Paper Mario Series

[PsychoNerd054]

I'd plow Vivian.

Even his tranny cock?

 

[A Hot Potato]

Even his tranny cock?

 

[The Fool]

I know it's an unpopular opinion but I much prefer Paper Mario over TTYD. It's far more balanced, far less dialogue and pointless quests, not to mention TTYD recycles way too much from the first game. There's endearing throwbacks and then there's just putting a script in a blender and calling it brand new. Paper Mario just felt more fresh in comparison. Also I cannot fucking stand the minigames for using the star power. It's fun one or two times after getting a new star, but they get so annoying by the time I'm at the final boss I forgot they existed out of reluctance to use them. I just want to use them without the dumb minigame, which the first game did. I still love TTYD of course, but I'm way more disappointed in it than a lot of other people. They could have done more.

I like SPM too, and it does have the best writing out of the series, but I was also kind of disappointed that the plot was kind of a knockoff of The Count of Monte Cristo.

 

[MysticMisty]

Unpopular opinion, but the first Paper Mario is the best by far. The art direction and music are much better than TYD, even though it came out on the N64. I feel like the plot moved along at a good pace, and Bowser was well done as a villain. He felt as menacing as he does in the main games while his minions added a dash of comedy (except for the bit where it's revealed he keeps a diary). I also love how it's the closest thing to an official sequel to Super Mario RPG as we'll ever get, even if they couldn't call it as such in the end. It took SMRPG's concepts and built upon them as a worthy sequel.

Thousand Year Door wasn't bad, but it was too much reliant on doing everything the first game did but slightly different, whereas the first game could distinguish itself from SMRPG. It's also bogged down by way too much backtracking, something the first one barely did. The result is that the chapters feel much longer than they really should be, while the first game kept them at an appropriate length. As I said above, the music and art are also not as good, which weakens the game as well. I just didn't find most of the songs to be especially memorable, which is unfortunate. The plot is good, but isn't great because it's mostly a rehash of what the first game did (which itself was based off of SMRPG). Bowser being the designated comic relief character falls a bit flat in this game. SMRPG had better writing for Bowser in a comedic role.

Super Paper Mario on the other hand is just garbage. A platformer with RPG elements could be an interesting game if well done. Unfortunately everything about SPM just fails. They could have done a lot of interesting things with the multiple dimension concepts but instead went for artsy in a lazy sort of way. There actually isn't a lot of variation, art wise, between the chapters, except for the setting. The plot has potential but it's wasted because the game spends very little time actually fleshing anything out, particularly in the chapters. Most chapters end with a big explanation for everything that just happened with dramatic music playing without giving us a reason to care about the characters. It's extremely tryhard and falls completely flat: there is just way too much telling and not nearly enough showing.

Sticker Star and Color Splash manage to be even worse with the horrible sticker gimmick. That type of thing just doesn't work for RPGs. I admit that I've not actually played either one. Actually when Sticker Star was first announced (as just Paper Mario) I was excited to see the series returning to it's roots both art-wise and gameplay-wise. But then a year later they revealed they dropped partners to completely rely on the sticker mechanic, and the art looked much blander than it originally did. So when it came out I erred on the side of caution and watched videos of the game on YouTube to get an idea of what it'd be like before making my final decision and man am I glad I did. It looked incredibly shitty and I decided not to get it. Going by the universal lack of praise I definitely dodged a bullet with that one. When Color Splash was announced they immediately made it clear that it was more of the same and I didn't even bother to look at any videos for it.

 

[Slap47]

I have a hard time choosing between TTYD and the Original. They're both perfection when it comes to storytelling, worldbuilding and gameplay for children. I'll go with the OG but nostalgia probably plays a big role in that. Its simply more memorable.

I hate replaying games but I've replayed the OG multiple times... although much of that was because I didn't have any other games.

There is currently a mod out that lets you play the OG Paper Mario on a difficulty that is actually hard. I haven't been able to figure out emulation stuff but just an FYI for your enjoyment.

My unpopular opinion will be that I personally really enjoyed Super Paper Mario. The only downside was that most of the bosses were pretty shit. The platforming was great and the world and characters were on-point. SPM kept the soul of the series but suffered in the gameplay so I can understand why people hate it.

I only like Sticker Star is because it is a sperg magnet.

Even Chuggaaconroy is disgusted by Sticker Star and he loves all Nintendo games.

 

[ComputerWife]

Super Paper Mario on the other hand is just garbage. A platformer with RPG elements could be an interesting game if well done. Unfortunately everything about SPM just fails. They could have done a lot of interesting things with the multiple dimension concepts but instead went for artsy in a lazy sort of way. There actually isn't a lot of variation, art wise, between the chapters, except for the setting. The plot has potential but it's wasted because the game spends very little time actually fleshing anything out, particularly in the chapters. Most chapters end with a big explanation for everything that just happened with dramatic music playing without giving us a reason to care about the characters. It's extremely tryhard and falls completely flat: there is just way too much telling and not nearly enough showing

Spoiler: Super Paper Mario Sperging

I’ve always been a firm believer in different doesn’t necessarily equal bad. The dimensions are well done enough with usually reasonable overlap. One can show most enemies and it’s respective setting and comprhend it (Squigs are bad and overused, Koopas and Goombas existing outside of Chapter 3 are kind of an excuse). I think most people who haven’t played it would look at these and infer one of these is a space alien and the other is a girl.

Stylistically, the designs do rely on geometric shapes in most cases with the rare exception an enemy from previous titles shows up (which can be jarring, but the explanation is that those enemies are not supposed to be there anyway). Getting a more stylistically diverse art team wouldn’t have hurt but most characters’ home dimensions can be identified by their appearance.
As for story, hoping for players to always use Tippi to learn more lore about everything was not a wise choice. The also game wants you to get lost in Flip/Flopside to scour deep into each character’s pasts, but it can be frustrating to some with its elevator design. It’s hard to show emotion through a paper doll, and there’s a large amount of story tangents so reeling it in with (sometime well written) text chunks was the solution. The dialog between Bleck and Tippi in flashbacks is soap opera tragedy-esqe but that seemed to be the goal since it takes some inspiration from dramatized novels. Nastasia is well developed even if she is pretty sad as well. The humor being interlaced with that tragedy style plot is off putting to some but I remember me and my friends being fond of it being able to not get too depressing or off the rails often.

I’ve played all three of the nice ones and I loved each one for doing something different. Paper Mario is a solid start, TTYD is a much more involved RPG plot and improves control and mechanics significantly, and Super is a storybook tale turned game with odd but not unenjoyable gameplay for the series. Sticker Star was an all time low where neither gameplay nor plot was satisfied due to misinterpreting complaints of TTYD being too similar and SPM being too different. Color Splash attempts to return to the humorous style and more character involvement of past entries but cannot commit to a grand involved plot.

 

[SugarSnot]

I think what a lot of people get wrong when talking about these games is when they say the story is good. The story in all the games is as basic as they come, some great evil is about to fuck things up, so collect the macguffins and stop it from happening. What the early games did right was world building. They turned the Mushroom Kingdom and beyond into a place to live instead of just a giant obstacle course that we see in the platforming games.

Color Splash and Thousand Year door are actually very similar, both take you to a seaside town in a different country and fills in a world with charming writing and great environments. But Color Splash's biggest mishap was avoiding unique character designs for that region. Sure, it is different geographically than Mushroom Kingdom, but the habitants makes it feel no different at all.

As far as gameplay goes, the first two games made a genius move in keeping the numbers *small*. Only being able to do single digits of damage every turn and anything double digit being *huge* makes every battle into a precise math puzzle where you have to carefully manage damage dealing and damage prevention. So many RPGs have you deal arbitrary high damage numbers with big variables. An attack can do 700 damage one time and 1100 the next round. Paper Mario made any attack upgrade feel significant, something I miss.

They managed to fuck up a good formula, but what you fuck up can also be fixed in a new game. I've still got some hope for this series still.

 

[Kosher Dill]

The series was kind of good for me until Sticker Star came out (which encouraged me to be an pacifist, since fighting is kind of pointless there).

Yeah, I really don't like a game that actively punishes you for playing it.

 

[dunbrine47]

Even Chuggaaconroy is disgusted by Sticker Star and he loves all Nintendo games.

Speaking of that might as well post this gem:

 

[NerdShamer]

Yeah, I really don't like a game that actively punishes you for playing it.

Well, they've could've thrown in an free weak attack, like those crappy boot and hammer stickers; then I might be singing an different tune. But hopefully the dev team has learned something from this.

 

[Slap47]

I think what a lot of people get wrong when talking about these games is when they say the story is good. The story in all the games is as basic as they come, some great evil is about to fuck things up, so collect the macguffins and stop it from happening. What the early games did right was world building. They turned the Mushroom Kingdom and beyond into a place to live instead of just a giant obstacle course that we see in the platforming games.

Sure its basic if you look at the greater story but the game had plenty of great memorable stories.

Of course, there isn't anything wrong with being basic. Execution is all that really matters.

 

[StoneKnightMan]

hey guys. if you like the first paper mario. you should try out the pro mode. skawo on youtube has an entire playlist of his playthrough on it.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNt9bYwiVIA8JRHxaSK8_D_aZMcXaZsPh

its a rom hack of the first paper mario game. but a hard mode version. think of it like a new game + like zelda and dark souls.

enemies have more hp, defense, and attack power.

there will be enemies in areas where they shouldn't be. like a hammer bro on pleasant path.

some enemies that were originally planned but scrapped are in the game. and boos are enemies too.

badges that were originally planned for the retail version but were scrapped were added with real functions. like the berserker badge.

items that were planned for original but were scrapped were added with real function.

some original paths were added.

there is a boo in toad town that will hit you with a battle rush. you fight a certain number of waves of enemies in one shot and get a prixe if you defeat them all like items and badges.

one more thing. there is a star place in shooting star summit that will let you fight the chapter bosses again after you have beaten them. and theres one for bowser if you beat the game.

 

[MysticMisty]

I’ve always been a firm believer in different doesn’t necessarily equal bad. The dimensions are well done enough with usually reasonable overlap. One can show most enemies and it’s respective setting and comprhend it (Squigs are bad and overused, Koopas and Goombas existing outside of Chapter 3 are kind of an excuse). I think most people who haven’t played it would look at these and infer one of these is a space alien and the other is a girl.

Stylistically, the designs do rely on geometric shapes in most cases with the rare exception an enemy from previous titles shows up (which can be jarring, but the explanation is that those enemies are not supposed to be there anyway). Getting a more stylistically diverse art team wouldn’t have hurt but most characters’ home dimensions can be identified by their appearance.
As for story, hoping for players to always use Tippi to learn more lore about everything was not a wise choice. The also game wants you to get lost in Flip/Flopside to scour deep into each character’s pasts, but it can be frustrating to some with its elevator design. It’s hard to show emotion through a paper doll, and there’s a large amount of story tangents so reeling it in with (sometime well written) text chunks was the solution. The dialog between Bleck and Tippi in flashbacks is soap opera tragedy-esqe but that seemed to be the goal since it takes some inspiration from dramatized novels. Nastasia is well developed even if she is pretty sad as well. The humor being interlaced with that tragedy style plot is off putting to some but I remember me and my friends being fond of it being able to not get too depressing or off the rails often.

I never said different is bad. If I believed that to be the case then I wouldn't have been interested in playing it in the first place. What I did say is that the execution was a complete fail in everything. Honestly you prove my point with the character design. Even though Mimi and Squirps are completely different species that don't cross paths at any given point they are both designed very similarly. Square heads, square/rectangle body parts, and stick limbs. They're even similar shades of green. Pretty much every character and every location is a cross between geometry and modern art. If the game didn't explicitly state these are different dimensions you'd believe you're just visiting different areas of a single planet. This shouldn't be the case.

Regarding the plot though it doesn't matter if you're supposed to use Tippi on every person when the game is only describing things between chapter portions instead of showing them, or dumping large plot expositions at the end of a chapter with little to no build up. The first two games didn't just dump everything all at once, or only describe things instead of actually showing character interactions, and they didn't punish the player for not seeking out extra background information either.

 

[ComputerWife]

I never said different is bad. If I believed that to be the case then I wouldn't have been interested in playing it in the first place. What I did say is that the execution was a complete fail in everything. Honestly you prove my point with the character design. Even though Mimi and Squirps are completely different species that don't cross paths at any given point they are both designed very similarly. Square heads, square/rectangle body parts, and stick limbs. They're even similar shades of green. Pretty much every character and every location is a cross between geometry and modern art. If the game didn't explicitly state these are different dimensions you'd believe you're just visiting different areas of a single planet. This shouldn't be the case.

Regarding the plot though it doesn't matter if you're supposed to use Tippi on every person when the game is only describing things between chapter portions instead of showing them, or dumping large plot expositions at the end of a chapter with little to no build up. The first two games didn't just dump everything all at once, or only describe things instead of actually showing character interactions, and they didn't punish the player for not seeking out extra background information either.

Spoiler: SPM Continued

The designs are easily recognizable by silhouette, fit world themes, and show character. One can look at the alien Squirps and tell by the artist’s posing he is supposed to be a comedic character. One can also tell just by looking at the girl Mimi’s first form she is supposed to be seen as cutesy and not threatening. Not every character is square and green, such as Dimentio, Merlee, and many more that would be overkill to attach. They’re geometric, but one can see one is a jester and the other is a fortune teller no question.

The game doesn’t punish players for seeking out lore, it is made optional. It only gives you more context and understanding of the characters and their actions. Punishment would be requiring you to go to Carson’s for example, and preventing the player from advancing until all of his stories were paid for. A lot of lore is delivered through Carson who is SPM’s version of TTYD’s Wonky and PM’s Russ T, their functionalities are the same. Tippi’s information command is SPM’s version of Goombella and Goombario’s Tattle, and the game rarely requires you to use her other than for your own enjoyment. The story isn’t dumped on you at once, details are laid out over the chapter’s section. Those details are summarized in like diary entries which progress as you do. Story is conveyed through NPC and Narrator dialogue and in-universe documents as in the other games before it. TTYD’s main story is Mario attempting to save Peach from the X Nauts’ awakening an ancient evil with each chapter having its own goals along the way; SPM’s main story is Mario attempting to prevent the destruction of the worlds brought by Bleck using ancient evil prophecy with each chapter once again having its own subplot. Similarities are plain to see.

The issue most have is that it isn’t told in a completely RPG format, which is understandable but not a reason to write off the game as an automatic failure. The gameplay has issues, which are indisputable. Boss battles are a joke, attack items are useless due to the platforming style, certain chapters rely on TTYD reminiscent backtracking, and Flip/Flopside’s design is tedious to navigate. There are valid issues to discuss but the story’s method is not unfamiliar, and the character designs (with exceptions) are not mismatched or poorly thought out.
I hope I’m making sense here, this was a larger block of text than is most likely necessary.

 

[REGENDarySumanai]

If anyone wants to replay TTYD, but with a different coat of paint, then you can try this.

 

[Islamic Creampie]

I want a Paper Luigi game based on him finding that compass.

Only really played TTYD, which I really enjoyed. Sticker Star and Color Splash look like bunk.

Currently playing Paper Jam. Better than Dream Team.

 

[Billy_Sama]

I only played the first two and I am more leaning towards the first for setting the series. It also stands out for me more as it and Ogre Battle 64 are the only two RPG games on the N64 that are amazing and worth playing IMHO.

I need to invest playing the Mario Luigi games more, I still to play that with Paper Mario still.

 

[Black Waltz]

I never said different is bad. If I believed that to be the case then I wouldn't have been interested in playing it in the first place. What I did say is that the execution was a complete fail in everything. Honestly you prove my point with the character design. Even though Mimi and Squirps are completely different species that don't cross paths at any given point they are both designed very similarly. Square heads, square/rectangle body parts, and stick limbs. They're even similar shades of green. Pretty much every character and every location is a cross between geometry and modern art. If the game didn't explicitly state these are different dimensions you'd believe you're just visiting different areas of a single planet. This shouldn't be the case.

Regarding the plot though it doesn't matter if you're supposed to use Tippi on every person when the game is only describing things between chapter portions instead of showing them, or dumping large plot expositions at the end of a chapter with little to no build up. The first two games didn't just dump everything all at once, or only describe things instead of actually showing character interactions, and they didn't punish the player for not seeking out extra background information either.

My biggest problem with SPM is that the bosses could be killed in 30 seconds or less. Which is a shame because I liked some of the concepts for them.

 

[The Fool]

My biggest problem with SPM is that the bosses could be killed in 30 seconds or less. Which is a shame because I liked some of the concepts for them.

I was going to rant about how the final boss is literally a trampoline but it made me feel elitist and autistic. It really was disappointing though. Bleck just before it was cool but then the actual final boss, like, did they rush that or something? How did they think that was in any way satisfying?

 

[MysticMisty]

My biggest problem with SPM is that the bosses could be killed in 30 seconds or less. Which is a shame because I liked some of the concepts for them.

I meant to expand on the gameplay itself but pretty much forget, so thank you for reminding me. I like the idea of a platformer with RPG aspects, but in execution the platforming becomes way too easy, and there's not enough variation in the boss battles. If you're not bouncing off the enemy, you're throwing them/something back at them.

Incidentally I don't know if it's my copy of the disc or what, but repetitive gameplay in certain areas seems to have damaged my copy of the game. It's noticeable in Chapter 1-2 (because I went there a lot to sell gold bricks for profit) and in Chapter 5-4 trying to use Bowser's down attack on a pipe with enemies constantly coming out of it to gain easy exp. My game will flicker and shit if I try to do either of those things, which is weird as hell considering I've barely ever played the game and take care to never scratch the discs.