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- Feb 9, 2013
It was a normal extension cord. I think Barb plugged it into the bathroom socket and ran the cord through the door. Opening and closing on the cord the bathroom door regularly wore it down, exposed wires and caused a fire.
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- Aug 20, 2014
Shame involves two parties, as embarrassment is a social emotion. The shamers and the shamee. When the shamee has no shame you just end up wasting your time.
General Juicer
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2014
Shame works on three levels. The first level is of course to change the behavior of the shamee. The other two levels is for the shamer to display their conformance to social norms and to directly or indirectly warn other potential nonconformers the consequences of behaving like the shamee.
On one hand, stuff like shaming Chris for sitting around in his filth (as opposed to shaming him for asking for a handout) comes across as disingenuous and/or fishing for easy cool points because most people aren't going to literally shit themselves and do nothing. On the other hand Chris's playing the autism card, wasting his life with his obsession with childish hobbies, making people on welfare look bad, etc. attracts shaming because autists/geeks/welfare recipients are using it in an attempt to preemptively shame people who may be tempted to behave like Chris and also to try to distance themselves or their subgroup from him.
And before you criticize people for using Chris to maintain social cohesion, keep in mind that A.) most visitors to the Chris-chan bubble are just that, visitors, and aren't aware of the nuances of Chris culture B.) Chris does legitimately give the trait groups/subcultures he intersects with an undeservedly bad name. Check out the use of the word 'autistic' as an insult. Or chaining off of that 'what's with Sonic fans and autism'.
NapDaddy
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2014
Watched the Chris Chan documentary yesterday, there's no way anybody can convince me that the continuous trolling didn't contribute to Chris going off the rails the last 4-5 years. Believe it or not Chris would be much better off if he hadn't been harassed and monitored for the past 8 years. Not trying to "morally condemn" the trolls or anything, not at all, but the trolling and harassment drove a person with a mental illness even more insane.
It's obvious that some of the trolls(ie bluespike) are pretty much sadistic people, while some are just trying to have some fun and get a rise out of him(ie liquid chris). The 'shame' argument is pretty redundant, some of the trolls might be trying to 'shame' Chris or try and get him to change his behavior, but pretty much all of them were trying to fuck with Chris one way or another for their own pleasure and amusement. It's pretty laughable that people think that trolling is good for Chris or try and justify it in anyway, it's all about the the lulz and it has always been about the lulz. Again I'm not trying to condemn the trolls or saying they're deserving of any kind of punishment just be honest about it. And hey, I laugh right along with them.
It's obvious that some of the trolls(ie bluespike) are pretty much sadistic people, while some are just trying to have some fun and get a rise out of him(ie liquid chris). The 'shame' argument is pretty redundant, some of the trolls might be trying to 'shame' Chris or try and get him to change his behavior, but pretty much all of them were trying to fuck with Chris one way or another for their own pleasure and amusement. It's pretty laughable that people think that trolling is good for Chris or try and justify it in anyway, it's all about the the lulz and it has always been about the lulz. Again I'm not trying to condemn the trolls or saying they're deserving of any kind of punishment just be honest about it. And hey, I laugh right along with them.
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- Feb 9, 2013
Much better off? I can't imagine how.
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- Mar 23, 2013
People always come back to this, but let's be reasonable here... bluespike was a 13 year old kid. There's a reason why we don't let 13 year old kids vote, drive, or live by themselves; they're not really emotionally mature. I won't speak for bluespike, but I do know that when I was 13 years old I didn't really consider how a lot of my actions or words affected other people. That's because I didn't have enough life-experience to understand how things affect people in the long run. I'm not saying what bluespike did or said was right, of course it wasn't. I'm just saying that if he were hauled into court over it, most justice systems recognize that children are different when it comes to doing shitty stuff, and they'd be far more lenient in their judgement.
General Juicer
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2014
Yeah, if it wasn't for the trolls, Chris's finances would've been better, he wouldn't have had gender identity issues, he wouldn't have been a pariah in his few places of social contact, he would be in better physical and mental health, he'd have a better relationship with his family, would have had people thinking better of his magnum opus, would have had fewer issues with law and authority, would be reaching a level of vocational development above that of a 12-year old, and maybe even have become less of a coward.
Goddamn trolls. People going through his garbage and gaslighting him with gal-pals and business figures and fucking with his comic and website is what really made his life the hell it is today.
- Joined
- Sep 18, 2014
I doubt he would be better off or at least better off in any real tangible way, is way of thinking, his attitude an personality have been set since he left school. His impetus to change has been non existent long before that, and his hampered intellect (outside of autism) precludes him from making any significant change, prior to his discovery he was already making bad art, had a inflated ego, filmed really ego centric videos, escaped into his fantasy world at any opportunity, an had already racked up a ban or two from local establishments.
He has a big ego yes, but he lacks introspection and accurate recall so your right shame won't work on him. We have pictures of Him in situations an saying things that are cringe worthy in retrospect without troll interaction I would go as far as saying he hasn't leanred a single thing in the last few years since the trolling began as he is basically the same person an holds most of the same limited worldview as he did before the trolling began. He still hates Men, is hypocritical and can perform feats of mental gymnastics that will leave us all dumbfounded.
About the only thing's that have changed is his boogy man of choice (troll's) and his openly waring women's clothing (an that won't last), he would not be better off in the least just least, emotionally or financially (he would arguably be worse off, with the care package an ebay sales).
The few troll's who have genuinely harmed Chris are few an far between an are frowned upon, an what bluespike did was weenery of epic proportions but he doesn't really care or rember them partly out of choice an partly out of blacking out thing's he does not like to recall.
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- Feb 3, 2013
I think it's worth pointing out that most of the really bad stuff that's happened to Chris has been completely independent of the trolls - PVCC, his many bannings, Bob's death, the fire, the whole blarms saga, etc. All of that would have happened one way or the other.
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- Apr 10, 2013
And some of the more reprehensible things he's done, like creeping on Megan, doxxing the wallflower, hitting Snyder, have been his own doing. Not the trolls.
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- Sep 16, 2013
It is impossible to say with much authority what exactly Chris would be like without trolling, since it played such a large role in his life. He has lived so much of the past 7 years in a virtual world created by trolls. But I don't really agree with your conjecture.
At the time the trolling got rolling he was an incredibly awkward and angry guy. He had gotten suspended from community college for trying to attract women with a sign. He had very little social life. He had almost no history of working. He spent much of his time using ridiculous techniques to attract a sweetheart. He constantly feuded with store managers and got banned from stores.
Trolls didn't just pick a random run-of-the-mill guy with autism. Chris was trolled because he was truly ridiculous.
So what rails did he go off? He doesn't seem to have changed that much. I suppose the tomgirl saga and his arrests are new. The trolling didn't directly cause any of those, but could you say trolling put him in a mental state to do those things, and that absent trolling he wouldn't have done them? I suppose so. There is no evidence either way. But overall, I don't think those things define his life. His life then and now is defined by a desire to find a sweetheart, his complete inability to find one, and his complete apathy about anything else.
Most people who say trolling is good for Chris point to a very few specific incidents like the taint piercing where trolls stepped in and may have done him some material good. That argument seems valid, although there aren't a ton of examples. There were other trolls who said things like "get a job" or "be healthier". One could easily argue that this part of the trolling had some of Chris' interests at heart. But they did not succeed in getting him to do those things.
Overall, the main reason people troll Chris because it is funny. Trolls vary along the sadism/benevolence spectrum, but their position on that spectrum is completely secondary to the amusement factor.
General Juicer
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2014
Emphasis mine. The arrests aren't new. Chris's narcissism- and anger-induced troubles with authority figures and the law come from way before his discovery by trolls. Sure, the October 2011 and GameStop spraying and Best Buy attempted shoplifting is definitely an escalation of his pre-troll behavior, but the underlying factors that led to his Game Place and mall and Target bannings haven't changed. Chris thinks that he's a special snowflake of autism and repeatedly dices with disaster for the pettiest of reasons. This confrontation was a long time coming and the only really surprising thing is that it has taken Chris so long to get the ball rolling.timtommy said:
And if you asked me to compile a ranked list of Chris's problems that are fucking him over or have the potential to greatly fuck him over, his relationship with authority would be second on the list. Right underneath 'finances'.
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- Apr 10, 2013
I'm sure it's been said before, but here's my two cents:
The "inner circle" trolling was a bit much. There weren't any medallions shoved up CWC's ass, but Null's point about it becoming like gang stalking is essentially true. On the other hand, it probably kept him from stalking his former classmates, which is definitely good. At this point, trolling Chris is futile. I've said on multiple occasions that reality is the ultimate Chris troll, and we see this in his current legal issues. I hate to reference Star Trek, but the Prime Directive is a good rule to follow. Observe but don't interfere, especially now that the fool has pepper spray.
The "inner circle" trolling was a bit much. There weren't any medallions shoved up CWC's ass, but Null's point about it becoming like gang stalking is essentially true. On the other hand, it probably kept him from stalking his former classmates, which is definitely good. At this point, trolling Chris is futile. I've said on multiple occasions that reality is the ultimate Chris troll, and we see this in his current legal issues. I hate to reference Star Trek, but the Prime Directive is a good rule to follow. Observe but don't interfere, especially now that the fool has pepper spray.
NapDaddy
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2014
Whoa didn't expect so many replies
I think him being 13 does defiantly make him an exception, I think it has a lot to do with why he was so cruel probably. But he's always been the most extreme example. There are a lot of much older trolls.
Chris made it it so trolls were bound to find him, but I think he honestly didn't think that kinda shit would happen to him, and he was too stupid and gullible otherwise to defend himself. He likely would have been better off in all the ways General Juicer listed.
@timtommy
I pretty much agree with you, but don't think Chris being insane like that makes him "deserving" in any objective sense. Him being a prime target is another thing. We don't have any kind of crystal ball to see "what ifs" of Chris, but I don't think he would be quite like he is now.
Edit: but granted he could be even worse.
I don't think he'd be a "Tom Girl" or a male lesbian.
I think him being 13 does defiantly make him an exception, I think it has a lot to do with why he was so cruel probably. But he's always been the most extreme example. There are a lot of much older trolls.
Chris made it it so trolls were bound to find him, but I think he honestly didn't think that kinda shit would happen to him, and he was too stupid and gullible otherwise to defend himself. He likely would have been better off in all the ways General Juicer listed.
@timtommy
I pretty much agree with you, but don't think Chris being insane like that makes him "deserving" in any objective sense. Him being a prime target is another thing. We don't have any kind of crystal ball to see "what ifs" of Chris, but I don't think he would be quite like he is now.
Edit: but granted he could be even worse.
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Atlas 95
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2014
I don't believe that for a second. Chris always had a fucked up view of gender roles, and most importantly hated other men long before the trolls came along and started playing with that fear. It might have taken longer, but Chris would have started trying to escape being a man because his ego demands he is perfect eventually.
How would that happen? Chris always had shitty finances, he got himself banned from the Gameplace and everywhere else by being his shitty self not through troll actions, his health was always going to spiral downwards because he has a shitty diet with no exercise whatsoever and he was getting into trouble with the authorities before ED found him (remember the banning from the Mall?). Everything General Juicer mentioned is stuff innate to Chris, that troll discovery or not would not have changed
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2014
Just to piggyback on your point here, even Bluespike himself disagrees with his actions back then (source: some recent 4chan discussion) and by all accounts is now a good natured adult human. Judging a highly influenced 13 year old isn't fair. Clyde Cash deserves as much or more blame than Bluespike for the medallion penetration, but he is idolized for his volume of great work and therefore more untouchable it seems.
(To be clear: I agreed with CC's motives most of the time, but he was wrong to get a youngster to do his dirty work and reaped the whirlwind when BS went off the rails)
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- Nov 15, 2014
Yeah - on the recent PVCC "reunion" thread, most of the key figures from those days (Bluespike included) regretted their roles in the past trolling. They didn't seem to have a high opinion of anyone who continues to interact with Chris on any level. I pretty much agree. Keeping tabs on his lulzy FB posts is one thing, playing Truman Show with Chris in 2015 is pretty hard to defend.
The Other Chandler
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jan 30, 2015
Is there a screencap or transcript of that thread anywhere?
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- May 20, 2014
PVCC thread 3: http://8ch.net/cow/res/38834.html (Backup)
PVCC thread 2: http://8ch.net/cow/res/23310.html (Backup)
There was a PVCC thread 1, but it's probably been swept into wherever /cow/ gets archived by a tsunami of high-quality Peter Coffin threads. Also no-one from actual PVCC really posted in it.
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- Feb 28, 2013
Wow, such trolls trolling trolls trolling trollception. I am seriously amazed at how many of the inner circle who weren't literally fucking each other were busily, and to a really complex extent, engaged in fucking each other over on the daily -- and that's even after knowing about some of the feuds. I do think it's rather sweet that one of the alternate forums was named after Clyde's then-girlfriend's parrot. That's kind of the humanizing detail in that cascade of wtf. (And sorry not sorry if this sounds SJW, but "epileptic" as an insult? Really?) Yet there's everybody reuniting and going "I LOVE YOU MANG, oh God, how I regret these 95 horrible things we did to you because you were actually pretty chill." The Stockholm is strong with that group.
Having read those screencaps, I now feel that it was inevitable that some of the bullshit we know about got shat, given the particular personalities involved in initiating the trolling. As Marvin said, I think it would be pretty interesting to trace the CWCki's evolution away from EDiot culture via a timeline of edits; I'm just too lazy to do it myself. I'm kind of sad to hear about Ivy not being cool, because I always had a soft spot for her saga. But according to the screencaps, and of course taking them with a proverbial grain of salt, these are people who invented an entire fake forum and invited somebody to mod it in order to test his lolcow potential. So given the particular people (like the guy who didn't even have to act to be Jack Thaddeus effectively), yeah, no wonder the first wave of Christory has a profound cruel streak. Obligatory props to Bluespike, of course, for moving on from his 13-year-old anger and apparently now leading a pretty normal college life. (But these same people are outraged at Skyraider for picking Chris's old homework out of the post-fire dumpster? That seems comparatively benign of him, all else considered.)
Having read those screencaps, I now feel that it was inevitable that some of the bullshit we know about got shat, given the particular personalities involved in initiating the trolling. As Marvin said, I think it would be pretty interesting to trace the CWCki's evolution away from EDiot culture via a timeline of edits; I'm just too lazy to do it myself. I'm kind of sad to hear about Ivy not being cool, because I always had a soft spot for her saga. But according to the screencaps, and of course taking them with a proverbial grain of salt, these are people who invented an entire fake forum and invited somebody to mod it in order to test his lolcow potential. So given the particular people (like the guy who didn't even have to act to be Jack Thaddeus effectively), yeah, no wonder the first wave of Christory has a profound cruel streak. Obligatory props to Bluespike, of course, for moving on from his 13-year-old anger and apparently now leading a pretty normal college life. (But these same people are outraged at Skyraider for picking Chris's old homework out of the post-fire dumpster? That seems comparatively benign of him, all else considered.)