Community Munchausen's by Internet (Malingerers, Munchies, Spoonies, etc) - Feigning Illnesses for Attention

[Tiny Clanger]

I love that idea.

And, of course, it would have the latest, fastest wi-fi so they can stream the drama to the plethora of groups they are in. The "doctor" could come and give them their very own, special hi-def camera and tell them only the gravest patients got them (the fact every other munchie eejit had one wouldn't register. They'd be too busy filming themselves saying "the consultant says I'm the worst case of paper-cut he's ever seen. But I'm strong, I'll fight this, and I know you're all with me. And so's Jesus!")

That whole "strong, fight, brave" thing winds me up something chronic. If you're sick, it's beyond your control, end of. You just deal. All this sentimental bollocks really doesn't help sick people and those I know who are genuinely very ill get extremely snarly about it.

 

[Jaimas]

I remembered one of these from the 1980s internet days, but then did research and realized it was the Tawana Brawley scandal.

Asshats like this have been around literally forever, even back when we called the Internet the Information Superhighway, Prodigy was the only ISP worth a damn on the east coast, most people connected to the internet via work or school, and webpages had only just started to become a thing.

 

[Medea23]

And, of course, it would have the latest, fastest wi-fi so they can stream the drama to the plethora of groups they are in. The "doctor" could come and give them their very own, special hi-def camera......
That whole "strong, fight, brave" thing winds me up something chronic. If you're sick, it's beyond your control, end of. You just deal. All this sentimental bollocks really doesn't help sick people and those I know who are genuinely very ill get extremely snarly about it.

Plus make up artists; hairstylists and personal shoppers on call because you know 'We're not giving in! We are fighting this and looking good is all part of the brave struggle.'

Thread derail: have you read Barbara Ehrenreich's takedown of the whole fighting a battle/so brave/keeping going/thinking positive bollocks?

Back on thread: I will never understand the asspats that (genuinely) sick people get for making themselves suffer more than necessary. Who the fuck wants to run a marathon/climb Mount Everest/cycle coast to coast across the USA when they feel like death? Its like they have some kind of death wish. I mean if you want to hurt that bad stop treatment/overdose on the drugs/don't follow medical advice.

Why the fuck should the rest of us sponsor you for self harming?

 

[Tiny Clanger]

Plus make up artists; hairstylists and personal shoppers on call because you know 'We're not giving in! We are fighting this and looking good is all part of the brave struggle.'

Thread derail: have you read Barbara Ehrenreich's takedown of the whole fighting a battle/so brave/keeping going/thinking positive bollocks?

Back on thread: I will never understand the asspats that (genuinely) sick people get for making themselves suffer more than necessary. Who the fuck wants to run a marathon/climb Mount Everest/cycle coast to coast across the USA when they feel like death? Its like they have some kind of death wish. I mean if you want to hurt that bad stop treatment/overdose on the drugs/don't follow medical advice.

Why the fuck should the rest of us sponsor you for self harming?

Ooooo...I like Barbara Can'tspellhername, I'll check it out. Thanks :-)

In my original long ranty post I wrote about infiltrators into proper groups, including the Jesusfreaks and "alternative" bullshitters. They always go for the "you have to fight this, you will beat if if you are strong and positive....and pray the right way to the right version of the right god/take the right pill that's made of water thumped the right way/eat your own sandals during a full moon whilst stuffing a crystal up yer bum etc etc blah blah twang." It puts the person with the illness into a position of responsibility and attendant failure (you have to give the Great Juju EVERYTHING and you WILL be cured" - the inference being no cure means you failed somehow. They're so bloody self-righteous but it's actually a terrible thing to load on an already sick person. The "strongest" people in the world still die of cancer and any fighting is not within our conscious purview. Maybe that hard reality is too gnarly to face so we go for the sentimentality instead.

I don't get any form of "public" sickness. It's always about raising awareness, but we're already more than aware of most of these horrible diseases. I don't want to knock people who do it - perhaps focussing on a difficult goal gives them relief. But I'm definitely a bugger-off-and-leave-me-alone type when I feel bleh - I don't want to spread the misery (tho I prolly would if I thought it'd make me feel better!) No I will NOT climb mount sodding Everest (or, in actual fact, be towed up it by a team of Sherpas, if we're being totally honest)....I will climb the stairs to my bed and sulk, thank you very much. Even if I've only got a cold.

Don't think I'm going to win any awards for nobility and strength in distress, am I? But that's part of why this whole phenomenon is so bizarre - they act like they THINK very sick people act. But that's not how the truly sick behave. Weird weird weird.

 

[There_is_no_Dana]

I've had dilaudid a couple times - that shit knocks you on your ass so hard it's not even enjoyable.

Takes care of the pain though, real fast.

 

[Orc Girls Make Due]

I've had dilaudid a couple times - that shit knocks you on your ass so hard it's not even enjoyable.

Takes care of the pain though, real fast.

Had it once when I was twelve for my broken hand. Do not remember a thing. (Shitty hospital in Texas, what can you expect?)

 

[repentance]

I don't get any form of "public" sickness. It's always about raising awareness, but we're already more than aware of most of these horrible diseases. I don't want to knock people who do it - perhaps focussing on a difficult goal gives them relief. But I'm definitely a bugger-off-and-leave-me-alone type when I feel bleh - I don't want to spread the misery (tho I prolly would if I thought it'd make me feel better!) No I will NOT climb mount sodding Everest (or, in actual fact, be towed up it by a team of Sherpas, if we're being totally honest)....I will climb the stairs to my bed and sulk, thank you very much. Even if I've only got a cold.

I do get it. For many it's a form of personal catharsis, but it's also a brutal reality that research dollars and public funding for resources depend a great deal on how much of a personal face can be put on diseases. Think about how many diseases out there are competing for your donation dollar and what makes you decide to donate or buy merchandise supporting one over another.

People don't respond to numbers. They respond to emotional appeals. Cancer in general and breast cancer in particular is a huge money magnet and few people ever question whether that money could be better spent on research into other diseases.

I do think some people want to be more public because they believe it will get them personally better resources or support (and it very often does). I think that for many others, though, it's a byproduct of being in a situation where they feel like whatever is being done to address the underlying cause of distress in their lives is not "enough". It's not pure altruism, because they obviously want to change things for themselves as well as others, but I can't blame them for trying even if I sometimes find their chosen methods distasteful.

 

[There_is_no_Dana]

Had it once when I was twelve for my broken hand. Do not remember a thing. (Shitty hospital in Texas, what can you expect?)

Mine was for gall bladder pain and post-op gas - both pretty horrible pains. I can't imagine using it for a broken bone though, seems like overkill.

 

[repentance]

Mine was for gall bladder pain and post-op gas - both pretty horrible pains. I can't imagine using it for a broken bone though, seems like overkill.

Fractures can be excruciating. Or not. I've seen people with severe fractures not need anything more than APAP, yet when I broke my foot it was right up there with childbirth and impacted gallstones (hideous as that was, morphine and fentanyl were both overkill for that and an APAP/codeine or APAP/hydrocodone combo reduced the pain to tolerable levels).

I think they're much more willing to give heavy duty drugs in the ER when they can identify a cause which they know can produce severe pain, especially as you're likely to need them for such a short time. The same with acute exacerbation of chronic illness. They're willing to give heavier drugs because it's only going to be short-term - long term pain management isn't a problem to be dealt with by the ER. It's not at all unusual here for you to be given stronger drugs in the ambulance or ER than you're given when ultimately admitted to the ward. The priorities change depending on the setting.

 

[MirnaMinkoff]

I do get it. For many it's a form of personal catharsis, but it's also a brutal reality that research dollars and public funding for resources depend a great deal on how much of a personal face can be put on diseases. Think about how many diseases out there are competing for your donation dollar and what makes you decide to donate or buy merchandise supporting one over another.

People don't respond to numbers. They respond to emotional appeals. Cancer in general and breast cancer in particular is a huge money magnet and few people ever question whether that money could be better spent on research into other diseases.

I do think some people want to be more public because they believe it will get them personally better resources or support (and it very often does). I think that for many others, though, it's a byproduct of being in a situation where they feel like whatever is being done to address the underlying cause of distress in their lives is not "enough". It's not pure altruism, because they obviously want to change things for themselves as well as others, but I can't blame them for trying even if I sometimes find their chosen methods distasteful.

I think the hard part for me to understand is ppl wanting to be looked and paid attention to while in pain or feeling terrible. I get the need to raise awareness for a chronic condition that needs research funds or for someone to get medical care funded - a price you pay for getting something much needed. But personally when I'm sick or in pain I want to be alone and left alone. At most family or friends bringing food, otherwise I feel the need to put on a social face or not be embarrassed by my current miserable state. I just want to be left in peace when I'm in pain or ill, I can't fathom posting photos of myself or posting all the gory details of my current condition. I want to curl up in a ball and the world needs to leave me alone until I feel better.

Of course, I don't like attention and hate being the focus of pity/worry/concern. I find it uncomfortable. It would seem that's the polar opposite of munchies who have a literal lust and limitless need for attention and illness can be an easy vehicle for it.

EDIT: I should say I'm lucky enough to never have suffered from a chronic condition or needed long term medical care. I do understand people suffering from a chronic disease or illness wanting to find a community of other suffers for support and understanding, because it can be isolating and depressing. It's posting publicly on SM just to get pity and sympathy from randos online that I don't get.

 

[repentance]

I just want to be left in peace when I'm in pain or ill, I can't fathom posting photos of myself or posting all the gory details of my current condition. I want to curl up in a ball and the world needs to leave me alone until I feel better.

These people aren't going to feel better in a few days or weeks, though. There's a point at which self-isolation just adds to the burden.

With munchies, though, it's all about the attention right from the start and there's no such thing as "enough" attention. The need for attention increases as time passes and they'll take increasingly more extreme measures to get it.

 

[Tiny Clanger]

I do get it. For many it's a form of personal catharsis, but it's also a brutal reality that research dollars and public funding for resources depend a great deal on how much of a personal face can be put on diseases. Think about how many diseases out there are competing for your donation dollar and what makes you decide to donate or buy merchandise supporting one over another.

People don't respond to numbers. They respond to emotional appeals. Cancer in general and breast cancer in particular is a huge money magnet and few people ever question whether that money could be better spent on research into other diseases.

Fair enough. I'd guess the reasons are many and varied - when I say "don't get" it's more a reflection on my personal reaction. But I'm not from the US, and although research and funding is an issue here, medicine is seen as social necessity rather than a matter purely of $. The US attitude is different, simply because you don't have the social medicine mindset which is the backdrop elsewhere.

The part I DO understand is the initial I-will-not-let-this-stop-me. But sadly its a false hope - somehow, even if only for awhile, it will change your life dramatically. It's like anything human, I guess, and the range of reactions will be just as wide.


Incidentally, another reason the munchies/hypos/general fussers are such a pain in the arse on some medical communities is that doctors use them. If an illness is a rarity, even a specialist may see only a couple of cases and never see a non-"textbook" case so specialists get info from the forum. Yet another way these people can do horrendous damage because their fabrication may actually skew opinion. This is offset by their not claiming rarer illnesses through lack of knowledge, but the internet has blown open a massive amount of hitherto unknowns to these people. Rather like the very small number of genuine ME/fibro cases, the last thing you want is them glomming onto your thing because it really harms those with the real thing.

 

[Medea23]

It puts the person with the illness into a position of responsibility and attendant failure (you have to give the Great Juju EVERYTHING and you WILL be cured" - the inference being no cure means you failed somehow. They're so bloody self-righteous but it's actually a terrible thing to load on an already sick person. The "strongest" people in the world still die of cancer and any fighting is not within our conscious purview. Maybe that hard reality is too gnarly to face so we go for the sentimentality instead.

Amen sister! Clapping hands and cheering.

I don't get any form of "public" sickness. It's always about raising awareness, but we're already more than aware of most of these horrible diseases. I don't want to knock people who do it - perhaps focussing on a difficult goal gives them relief. But I'm definitely a bugger-off-and-leave-me-alone type when I feel bleh - I don't want to spread the misery (tho I prolly would if I thought it'd make me feel better!) No I will NOT climb mount sodding Everest (or, in actual fact, be towed up it by a team of Sherpas, if we're being totally honest)....I will climb the stairs to my bed and sulk, thank you very much. Even if I've only got a cold.

I actually feel embarassed to talk about whatever I'm going through and a big part of that is because of the munchies et al, but also because I don't want to be brave and fight to my dying breath. I want to be left the fuck alone to stay in bed when I need to or lie on the sofa watching crap for days on end.
And yeah, it was shitty of me to knock those who are sick and choose to put themselves through endurance tests but it does make the rest who don't feel like fucking, pathetic failures. On top of being a total loser anyway because they are so knackered that they can't keep their job or do loads for charidee.

Don't think I'm going to win any awards for nobility and strength in distress, am I? But that's part of why this whole phenomenon is so bizarre - they act like they THINK very sick people act. But that's not how the truly sick behave. Weird weird weird.

Even more weird, they are fucking sick. Just not with what they are claiming!
As for awards 'It's the taking part that counts hun!' Posts lots of emojis of clapping hands, flowers and medals. Big wink.

 

[Tiny Clanger]

Amen sister! Clapping hands and cheering.

I actually feel embarassed to talk about whatever I'm going through and a big part of that is because of the munchies et al, but also because I don't want to be brave and fight to my dying breath. I want to be left the fuck alone to stay in bed when I need to or lie on the sofa watching crap for days on end.
And yeah, it was shitty of me to knock those who are sick and choose to put themselves through endurance tests but it does make the rest who don't feel like fucking, pathetic failures. On top of being a total loser anyway because they are so knackered that they can't keep their job or do loads for charidee.

Even more weird, they are fucking sick. Just not with what they are claiming!
As for awards 'It's the taking part that counts hun!' Posts lots of emojis of clapping hands, flowers and medals. Big wink.

EgggfuckingZACKLY. I think this is a tiny, but very vocal minority - meaning the genuinely ill who do seemingly crazy shit - and it's no doubt part of their coping mechanism. I fucked up my previous post (my medical problem is lack of brain!) but it's maybe part of that "I will not let this affect me" thing we all go through, but it's actually a form of denial. But because it's so "inspiring" that's the bit of the whole acceptance process that gets reported but it does create a false reality.

I think the biggest distinction is that these people never get bored of their copious maladies. I find their intense self-absorption far more interesting than all the minutiae of any illness, but that's the one thing they won't discuss. Other peoples' illnesses are boring. Hospitals are boring. Procedures are boring. Even drugs get boring (never thought I'd see THAT day!)

They also seem to be the only people that glorify in all the gadgetry as you see them carefully measure out to the nth degree their ibuprofen into a syringe with a huge long explanation about why it's so important it not be a fraction of a degree over....but anyone on morphine long-term just swigs it from the bottle. And they never have side-effects, its always another whole new illness. No, you HAVEN'T got IBS - you're taking five thousand meds, 4,999 of which are unneccesary - of COURSE your stomach feels like a washing-machine.

Like I say. Fascinating but sooo annoying. But fret not - next time you're gouged out on the sofa know that I, at least, am not climbing K2. I'm neither strong nor brave and I'm not going to feel any differently if an entire continent of people I don't know and who don't know me tell me I am. I know we all have different value-judgement but I just cannot see how it's anything but meaningless. There's no part of illness that's a choice or an achievement, it just happens.

You go grrrrrrl! You're so inspiring! Smileywinkiebastardemojithing x 3000000000.

 

[Cripple]

People with actual chronic pain are the best maskers in the world. To the point where it's a shock to an outside observer to learn this is so. You'd just be hoarse and exhausted if you screamed and flailed everytime you had a shot or upswing of pain. Plus you'd never get anything done. You have to learn coping mechanisms and if you're lucky those aren't addictions.

 

[cuddle striker]

assanti had leg pain due to his weight, and the infections and swelling and water retention in his leg. so he actually was in chronic pain at all times, but physical therapy and weight loss are the cure. the opioids just kept him lethargic, making the pain worse in the long run.

people with chronic pain underestimate their pain. they rate broken legs at a six. I've seen this in action. low ratings for obvious real pain tell us that the person is accustomed to pain and is honestly hurting.

 

[glass_houses]

People with actual chronic pain are the best maskers in the world. To the point where it's a shock to an outside observer to learn this is so. You'd just be hoarse and exhausted if you screamed and flailed everytime you had a shot or upswing of pain. Plus you'd never get anything done. You have to learn coping mechanisms and if you're lucky those aren't addictions.

assanti had leg pain due to his weight, and the infections and swelling and water retention in his leg. so he actually was in chronic pain at all times, but physical therapy and weight loss are the cure. the opioids just kept him lethargic, making the pain worse in the long run.

people with chronic pain underestimate their pain. they rate broken legs at a six. I've seen this in action. low ratings for obvious real pain tell us that the person is accustomed to pain and is honestly hurting.

My friend who has legit fibromalgia only told me about how much pain she's in all the time just recently. I knew she had chronic pain, but the extent of it is just mind blowing. Hell if I can figure out how she gets out of bed of a morning.

 

[Slowboat to China]

Thanks to all the experienced and medical Kiwis for weighing in on this thread. Seconding the recommendation for the Dee Dee Blanchard documentary, too--it's on YT right now, and it's pretty creepy stuff. It does try to raise some questions about just how involved Gypsy was in the murder, and whether she's manipulating people the way her mother did, but overall it's a pretty solid case summary.

Question about ER stuff, though. Taking selfies in the ER is kind of a douchey move, but what about patients doing other things to kill time when waiting? I had a broken ankle a few years ago, and what surprised me was how the pain would come in waves. Felt kind of ridiculous waiting in the ER with heat packs on my leg when my pain was only a two or three. (Then I tried to move. Big mistake.) Can people slip through the cracks because they seem too casual momentarily, like how chronic pain patients will underestimate their pain levels?

 

[For The Internet]

I have chronic pain and the worse I feel the more I feel the need to put on a brave face. I always know I'm really sick when I try to convince myself I'm really not that poorly. Basically, the sicker munchies appear to be the more well I believe they are based on my personal experience.

It horrifies me that they eagerly seek out cannulas. I have shit veins - as in, once the head anesthesiologist at the hospital I was in had to be called in to get a line into me because nobody else could place one - and every blood test or IV placement is torture. Don't any of these people have shitty, awful veins that can't take IV placement? I saw one girl with this baby pale blue bruise, the one saying her arm looked beaten up. PL but after the surgery for my kidney stone a quarter of the arm they managed to get a line into was literally black. It makes me lol rather than infuriating me but the idea of unnecessary IVs makes my skin crawl.

Pain at level 10 leaves you borderline or unconscious. The bits which ARE conscious, the sole thought is "I want to be unconscious." Rather than taking selfies, the person is more likely to have no comprehension of what a phone is.

Definitely. I thought I'd had 10/10 pain before when my leg was heavily infected with staph and I couldn't walk, but then I got a kidney stone and all I could do was moan and vomit. Couldn't speak in a complete sentence until they gave me some fentanyl. Sorry to PL, just can't agree enough with this statement.

Thanks so much for posting the link to the documentary about Dee Dee and Gypsy. That was really interesting. I think when she first got apprehended she was in manipulation mode but slowly managed to overcome that and be more honest with herself and others. I think that 30 years for her autistic boyfriend is a little steep if he really is mentally 16/17. Maybe 20, since he actually did the deed but there should be some mitigation. Might be a controversial opinion. I'd be very surprised if his defense team didn't argue for leniency based on his tism.

 

[MysticMisty]

Can people slip through the cracks because they seem too casual momentarily, like how chronic pain patients will underestimate their pain levels?

I think it's more that people slip through the cracks because they're not potentially about to die and the ER is understaffed/over worked in general. Even people that are called into the back can, and do, wait hours to receive treatment.