Katholic Kiwi Kathedral (Catholocism General) - Byzantine? Ethnic? Roman? It doesn't matter. It's a place for Catholic Kiwis to discuss Catholicism and inquirers to inquire

[Yet Another Wanker]

For 99% of history, almost all members of the Church, Saints or otherwise believed that Islam is merely a Christian Heresy, a position that almost all Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs hold, that was until Jay Dyer said other wise

https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/heresy-of-mohammed-10817

 

[Local Farmer]

https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/heresy-of-mohammed-10817

Belloc

Be still, my love

 

[Paradox Mystic]

making such a scene during Mass to me is insulting

Some people see attending mass as only a form of therapy/self-help for themselves and neglect the aspect of it being something they offer to the Holy Trinity. "Oh this service/priest/church didn't feel good to me so I better overreact!"

Its getting close to sedevacantist bullshit.

Those type of people want the benefits of seeming "extra based" due to their rigorism but without the drawbacks of fully commiting to being SSPX or a Sedevacantist ect. I wouldn't be surprised if they give Taylor Marshal a undue amount of influence since it feeds their desire for their slippery position to have a online voice to rally around.

 

[Local Farmer]

It's literally just Orthos crashing out over V2 and Nostra Aetate. The Orthobro online horde likes to pick particular pet issues to complain and debatebro about for a couple weeks before dropping it and finding something else to do. This too shall pass.

Orthobros are legitimately the Niggers of Christianity, if you want proof go to the Orthobro thread to see them WE WUZING and blaming all their problems on Catholics

 

[RomanianSchizo]

Some people see attending mass as only a form of therapy/self-help for themselves and neglect the aspect of it being something they offer to the Holy Trinity. "Oh this service/priest/church didn't feel good to me so I better overreact!"

I find that a lot of Catholics do this not even with the Mass, but also when it comes to prayer and the Pope. It's very aggravating. Our religion is not something that's meant to feel good, it's meant to change us for the better and ultimately lead us to Heaven, even if that means we "feel uncomfortable".

Those type of people want the benefits of seeming "extra based" due to their rigorism but without the drawbacks of fully commiting to being SSPX or a Sedevacantist ect. I wouldn't be surprised if they give Taylor Marshal a undue amount of influence since it feeds their desire for their slippery position to have a online voice to rally around.

These people should just take the L and become a sedevacantist or SSPX. It would make it easier for the normal everyday Catholic to realize who to steer clear from.
Also Taylor Marshall 100% has a lot of influence in the Catholic-to-sede/SSPX pipeline. This is the guy who wrote a book that's literally called Infiltration: The Plot to Destroy the Church From Within. The title alone sounds like a conspiracy theory, but I've seen firsthand how Catholics (more often that not men) believe this tripe. This book talks about how the Church has been attacked from the inside by various forces like the Freemasons, Communists, and other various groups. He even talks about how there was a prophecy from Our Lady of La Salette that would be a plot of infiltrate the Church from within.
Now this doesn't sound that unbelievable, and I would say some of it is probably accurate, but what is the conclusion that Taylor Marshall comes to? That there is a group called the St. Gallen Mafia that were the reason why Pope Francis got elected, and that the infiltration of the Catholic Church reached its peak once that happened. But that's not all - he actually believes that Pope Francis is promoting Freemasonry, which is a very scandalous thing - I would even go as far as to say blasphemous - to say. And what is Marshall's solution for Catholics who after reading this book are now scared out of their minds and probably thinking, "well why am I Catholic then?"
Returning to traditional values (which to me seems like a weak conclusion although I understand why that is the conclusion. After all, a weak book would suggest a weak conclusion). Anyway, this means according to him, going to confession every two weeks (how is this not scrupulosity?), participating in novenas and feast days (ok, fair enough), and "rediscovering what it means to be Catholic" (like...following the Pope, which your book, whether intentionally or not, is promoting the exact opposite of?). He did say that he believes that Mary would lead us, but if he really believed that, why would he even write this book? (Also if I want to be more pedantic, the Holy Spirit leads the Church, although I understand why he is saying Mary - he probably has some sort of devotion to her. Anyway, I digress.)
I 100% believe that this guy who converted to Catholicism (he used to be an Episcopal priest) and his stupid book has led more Catholics astray than not, and I ultimately believe that the title of his own book is what describes Taylor Marshall. Jesus Christ Himself literally said that the gates of hell will not prevail against His Church. I know there are a lot of politics in the Vatican, and there's the Lavender Mafia, and the Germans, and probably even more shady-at-best and evil-at-worst characters in the Vatican. Yet Jesus' words still remain, and we as Catholics ought to believe Him, which the sedes and the SSPX (and I would even say Taylor Marshall) do not do. At the end of the day, who would you rather believe - a former Protestant who converted to Catholicism who may be a Dr. but isn't even a Catholic priest, and pedals conspiracy theories about the Pope, or Jesus Christ Himself? I know who I would choose.

 

[Tom Bombodildo]

That there is a group called the St. Gallen Mafia that were the reason why Pope Francis got elected

I can't say how I know this without powerleveling hard (which I'm not gonna do), so take it with a pinch of salt, but suffice to say the Sank Gallen clique is real, and have been involved in the upper echelons of the church for a while. They're not as malicious as Taylor Marshall indicates they are, and it's certainly not an infiltration. They're just libs.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

Brothers and Sisters, behold! The most cursed bastardization of the Blesssed Sacrament I've yet seen.

View attachment 7379364

Is that a sincere thing? Because I've bought Skittles and Arizona sweet tea to dance on his grave on his deathiversary before.

 

[RomanianSchizo]

I can't say how I know this without powerleveling hard (which I'm not gonna do), so take it with a pinch of salt, but suffice to say the Sank Gallen clique is real, and have been involved in the upper echelons of the church for a while. They're not as malicious as Taylor Marshall indicates they are, and it's certainly not an infiltration. They're just libs.

I knew that the St. Gallen Mafia was real, it's the same with the Lavender Mafia. These mafias do exist, but I agree with you, I definitely don't believe that they are part of a grander conspiracy like Taylor Marshall is claiming. In fact, I would even say that a lot of the groups that he mentioned are simply libs. I mean we know there are at least bishops/archbishops/cardinals who are, such as the German bishops and Cardinal Tagle. But that's my big issue with Taylor Marshall. It's one thing to say that there's libs in the Vatican who should turn away from their sin and become better Catholics. All of us should become better Catholics and turn away from sin, no Catholic is exempt from that. But Taylor Marshall doesn't say this, instead he makes these fear-mongering, conspiratorial, and even blasphemous claims that ultimately lead Catholics astray. His book is the very definition of causing scandal to the Church and I wish that more Catholics would call him out for this (maybe there are some that do, I haven't seen much though).

 

[Froggy Fresh Sextape]

Those type of people want the benefits of seeming "extra based" due to their rigorism but without the drawbacks of fully commiting to being SSPX or a Sedevacantist ect. I wouldn't be surprised if they give Taylor Marshal a undue amount of influence since it feeds their desire for their slippery position to have a online voice to rally around.

It was the same shit with Vigano before he went fully crazy.

Jesus is fully present in the Eucharist regardless of it being NO or TLM and you would think that's the most important thing but no bro it needs to match my aesthetic preferences

 

[Paradox Mystic]

It was the same shit with Vigano before he went fully crazy.

Jesus is fully present in the Eucharist regardless of it being NO or TLM and you would think that's the most important thing but no bro it needs to match my aesthetic preferences

I think a lot of that type of person wants to say the Eucharist of the NO is invalid, but they won't fully commit to it, they will say stuff like communion on the hand is heretical though. Taylor Marshall said he decided to be almost exclusively TLM-attending because one NO parish had a guy in a Cookie Monster shirt give him the Consecrated Host (I think he mentioned it was on a spoon but I thought that was only a Byzantine Rite/EO thing?) Also regarding Taylor Marshall's rigorism/issues, he recently tweeted that Head Coverings are a requirement for women.

 

[Froggy Fresh Sextape]

one NO parish had a guy in a Cookie Monster shirt give him the Consecrated Host (I think he mentioned it was on a spoon but I thought that was only a Byzantine Rite/EO thing?)

Yeah this just seems like shit that didn't happen. I've never seen a Latin Rite parish that did intinction.

 

[Bowl of Ramen]

Intinction is done at the Novus Ordo, but should be strictly by the priest, and given to the laity by him (lay EMHCs may not do so). I’m personally not a fan of the practice, unless extreme precautions are taken, i.e., with a paten, cloth, etc. Intinction for the Rites that use leavened bread make perfect sense, but not so much for unleavened. IMO, leave intinction to the professionals, which Latin Rite priests are generally not.

Would that we get rid of EMHCs altogether.

 

[Tom Bombodildo]

Intinction is done at the Novus Ordo, but should be strictly by the priest, and given to the laity by him (lay EMHCs may not do so). I’m personally not a fan of the practice, unless extreme precautions are taken, i.e., with a paten, cloth, etc. Intinction for the Rites that use leavened bread make perfect sense, but not so much for unleavened. IMO, leave intinction to the professionals, which Latin Rite priests are generally not.

Would that we get rid of EMHCs altogether.

What? I've attended and served both normal Latin NO masses and Eastern Rite Masses and the unleavened host works way better for intinction. The unleavened host absorbs the Blood, and so long as you hold it over the chalice for a heartbeat, it quickly sheds any excess it can't hold and can then safely be given by the priest to a communicant. There should always be a chalice/paten/plate of some kind beneath the inticted host to be safe, but the host maintains its integrity and doesn't really lose what it's absorbed. Doing intinction with leavened bread leads to a loss of integrity in the host which absolutely requires something to catch particles and droplets when the Eucharist is being administered.

The EMHC question is something I've thought about a lot; I hope they become much less common in the next few years since it seems to be something Boomers are particularly obsessed with, with most younger people being neutral or against EMHC.

 

[Bowl of Ramen]

What? I've attended and served both normal Latin NO masses and Eastern Rite Masses and the unleavened host works way better for intinction. The unleavened host absorbs the Blood, and so long as you hold it over the chalice for a heartbeat, it quickly sheds any excess it can't hold and can then safely be given by the priest to a communicant. There should always be a chalice/paten/plate of some kind beneath the inticted host to be safe, but the host maintains its integrity and doesn't really lose what it's absorbed. Doing intinction with leavened bread leads to a loss of integrity in the host which absolutely requires something to catch particles and droplets when the Eucharist is being administered.

The EMHC question is something I've thought about a lot; I hope they become much less common in the next few years since it seems to be something Boomers are particularly obsessed with, with most younger people being neutral or against EMHC.

Fair, I suppose I’m thinking in more utilitarian terms. I would rather receive from an Eastern Rite priest who uses a spoon.

I’m sure it’s PTSD from my former parish, which not only allowed “creative” forms of receiving, but the treatment of the Precious Blood was consistently egregious. I hung up my time there when someone spilled Our Lord and proceeded to wipe Him up with a common cloth with her foot.

 

[Formica Sample]

My fiancé is throwing elbows on the Internet with Orthospergs who are circling the drain on the question of whether Muslims worship the same God as Catholics.

I'm a lucky man.

As far as where I fall on the matter: Yes, same God, but they are wrong.

I'm not really convinced by the argument that shifts the framing to the definition and efficacy of worship to mean that which the Muslims worship is a different God. Orthos are crashing out on this because of a debate with a prominent Ortho bro that wanted to change the argument from "Same God or not?" to "Why won't you defend your papacy!"

I think Muslims believe in the same God as us to an extent, though their worship has been greatly perverted by Satan.

What about the argument that they don't believe in the Triune God? Because that would be my argument as to why neither Muslims nor Jews worship the same God that Christians do. I would say the Jews are a bit closer, but the Islamic relationship with their god is nothing like the Christian relationship.

The Holy Trinity is a crucial part of our faith. Without acknowledging all three parts of that Trinity, I'd say we don't believe in the same God.

 

[Local Farmer]

What about the argument that they don't believe in the Triune God? Because that would be my argument as to why neither Muslims nor Jews worship the same God that Christians do. I would say the Jews are a bit closer, but the Islamic relationship with their god is nothing like the Christian relationship.

The Holy Trinity is a crucial part of our faith. Without acknowledging all three parts of that Trinity, I'd say we don't believe in the same God.

When Islam was on the rise Most Christians viewed Muhammad as a Christian Heretic that was perverting the Gospel, there are some stories and accounts that Muhammad was greatly influenced by either Arian or Monophosyte Christian’s (I can’t remember), they do claim to follow the God of Abraham but do not recognize Jesus Christ as God. That is their most categorical error and does not make them Christians, but it does make them “Abrahamic”

They cannot be saved because of that, no one is arguing that they are. (except maybe in cases of Invincible ignorance)

Recognizing that is not some Vatican II hippy dippy mumbo jumbo, but the position that the Apostolic churches have always had

 

[Local Farmer]

I wonder what everyone’s thoughts are about this. It seems like the sin of ‘detraction’ (lol DSP mentioned) as described is pretty prohibitive-like would exclude discussions of ‘small time’ true crime or even deceased war criminals (if that could harm the reputation of living family members and the need to discuss their crimes isn’t urgent.)

I also don’t understand why the right to a neutral to positive reputation is being treated as almost equal to someone’s life or possessions. IDK I’m not a moral theologian though.

I am at peace with the fact that I will probably spend a very long time in purgatory for ranting about Pajeets on this website

 

[Froggy Fresh Sextape]

there are some stories and accounts that Muhammad was greatly influenced by either Arian or Monophosyte Christian’s (I can’t remember)

Most likely Nestorianism which spread like wildfire eastwards (Genghis Khan had Nestorians in his family)

Regardless, Muhammed seems to think that Christians worship Mary as a goddess so whatever his exposure to Christianity was was not very high on the orthodox scale.

 

[Dagoth AMOGUS]

 

[Blackstar]

Has anyone here watched The Chosen? It's flooded my YouTube shorts and I'm tempted to watch it. I know that it's made by an Evangelist but the actor playing Jesus is a Catholic minister and I've enjoyed the clips that I've seen. I really like how it humanises Christ.