Greta Gustava Martela / Kjel Anderson & Nina Chaubal / Niraj Chaubal - Stole $350k+ from Trans Lifeline, kill count of 2+ from negligence, Founders of Sisterwood/La Zorra.

I'm also curious about their answered calls numbers. You can kind of fudge these if you don't have the right software because someone getting an "we can't take your call right now, please try again later" will count as an "answered" call. For accurate numbers, you need to be able to distinguish between callers who got to talk to a worker, callers who got a call later message, callers who hung up before the call was answered, calls which rang out, and callers who got the engaged signal.

@Null, can you comment on what their shitty software can actually track?
 
  • Agree
  • Informative
  • Like
Reactions: Super Collie, GREEDY FIREMAN, Trombonista and 2 others
Saw the post in the wild today and all I gotta say is: tumblr will believe anything but what they really need to know, when it comes to this shit. :story:

-But seriously, I feel like the people who try to reach out to TLL are better off calling a regular suicideline with as bad as TLLs track record is. They may not get a fellow "troon in arms" but they'd at least get someone to listen with a higher chance of their call being answered. jfc the amount of predatory scamming shit is astounding on its own without them falling for it hook line and sinker.

Then again, I'm a cis shitlord sooo what do I know lel
 
Last edited:
  • Agree
Reactions: Super Collie, Portajohn, Mage Of The Patriarchy and 2 others
Honestly the whole situation is really a perfect example of how these kind of communities allow this sort of shit to fester. No one wants to be the person calling out the abuser in their community because everyone wants to believe that the "bad guys" are straight/cis/etc people. No one wants to admit that their own minority community, shit on as it may be, can have terrible people in it.
I think another reason why no one wants to speak up against TLL is that the concept, in and of itself, isn't necessarily a bad idea when you consider the statistics for suicidal ideation/self harm/etc among trans people and people who are still figuring shit out. When you have a group that is significantly more at risk, it does make sense to have a service specifically for them. But, because TLL is the only hotline targeted specifically at trans people, it makes it easy to hide the scam because you have the argument of "where else are they gonna go!" and, again, no one wants to be that bad guy who called out the suicide hotline for trans people. Even if it is a scam.

The whole thing is honestly just really depressing.
 
  • Agree
  • Feels
  • Like
Reactions: negative nelly, adderall, BOLDYSPICY! and 20 others
Melkor said:
HOOOO boy. This is gonna be a long night.
Click to expand...

Don't fret too much. They're actually painting themselves into a corner. A lot of their support base are povos who can't afford to donate substantial amounts on a regular basis. To grow significantly, they need corporate and/or government dollars. Their problem is that grants come with all sorts of organisational compliance requirements, including how your board and staff are acquired.

It's not easy to get big grants if your "charity" is founded by you, run by you, the board is selected by you and you're employing your friends. Big grant givers like to see the users and stakeholders of an organisation elect the office bearers and any staff positions be filled through well thought out, rigorous recruitment processes. They require an awful lot of information about how you're spending their money and an overall level of accountability which is foreign to Greta and Nina.

TLL needs to be careful about its statements regarding how it intends to spend donations, too. If you solicit donations for a specific purpose, you can't then spend them on something else - and "we need to raise X dollars this month in order to do Y" can easily fall into the territory of committing to spend those funds for that specific purpose and that purpose only.
 
  • Like
  • Agree
  • Informative
Reactions: demeter, adderall, Super Collie and 12 others
repentance said:
Don't fret too much. They're actually painting themselves into a corner. A lot of their support base are povos who can't afford to donate substantial amounts on a regular basis. To grow significantly, they need corporate and/or government dollars. Their problem is that grants come with all sorts of organisational compliance requirements, including how your board and staff are acquired.

It's not easy to get big grants if your "charity" is founded by you, run by you, the board is selected by you and you're employing your friends. Big grant givers like to see the users and stakeholders of an organisation elect the office bearers and any staff positions be filled through well thought out, rigorous recruitment processes. They require an awful lot of information about how you're spending their money and an overall level of accountability which is foreign to Greta and Nina.

TLL needs to be careful about its statements regarding how it intends to spend donations, too. If you solicit donations for a specific purpose, you can't then spend them on something else - and "we need to raise X dollars this month in order to do Y" can easily fall into the territory of committing to spend those funds for that specific purpose and that purpose only.
Click to expand...

The fact they openly admit to refusing to accept any "official" accrediting or avoiding referring the suicidal to more competent services because they admit open fear, distrust, and contempt of those bodies is a self inflicted death sentence in the long term, and their refusal to actually be transparent about their own expenses and service statistics (in the sense of providing information that would stand up in a courtroom) is a more or less open admission on their part they don't want to be held accountable for their own actions and makes them a scam in spirit even if they were actually otherwise providing something resembling an actual service.
 
  • Like
  • Agree
Reactions: Super Collie, Portajohn, Mage Of The Patriarchy and 5 others
Herbert Hoover said:
If people are defending this as hard as they are, then maybe the best method would be to let more people find out the truth on their own as TLL slowly fades away (then again this is Greta we're talking about, so it might end with her showing up to someone who wasn't taking a shit and owns guns)
Click to expand...
I would imagine there's always going to be a tendency to ass pat these sort of groups, or sweep their fuckups under the rug under some sort of misguided feeling of solidarity.

They make a lot of money off of the "listen and believe" crowd.
 
  • Agree
  • Feels
Reactions: BestUserName, adderall, Yawning Asperchu and 7 others
It's poorly-written for sure:

Moreover, many of our callers report suffering abuse in psychiatric hospitals, so we cannot presume these institutions will be healing to our community. We conducted our own small scale research (about 300 respondents) and found that 40% of trans people said they would not call a hotline if there was a possibility that the police would be called on them.
Click to expand...

To address this specifically, it's incredibly paternalistic to deny people the help they need because 40% of them might not like how it's delivered. No one in a psych hospital wants to be there but many, MANY people benefit from removal from an anxiety-provoking environment, structure, and medication. Instigating and promoting fear of the police - who are there to help them, and are actually trained in suicide prevention (lol) - is irresponsible.

“Only about 19% of incoming calls were being answered.”
Click to expand...
To date we’ve answered 17,064 calls.
Click to expand...

Compares a percentage to an absolute value... so, a totally worthless comparison, and now you look like you're trying to weasel your numbers, good job Greta.

Greta is currently on the consumer/survivor committee for the National Suicide Lifeline. She speaks at conferences, universities, and even the White House to help mental health providers, trans people, and policy makers address transgender mental health issues.
Click to expand...

A) This is bragging and B) hasn't described into how any of that shit helps Lifeline callers directly. TLL's mandate should be to its callers first and THEN to fun field trips being Trans Advocate Barbie. It doesn't matter how popular those conferences were when those dollars were more urgently needed training volunteers or working towards accreditation.
 
  • Agree
  • Disagree
Reactions: BestUserName, demeter, adderall and 22 others
The Collective addresses the issue:
I understand you want to clear your reputation of the accusations that have been leveled against you, but all you posted is unsourced rebuttals.

Linking to hard evidence that conclusively proves your case would be much more effective. Also, most of your rebuttal is a gigantic appeal to emotion, not a consistently citable list of sources that can exonerate your organization of these charges.

For the record and in the interests of honesty, I am a fan of the Kiwi Farms and I disagree with your interpretation and portrayal of their activities, but if you are truly being libeled and/or misrepresented, I suggest redoing this piece with the advice I have provided if you really are innocent of the charges you are trying to disprove.
(Archive)
 
  • Winner
  • Like
  • Agree
Reactions: Fullmetal Autist, Helvetica Scenario, adderall and 18 others
GREEDY FIREMAN said:
The Collective addresses the issue:
I understand you want to clear your reputation of the accusations that have been leveled against you, but all you posted is unsourced rebuttals.

Linking to hard evidence that conclusively proves your case would be much more effective. Also, most of your rebuttal is a gigantic appeal to emotion, not a consistently citable list of sources that can exonerate your organization of these charges.

For the record and in the interests of honesty, I am a fan of the Kiwi Farms and I disagree with your interpretation and portrayal of their activities, but if you are truly being libeled and/or misrepresented, I suggest redoing this piece with the advice I have provided if you really are innocent of the charges you are trying to disprove.
(Archive)
Click to expand...
Crosspost. Fellow scammer Kiva Bay was tweeting about Geth's post.

upload_2016-11-16_19-12-1-png.154410

upload_2016-11-16_19-11-50-png.154409
 
  • Informative
  • Winner
Reactions: Super Collie, Portajohn, Mage Of The Patriarchy and 1 other person
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back