US US Politics General 2 - Discussion of President Trump and other politicians

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Should be a wild four years.

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That's an interesting thing then because Tesla and Elon are attached at the hip with the current US government administration. I am curious if the same thing would happen to another company that isn't as directly politically connected. Say for example Walmart or Starbucks piss people off and they start getting materially vandalized (not just spraypaint) but there's no harm to human life (say it happens when they're closed)... in essence if people damage a corporations property with the intent of changing that companies policies (but not the government) then would a terrorism charge still be applicable?
The main factor of what turns a crime into terrorism is the intent. Terrorism is just any crime intended to intimidate civilians or influence the policy of the government through unlawful violent acts.
They are attacking Tesla because they are angry at government policy and they created the website to show all the people who own said cars because they want to influence how people vote and act.
 
"political violence" means assassinations, kidnappings and shit and sometimes also includes the damage of private property.

There's no violence happening. The cars are inanimate objects and belong to a company.

Destruction of property is violence, and at least in my state, I can use deadly force to put a stop to it. "But it's company property." And if a company security guard shoots you, congrats on getting ventilated by company bullets, I guess.
 
It's not the target that matters. It's the purpose and intent of the people committing the acts of violence, destruction or vandalism. If people decide to start firebombing Walmarts nationwide because they want Trump to do X thing and for some reason they think that's the best way to achieve it, they're engaging in domestic terrorism.

It's a very simple definition -- committing violent or destructive crimes with the purpose of forcing political change. Just because not enough of it gets prosecuted doesn't mean it isn't pretty widespread now.
The main factor of what turns a crime into terrorism is the intent. Terrorism is just any crime intended to intimidate civilians or influence the policy of the government through unlawful violent acts.
They are attacking Tesla because they are angry at government policy and they created the website to show all the people who own said cars because they want to influence how people vote and act.
No I'm not saying these hypothetical attacks would be aimed at changing government policy or politics but rather the policies of a private mega corporation.

Like think of the way people take rental escooters and deliberately damage them, or those little food delivery robots in the city. If people start firebombing those because the megacorp that owns them has caused job losses or is just shitty in general but is not politically attached to the government - what happens then? Like what if Amazon builds humanoid robots that are on every street corner and have taken a bunch of jobs or maybe one of them went haywire and killed some kid and people went apeshit and started destroying them?
 
I think it easily qualifies.
View attachment 7113956

Pretty handy breakdown there.
Terrorism laws are retarded. I classify them in the same bullshit category as hate crimes. I shoot a nigger? Murder. I shoot a nigger and say "fuck you, nigger," murder with hate crime modifier.

Burn a building down, arson. Burn a Tesla dealership down, arson with domestic terrorism modifier.

It's all bullshit. There are already laws to punish unlawful behavior. Instead of playing political gotcha games, they should be enforcing the fucking law. Why are they not using these resources to look back and get the people that tried to burn down federal court houses?
No I'm not saying these hypothetical attacks would be aimed at changing government policy or politics but rather the policies of a private mega corporation.

Like think of the way people take rental escooters and deliberately damage them, or those little food delivery robots in the city. If people start firebombing those because the megacorp that owns them has caused job losses or is just shitty in general but is not politically attached to the government - what happens then? Like what if Amazon builds humanoid robots that are on every street corner and have taken a bunch of jobs or maybe one of them went haywire and killed some kid and people went apeshit and started destroying them?
In this hypothetical, is Jeff Bezos personal friends with the president? If yes, terrorism, if no, regular destruction of property.
 
Terrorism laws are retarded. I classify them in the same bullshit category as hate crimes. I shoot a nigger? Murder. I shoot a nigger and say "fuck you, nigger," murder with hate crime modifier.

Burn a building down, arson. Burn a Tesla dealership down, arson with domestic terrorism modifier.

It's all bullshit. There are already laws to punish unlawful behavior. Instead of playing political gotcha games, they should be enforcing the fucking law. Why are they not using these resources to look back and get the people that tried to burn down federal court houses?

In this hypothetical, is Jeff Bezos personal friends with the president? If yes, terrorism, if no, regular destruction of property.
Don't like it when it applies to lefties, huh? Kill yourself, faggot.
 
What do you guys think of how the phrase MAGA being used as an insult and even slang? It's hard to take seriously, especially when leftist say MAGAT because it destroys their "Trump is a bully/dehumanizes people" argument when they did that with him and his supporters for a decade.
The m-word is OUR word, they don't get to say it
 
No I'm not saying these hypothetical attacks would be aimed at changing government policy or politics but rather the policies of a private mega corporation.

Like think of the way people take rental escooters and deliberately damage them, or those little food delivery robots in the city. If people start firebombing those because the megacorp that owns them has caused job losses or is just shitty in general but is not politically attached to the government - what happens then? Like what if Amazon builds humanoid robots that are on every street corner and have taken a bunch of jobs or maybe one of them went haywire and killed some kid and people went apeshit and started destroying them?
Ah I see what you mean. It's still terrorism -- the government or its policies doesn't have to be the final target. It's violence being committed specifically to effect change (e.g. "stop building the killer robbits").
 
Like think of the way people take rental escooters and deliberately damage them, or those little food delivery robots in the city. If people start firebombing those because the megacorp that owns them has caused job losses or is just shitty in general but is not politically attached to the government - what happens then? Like what if Amazon builds humanoid robots that are on every street corner and have taken a bunch of jobs or maybe one of them went haywire and killed some kid and people went apeshit and started destroying them?
I'm not sure if there has been a group that went after only one corporation over something like that as the closet would be eco-terrorists who targeted businesses and schools which as you can tell still has the word terrorism in it. You are still using crime to sow fear to make them doing something you want.
 
Don't like it when it applies to lefties, huh? Kill yourself, faggot.
No, nigger, I don't like them at all.

Terrorism laws are a bullshit scam to take away our rights. I didn't like it when Biden used the DOJ to specifically target the J6 Unguided Boomer Tour and I don't like it now that Trump is using terrorism laws to protect fucking Tesla, for no other reason than he personally likes Elon Musk. Why didn't Trump use these bullshit terrorism laws on the people that attacked cops and tried to burn down police stations and federal courthouses in 2020?
 
Ah I see what you mean. It's still terrorism -- the government or its policies doesn't have to be the final target. It's violence being committed specifically to effect change (e.g. "stop building the killer robbits").
Interesting, and yeah something like "stop building the killer robots" is a good example. The anti-AI sphere has some people who have said it would ok to launch airstrikes on datacenters to stop the growth of AI because they're concerned about AGI or superintelligence being developed and that it would wipe out humanity.

There's an absurd amount of money that has gone towards anti-AI or "AI safety" shit: https://kiwifarms.st/threads/effective-altruism-eas.151752/post-20841036 and a lot of the key AI people seem to believe in Roko's Basilisk shit (basically if they don't help the AI come to life then it'll torture them for the rest of eternity or some shit)

Another good example would be the vandalism of 5G towers, but I never saw any terrorism charges stem from that? Most of the articles I found about 5G tower destruction didn't mention the word terrorism at all, but one case did: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-65377361 (but they were calling for politicians to be hung)

What's interesting is that telecommunications infrastructure is probably termed as "critical infrastructure" so the destruction of it might carry other charges that aren't related to terrorism.

Government policy doesn't really apply to stuff like that.

Anyway, an interesting thing to ponder and people's attitude towards giant corporations has become increasingly heated in recent history. That was why I was asking about the "terrorism" stuff btw - because I am certain in the near future we'll have some sort of scenario like the above that I mentioned start to happen.

(just to make clear I'm not advocating for anything, I am just curious about what happens in the near and far future)
 
No I'm not saying these hypothetical attacks would be aimed at changing government policy or politics but rather the policies of a private mega corporation.

Like think of the way people take rental escooters and deliberately damage them, or those little food delivery robots in the city. If people start firebombing those because the megacorp that owns them has caused job losses or is just shitty in general but is not politically attached to the government - what happens then? Like what if Amazon builds humanoid robots that are on every street corner and have taken a bunch of jobs or maybe one of them went haywire and killed some kid and people went apeshit and started destroying them?
It's still terrorism. You're trying to use violence, and the threat of more of it, to get people to do what you want.
 
It's still terrorism. You're trying to use violence, and the threat of more of it, to get people to do what you want.
Under the legal definition of terrorism in the US it wouldn't be considered terrorism:

There's a few things mentioned:
  • (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
  • (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
  • (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping;
Destroying megacorp's robot fleet doesn't fall under any of these because it isn't threatening or coercing a civilian population or the policy of a government and doesn't involve violence against a human.
There are provisions for critical infrastructure (such as 5G towers) but megacorp's robot fleet doesn't seem like it has some special legal provision/protection.
 
Burn a building down, arson. Burn a Tesla dealership down, arson with domestic terrorism modifier.

It's all bullshit. There are already laws to punish unlawful behavior
I don't think you grasp the law very well, it's understandable it can be confusing. If you rob someone with deadly force it's much more serious than strongarm robbery. Let's take a more simple case, murder; losing your shit and murdering someone is a much less serious offense than if you plan out killing your ex boss because he fired you. This stuff is in same vein.
 
No, nigger, I don't like them at all.

Terrorism laws are a bullshit scam to take away our rights. I didn't like it when Biden used the DOJ to specifically target the J6 Unguided Boomer Tour and I don't like it now that Trump is using terrorism laws to protect fucking Tesla, for no other reason than he personally likes Elon Musk. Why didn't Trump use these bullshit terrorism laws on the people that attacked cops and tried to burn down police stations and federal courthouses in 2020?
You're not wrong but so what, we should just allow Paid Protesters to torch down Tesla just because Elon sucks? I completely agree its bullshit that anyone can be organized as a terrorist organization on the whim of the President but these (more than likely paid) Protesters are literally burning down businesses in a coordinated attack all over the country at Tesla dealerships because they are upset Elon is finding fraud and abuse? Also in 2020 Trump was literally under so much scrutiny even by his own party he wasn't able to get anything done during that time. We should all be thinking about the American workers at those dealerships who have nothing to do with Elon or his politics and Feel unsafe at work now and are being targeted and harassed for no real reason other than having a job.
 
No, nigger, I don't like them at all.

Terrorism laws are a bullshit scam to take away our rights. I didn't like it when Biden used the DOJ to specifically target the J6 Unguided Boomer Tour and I don't like it now that Trump is using terrorism laws to protect fucking Tesla, for no other reason than he personally likes Elon Musk. Why didn't Trump use these bullshit terrorism laws on the people that attacked cops and tried to burn down police stations and federal courthouses in 2020?
These laws aren't going away, and if some Rand Paul figure got into office and abolished them the next Democrat after him will reinstate these laws. The best we can do is use the same power against the left.
 
I don't think you grasp the law very well, it's understandable it can be confusing. If you rob someone with deadly force it's much more serious than strongarm robbery. Let's take a more simple case, murder; losing your shit and murdering someone is a much less serious offense than if you plan out killing your ex boss because he fired you. This stuff is in same vein.
It's not that he doesn't understand the law, it's that nobody seems capable of grasping the simple point he's making.

Having a law against [thing] and a law against [thing] plus [feelings] is bullshit. Killing a person is killing a person regardless of the color of their skin, and applying additional draconic punishments for the same action because there's some magical intent behind it is easily abused. Due to political reasons, the punishment for a white man killing a black man can be way more severe than a black man killing a white man. Due to politics, firebombing car dealership A is a much worse crime than doing the same amount of damage to dealership B. Is this equal treatment under the law? There are existing laws that can be applied equally that already lock people away in all of these scenarios. Implementing conditional bonuses might sound fun in the moment, but it always just ends up making things shittier for normal people in the long run.

By the way that's just my devil's advocate defense of the point. Personally, I'm so sick of these fuckers, I think that the people should hand Trump a gold plated handgun, round them up with no trial (and a quarter of the judiciary too for good measure) place them on Fifth Avenue, and let him realize one of his classic comments - a DOGE approved cheap for the tax payer resolution to a lot of problems
Donald Trump:

I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters
 
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