Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

Sorry to doublepost but I'm caught up with the thread after this post
dont know if I posted this already but im gonna do it anyways, I still think half life 2 gets beat out by jedi outcast and jedi adaemy out of pure cool factor, yes im biased because its the first fps I played but some maps are batshit insane compared to source, heres one example.
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Dont have a lot at the moment because I dont have the game installed but it is one of the games back to, to ponder if this game had a physics engine would it have surpassed hl2 altogether as the deathmatch was extremely varied and combat scenarios werent entirely based off physics, but how your weapon worked, having each weapon have a different mechanic instead of having a ton of weapons that all have 1-2 functions whereas jedi outcasts aresenal provides multiple different playstyles for beginners and experienced people alike.
handful of notable examples are, mace windu party crasher, movie battles 1-2
Star Wars: Jedi Knight, Jedi Outcast, and Jedi Academy are all three some of my all time favorite games and I think everyone should play all three whether you're a Star Wars fan or not, the games are that fun. I play all three of them all the time and they've never once gotten old. Jedi Outcast is my personal favorite, it has the best level design out of the whole series imo.

Am I the only one who's disappointed with how repetitive Star Wars has become? For all of George's faults, I will give him this: he definitely delivered when it came to not repeating himself. The prequels aren't a rehash of Rebels vs. Empire at all. It does feel like the tale of the fall of democracy, and the rise of darkness.

I will also be fair and say the EU was guilty of this too. A lot of it was great. But some of the expanded material seemed to want to simply recapture the magic of the OT and just rehashed the idea of superweapons, like the Death Star, and Sith trying to one-up Palpatine. That being said, Disney and JJ are by far the worst because they aren't even pretending to be original. The Force Awakens is basically a rip-off of A New Hope, but worse.

Point is, you’ve got a rich universe with hundreds of factions, complex politics, exotic planets, and a history that spans millennia where anything can happen, and the only thing you can think of is… rehashing the OT? Seriously?
Say what you want about the New Jedi Order era of novels with the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, but you can't say it was a rehash of anything. It was pretty original and a very new kind of threat for the characters to face and I always loved that about this era. Before Disney came into play I always thought these books would have made for a perfect sequel trilogy had they not been made as books already.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but wasn't that the same game where said Sith Apprentice pulled an entire Star Destroyer from orbit? Because that was some Holdo maneuver-tier bullshit.
If you're referring to The Force Unleashed, I seem to remember that game being a different set of canon than most other stuff. I remember it being regarded as a "Legend" kind of story within the EU continuity (before the entire EU was called Legends) rather than 100% established canon. I always preferred that anyway, because I think TFU is just as bad as Filoni's Clone Wars and Galen Marik is just as dumb as Ahsoka.
 
Say what you want about the New Jedi Order era of novels with the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, but you can't say it was a rehash of anything. It was pretty original and a very new kind of threat for the characters to face and I always loved that about this era. Before Disney came into play I always thought these books would have made for a perfect sequel trilogy had they not been made as books already.
Definitively. I'm not denying the EU had some gems. Hell, I commend heir of the empire for being extremely original and going for a military genius instead of yet another sith lord. But I also see lots of Palpatine/Vader wanabes there. And lots of attempts to one-up or redo the Death Star. For example:


I know. Wookiepedia. But this time they made an useful list. The movies gave the impression The Death star was a one of a kind terror that changed the tide of history forever. But I see a lot of planetkiller weapons there. And that's not even getting into how JJ's starkiller base is basically the Death Star again but bigger.
 
Definitively. I'm not denying the EU had some gems. Hell, I commend heir of the empire for being extremely original and going for a military genius instead of yet another sith lord. But I also see lots of Palpatine/Vader wanabes there. And lots of attempts to one-up or redo the Death Star. For example:


I know. Wookiepedia. But this time they made an useful list. The movies gave the impression The Death star was a one of a kind terror that changed the tide of history forever. But I see a lot of planetkiller weapons there. And that's not even getting into how JJ's starkiller base is basically the Death Star again but bigger.
To be fair, most of the superweapons on that list aren't ones that will outright destroy a planet. Lots of them only effect technology or ecosystems. The Death Star was pretty groundbreaking for it's effectiveness and efficiency at obliterating planets in mere seconds as if they never even existed. Nothing like that was ever made before the Death Star. More were made after the fact of course, once the genie is out of the bottle there's no putting it back in and that technology was around to stay even after both Death Stars were destroyed. After the Death Star had been destroyed it was more a question of perfecting the design and making one that's not so easily destroyed.

I agree that JJ's Starkiller Base was gay as hell though.
 
For all of George's faults, I will give him this: he definitely delivered when it came to not repeating himself.
He repeated himself with the second Death Star in the OT and the Lucrehulk-class Droid Control Ship which can be viewed as another Death Star waiting for a Skywalker to blow it up. One could argue that Jango Fett and revisiting Tatooine were also repetitions and a terrible place to hide baby Luke BTW. But It's definitely not as bad as the Disney sludge. Lucas wanted to show us different things for the most part even if they were really bad ideas (Midichlorians, Yoda fighting, battle droids IMO) not the same stuff over and over again but bigger and shinier.
 
I know. Wookiepedia. But this time they made an useful list. The movies gave the impression The Death star was a one of a kind terror that changed the tide of history forever. But I see a lot of planetkiller weapons there. And that's not even getting into how JJ's starkiller base is basically the Death Star again but bigger.
That's something I always appreciated about the Sun Crusher. It was a single-seat fighter craft no bigger than a B-Wing bomber, but it was capable of destruction several orders of magnitude more than the Death Star I & II, Darksaber, etc.

Going against the trend of each Superweapon being bigger than the last was a refreshing change.
 
I know. Wookiepedia. But this time they made an useful list. The movies gave the impression The Death star was a one of a kind terror that changed the tide of history forever. But I see a lot of planetkiller weapons there. And that's not even getting into how JJ's starkiller base is basically the Death Star again but bigger.
The Death Star was more of a scare tactic. Sure, there were glazers for it in the Imperial system, but the fact that the Emperor could build something of this scope without the Senate noticing, or the fact that he could rebuild it without the Rebels noticing until he tipped them off, goes to show that in the full scale of things, the Death Star was just another terror weapon, and the Empire had more than enough of those. So it makes sense the Empire would have other projects in the works, like the Galaxy Gun, Sun Crusher, and World Devastator. The Death Star was iconic, but it was hardly the Empire's best.

One of my favorites is the Orbital Nightcloak; a system of satellites that not only jam all communications and sensors, but they can also block all forms of light from reaching a planet. The eventual result is that a planet slowly freezes itself to death. Simple, yet effective.

And unlike the Death Star, where the target planet at least goes out with a bang rather quickly, the horror factor for the Orbital Nightcloak is pure nightmare fuel, especially since the freezing process takes days or weeks. Just imagine what's happening to the people below. They can't call for help. They can't tell what's above them. Then before they know it, the sun is blacked out, temperatures fall to freezing levels, and eventually, all plant and animal life dies, leaving the humans and other sapients to slowly starve to death.

Not only does it guarantee total annihilation of the target planet's defenders and populace, it also keeps the planet mostly intact, so if there were any valuable resources under the surface, you can mine it afterwards, once the system is turned off and the weather and temperature return to normal.

Another one of my favorites is the Magnetic Bombard. Made for those who wish to fight the likes of the droid armies and other high-tech civilizations, or more accurately, for those who wish to capture the enemy alive by disabling their technology, the Magnetic Bombard is a warhead that can send an entire city back to the Dark Ages by literally EMP-ing the entire settlement with one blast.

Remember the Guardians from Halo 5? Well, this is the Star Wars equivalent of it. Not quite useful when you're fighting Felucians or the Vong, but against the CIS or the Rebels who use a lot of technology, it's a sure-fire way to win. Just imagine that large EMP bomb they dropped on the droids on Malastare back in TCW, but big enough to force a large city to surrender.

The only problem was that this weapon was very expensive, but I can see someone like Thrawn producing this weapon in greater quantities in lieu of the Death Star or some other superweapon, then dropping it on resisting planets who suddenly find the urge to submit once their surface-to-orbit defense turbolasers just blacked out and they now have a pissed-off fleet of Star Destroyers ready to reduce them to rubble.
 
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And unlike the Death Star, where the target planet at least goes out with a bang rather quickly, the horror factor for the Orbital Nightcloak is pure nightmare fuel. Just imagine what's happening to the people below. They can't call for help. They can't tell what's above them. Then before they know it, the sun is blacked out, temperatures fall to freezing levels, and eventually, all plant and animal life dies, leaving the humans and other sapients to slowly starve to death.
Fun fact: being that space is a vaccum, its is actually quite an insulator. This means that if the sun were to go out right this minute, given the earth only loses thermal energy via radiant loss, it would take over 100,000 years for the global average to drop below freezing. Given the Nightcloak would block all light, it very likely means that it would reflect the planet's ambient radiated heat back at it, delaying the onset of freezing even longer.

This doesn't mean everything is hunky dory though. With no sunlight, the water cycle would only be driven by volcanic activity. With no day/night temperature differential wind would stop.

Which means if the Sun goes out, you will likely die of thirst before you froze or starved.

Of course in a universe of viable planetary fusion, it would be very easy to replace the energy of the local sun.

So I guess what I'm saying is the Empire nightcloaks a planet, and then in a million years lifts up the hatch "You guys dead yet?" and just finds a bunch of pastey MMO nerds.
 
Which means if the Sun goes out, you will likely die of thirst before you froze or starved.
That's just as bad, isn't it? But it is quicker, since you cannot survive a few days without water. But again, no water means no plant or animal life, and that includes human life.

But here's the actual description of what happens under an Orbital Nightcloak, courtesy of Wookieepedia.

"The impact on the planet's climate began immediately; surface temperatures began dropping immediately, with snow beginning to fall in areas that had recently been temperate. Four days was long enough for the temperature to drop low enough to kill off the majority of life on the planet, and after as little as three weeks, the temperature of the entire planet was freezing. Plant life began to die off, eventually causing a collapse in the entire food chain."
 
Lucas wanted to show us different things for the most part even if they were really bad ideas (Midichlorians, Yoda fighting, battle droids IMO) not the same stuff over and over again but bigger and shinier.
Midichlorians as a concept dates back to the OT even when they didn't have a word for it yet, but the only reason Kenobi bothered training Luke and not someone else who was more mentally sound and mature was because he was Vader's kid. Likewise, Luke tells Leia that if he dies, she's their next best hope, because she has the same power he does. Why? Because she's his sister. It was always in the family with these guys.

Yoda fighting makes perfect sense. He is a Jedi Master. Jedi are called KNIGHTS because they fight for a living; they're not just some random gurus in a shithole, they were responsible for PROTECTING the Republic. And you can't be a knight who protects something if you don't know how to fight. Yoda wouldn't be a Jedi at all, much less a Jedi Master, if he can't fight for shit. That's like taking samurai training lessons from a man who's never held a katana in his entire life. The only people who complain about Yoda fighting are more in love with pie-in-the-sky concepts of wisdom, people who have no knowledge of what it takes to train fighting men in martial arts. You can't learn how to be a samurai/knight from someone who isn't one.

Battle Droids make perfect sense in a military sci-fi series. Some race out there is going to be technologically advanced enough to develop droids. Especially in a space capitalist society where you have a people wanting to reap profits while minimizing risks. It's actually quite strange that the Empire didn't have armies of battle droids supporting its Stormtroopers. Hell, if it were up to me, each Stormtrooper would be leading a small squad of Battle Droids.

Taking the average mass-produced droid, giving it a gun, and some programming/orders, is one cheap, easy, and clean shortcut to victory. You don't risk the lives of your men, you don't have to worry about soldiers disobeying orders, and since they're easily made, you can always count on having the numbers advantage. Plus, your soldiers don't have to eat, shit, or sleep. Just plug up their batteries like any other device. You don't even need living quarters for them; just power them down when not in use.

It's quite obvious that if there were droids in a given universe, you can bet your ass some droids would be made to kill like IG-11, and some folks would go the easy route of just mass-producing the fuckers so they can have a legion on the go.
 
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Midichlorians as a concept dates back to the OT even when they didn't have a word for it yet, but the only reason Kenobi bothered training Luke and not someone else who was more mentally sound and mature was because he was Vader's kid.
This is 100% right and something I've harped on for years, I wish more people knew it. I don't even know what people think the problem with the midichlorians are anyway, it's already understood that the connection between midichlorian count and how powerful someone is in the force is shakey at best, as well as the fact that everybody has midichlorians just some have more than others. It can't be understated just how many Anakin had though. All the other Jedi's midichlorians were greater than the average Joe but when compared to each other the counts didn't really seem to matter much in connection to how powerful in the force they were. Qui Gon had a suspicion about Anakin's midichlorian count and Obi Wan treated it as a trivial thing to worry about until he saw just how high Anakin's midichlorian count really was. The Jedi Council didn't even want to consider this at all because it's such a game changer.
 
. I don't even know what people think the problem with the midichlorians are anyway,

I think people hate midichlorians because, at face value, they seem to give a "science" or "biological" explanation to something that seemed spiritual or mystical- the force.

I personally think they can work. But my solution to keep the mystical aspect of the force would be to have them as mere harbringers. In other words have midichlorians be attracted to people strong in the force and not the other way around it. Having midichlorians grant the force feels wrong in my opinion.

You have many midichlorians because you are strong in the force is better than you are strong in the force because you have many midichlorians. That small change makes a huge difference.
 
I can understand the dislike of the first two, but what's wrong with the battle droids? I thought they served their purpose fine as generic cannon fodder in the same vein as the stormtroopers.
Battle Droids make perfect sense in a military sci-fi series.
LORD IMPERATOR is right and all. But I never saw most of the damned things showing up in the prequels (excluding droidekas, tanks, fighters and spider droids) as a real threat to legions of cloned badasses AND a whole order of the galaxy's finest warriors and they mostly aren't. Especially the basic B1 grunts. Your main enemy is this gaunt piece of shit. We have footage of Lucas showing one to Spielberg and saying that that they're "not very efficient", "useless" and "Jedi cut them down like butter". We've seen Padawans trash these droids by the dozens. Then there's the infamous scene where a lowly astromech droid takes out several advanced B2s. Stormtroopers seemed useless on screen but you knew that they were dangerous because they kept the Emperor on his throne and conquered worlds. The Droid Army just showed up one day and got its shit pushed in. Its threat felt forced.
 
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The Death Star was more of a scare tactic. Sure, there were glazers for it in the Imperial system, but the fact that the Emperor could build something of this scope without the Senate noticing, or the fact that he could rebuild it without the Rebels noticing until he tipped them off, goes to show that in the full scale of things, the Death Star was just another terror weapon, and the Empire had more than enough of those. So it makes sense the Empire would have other projects in the works, like the Galaxy Gun, Sun Crusher, and World Devastator. The Death Star was iconic, but it was hardly the Empire's best.
But the Senate did notice. Leia found out and the Senate was dissolved. The timeline itself is muddled, but Palpy had a tyrannical reason to get rid of the Senate.
I can understand the dislike of the first two, but what's wrong with the battle droids? I thought they served their purpose fine as generic cannon fodder in the same vein as the stormtroopers.
RLM was the ones who complained about it as an own. It's not as much as people think it is:

1. Yes, Roger Roger battle droids are jobbers meant to fall to Jedi lightsabers. That doesn't apply to Droidekas or tanks, which can kill Jedi under a hail of blaster fire.
2. While they aren't a threat to super fast, super dextrous Jedi, regular Theed Security men are only protected by plot armor against normie battle droids. So while Padme and Panaka get to live and avoid getting shot, Theed Extra number 2 gets to buy the farm. Jedi Extras too, if we're counting AotC.
3. In-universe, it make sense for cheap, mass produced droids that can perform a variety of non to pseudo-combat functions like driving vehicles, patrol, and maintenance. You don't always need Droidekas to escort hostages for the same reason you don't need SEAL teams to supervise Julian Assange. For low-intensity combat, having a bunch of robo Paul Blarts is fine.
4. In Battlefront games, even the lowly Battle droid has less center mass, meaning it takes a split-second longer to line up shots on them, so even their shape ends up being of some use on a battlefield. Unintentional benefit that Lucas didn't foresee, but it's there nonetheless.
 
Yoda fighting makes perfect sense.
Again, I get where you're coming from and I agree but I'm going back to the much younger, pre-PT Manly_Brony who always saw him as a priest/scholar of the Force instead of a swordmaster. I never expected him to fight. Millions of fans are perfectly satisfied that Palpatine didn't duel the Skywalkers at the end of ROTJ and I'm one of them. I imagined the churches of both sides of the Force as religious organizations with higher and lower ranking priests and templar knights. It made perfect sense to me back then. I wasn't angry at the flea with the green lightsabre but I shook my head a couple of times. I very vaguely recall reading about Luke mentioning recordings of a young Yoda in Courtship to Isolder when they were on Dathomir but I'm 99% sure that Yoda didn't physically fight the Nightsisters. But it's been 20 years since I read that novel.

Edited because I typed it in a hurry.
 
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LORD IMPERATOR is right and all. But I never saw most of the damned things showing up in the prequels (excluding droidekas, tanks, fighters and spider droids) as a real threat to legions of cloned badasses AND a whole order of the galaxy's finest warriors and they mostly aren't. Especially the basic B1 grunts. Your main enemy is this gaunt piece of shit. We have footage of Lucas showing one to Spielberg and saying that that they're "not very efficient", "useless" and "Jedi cut them down like butter". We've seen Padawans trash these droids by the dozens. Then there's the infamous scene where a lowly astromech droid takes out several advanced B2s. Stormtroopers seemed useless on screen but you knew that they were dangerous because they kept the Emperor on his throne and conquered worlds. The Droid Army just showed up one day and got its shit pushed in. Its threat felt forced.
That is the point. The threat WAS forced. It's a fake war. The robots were a distraction. The true enemies of the Jedi were never the droids, but the clones and the Chancellor, and that became obvious during Order 66.

What you see as a narrative weakness was, in reality, actually subtle clues from the story. It wasn't so much a war with clear objectives and goals; it was Palpatine playing both sides to get what he wanted, complete with an "off" switch for both the Jedi and the Droid Army once they ceased to be useful. People complaining that the CIS droids were an artificial threat didn't take the time to notice that it was an artificial war manufactured by a politician so that he can become Emperor of the galaxy for life.

But the Senate did notice. Leia found out and the Senate was dissolved. The timeline itself is muddled, but Palpy had a tyrannical reason to get rid of the Senate.
Leia only knew from the Rebels, not the Senate. And she was unable to spread the knowledge of it to the Senate, which was dissolved before it could find out. And by that point, it was already too late.

Again, I get where you're coming from and I agree but I'm going back to the much younger, pre-PT Manly_Brony who always saw him as a priest/scholar of the Force instead of a swordmaster. I never expected him to fight. Millions of fans are perfectly satisfied when Palpatine who didn't duel the Skywalkers at the end of ROTJ and I'm one of them. I imagined the churches of both sides of the Force as religious organizations with higher and lower ranking priests and templar knights. It made perfect sense to me back then. I wasn't that at the flea with the green lightsabre but I shook my head a couple of times. I very vaguely recall reading about Luke mentioning recordings of a young Yoda in Courtship to Isolder when they were on Dathomir but I'm 99% sure that Yoda didn't physically fight the Nightsisters. But it's been 20 years since I read that novel.
That's on you. Your personal point of view doesn't matter when it was someone else's story. You can't expect it to always go the way you want. The thing is, you don't own Star Wars. You're free to come up with your own fanfic version of it, but what's on the screen isn't yours to decide.

Yoda's not a priest. He is a master in an order of KNIGHTS. What do knights do, aside from fight?

Hell, if the story went the way I wanted it, Vader would uphold his promise to Luke at the end of EPV and help him overthrow the Emperor, and the Rebels wouldn't win on Endor without half the Imperial fleet defecting and helping them, and still, it would be an uphill battle, because Vader's supporters who would help the Rebels would barely be a match for the Emperor's elite forces, who would actually put up a stiffer fight instead of just bolting after the Death Star was destroyed.

The fall of the Empire would've been more realistically portrayed the way regimes like those of Assad's or Saddam's would fall, or how the Roman Empire fell, rather than just them falling in one clean swoop in ROTJ. Thankfully, the EU handled it better than the films, where the end of the Battle of Endor was just the beginning of a new phase in the war.
 
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LORD IMPERATOR is right and all. But I never saw most of the damned things showing up in the prequels (excluding droidekas, tanks, fighters and spider droids) as a real threat to legions of cloned badasses AND a whole order of the galaxy's finest warriors and they mostly aren't. Especially the basic B1 grunts. Your main enemy is this gaunt piece of shit. We have footage of Lucas showing one to Spielberg and saying that that they're "not very efficient", "useless" and "Jedi cut them down like butter". We've seen Padawans trash these droids by the dozens. Then there's the infamous scene where a lowly astromech droid takes out several advanced B2s. Stormtroopers seemed useless on screen but you knew that they were dangerous because they kept the Emperor on his throne and conquered worlds. The Droid Army just showed up one day and got its shit pushed in. Its threat felt forced.
The threat behind B1s is that they can make a near-infinite amount of them, so they can distract and overwhelm Jedi. Also, there are some pretty scary droids in the Trade Federation's army -- I know Droidekas were already mentioned but there are also buzz droids (which are an instant death warrant if you're in a starfighter), spider droids, halifire droids (crush everything in their path), and octuparra droids (spider droids armed with torpedoes). And sure, R2-D2 may have been able to outsmart the B2s, but that's because the B2s weren't prepared for an astromech to be a threat and it was a fairly isolated area -- B2s absolutely are scary if you're a Jedi or a clone trooper (what they're programmed to fight) on a battlefield with tons of other droids firing at you.
 
You can justify the B1s being a trash mob all you want, but that's one of the worst ways humanly possible to sell the threat of anything if the first thing you see out of the lot is them being taken apart and treated as mostly jokes. Sure, they got the droideka, but there's this thing.

It's called first impressions, and guess what the stormtroopers did that sold their first impression despite the pratfalls George had them do from time to time? Be really good at wiping out the Tantive IV's guards efficiently. And then later on turning Luke's uncle and aunt into a burned set of skeletons.

Sometimes a film decision is shit, and it's going to be shit no matter the justification. Stylistic suck is still suck, and in fact it's more obnoxious suck, since you knew you made something shit and are trying to get off for it. I uphold the B1s are too ineffectual in their first entry to make them ever come off as a threat, and paired with the Nemoidians over the topness, it botches the tone and leans too hard in them being goofy. Sure you got Maul and Sidious especially early on via holonet, but that's a thing you have to factor in.
 
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