US US Politics General - Discussion of President Biden and other politicians

  • 🔧 Actively working on site again.
Status
Not open for further replies.
BidenGIF.gif
 
Last edited:
  • Like
  • Winner
  • Informative
Reactions: ThisIsGonnaBeGood, The Shredder, ActualCracker and 120 others
Click to expand...
The Gene Genie said:
Again, this is all a misdirection. The H-1B was NEVER used for highly-skilled people. You don't need to be a highly-skilled person to possess a bachelor's degree. That's the criteria for it according to the Citizenship and Immigration Services. It does, to be fully transparent, note "Theoretical and practical application of a body of highly specialized knowledge" as another requirement but that could literally mean anything. That's vague as hell and anything can be highly specialized if you word it right.
Click to expand...
H1B is used for mainly two separate groups.

Very low-skilled it monkeys that work for slave wages doing tech support for Walmart via an outsourcing company. This group definitely displaces american workers and depress wages.

And a second group of 0.01% people working for Google/Space-X/Meta/Apple/... This second group all make minimum 250k$ base salary and likely up to the same again if you add in bonuses and stock options. When Elon talks about the best of the best, this is the group he is talking about. The 0.01% of engineers in the world. He sure as hell is not talking about a south-asian nigger working for poverty level salary at walmart tech support.

The frustrating part here is that the two sides that fight over the h1b debacle are both either ignorant or they just want to bang their drum and banging their drum demands that they willfully misrepresent the issue and ignore all nuance.


The people against h1b are all pointing to the indian faggots that stole low-skilled jobs from americans and working for slave wages at walmart. But they completely willfully ignore that Elon is not talking about these people when he mentions "the best of the best".
Or they are retarded and think that "the best engineers in the world" works at walmart.

If you explained this abuse of H1B to Elon he would agree and say "Fuck those niggers, we should close that type of visa abuse on day one. We want to import exceptional people, not mediocre people. We already have enough mediocre people, we don't need any more.".


When it comes to the truly brilliant 0.01%, Google/SpaceX/Meta/Apple/... already have hired every single one they can in america. There is not enough of them.
So either they lower their standards (they will not) or they will hire from abroad and bring over on h1b and other visas, and pay them just as much as everyone else in the same band.


Maybe a compromise would be :
Unlimited numbers of H1B visa available. Only condition is that they have to pay a minimum of 200k$ / year in base salary.
 
  • Like
  • Winner
  • Thunk-Provoking
Reactions: Rotdog, UERISIMILITUDO, spiritofamermaid and 16 others
FILTH Tourist said:
Is there a reason why we can't raise more "highly skilled people" ourselves? Also, even if we limit it to "highly skilled", they will still be willing to work for cheap compared to their American counterparts because they are getting paid with a visa. We have plenty of people with potential who are disillusioned due to DEI and H1B limiting their career prospects before they even really start. We need to tap into our own talent first before we start poaching from other developed countries.
Click to expand...
No real reason, except it takes a long time to see results.
So, you can fix the culture (make children strive to become a scientist or astronaut, not a youtuber) and education to focus on and make STEM a high priority.
Fix culture and fix education and maybe in 20 years time all these additional brilliant engineers will start to show up.

No need to pay them any less. They get the same salary as everyone else and big tech is not really interested in underpaying people. That shit would only make them unattractive for the tryly exceptional people out there.
(When I worked at Google the H1B folks I worked with all had the same salary as everyone else in their band. Today that would be base salary of $250k or so.)

The problem with training as an alternative to hire exceptional people is that there is only so much you can do with training. If you have very good training then that
can unlock an individuals full potential of intelligence and brilliance. But you can not go above that, not matter how much training you give a person.
Just like Ethan Ralph will never win the 100m sprint in the olympics no matter how much training he gets, same goes for engineers.
A persons level of brilliance is immutable. Training can unlock the potential but not go beyond.


It is great if tapping into own talent is viable but that will take a minimum of twenty years before it will have any material effect even if you are successful.
If a child is already stunted mentally and culturally by the age of ten, then it is too late.


Before Covid, people working at google considered themselves the smartest people in the world (this is true) but had hubris and thought that since they were the smartest people in the world there was no limit to what they could achieve (this is not true as it turns out.)

One of the programs that Google tried was very much about training.
They hired a whole bunch of minorities, with good technical skills, into a program. Smart people with good technical skills but not brilliant.
These were people that would not pass the hiring standards normally but we needed diversity so since we are Google why can't we take good engineers and train them into brilliant engineers?

So a program started with specialized training. No costs were saved. This was the best software engineering training that had ever taken place in human history.
There were no limits on resources. You give training on how to build a scalable global database. Ok, send in Jeff Dean and his team to give a course on Spanner, how it was designed, how it works and why it works. You give training in GOlang? Ok, bring in the team that maintains the GO language standard and who wrote the compiler.
etc etc
Never before and never again will a teaching program of this caliber ever be attempted (or maybe even feasible).

What was the end result? They all joined together and sued Google.
Turns out that even with the best training program ever devised in human history they still could not go beyond their potential and become brilliant.
And as sub-brilliants going up for promotion against peers that were all brilliant they obviously fell behind on promotion.
And that is what they sued for.

Just like you can not train Ethan Ralph to become the fastest sprinter in the world, no amount of training can turn an average engineer into a brilliant engineer.

Google nowadays pretend that this experiment never happened and they will never repeat it. No other tech giant will perform this experiment either.


You can train an average person to acquire average skills and perform an average task. Training is good at that. But you can not train someone to become the next Jeff Dean.
Not even if you have all the resources of Google.
 
Last edited:
  • Informative
  • Like
  • Optimistic
Reactions: Davis, LeChampion1992, UERISIMILITUDO and 15 others
Cuckoman said:
The frustrating part here is that the two sides that fight over the h1b debacle are both either ignorant or they just want to bang their drum and banging their drum demands that they willfully misrepresent the issue and ignore all nuance.
Click to expand...
I think you discount the majority of H1Bs filling "low skilled" jobs too much. A lot of entry level tech jobs are taken up by H1B and I'd wager this contributes heavily to fresh grads needing to throw out dozens or even 100+ applications to get their first job as a lot of places keep job postings up to say they can't fill them to justify H1B jeets. This also contributes to wage stagnation/depression.
Even at higher levels you can't escape them as an entire section of an office may have contractor H1Bs you have to get stuff from or run stuff through and they're just madly incompetent but if there's ever a mistake they'll swear up and down it was anything but them. They didn't get the email, they didn't get the notification, something is slow, no one told them, etc etc.
 
  • Like
  • Agree
  • Feels
Reactions: UERISIMILITUDO, spiritofamermaid, Alex Yiik and 17 others
  • Optimistic
Reactions: Betonhaus
Aidan said:
I think you discount the majority of H1Bs filling "low skilled" jobs too much. A lot of entry level tech jobs are taken up by H1B and I'd wager this contributes heavily to fresh grads needing to throw out dozens or even 100+ applications to get their first job as a lot of places keep job postings up to say they can't fill them to justify H1B jeets. This also contributes to wage stagnation/depression.
Even at higher levels you can't escape them as an entire section of an office may have contractor H1Bs you have to get stuff from or run stuff through and they're just madly incompetent but if there's ever a mistake they'll swear up and down it was anything but them. They didn't get the email, they didn't get the notification, something is slow, no one told them, etc etc.
Click to expand...
Unlimited number of VISAs but only for positions that pay >=200k$ base salary.
That solves it.
No one will import low skilled worker and pay 200k$ / year

Big Tech that needs skilled workers can still hire and they already pay well above 200k$/year.

Do you think when Elon says "the best of the best" that he means the low-skilled entry level jobs?
 
  • Like
  • Thunk-Provoking
  • Optimistic
Reactions: UERISIMILITUDO, spiritofamermaid, Pocket_Sand! and 7 others
Sekirodiealot said:
That's just sad. They're reality will be shattered in a few hours
Click to expand...
I was watching a lot of GOP and far right going on about how 2020 election would be overturned via things like this. (j6 style mentality) and knew that it wouldn't happen.

So when the left tries it too, oh well. It's just retarded to overturn things in general "both sides"
 
  • Like
Reactions: spiritofamermaid, MrJokerRager, Pocket_Sand! and 2 others
Jace on ice said:
The average IQ in India is 73 almost 30 points below the average IQ of someone living in Alabama, if there are absurdly gifted people there they are very few and far between.
Click to expand...
A lot of these "averages" that people always like to bring up regarding 3rd world countries have to do with malnutrition, and not genetic differences.
Don't take this the wrong way and assume that I'm saying you can make an Indian into a White person by feeding them enough burgers, but that when you talk about the average African being dumber than Koko or the average Indian man being weaker than a White woman, something drastic like that has significantly more to do with malnutrition during puberty than genetics.

That said, this is still ultimately in concurrence with what you're saying. You can't argue in favor for H1Bs from a practical angle, only a humanitarian one, because you're significantly more likely to find talent by training Americans. Or they could stop trying to lie about their intentions, and outright say "Yes, we want Indians because they're cheaper, not better."
 
  • Optimistic
  • Agree
  • Like
Reactions: Davis, UERISIMILITUDO, spiritofamermaid and 11 others
mlanguishi said:
I was watching a lot of GOP and far right going on about how 2020 election would be overturned via things like this. (j6 style mentality) and knew that it wouldn't happen.

So when the left tries it too, oh well. It's just retarded to overturn things in general "both sides"
Click to expand...
The left did set the precedent so it won't surprise me
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back