Russian Special Military Operation in the Ukraine - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

EscapeVorkuta said:
Considering how the West fucked up Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Serbia, and the list goes on, you'd think these liberals cocksuckers would be more self-reflective.
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Just like how a true Muslim would be physically incapable of spitting on a Quran globohomo politicians (and their voters/dickriders) are unable to admit their faults, doubly so when it comes to wars; if we lost then they will say it was only because we didn't support it enough, and if they are forced to denounce that earlier war they will just rewrite history to say only the heckin unwholesome chuds supported it whereas whatever war our democracy wants now is critical to the revolution.

Assuming everything goes well and ww3 remains in the realm of fiction it is safe to say that those like Destiny, Kamala Harris, or any other pro Ukraine leftist will more likely then not in the future will only mention Ukraine to justify the obliteration of the West's culture and people by saying we gave too much of our supplies to neo nazis when we could have beaten those meanie Russian Christians if we had only given it all to the queer resistance or some other cope. The specifics of what they will say won't matter of course, it will just be used as a soundbite to retroactively justify policies they already were going to do.
 
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Useful_Mistake said:
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So, we need to remember this when they start rambling about Iranian nukes again.

Tax but in german:

That's practically the first time german media acknowledges that men are trying to escape ukraine en masse to doge the draft which has now been lowered to 25. Sure, before we had "no men leave" for months but they're tightening the noose now, pressing most of them into actual service.
So, reinforcements are really drying up. Odd, considering how Ukraine has been winning non stop for 500 Days + while being totally OP with western super weapons.
Oh, and they want germany to repatriate deserters now.

Good luck with that, considering that putin has tens of thousands gulag death row inmates, chechen mercs and north korean (and countless other destitute) "volunteers" at his disposal to feed the ranks of penal battalions. West Ukrainians will get their warcrime/genocide press but it's on them for sperging out over the krim and donbass in the first place, not because that was putins intention. They kept feeding us this bullshit about le putler wanting to take the baltic states but I only see ukrainians trying for ethnic russian territory: Krim, Donbass and now fucking Kursk. Being a backwater el presidente affords him freedoms, western "allies" and nafo generals can only have wet dreams of.

Sorry had to vent. Shit is too close for comfort and NATO keeps fanning the flames.
 
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jje100010001 said:
Interesting snippet from defenseforumbharat regarding Ukranian Nazism, which I think matches what we've seen
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There's lots of wisdom in his 3rd paragraph but the rest is rubbish. German nazism also fed it's ranks from rural, low iq, sociopath brutes. Large amounts of the populous of industrialized cities, like hamburg and berlin, were distinctively hard left, somewhat educated and progressive in the 20s, their leading politicians anglo style liberals. Nazism flourished in the less industrialized and, ironically, more eastern, slavic regions of prussia and also bavaria which wasn't the powerhouse it became after the war - it was a backwater. But the intellectual elite behind the curtains, the old money industrialists, artistocrats and wehraboos (who wanted revenge on france and britain) are what's missing from modern larpers, be they americans, german or hohols. With original Nazism, the old guard progenitors of it basically lost control of what was supposed to be their version of a Volksbewegung to counter communism. But the nazi base is always the same: unhinged, easily impressed, dysgenic rabble. But I agree, it's funny to watch ukranians cargo cult the shit out of it and falling over themselves. Kinda like indians still living and dying by the caste system some foreign overlords installed to herd them like cattle. Hell, they're even bleaching their skin to look more like their long gone masters and dunk on each other for being whiter. I'm not even arguing that there weren't sophisticated nazis but that was mostly because everybody of rank and standing was a nazi after they took over. That is why I find the AFD fascinating it's the same kind of people and even some family names who were behind the original nazi movement kickoff but they've learned their lesson in a way and actually aren't trying to be new nazis contrary to popular opinion - they're just the same shadowy artistocrat and old money assholes taking money from china and russia now, instead of the U.S. back then.
 
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Feline Supremacist said:
How does the Ukraine convince recalcitrant hohols to enlist in the military?
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Rape. Not joking. Source
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Some context for those who are curious.

The man is a fitness trainer from Odessa who got into a squabble with some military folks in early June and told them some nasty things, like wishing death to all Ukrainian army members. He was then democratically beaten to a pulp by some "activists" who then delivered him to a recruitment center. The video where he is chained to a tree and professes to be a "faggot who has just been fucked in the ass" surfaced only yesterday. I am told that not even Ukrainians are thrilled with the story, although they did approve of the "activists" back in June. He is speaking Russian in the video.
 
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ConsentAccidentVictimNo98 said:
"Omg Putler is ordering military strikes on his OWN CITIZENS!"
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They're definitely trying to force a Hamas situation where they can insist the Russians are pure evil and don't care about their civillians. While casually avoiding the fact that a US backed army is taking hostages or using civillians as shields.

We're about to slide headlong into "Every accusation is a confession" territory. Everything the Russkies were accused of is actually going to happen in Kursk.
 
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Gondolindrim said:
They're definitely trying to force a Hamas situation where they can insist the Russians are pure evil and don't care about their civillians. While casually avoiding the fact that a US backed army is taking hostages or using civillians as shields.
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Well they shouldn't have been Russian if they didn't want to be taken hostage. Checkmate, ziggers. :smug:
 
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A well written short summary of Kursk v2.0

[...] There is a disconnect between the number of brigades and different vehicle types identified in Kursk and the actual size of the AFU grouping. What this suggests is that the Ukrainians stripped down the motor pools from a variety of different brigades and concentrated them in a strike package to attack Kursk, rather than deploying these brigades as such.

The situation would appear to be highly similar to the Second World War German practice of forming Kampfgruppen, or Battle Groups. As the Wehrmacht became more and more overstretched, German commanders became accustomed to forming improvised formations comprised of sub-units stripped from the line as necessary: take an infantry battalion from this division, steal a dozen panzers from that division, commandeer a battery from that regiment, and voila: you have a Kampfgruppe.

In the voluminous masses of World War Two literature, Kamfgruppen were often taken as evidence of Germany’s wonderful improvisational powers, and the ability of their cool-headed commanders to scrape together fighting power from threadbare resources. There’s nothing specifically incorrect about that, but this tends to miss the larger point - Kampfgruppe did not become a phenomenon until late in the war, when Germany was losing, and their regular order of battle (ORBAT) was becoming shredded. Cobbling together mutant formations can help you stave off disaster, but it is not a superior option to deploying organic brigades as such.

We appear to have a Ukrainian Kampfgruppe in Kursk, with elements of a variety of different brigades - bringing with them a whole hodgepodge of different vehicles - forming a grouping that is likely not more than 7-8,000 men. Above and beyond the progress that they are making in Kursk, this does not suggest anything good about the state of the AFU. To launch this offensive, they had to strip down units that were actively fighting in the Donbas and rapidly shuttle them to Sumy to accumulate in an improvised strike group. It is a threadbare grouping for a threadbare army. [...]
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[...]The AFU is expending carefully husbanded and scarce resources in the pursuit of operationally inconsequential objectives. The exhilaration of taking the fight to Russia and being on the attack again can certainly work wonders for morale and create a spectacle for western backers, but the effect is short lived - like a broke man gambling away his last dollar, all for the momentary thrill of chance.
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Sexual Chocolate said:
Big Serge is the most level headed and best Ukraine war blogger. Not sure why Scott Ritter and Col MacGregor get invited to so many interviews while Serge doesn't. Their hot takes are usually quite lurid and dramatic, Serge just calmly discusses facts, history and possibilities.
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Well, that and he denies the Holodomor as "collectovization famine" as though the liquidation of thr Kulaks as a class was some Imperium of Man-esque paperwork oopsie as opposed to government policy. I realize that's not directly relevant to the topic at hand, but like a lot of WW2 historians, he's a bit brain rotted about the human element, and it's probably easy to make him look like a lunatic sociopath with an even mildly hostile interview.
 
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Roman Dmowski said:
A well written short summary of Kursk v2.0
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The situation would appear to be highly similar to the Second World War German practice of forming Kampfgruppen, or Battle Groups. As the Wehrmacht became more and more overstretched, German commanders became accustomed to forming improvised formations comprised of sub-units stripped from the line as necessary: take an infantry battalion from this division, steal a dozen panzers from that division, commandeer a battery from that regiment, and voila: you have a Kampfgruppe.
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Once again, I cannot help but with the Ardennes comparisons. Kampfgruppen's spearheaded the attack, to such prominence that you can go on a tour of their attack routes and actions. I am starting to hit the point in this comparison where I have to wonder whether the Ukrainians just repeated history by being in the same general position and making the same decisions for the same reasons, or if someone in higher command is REALLY trying to LARP as a Nazi, and just stole the battleplan wholesale.
 
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Wikipedia now calls it: War in Donbass. The stuff that was going on in Ukraine 2014 - 2022. Which is a change of tone. They called it "The Donbass conflict", or the "Donbass insurgency" before. Just a pillow fight.

So its a war now. The "invasion" wasnt unprovoked then.

The wiki article mentions the number of casualties too:

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14000 dead. including 3400 civilians. Killed by their own government.
 
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Butterschmalz said:
Wikipedia now calls it: War in Donbass. The stuff that was going on in Ukraine 2014 - 2022. Which is a change of tone. They called it "The Donbass conflict", or the "Donbass insurgency" before. Just a pillow fight.

So its a war now. The "invasion" wasnt unprovoked then.
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It should really be called the Ukrainian Civil War. Except this time, the good guys are winning.
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Butterschmalz said:
Wikipedia now calls it: War in Donbass. The stuff that was going on in Ukraine 2014 - 2022. Which is a change of tone. They called it "The Donbass conflict", or the "Donbass insurgency" before. Just a pillow fight.

So its a war now. The "invasion" wasnt unprovoked then.

The wiki article mentions the number of casualties too:

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14000 dead. including 3400 civilians. Killed by their own government.
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If they're going to talk about the number of Ukrainians who fled since 2016, they should talk about the number who fled since 2014 and make clear that about half of the refugees from Ukraine fled into Russia.

EDIT: Lets include this classic about who edits Russian entries on Ukraine as while we're at it:
 
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