Tesla Hate Thread - oh and come seethe about EVs in general with me

[MrJokerRager]

 

[Hunter Hearst Helmsley]

This has disproportionate impact written all over it.

 

[quaawaa]

how often are you driving 400 miles in a day in a sedan

Because once you account for the 20-80% buffer to preserve battery life, reduced efficiency driving at real-world highway speeds, and capacity losses from age and weather conditions, the "400 mile" car is lucky to go 200 miles.

An EV needs a rated range of 1000 miles to equal a normal gas car.

 

[DeadwastePrime]

An EV needs a rated range of 1000 miles to equal a normal gas car.

what gas powered car has 1000 miles of range on them? their fuel economy has allowed gas capacities to be lowered into like 10 to 15 gallons and only trucks and suvs are the outlier going at around 20 to 30ish

 

[DavidS877]

Because once you account for the 20-80% buffer to preserve battery life, reduced efficiency driving at real-world highway speeds, and capacity losses from age and weather conditions, the "400 mile" car is lucky to go 200 miles.

An EV needs a rated range of 1000 miles to equal a normal gas car.

I find 450 rated to be pretty good. There are a few spots here in the western US where there's a challenge but you can get to most of it without an issue and plenty of margin. My usual planned drive is 80%-30%, I've been in one spot where that 30% would have required me to slow down a bit from my normal speed to make the next fast charger if the one for 30% was dead since it was the only one around. Another trip I planned was Las Vegas to Carson City NV in the Greer thread. The chargers on the most direct route are very slow and would add time. I could almost make it without charging if I kept my speed down, but that's no fun through Nevada. So to do that trip safely you take a longer route with a bunch of available fast chargers.

I think 600 rated range could get you anyplace in the lower 48 in a sane manner.

 

[teriyakiburns]

what gas powered car has 1000 miles of range on them? their fuel economy has allowed gas capacities to be lowered into like 10 to 15 gallons and only trucks and suvs are the outlier going at around 20 to 30ish

The point is that an EV would need a 1000 mile ideal range for its real-world performance to match an ICE.

 

[Thiletonomics]

BYD announced that their Yangwang U9 Xtreme EV Hypercar was sold for over 20 million RMB ($2.76 million) each. It will also be limited to 30 units in total.

I still don't know what makes this car so special that it almost costs as much as a Bugatti Chiron. And I don't see U9 Xtremes holding their value like Chirons and other European Supercars and Hypercars do.

 

[Thiletonomics]

And not even BYD is safe from the brony menace, and BYD is in talks with VW to take over part of the Dresden plant:

 

[Bonesjones]

what gas powered car has 1000 miles of range on them? their fuel economy has allowed gas capacities to be lowered into like 10 to 15 gallons and only trucks and suvs are the outlier going at around 20 to 30ish

All of them? You can fill the trunk with gas cans if necessary. Most vehicle ranges are intentionally kept within the 300 to 400 mile range but there was several diesel cars that were capable of up to 1000.

 

[The Ugly One]

what gas powered car has 1000 miles of range on them? their fuel economy has allowed gas capacities to be lowered into like 10 to 15 gallons and only trucks and suvs are the outlier going at around 20 to 30ish

It takes about 5 minutes to refill a gasoline car, so range doesn't really matter. Nobody ever thought about "range" until governments started demanding we all switch to vehicles that take hours to recharge.

 

[Stella d'Oro]

All of them? You can fill the trunk with gas cans if necessary. Most vehicle ranges are intentionally kept within the 300 to 400 mile range

Wouldn't that be an extreme edge case, like for someone traveling through Alaska, the Canadian north, maybe the more sparsely populated parts of the Southwest or Mexico? I know people who pull campers long distance sometimes have a big diesel tank in their truck bed but that's more for fuel arbitrage where they can buy 100 gallons of diesel where it's cheap before entering a higher-taxed State or taking advantage of the exchange rate and filling up in Canada.

Are people really driving 400 miles in one shot? That seems a bit much even for professional truckers. At some point you're limited by biological range than the car. My EV is a standard range model and even it has a longer range than I do. If I hit a level 3 charger I can add enough miles to make it to my next stop in the time it takes me to use the restroom, walk the dog, and eat a snack. Even back when I had an ICE I stopped the same number of times even if I didn't refuel.

Another consideration is how often are people taking long trips? Additional range requires a larger pack which means additional weight. That's a lot of dead weight to haul around, impacting range during everyday driving. I'd rather have the added efficiency for the 90% of the time I'm just driving around town than a bunch of extra range for occasional trips and "what if" cases. This is also a consideration with ICE vehicles, where the engineers have to consider the weight of the fuel in the tank and find a tradeoff between range and efficiency.

 

[The Ugly One]

Are people really driving 400 miles in one shot? That seems a bit much even for professional truckers.

Long haul drivers go 500-600 miles per day.

 

[Bonesjones]

Are people really driving 400 miles in one shot? That seems a bit much even for professional truckers.

That's only 5 to 6 hours of interstate driving nonstop. Long Haul Truckers can easily do twice that in a day.

. At some point you're limited by biological range than the car.

That's why they generally keep capacity to around 3 or 400 miles. People get fatigued and try to push on or they can start getting thrombosis in their legs.

Another consideration is how often are people taking long trips?

I've known many people who commute over 100 miles a day to and from work. I've known people with spouses 500 miles away so they would get off work and drive there every weekend or two. People have myopic views on how others live their lives because they never would do that. The point is you can, and it has to be accounted for.

What will you do in a natural disaster when you have to evacuate? Can you afford to sit at a charger in line for hours to get enough juice to escape? What happens when the power goes out? Now you are a sitting duck with no plan, no resources, and no eay to do anything about it. You can put 5 gallons of gas in most vehicles and get over 100 miles away.

This is also a consideration with ICE vehicles, where the engineers have to consider the weight of the fuel in the tank and find a tradeoff between range and efficiency.

The difference is gas is a decreasing component compared to batteries which are always dead weight. Your car gets more efficient as you run out of fuel while EVs are as efficient as they will ever be. People also underestimate how efficient you can be if you aren't in a hurry, so you can stretch a 35 mpg car to twice that with hypermiling techniques.

 

[DavidS877]

What will you do in a natural disaster when you have to evacuate? Can you afford to sit at a charger in line for hours to get enough juice to escape? What happens when the power goes out? Now you are a sitting duck with no plan, no resources, and no eay to do anything about it. You can put 5 gallons of gas in most vehicles and get over 100 miles away.

Um, get in the car and drive 300 miles? There's actually a bigger chance my EV is full enough to get 300 miles than my gas car was. Power outage is only a thing if I get home and immediately the volcano erupts, then I can still probably get at least 80 miles, same as if I put off getting gas until tomorrow. And around here at least none of the gas stations seem to have backup generators in case of power outages.

On the other hand there apparently are people who have electric cars who can't charge at home so they can guarantee they can go 300 miles without stopping, those people are morons.

 

[Bonesjones]

There's actually a bigger chance my EV is full enough to get 300 miles than my gas car was. Power outage is only a thing if I get home and immediately the volcano erupts, then I can still probably get at least 80 miles, same as if I put off getting gas until tomorrow.

I like how I spend half the post talking about use cases that EV owners ignore because of their myopic viewpoint and then you show up to prove me right.

 

[DavidS877]

I like how I spend half the post talking about use cases that EV owners ignore because of their myopic viewpoint and then you show up to prove me right.

I'm not sure what use cases I'm ignoring. If a forest fire breaks out, I get in my car and drive 300 miles the opposite direction. If the volcano erupts and the power goes out, I get in the car and drive 300 miles away from the lava and ash. When I got home Wednesday night and the power was out, the hills were on fire and the volcano was erupting I turned around and drove 120 miles. Which even if the power is still out there I'm probably far enough away from the danger and I couldn't buy gas either. The closest chargers to me(and the closest gas stations) that are out of the volcano and wildfire zone and on a different power feed are about 60 miles. There's plenty of stupid people who live in natural disaster prone places like I do and don't keep their cars full of gas and would have the same problems you're alleging only causes a problem for electric cars.

 

[Bonesjones]

I'm not sure what use cases I'm ignoring.

Yeah the power never goes out before or during a disaster while you are asleep. If someone else needs help you can just run a line from their car to yours? Oh you can't. As always, intensely selfish and self-serving with zero regard for anyone else.

 

[DavidS877]

Yeah the power never goes out before or during a disaster while you are asleep. If someone else needs help you can just run a line from their car to yours?

Oh noes, the power went out, my car is only 40% charged, whatever will I do? Oh, right, only drive 150 miles to escape the wildfire. Of course as I said, if the power went out as soon as I got home, I've got at least 80 miles, probably 100+.
And yes, I can charge another car. for a Tesla it would get them about 20 miles of range in an hour. Or I wrap a tow-strap around them and drag them out of the way.

 

[Hunter Hearst Helmsley]

It's a trick question, your battery started the wildfire.

 

[Bonesjones]

Oh noes, the power went out, my car is only 40% charged, whatever will I do? Oh, right, only drive 150 miles to escape the wildfire.

And how does the heat effect your batteries exactly? Do you know? Did you even think about it before I brought it up?

And yes, I can charge another car. for a Tesla it would get them about 20 miles of range in an hour. Or I wrap a tow-strap around them and drag them out of the way.

So your big emergency plan to help others is to either do nothing, move them out of the way, or sit around for an hour so they can go down the road a bit?

Its incredible how often you can self own. EV retards not thinking of anyone but themselves unless forced to.