Victor Mignogna v. Funimation Productions, LLC, et al. (2019) - Vic's lawsuit against Funimation, VAs, and others, for over a million dollars.

[fat ugly sped]

What happened to 19 and 20?

 

[Dixieland Buckaroo]

Running Chuck's affidavit against Ty's general outline of Igor and Iago, it seems a safe to conclude that those two are Sabat and Schemmel.

I'm still curious about Renfield- could that be someone at RoosterTeeth? In point 49, Chuck mentions Sabat has pull at other studios including RT (and Toei).

 

[Son of Sparda 84]

What happened to 19 and 20?

View attachment 916390

Hey so it was Sean, Cody was talking about

 

[Legioneer]

Okay this is the funny part. Yes, a lot of that is arguably hearsay. But, we have an adversarial system, so it gets admitted as evidence unless the defense makes a motion to strike. MoRonica dumped a gigantic pile of hearsay for BHBH to go through and have move to strike, so why not return the favor, especially when you have more time to wade through bullshit and better funding?

It's not even that. Rumors are hearsay if you're trying to pass off the content of a rumor as a fact that actually happened. Or justify your own or someone else's words or actions with this rumor. Rumors are not hearsay if you tell the court that a rumor existed.
The catch is that Vic himself during his deposition admitted the fact that the rumors about himself had existed for many years, so it is a rudeness to bury the court with a bunch of waste paper, which simply confirms the already established fact.
But the plaintiff reports that the rumors existed not only about Vic, and thus proves that the very reference to the rumors is not only not an excuse, but also a direct attempt to deceive the court about the essence of the case.


Two-part argument.
1) The fact that you have heard rumors does not justify you.
2) The rumors were not only about Vic. So you were not mistaken because of your disregard for the truth and the fact that you are that stupid. You knowingly did malice, and now you're lying and making up false excuses.

 

[Gehenna]

What happened to 19 and 20?

Probably got removed in favour of better argumentation, and with the sheer size of the thing some tidying up got lost in the cracks,

 

[Legioneer]

The point of the court is that everybody should speak on the merits and make only those arguments that actually work in their favour. Not to blow everyone's mind with endless stories about what the weather was like that night when Vic invited Monica to his hotel room and what was there for lunch.

The court is interested in real evidence and episodes. That is, if 10 people said they were robbed, or it happened in front of them - it is important. The number is also important, and divercity in details. But if 10 people said that they heard about someone being robbed - 10 independent affidavits with different details are absolutely unnecessary in the case materials. This is disrespect for the court and an increase in costs for all parties.

They are useful during the investigation, but the investigator must find the source. And then it is the first hand information that should be put into the materials for the court.

There were a lot of rumors about Vic going around. Neither party disputes this fact. Noted, moving on. It has to be that quick, otherwise the trials will last for centuries.

To the extent that it was brought by BHBH - this is really new and important information. Because it undermines the arguments of Funimation and the other defendants (there's a lot more dirtier rumors about other people, but no one fired them). It shows that they are deliberately trying to deceive the court.

 

[Iron Hamster]

1200 pages!! He actually did it! The absolute madman!

This is what mosquito boy gets for dumping 500 pages on them. It all has to be addressed.

1,200 pages. Looks like Judge Chupp and his staff are gonna have a working labour day

And mosquito boy has to read all of it to respond.

 

[NotaLolyer]

Also, Chuck's affidavit is notarized... yesterday. He must have really been worried about coming forward.

View attachment 915581

In fact, he says that Sabat is going to ruin his life for it.

More likely it took that long for both that reason but also because it was thoroughly proofread and written in a way that wouldn’t be hearsay

Will it survive? I assume BHBH wrote or proof-read it, so it's been through a pro's hands, but my layperson reading is that this is completely hearsay.

Sorry if this is a dumb question but are the bits where chuck says "x told me..." or especially "x told me y told them..." not hearsay?

That seems like the same sort of stuff Nick was dinging as he went through manjaw's affidavit.

It’s not hearsay, Lemonfuhrer would probably challenge it as such, however it borders on a perfect affidavit structure. He doesn’t make any legal conclusions and mentions exactly where the info came from and what put him in the position of providing that statement. Unlike the other affidavits when he mentions “I heard from... I disagree with...” he cites sources, emails, first hand experience, etc.

 

[Legioneer]

This is what mosquito boy gets for dumping 500 pages on them. It all has to be addressed.



And mosquito boy has to read all of it to respond.

From what I've looked at, they haven't addressed everything and haven't dealt with each piece separately.
All the basic and new information, as far as I understand, is on the first 106 pages.
They then simply put all the evidence currently filed in the desired order.
As I understand it, to make it convenient for them to name the pages at a live hearing.
Maybe they will give the judge one or two large folders, and it will be convenient for everyone to browse through them, if necessary. When the plaintiff's lawyers speak.
Defendants can probably print their version, provide a copy to everyone and name the pages from their version.

These are my guesses. But after 106 pages I haven't found any comments yet. Only alphabetical pointers.

 

[AnOminous]

Hearsay is anything where you said you heard someone else say something, or otherwise are talking about an out of court statement of someone not available to testify at that time. For instance, a police officer is generally not allowed just to read from his own written report at the time, at least as evidence, although the usual excuse for consulting it while testifying it is to "refresh recollection."

What people say when they make a hearsay objection is that something is INADMISSIBLE hearsay.

Inadmissible hearsay is by the most common definition "an out-of-court statement offered to prove the truth of the matter asserted therein."

Often this is acronymized as OTOMA.

Offered for the
Truth
Of the
Matter
Asserted.

This is the test for presumptively inadmissible hearsay.

Is it a quoted statement of someone who is not in the court?
Is it offered to prove that the statement IN the quote, itself, true?

A statement can be inadmissible hearsay for one purpose and admissible for another.

For instance: "I heard Chris Sabat say that Ron Toye is a wife-beating pedophile but I keep him around for now because he's useful."

If you were offering that statement to prove that Ron Toye is a wife-beating pedophile, it would be inadmissible for that purpose.

If you were using it to prove that Chris Sabat SAID that, and by doing so defamed Ron Toye, it would be admissible for that purpose. If you heard him say that, the fact that he said that would be a matter within your personal knowledge.

Just because something is presumptively inadmissible hearsay doesn't mean it's inadmissible, though. There are 23 enumerated hearsay exceptions just in federal court, including a catch-all exception for almost anything the court feels like.

 

[fat ugly sped]

The point of the court is that everybody should speak on the merits and make only those arguments that actually work in their favour. Not to blow everyone's mind with endless stories about what the weather was like that night when Vic invited Monica to his hotel room and what was there for lunch.

The court is interested in real evidence and episodes. That is, if 10 people said they were robbed, or it happened in front of them - it is important. The number is also important, and divercity in details. But if 10 people said that they heard about someone being robbed - 10 independent affidavits with different details are absolutely unnecessary in the case materials. This is disrespect for the court and an increase in costs for all parties.

They are useful during the investigation, but the investigator must find the source. And then it is the first hand information that should be put into the materials for the court.

There were a lot of rumors about Vic going around. Neither party disputes this fact. Noted, moving on. It has to be that quick, otherwise the trials will last for centuries.

To the extent that it was brought by BHBH - this is really new and important information. Because it undermines the arguments of Funimation and the other defendants (there's a lot more dirtier rumors about other people, but no one fired them). It shows that they are deliberately trying to deceive the court.

The rule against hearsay is more about preserving due process rights in the court of law. If a civil lawsuit uses Johnny's affidavit that he heard Timmy say that I hit him, I'm denied my right to cross-examine the actual witness (Timmy) to the actions under dispute (whether or not I hit Timmy). Furthermore, allowing hearsay would open the door to false testimony; instead of lying to the court under oath, you lie to someone else who truthfully testifies that they heard those lies.

There's other procedural stuff about procuring the best and most direct evidence about things too, but the big concern is due process.

 

[Gehenna]

Just because something is presumptively inadmissible hearsay doesn't mean it's inadmissible, though. There are 23 enumerated hearsay exceptions just in federal court, including a catch-all exception for almost anything the court feels like.

I'd suspect this court 'feels like' offering a lot of leash to whichever side hurts the idiots who gave him the original 400 page screed the most.

 

[Tour of Italy]

The fact that the defense has locked shields with Sabat during this whole ordeal is fucking hilarious.

You don’t get to be #metoo while being chummy with the local Weinstein.

It’s smart for Ty to bring Sabat up here; if he can demonstrate that Toye et al. have double standards with regards to rumors and personal conduct, it makes it easier to paint them as malicious. Plus it puts pressure on Sabat to cooperate or settle if he really has been throwing his weight around. It puts him on notice in a big way.

It’s a good filing, and the best part will be not just the actual analysis but having a laugh at the shitbrained hot takes from the twitter crew who are too exceptional to admit they’re wrong.

 

[mindlessobserver]

More likely it took that long for both that reason but also because it was thoroughly proofread and written in a way that wouldn’t be hearsay


It’s not hearsay, Lemonfuhrer would probably challenge it as such, however it borders on a perfect affidavit structure. He doesn’t make any legal conclusions and mentions exactly where the info came from and what put him in the position of providing that statement. Unlike the other affidavits when he mentions “I heard from... I disagree with...” he cites sources, emails, first hand experience, etc.

This was my takeaway as well. Chucks affidavit was the real ace in the hole that Ty was hiding. Reading between the lines the dude really needs to be commended for going out on the limb here. He clearly expects professional and personal reprisal for this. But he also claimed to be an friend of Vics and this really proves that true. I was expecting @Erinmin to be the star affidavit, but this one really came out of left field.

Beyond simply airing the dirty laundry of the VAs, it sends a torpedo right into Funimations efforts to get out of this. He claims first hand knowledge to directors and executives at the company being involved in how this shit went down and in the whisper campaign that preceded it. It does not win the case but it clearly meets the primary fascie burden that Vic has an argument to make before the court

 

[Johann Schmidt]

I have a feeling what we're looking at isn't the final version. Weren't they supposed to include some sort of checklist for the judge to use when deciding what sections of the defendants' fillings should be struck?

 

[mindlessobserver]

I have a feeling what we're looking at isn't the final version. Weren't they supposed to include some sort of checklist for the judge to use when deciding what sections of the defendants' fillings should be struck?

That may be a separate item sent to the judge for his own use rather then a specific filing.

 

[Urbanmech]

That may be a separate item sent to the judge for his own use rather then a specific filing.

I thought that thing at the end with the short concise paragraphs about each affidavit's hearsay in it? I mean I know we were thinking a pure checklist but maybe that was it, not sure.

 

[Tight pantaloons]

I like Hubert's affidavit, even the stuff about the "narcissism and ego" sounds more like "he got fame, got a bit full of himself and got as much pussy as he could." It makes Vic sound like a person capable of fucking up, which is one of the things I like most about BHBH's filings, they're not trying to paint Vic as some sort of holy saint of anime, just a guy that got fucked over by people he thought were friends. Simple. Relatable. In my opinion, if this gets to a jury it's a winner IANAL but judge Chupp seems to be a straightforward guy, there's a metric fuckton of evidence in Vic's favour that basically trashes every narrative kickvic have put out and a relatable angle to sell it to a jury, fuck I could argue this case and win Ty an co. are gonna absolutely destroy these people.
(Edited for stupid spelling mistake)

 

[mindlessobserver]

I like Hubert's affidavit, even the stuff about the "narcissism and ego" sounds more like "he got fame, got a bit full of himself and got as much pussy as he could." It makes Vic sound like a person capable of fucking up, which is one of the things I like most about BHBH's filings, they're not trying to paint Vic as some sort of holy saint of anime, just a guy that got fucked over by people he thought were friends. Simple. Relatable. In my opinion, if this gets to a jury it's a winner IANAL but judge Chupp seems to be a straightforward guy, there's a metric fuckton of evidence in Vic's favour that basically trashes every narrative kickvic have put out and a relatable angle to sell it to a jury, fuck I could argue this case and win Ty an co. are gonna absolutely destroy these people.
(Edited for stupid spelling mistake)

Our courts are quite capable of making terrible decisions. It ain't over until the blue orca screeches .

 

[Steve Smyff]

wargamer manouevering?

first the leaked audios, then this

Are all the motions to strike done or could there be more to come?

Could Sabat & Schemmel be served papers today?

to see one of them melt down on Twitter upon service. - Oh that would be HEAVEN.