US US Politics General 2 - Discussion of President Trump and other politicians

  • 🐕 I am attempting to get the site runnning as fast as possible. If you are experiencing slow page load times, please report it.
General Trump Banner.png

Should be a wild four years.

Helpful links for those who need them:

Current members of the House of Representatives
https://www.house.gov/representatives

Current members of the Senate
https://www.senate.gov/senators/

Current members of the US Supreme Court
https://www.supremecourt.gov/about/biographies.aspx

Members of the Trump Administration
https://www.whitehouse.gov/administration/
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Just wanted to point out that while bad things can happen with those examples there's also more good that comes from them. Cars for example provide transportation for people, goods, and services. What good does porn provide for society that would be akin to that?
It's not about the good of porn, it's about the bad of what that kind of legislation means. When the government is able to restrict internet access based on purely partisan morality you're opening the door to that same standard being applied when those same libs you're trying so hard to own are in power and you can be sure they're going to do the same thing to you. When they petition for mandatory government IDs to access some things on the internet, it's not long before that gets expanded to include more and more content. Governments do not give up or restrict their power, they always expand and abuse it.

And that's just talking about governments, that isn't even talking about risk adverse big tech companies. If the legislation is so vague that anything "objectionable" being shown to a minor is legally actionable they'll lock their websites down. You know how now you can't browse Youtube without an account because they force you to sign-in to view anything their jeet algorithm flags as 18+? Have fun putting in your government ID in order to view lolcow content on Youtube.
 
I was about to go to sleep. But then suddenly it occurred to me…
There are Jews in Massie’s district?! Appalachian Jews from rural Kentucky? I need to see this before I die 🍿
Last time he sperged out about this, it turned out that the “constituent” he was complaining about Massie refusing to meet was a lobbyist who didn’t even live in his district and had attacked him in the past.
 
This is what is so tilting about this discussion because it's not even like the Patriot Act is some obscure piece of legislation from the 1830s only history geeks would know about. And it's the same story as back then, everyone who was against mass government surveillance was just a terrorist sympathizer who hates America, same lack of ability to actually argue in favor of what they wanted without resorting to ad-homs and trying to change the subject every 5 seconds.

Dumb retards thinking this won't completely backfire because "porn bad", "gooning bad" (so it's okay), are so completely backwards and retarded that they haven't been paying attention to what the government does and IS. The government doesn't give a shit about protecting YOU. They want to protect their jobs. Therefore, they'll go with the mob, because they don't want to get tossed out onto the street.
 
It's not about the good of porn, it's about the bad of what that kind of legislation means. When the government is able to restrict internet access based on purely partisan morality you're opening the door to that same standard being applied when those same libs you're trying so hard to own are in power and you can be sure they're going to do the same thing to you. When they petition for mandatory government IDs to access some things on the internet, it's not long before that gets expanded to include more and more content. Governments do not give up or restrict their power, they always expand and abuse it.
WHY IS YOUR TEXT TINY
 
accept that you know the following things you cannot possibly know
Okay, look, I'll even admit this whole thing is correct. You are absolutely right on a technical level.

The thing I am trying and failing to convey is that even if you are technically correct, it does not matter because it looks a certain way if not viewed from a technical level.

I am mostly focused on this kind of thing from a different angle of "what secures victory for position ABC?" And unfortunately the ulterior motive insinuation attack works because there is a kernel of truth to it more often than not, even if imperfect. I don't like how easy the attack angle is because it undermines Internet free speech argumentation in general by association in my opinion.

That's it, really.
 
Dumb retards thinking this won't completely backfire because "porn bad", "gooning bad" (so it's okay), are so completely backwards and retarded that they haven't been paying attention to what the government does and IS. The government doesn't give a shit about protecting YOU. They want to protect their jobs. Therefore, they'll go with the mob, because they don't want to get tossed out onto the street.
Being illogical is not the same as being a retard. Even retards are capable, if slowly, of following logic.

These people are an echelon below retards.
it does not matter because it looks a certain way if not viewed from a technical level.
It does not 'look a certain way if not viewed from a technical level', it merely isn't unless you're a bad-faith actor and it is not different in substance from saying 'it looks like you're a closeted fag if you don't want gay marriage'.
there is a kernel of truth to it more often than not,
Is in conflict with:
I'll even admit this whole thing is correct
so pick one and stick with it if you want to continue this discussion. As it's just an extension of the paraconsistency you attempted to leverage to validate the viewpoint that there 'is a kernel of truth to it more often than not' in the first place.

There's no reason it cannot be equally stated that there is 'more often a kernel of truth than not' to the accusation that people against trannies in women's sports are secretly tranny-lovers, or that people against abortion are misogynist incels.

This is circumlocution and I'm not going to let you go without being called out for it. At this point out of respect, if anything, for the fact that you're even attempting a logical discussion rather than mindless monkey-tier shitflinging.

Edit: And I get, by the way, that you're 'on the same side' as I am. That makes this worse, not better.
 
Last edited:
They shouldn't have that fucking data in the first place.
Then how do you respond to people pointing out there are ways to verify identity without porn sites even having the data? Or will you shift the goalposts again?
This whole "You're either with us or with the gooners" bullshit is just as disingenuous as George W. saying "You're either with us or with the terrorists!"

And you a hypocrite for pushing it. Not trying to be a dick, because I like you.

And Hegel laughs at us all from Hell.
Some of my posts are intentionally a little inflammatory and that was one of them. This is the Thunderdome, after all. My real, not-trying-to-be-cheeky response is here and, so far, no one's really responded to it or my points within. Take it however you like. I do not believe that pornography is the canary in the coal mine for free speech. When people say "requiring identification for online porn sites is a slippery slope to overbearing government control," but say nothing about requiring identification to do everything else, it makes me think they are either knee-jerk reacting to anything government, annoyed that their personal porn consumption will be inconvenienced, or - at the very worst - want kids to easily access pornography.

Lastly, although this is a separate issue, if people were really that concerned about ID verification to access porn sites, they would call their representatives about the legislation. I called my reps about a right to repair bill in my state (which passed) and doing that got me called all manner of bad names by anti-government types - none on this site, since it was before I joined - but a lot of people who caterwaul about government overreach also bemoan the impossibility of doing anything to stop it. If people are too cowardly to stand by their convictions and participate in the political process, then fuck 'em.

PS: I think, if Hegel knew what havoc he wrought centuries later, he would have become a carpenter or something.
 
Last time he sperged out about this, it turned out that the “constituent” he was complaining about Massie refusing to meet was a lobbyist who didn’t even live in his district and had attacked him in the past.
For fucks sake man, that’s like finding out Santa isn’t real. Very disappointing. Could you imagine?
I think Moishe is a Doggone gentile! I was fixin for some Matza balls but he done fucked up ma’s old recipe
 
Do you guys let your kids walk into sex toy shops? Then why would you give them
unmonitored internet access and then blame the site owners for your lack of attention to what your kids are up to? Porn or not there is bad shit on the internet nowadays your kids don’t need to see.
Dont you get it? Its because setting up parental controls and securing your network is too hard, too much time. Parents are quick to point out the societal rot but are too lazy and willfully ignorant or straight up retarded to do their one job, parent their own kids. Theyd rather have the same government who was fine with giving puberty blockers to kids to parent their own children. The boot licking is nauseating
 
I object to this characterization. I think some do understand the concern, they just do not find it compelling enough.

Further, can you really blame ascribing ulterior motives to the pro-porn-by-unfortunate-coincidence position when it turns out to often actually be true?
I don't really follow a ton of cows to see that, mostly political ones. I think there were more than a few cases where people making pro-child porn arguments such as Vaush and Destiny were exposed as outright degenerates, but I'd argue that CP is indefensible in any form anyway.

Personally I put mental quotation marks around the word "pro" when it comes to "Pro"-porn side. It's less they're approving of the existence of such material, and more they're opposed to its banning and restricting because it'd necessitate the government's involvement on the internet (though maybe they have nothing to worry about ultimately, if the UK's new ruling yet ease of access to this site is any indication).

IRL it was easy to cordon off sections of stores where the 'adult' material was on display and whatnot, but a similar approach to the internet is a tad more difficult. ISPs can block access to adult sites if you request it, but it's usually drawn from a list and doesn't encompass the entire internet, and it differs by ISP. And even on websites that should be safe (youtube, twitch, roblox, tiktok), people still try to skirt the edge of what's acceptable to show kids. If it's present on every square inch of the internet, then you'd need to basically restrict all of it, which considering this website is a pretty good news aggregate and banning its users from accessing it is in the interest of my government, I'm understandably conflicted on.

The argument that parents need to be better parents is one I find personally compelling. In the UK News thread, I also posited that parents don't want to hold the blame on themselves for why their kid became a fuck-up/murderer/whatever, and will often pin the blame on something/someone else in order to ease their own conscience. You see it all the time in America too "he a gud boy, he dindu nothin'", etcetera. Make parents more accountable, for starters, and make it acceptable to discuss the actual negative effects of porn (for now, how it might lead to one becoming trans is taboo) and you should see certain problems become mitigated.
 
I do not believe that pornography is the canary in the coal mine for free speech.
I certainly did not say it was you illiterate fucking retard.

Most people are not making that argument. The argument is that it will be much worse than 'the canary in the coal mine for free speech' much like the Patriot Act was much worse than 'people getting spied on by NSA agents'.
 
Is the porn ID requirement any different from these things? If so why? And why do you figure that this law is the back door to tyranny compared to say needing ID for booze.
Because it's on the internet. That's the big thing.
Porn is good! =/= Restricting access to it is bad.
Whilst these arguments do appear to support one another, the big asterisk is that the IDs for booze and to drive a car are outside the home, whereas restricting certain things on the internet brings the government into your home, yeah, because they need to see all your internet traffic to see what sites your accessing to make judgement on whether you're accessing illegal content or not. It's the worst-case scenario of what such a restriction would allow, but that's my understanding of it.
 
no one's really responded to it or my points within.
But, there has been quite a bit of "discussion" about most of those points. Personally, I think the boot coming down on us all is absolutely inevitable, anyways, and no amount of REEEEEing here or anywhere else is going to do anything about it. But I don't have to like it. And I don't have to like gooners, either.

On a powerlevelish note, I'm glad my gramps caught me when I found my uncles old porno stash in his shed when I was a kid, before this whole fancy newfangled internet thing, and TALKED to me about what it was, and why I should probably avoid it. My uncle being kind of a shitbag helped reinforce it, too. So, I've never had much use for porn, because of that. And I thank God and my Granddad for this, because the coomer rabbit hole is fucking horrifying to me. The fact that the whole debate comes down to freedom of coomin and goonin is very disheartening.
 
because they need to see all your internet traffic to see what sites your accessing to make judgement on whether you're accessing illegal content or not. It's the worst-case scenario of what such a restriction would allow, but that's my understanding of it.
It would wipe for one thing the necessity of a warrant to weaponize your data against you and make it normalized for the government to have the capacity to, say, attach an AI to search with keyword detection for words like 'nigger' in any and all posts that are now attached to your real name with not even the figleaf of due process between you and suddenly, mysteriously, getting audited by the IRS every two years.
 
Apologies for necroing a debate but you have to use a ID to get a Uphold/Coinbase/any crypto account. Why would a site that'll want payment details would not want a ID so that they could verify the person paying for it. All I'm saying is porn is better when you have to physically to pay for it but when you have unfettered access to it, it'll be a extreme that is comparable to a addiction to drugs if not exactly like an addiction.
 
It's not about the good of porn, it's about the bad of what that kind of legislation means. When the government is able to restrict internet access based on purely partisan morality you're opening the door to that same standard being applied when those same libs you're trying so hard to own are in power and you can be sure they're going to do the same thing to you. When they petition for mandatory government IDs to access some things on the internet, it's not long before that gets expanded to include more and more content. Governments do not give up or restrict their power, they always expand and abuse it.
While I do agree with you, the social decay caused by porn is exponentially faster and looks like it is worse than what the government can do in that time. The boogeyman that the "otherside is gonna do it to you if you do it", in reality, is fake and gay. They do this kinda stuff already and the nudges like this are less meaningful than you'd think. Because of that it does come down to the "good" of things in the end
And that's just talking about governments, that isn't even talking about risk adverse big tech companies. If the legislation is so vague that anything "objectionable" being shown to a minor is legally actionable they'll lock their websites down. You know how now you can't browse Youtube without an account because they force you to sign-in to view anything their jeet algorithm flags as 18+? Have fun putting in your government ID in order to view lolcow content on Youtube.
So because the risk adverse tech companies could do something we as a society should be paralyzed in fear and just not do anything? Isn't that worse than trying to stand up for something and being wrong?

Instagram makes you sign in if you wanna view virtually anything on there, 18+ or not. Tech companies can implement this with or without legislature. Bending the knee and sucking dick for porn isn't going to save you from the boot
 
Back