Boeing Troubles - One of the world's largest aerospace manufacturers keeps having problems with their planes.

[Among Us Gaming]

The Max 737's seem like they where thrown together on a short budget with not enough time to properly test it and make changes.

Thats essentially why the MAX was created.
The A320 NEO put Boeing in a serious bind, as it competed for the same market share as the 737 NG, but was a newer design that was more automated (very appealing for 3rd world countries that have a lesser stock of good pilots), several thousand pounds more useful load, and importantly, much more fuel efficient, leading to a lower fuel burn, and longer range travel. Couple that with the fact that the 737 airframe is 60 year old design really showing its age (cough cough spoiler mixer), and Boeing was panicking because the one thing they make and sell the the most of was almost completely outclassed.

Thats where the time crunch came from. They needed to get something competitive out immediately before the A320 NEO tookover more of Boeings marketshare, and if they had to wait on the FAA to certify a brand new airframe, it would likely take at a minimum of 5 years, which would give Airbus a ton of essentially free reign.

 

[Falcos_Commisar]

The Max 737's seem like they where thrown together on a short budget with not enough time to properly test it and make changes. I've only flown on 737's and Dash 8s and the older 737s feel much safer. From what I've heard the triple 7 is a decent plane but it is not a budget plane so they probably wouldn't cut as many corners on it.

From 737 pilots they almost all say the MAX is a better airplane than the NG.

Better interior, better engines, and a better radar.

 

[Google.com]

From 737 pilots they almost all say the MAX is a better airplane than the NG.

Better interior, better engines, and a better radar.

Because the Max is just an NG with a couple of patches cobbled together to keep it competitive. But it doesn't change the fact that the airframe is aging and the avionics in the max wouldn't be able to get certification today as shown by Boeing having to beg the government to certify the rest of the models.

The 737 family should have ended and been replaced decades ago but they decided to keep putting tape on it instead. The 737 is simply at its core not built for this modern age. The avionics of course could be fixed at a cost(Boeing isn't willing to pay) but what cant be is the fact the family was built for tiny 60s era jets.

Shit don't fit no more.

 

[Among Us Gaming]

The 737 family should have ended and been replaced decades ago but they decided to keep putting tape on it instead

The real question is, can they make a new airframe? Their newest airframe, the 787, is already approaching 20 years old.

 

[Betonhaus]

The real question is, can they make a new airframe? Their newest airframe, the 787, is already approaching 20 years old.

i doubt it. they're an accounting firm, not an engineering firm. Their entire strategy for dealing with competition was to bribe the FAA to ban it, which backfired horribly when Bombardier sold the Cseries to Airbus who mass produced it.

 

[Google.com]

The real question is, can they make a new airframe? Their newest airframe, the 787, is already approaching 20 years old.

I mean 20 isn't that old for the design itself, for the actual frames ya. But with how fucked the 787s production and development has been I am sure whatever the 797 ends up being it will have a completely fucked development and production cycle. I think it can't be understated how fucked the 787s production has been, all the delays and stoppages not to mention the first 20 PRODUCTION aircraft had major errors which reduced their range and fuel efficiency forcing Boeing to sell them at a major loss due to the fact no one wanted them.

They have to make the 797 they can't even bring back the 757 as 737 replacement like people meme about they tossed the tooling. Even if they did it'd be dumb because Boeing already figured out the 757 would make a terrible shrink due to it's big and heavy landing gear and other issues when they first developed the 757. It will have to be a very original design and with their record recently it will be completely fucked in development and it'll take them years to figure out how to even build the pile of shit properly. If the 787 was already so much of a mess decades ago and they have only gotten more retarded it's horrifying to imagine how fucked the 797 will be.

They are also going to have to compete with more, not only do they need to replace the current 737's they will need to better compete with the A321 variants/replace the 757 properly finally. And they have to do it at the right time.

I am not one who believes Boeings downfall is entirely due to mixing with Mcdouglas management with the merger, Boeing has already been pretty fucking shady. But McDouglas failed partly because their lack of innovation opting to instead reuse the same aging technology and designs to cut cost... Really feels like Boeing is going to same way.

 

[Falcos_Commisar]

I mean 20 isn't that old for the design itself, for the actual frames ya. But with how fucked the 787s production and development has been I am sure whatever the 797 ends up being it will have a completely fucked development and production cycle. I think it can't be understated how fucked the 787s production has been, all the delays and stoppages not to mention the first 20 PRODUCTION aircraft had major errors which reduced their range and fuel efficiency forcing Boeing to sell them at a major loss due to the fact no one wanted them.

They have to make the 797 they can't even bring back the 757 as 737 replacement like people meme about they tossed the tooling. Even if they did it'd be dumb because Boeing already figured out the 757 would make a terrible shrink due to it's big and heavy landing gear and other issues when they first developed the 757. It will have to be a very original design and with their record recently it will be completely fucked in development and it'll take them years to figure out how to even build the pile of shit properly. If the 787 was already so much of a mess decades ago and they have only gotten more retarded it's horrifying to imagine how fucked the 797 will be.

They are also going to have to compete with more, not only do they need to replace the current 737's they will need to better compete with the A321 variants/replace the 757 properly finally. And they have to do it at the right time.

I am not one who believes Boeings downfall is entirely due to mixing with Mcdouglas management with the merger, Boeing has already been pretty fucking shady. But McDouglas failed partly because their lack of innovation opting to instead reuse the same aging technology and designs to cut cost... Really feels like Boeing is going to same way.

The 787 was such a cluster fuck because the retarded accountants at Boeing decided to make it all over the world (especially Japan) in the retarded belief that this would make those countries loyal to Boeing forever. It was also a groundbreaking jet so it had a LOT of "first time doing this" issues.

In Japan's case they happily took Boeing investment and know how then immediately bought Airbus a few years later.

Boeing can absolutely design a new jet or three, you just need to kneecap the accounting department or just nationalize it.

 

[namelesstacotruck]

Boeing can absolutely design a new jet or three, you just need to kneecap the accounting department or just nationalize it.

Why do you think Shaniqua, Sandeep, Juan, and Chong can design a new jet? Chong maybe, but he is so busy and working overnight to make sure China's equivalent is on track.

 

[Among Us Gaming]

Boeing can absolutely design a new jet or three, you just need to kneecap the accounting department or just nationalize it.

Yes, but my point is, that was nearly 20 years ago. I'm not asking if they  were able to do so, nor do I criticize the 787. What I'm getting at is, does Boeing, in the year 2025, have the engineering talent, and manufacturing talent, to design, create, and bring to market a new competitive airframe.
I'm as of now not convinced they're capable of that.
The other question even is this: does that even matter? Its Boeing, they basically have guaranteed infinite government bailouts waiting for them; market forces don't apply on a primal level. You might say "well the government could forcibly restructure/nationalize them" and maybe they technically could, but would they? Why would you invest even more time and money, when you could wag your finger after giving them a bailout?

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

It took Boeing, converting 100 767s and 12 years, to lose 6 billion on the KC-46 program. Apparently, those are rookie numbers in this racket.

Adding more to the lunacy of the KC-46, it is the second attempt using the 767 and is the one that's shit. Boeing prior tanker based on the 767 is the KC-767, which, for the information I could find online. It was functionally problem free and the USAF had bought 80 of them and were using them without incident. Of course Boeing corporate executives just had to go take a massive shit on Uncle Sam's money bed and got caught doing it. Of which the USAF canceled the ongoing contracts for more KC-767s and instantly retired the ones they already had. What exactly did the Boeing executives

 

[1Tonka_Truck]

USAF had bought 80 of them

USAF leased them from Boeing after Boeing bribed the shit out of a Procurement Officer.

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

USAF leased them from Boeing after Boeing bribed the shit out of a Procurement Officer.

Would this Link Archive link be an accurate account of this?
Brief excerpt from intro

The U.S. defense acquisition system’s “revolving door” is legendary, but few cases of officials performing favors in exchange for post-retirement jobs have been successfully prosecuted. In 2004, a senior U.S. Air Force procurement official was arrested in a textbook example of revolving door corruption, landing not only herself but also senior executives from contractor Boeing in jail.

 

[Car Won't Crank]

The 787 was such a cluster fuck because the retarded accountants at Boeing decided to make it all over the world (especially Japan) in the retarded belief that this would make those countries loyal to Boeing forever. It was also a groundbreaking jet so it had a LOT of "first time doing this" issues.

I thought Boeing's reason to spread the manufacturing of crucial 787 components to countries friendly with the US was to use that as leverage to sell 787s to those countries' flag carriers because they'd be invested in the 787 down to its production.

Why do you think Shaniqua, Sandeep, Juan, and Chong can design a new jet? Chong maybe, but he is so busy and working overnight to make sure China's equivalent is on track.

I dunno about Shaniqua and Sandeep, but Juan (Brazil) and Chong from China can sure make airplanes. Brazil is obviously more adept and experienced at it.

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

Probably Boeing was trying to take a page out of Lockheed's F-35 playbook with spreading production all around to make the 787 unkillable. By having everyone is getting some of the bacon with production in their districts or countries.

 

[mindlessobserver]

Restart the Clock. Boeing 787 goes down in India. No survivors.

 

[ToEnsureVerification]

Restart the Clock. Boeing 787 goes down in India. No survivors.

Not the Dreamliner It was the most beautiful Boeing plane. The wing design was like a bird. Apparently there's only 1 survivor who just walked it off. I don't know if this is the final straw for Boeing, but it couldn't have come at a worse time for them.

 

[Google.com]

Restart the Clock. Boeing 787 goes down in India. No survivors.

I will renounce my us citizenship and become Indian if the investigation doesn't conclude pilot error.

 

[ToEnsureVerification]

I will renounce my us citizenship and become Indian if the investigation doesn't conclude pilot error.

Putting your chips in Boeing is a dangerous gamble. Bossmanjack would be proud. It could also be a maintenance crew issue (airspeed computer was broken, which could have caused a misread on airspeed and stall, etc.)

 

[Google.com]

Putting your chips in Boeing is a dangerous gamble. Bossmanjack would be proud. It could also be a maintenance crew issue (airspeed computer was broken, which could have caused a misread on airspeed and stall, etc.)

There are 3 completely independent airspeed systems and unreliable airspeed checklist calls for the plane to be pitched up and set to a power level which will maintain climb without causing a stall. Still pilot error, I am going all in.

 

[Commodore 128]

Not the Dreamliner

First total loss of a dreamliner. Very weird crash, the footage from the runway and that other video of it gliding down suggest complete loss of power right after takeoff and the RAT deployed. Didn't see birds or any other obvious sign of engine problems on the runway footage. Pilots are commenting that the flaps look correct and if the takeoff config wasn't set properly the alarms in the cockpit would have been screaming at them the entire time. Guess we'll just have to wait for some data from the flight recorders.