hopped up tranny running on meth and delusion out of the fight, and is nearly guaranteed to cause them to bleed out inside of 5 minutes even on a poor shot. Multiple rounds on target turn this instant.
You can, and should get something meant for longer ranges for various reasons, but an AR with a suppressor will always be one of the best options for home defense. You can add a few things like a light, a red dot, and maybe a vertical grip, but that's all still you'll figure out as you train. You're likely going to do a fuck ton of research figuring things out that work for you, but I believe the starting point for you is an AR and a suppressor. Additionally, you should consider body armor for yourself. In the event of an invasion, if you have the time, you can at least match the armor they have in the worst case scenario.
Theory crafting about what kind of round defeats Level IV isn't useful for you right now. Spend that time researching training options near where you plan to settle, and then commit to actually doing said training.
The body's movement is centered around the pelvis. Basically no pelvic armor protects against rifle rounds. Any rifle rounds taken in the pelvic girdle instantly takes even a hopped up tranny running on meth and delusion out of the fight, and is nearly guaranteed to cause them to bleed out inside of 5 minutes even on a poor shot. Multiple rounds on target turn this instant.
You can, and should get something meant for longer ranges for various reasons, but an AR with a suppressor will always be one of the best options for home defense. You can add a few things like a light, a red dot, and maybe a vertical grip, but that's all still you'll figure out as you train. You're likely going to do a fuck ton of research figuring things out that work for you, but I believe the starting point for you is an AR and a suppressor. Additionally, you should consider body armor for yourself. In the event of an invasion, if you have the time, you can at least match the armor they have in the worst case scenario.
Theory crafting about what kind of round defeats Level IV isn't useful for you right now. Spend that time researching training options near where you plan to settle, and then commit to actually doing said training.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2023
The Ruger 5.7 is an objectively nicer feeling gun than the FN. I worked in a pawn shop and handled/shot both extensively. FN feels like a toy gun in comparison. Ruger is also a good bit cheaper. Not generally a fan of anything Ruger but if you're looking for a 5.7x28 pistol I'd definitely check out the Ruger before pulling the trigger on the FN.
One thing to keep in mind with all 5.7 rounds is that you will be limited to shitty blue tip or American eagle for the most part. The green tip FN ammo is only sold to military and law enforcement because they're faggots so in order to get it you will have to go on gun broker and pay 2-3x what it's worth. Black tip is the best but even harder to acquire. And if you're not shooting green tip 5.7x28 you might as well just get a .22 mag.
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2024
Make sure you don't post your serial number because people can falsely report it stolen or reverse search the serial number and find if you have posted it anonymously elsewhere.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2023
He wouldn't even tell us the model/brand of the pistol he has waiting for him, I don't think he would be dumb enough to even consider posting a serial number.
Also @Null when you do decide to buy a gun I highly recommend checking out gun.deals and searching for the model you want. You can generally find guns as much as 2-300$ cheaper than you'll find them at gun stores or well known websites. Gunzonedeals, Familyfirearms, and Lockedandloaded usually have near dealer prices for the guns they sell.
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likeacrackado
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2020
It might not be a bad idea to invest in soft body armor once you're set with a basic AR , handgun, and training. IIRC a bunch of the antifa killings in 2020 were just some tard dumping a few rounds into the victim from close range. A decent vest and kevlar is fairly concealable under a sweat shirt, maybe even an oversized t shirt if you're stuck in tropical weather. Might not be viable to wear everyday, but if you're aware of an actionable threat(or local chimpout), and still have to go outside, they can be a good option. Other people in the thread can probably point you in a good direction for where to buy new stuff, I own some fell off a truck NYPD shit. Find a reputable product(preferably listed on National Institute of Justice website) from a decent vender, not the cheapo "tested to NIJ standards" chinese shit people online push. @Club Sandwich may have some good recommendations of places that sell soft armor to civilians since he seems know a lot on this subject.
The only 5.7 I have rounds on is the Smith M&P 5.7. The grip is oddly wide and slim, so it might not be the best idea for smaller hands. The FN 5.7s feel like plastic bricks and the Ruger has the best ergos of all of them imo. Prepare to compete with nigger drug dealers if you buy ammo in person. 5.7 was some of the first stuff to run out at my LGS during shortages and most places don't keep a ton of it sitting around.
The only 5.7 I have rounds on is the Smith M&P 5.7. The grip is oddly wide and slim, so it might not be the best idea for smaller hands. The FN 5.7s feel like plastic bricks and the Ruger has the best ergos of all of them imo. Prepare to compete with nigger drug dealers if you buy ammo in person. 5.7 was some of the first stuff to run out at my LGS during shortages and most places don't keep a ton of it sitting around.
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- Joined
- May 6, 2020
There's no replacement for shot placement. Aim for the thighs and crotch.
Look into getting a decent armor carrier with both soft armor and rifle plates, like the Mayflower LPAAC. Soft armor is worth the extra weight, especially considering that trannies have an affinity for pistol caliber carbines like the Sub2000. Get the full soft armor, good plates, side plates, and a cock flap for best coverage while being still practical.
I've opted out of the side plates on mine but I'm not planning to deal with hordes of mad trannies.
Look into getting a decent armor carrier with both soft armor and rifle plates, like the Mayflower LPAAC. Soft armor is worth the extra weight, especially considering that trannies have an affinity for pistol caliber carbines like the Sub2000. Get the full soft armor, good plates, side plates, and a cock flap for best coverage while being still practical.
I've opted out of the side plates on mine but I'm not planning to deal with hordes of mad trannies.
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- Joined
- Jan 28, 2021
@Null
The Hk VP9 and P30 series both have an incredibly comfortable grip and feature interchangeable backstraps and side panels in small, medium, and large sizes so there is some customizablilty. I have a P30SK (subcompact model) which I carry and it’s been great for me. I have medium sized hands and I have no problem with the standard medium panel/backstrap set. The small size set felt a little too small so I would try those.
Hk has a great reputation for quality and I highly recommend them. They also just did a magazine capacity update on their P30/VP9s so the new magazines hold more rounds. If you’re interested, I recommend lurking and searching on the HKPro forums for info and watching Navyman8903 on YouTube.
P30 series for reference (not mine):
Also, people may recommend Sig Sauer but they’re currently mismanaged and have very poor QC. I would buy almost anything over a newer Sig right now. It’s a shame because the P365 is very comfy though the FN Reflex would be a good alternative if you prefer the micro compacts to the traditional compacts. The Ruger 5.7 is cool but make sure it’s reliable. Reliability is always a priority in my opinion but there is wisdom in using something you’re comfortable with so don’t worry too much I guess.
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- Joined
- Oct 6, 2019
Jesus Christ, guys, the last thing I would want to see in the news is Null shooting someone, self-defense or not. That's nearly certain to be a huge blow to the KF, if not a death blow. Null going to prison or getting bankrupted or bogged down by legal fees due to criminal or civil liabilities plus the negative media attention would be a godsend to people like Long Gone Dong Fong and insane trannies or the BRITISH.
Personal security, high quality home security, some tradecraft and OPSEC and common sense is infinitely more valuable. I'd rather Noool spend 5k on house security than an extra $100 on guns an ammo. I understand as much as the next guy the fantasy of shooting an insane invader, but it is in current day the last thing we all need.
My pfp is Lt. Col Galen Huss. He shot a utility worker in his property, mistaking him for a spy/thief. He got doxed and his house is known to the public, he had to give up on his career, maybe pension, is hiding out, and it's still up in the air if he's facing life-changing severe charges. For the rest of his life, he'll probably have to watch his back, and so will his family. Gun autism is fun, but let's be sensible about the seriousness of this.
Personal security, high quality home security, some tradecraft and OPSEC and common sense is infinitely more valuable. I'd rather Noool spend 5k on house security than an extra $100 on guns an ammo. I understand as much as the next guy the fantasy of shooting an insane invader, but it is in current day the last thing we all need.
My pfp is Lt. Col Galen Huss. He shot a utility worker in his property, mistaking him for a spy/thief. He got doxed and his house is known to the public, he had to give up on his career, maybe pension, is hiding out, and it's still up in the air if he's facing life-changing severe charges. For the rest of his life, he'll probably have to watch his back, and so will his family. Gun autism is fun, but let's be sensible about the seriousness of this.
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2021
N I G G E R F A G G O T
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2024
didn't he have some psycho with body armor and a weapon show up to his mom's house a few years ago?
That might explain why he's worried about body armor.
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2023
Really just depends on where he plans to live. Some states are incredibly gay and will fuck with people who defend themselves, some states will encourage law abiding citizens to shoot home invaders without question. I'd just make sure to live somewhere that has a cool local sheriff at least.
Like this one:
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2023
Null really can't be talked out of getting a dollar bill shooter, huh. Oh well, at least the stuff Ruger makes is affordable. The gun itself, not the ammo.
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2019
No one wins when someone is killed. It will all end in tears for everyone.
Yes. What you do in that situation is you don't answer the fucking door. You see them through a home security camera system. And you call the police saying you have armed people at your door. Just get the gun, in an actual, ACTUAL, LITERAL emergecy. Opening the door and blasting them will get you cool points, but the cost is horrendous, even if justified. Paul Harrel killed in self-defense and had to spend 6 figures defending himself.