Wuhan Coronavirus: Megathread - Got too big

[Not Really Here]

It's more about population density. Wuhan has 11 million people living in it, not around. I'm just saying we dont really have "mega cities" compared to other more populous nations.

Wuhan doesn't rank in the top 100 for population density.
Enjoy a list of the top 250 with New York coming in at #114.

City Mayors: Largest cities in the world by population density (1 to 125)

City Mayors: Largest cities in the world ranked by population density (1 to 125)

www.citymayors.com

 

[Stoneheart]

In other news, the german equivalent of the CDC noted a decrease of new cases for the last few days. This might be a statistical artifact of the weekend but they're carefully optimistic that there will be at least no huge increase in new cases. The way things will go this week will be decisive in how this pandemic will play out in germany.

The RKI is alot less political than the CDC and alot more competent. beeing named after the biggest name in bacteriology and having his ashes in the institute helps alot against political fuckery-

 

[DNA_JACKED]

I think you are picturing the rust belt as largely unpopulated or something, it isn't. They are some of the most populated states in America, with dense populations.

Most populated states:

1. California (Population: 39,747,267)
2. Texas (Population: 29,087,070)
3. Florida (Population: 21,646,155)
4. New York (Population: 19,491,339)
5. Pennsylvania (Population: 12,813,969)
6. Illinois (Population: 12,700,381)
7. Ohio (Population: 11,718,56
8. Georgia (Population: 10,627,767)
9. North Carolina (Population: 10,497,741)
10. Michigan (Population: 10,020,472)

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Numbers dont tell the whole story. New york has 8 million people, 3 million less then the ENTIRE state of ohio.

Dont want to PL too hard here, but our county has over 400,000 residents, mostly in urban settings. Outside of 12 city blocks, there are 0 buildings over 4 stories, and nowhere in the county does density even begin to approach new york, even in the high rises.

And as of now our corona count is still under 10 for the entire county. New York is a microcosm of america, along with seattle, LA, chicago, ece. Much of the country is far more spread out.

For those in the culinary arts this is truly a fate worst than death.

We still dont know whether that is permanent. I'm going out on a limb here and saying nope. Just like any other nasty cold, it can take time for these things to heal. Much like lung capacity.

If coronavirus is vulnerable to heat, would cranking up the heat or using a sauna get rid of it? Sounds too good to be true...

Breathing in steam from hot showers or boiling water is known to reduce the severity of symptoms.

 

[DubbleBubble]

If coronavirus is vulnerable to heat, would cranking up the heat or using a sauna get rid of it? Sounds too good to be true...

Just crank up the oven and climb on in. Good news, you won't have to worry about corona ever again!

But on the sauna thing, I'd think the issue there is human dehydration, which would only make it easier for a virus to take hold. But I'm no scientitian.

 

[EmuWarsVeteran]

I realize now I worded the post confirming no neurological damage poorly. I do find it slightly hilarious than due to said wording everyone's rating it "horrifying", almost looks like you fuckers qanted Corona to turn half the world's population into mongs.

If coronavirus is vulnerable to heat, would cranking up the heat or using a sauna get rid of it? Sounds too good to be true...

ATMOSPHERIC heat. You'd have to cook yourself for that to work! Also it seems to be less vulnerable than other diseases like the flu, so let's not boil people alive. Alright?

 

[Cat Menagerie]

Markets open in a little over half an hour. We ready to see stock brokers jump from buildings?

Don't play with my emotions like that.

 

[DNA_JACKED]

Just crank up the oven and climb on in. Good news, you won't have to worry about corona ever again!

But on the sauna thing, I'd think the issue there is human dehydration, which would only make it easier for a virus to take hold. But I'm no scientitian.

Using a sauna when sick is an immediate no go for this exact reason. NEVER use a sauna when you are sick, unless you enjoy getting other people sick and dying of dehydration. Dehydration also allows viruses to become more severe much more quickly.

 

[Judge Holden]

UPDATE 4: I feel almost entirely back to normal, albeit with my body seemingly dehydrating itself a lot more aggressively and thus requiring extra water.

Also SPICE

My 70% spicy fermented food diet has been an unqualified success.....maybe.....ok probably not but it probably kept my sinuses from completely clogging up and gave me both the metabolistic kick I craved and much needed morale. Either way it seems I probably had only a mild ass case if I even had it to begin with so if you are coughing up blood and globules of cum lung you should probably consult with a physician before you start choking down habenero poppers like your mother chokes downs swarthy cock at a diversity rally

 

[Marchesa of the Vast]

It's more about population density. Wuhan has 11 million people living in it, not around. I'm just saying we dont really have "mega cities" compared to other more populous nations.

Same difference when you're in a major US city, at least not one in the North East. In Houston for example there are huge suburbs within the city limits, even the apt complexes are all at most 3 or 4 floors with large spaces in between for parking and green zones (and yes even in the ghetto ass playwood door frame complexes). A lot of these municipalities in the metros that are not part of the city are also completely surrounded by the city limits. This is the best I can pull up for Houston on short notice but look at how the city kind of just sprawls and blobs around things, especially the E district. That's how US cities are, if you're only looking at city limits and not the metro you are literally missing large populations that are otherwise surrounded by the city.

 

[Barnard]

I think it's just anecdotal for now, but Polish epidemiological labs are hinting that quick corona tests imported from China give results divergent from standard, precise lab tests in up to 80% of the time. Anyone heard similar stories?

 

[AtomicAgeBoy]

Monday stat update on Finland
700 labrotary confirmed cases, 50 in hospital care, 13 of those in intensive care. 1 death so far. Number of tests made to date over 10 500.
61% of infected male, 39% female.

 

[Cutlass Supreme]

I think it's just anecdotal for now, but Polish epidemiological labs are hinting that quick corona tests imported from China give results divergent from standard, precise lab tests in up to 80% of the time. Anyone heard similar stories?

Aren't those the same as the WHO ones that were throwing 40% false negatives?

 

[Goronnn]

View attachment 1199447View attachment 1199448

Wuhan doesn't rank in the top 100 for population density.
Enjoy a list of the top 300 with New York coming in at #114.

City Mayors: Largest cities in the world by population density (1 to 125)

City Mayors: Largest cities in the world ranked by population density (1 to 125)

www.citymayors.com

I never said it did. Wuhan is bigger, so yes less dense than NYC, but it is 11 million people stacked on top of one another. NYC is still lacking in that by the millions in that aspect. Single family housing is extremely rare in Chinese cities, virtually non existent. NYC has single family housing, and the metropolitan area it is even more abundant. Mega cities in Asian countries are not comparable to US mega cities was the whole point. It is probably easier to spread in a Chinese mega due to the inability to actually isolate yourself and they have usually have a larger population.

 

[Drain Todger]

I’ve updated my COVID-19 file with a bunch more information, with info on PPE and a Glossary:

COVID19_Analysis_and_Summary.docx

Microsoft Word Document

tinyurl.com

This is getting a little scary, folks.

So on the neurological damage: I haven't managed to get my hands on the document, but they've gone public. They say it's NOT neurological. What it afects its the nose cells controling smell. And due to smell and taste being related this also afects the sense of taste. I repeat, NO neurological damage but it DOES make you loose partially smell and taste!

The nose cells controlling smell are nerves. The virus has been found in people’s cerebrospinal fluid. If people are saying it’s not neurological at this point, they’re being disingenuous.

 

[captkrisma]

I admit that Americans are far less disciplined in regards to staying indoors, but I have a proposal that could keep Americans in isolation until this boils over.

Electronic tethering with cash incentives. Simply have a range device linked to a phone. As long as the phone is in range, then you're making money. Also allow the user to pause the program for 3 hours daily to take care of essentials like groceries or walking pets.

 

[Not Really Here]

I never said it did. Wuhan is bigger, so yes less dense than NYC, but it is 11 million people stacked on top of one another.

Explain how when Wuhan is 10 times the physical size of NYC, Wuhan only has 3 million more than NYC but ten times the area.

 

[DNA_JACKED]

Wired did a interview with larry brilliant, an epidemiologist who helped wipe out Smallpox. The thing that stands out is he agrees with the general public that vast testing is needed to understand the spread, without it we are swinging in the dark.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/03/the-doctor-who-helped-defeat-smallpox-explains-whats-coming/ (not linking the wired article, because fuck wired)

Dude has a bit of TDS but makes a lot of good points in handling pandemics. Beyond optimistic here, but maybe with his input some government officials will stop putting their heads int he sand and start demanding more testing from the CDC or allowing state organizations to push for more testing, as well as get more manufacturing of testing kits set up.

In other news, At the moment there is little work to be done, and with the governor announcing stay-in-place there will likely be none, as despite being IT we are considered non essential. I'm thankful we are still getting paid (the benefit of a low paying public sector job, we get paid regardless), but I do wonder how much longer the government will be able to keep a lid on this. People are getting restless, and its only been a week. Hell I'm getting antsy, and I'm an introvert. The lack of info is getting on everyone's nerves. You know its bad when the disease cascades, but then you look at how few confirmed cases there are and it causes cognitive dissonance thinking how few people are ram-rodding the whole economy into the ground. The governor thinks that additional confirmed testing wont help anyone, I couldnt disagree more, knowing how widespread the disease is would put more people at ease with staying home for 4 weeks.

 

[mindlessobserver]

I admit that Americans are far less disciplined in regards to staying indoors, but I have a proposal that could keep Americans in isolation until this boils over.

Electronic tethering with cash incentives. Simply have a range device linked to a phone. As long as the phone is in range, then you're making money. Also allow the user to pause the program for 3 hours daily to take care of essentials like groceries or walking pets.

I like the illusion that my phone isnt spying on me already. This would shatter it.

 

[ultimate_racoon]

I read what you guys said about South Korea and now I wonder if we weren't fat and stupid if none of this would be a big deal. Old people and diabetics could stay home and the rest of us could go to work and practice hand washing, social distancing, go home with symptoms. And then it would all blow over with time. I bet the 40% of the hospitalized that are age 20-44 that the media is freaking out about are either smokers or fat. I bet none of them are healthy 30 year olds who exercise, eat vegetables, and abstain from smoking and drugs. So people are so unhealthy and too dumb for safe practices that we have to shut down the economy or the hospitals get overrun. Maybe I'm completely wrong and the aftermath will prove that it was way more serious than I think. (Apologies to fat people and smokers. Friends with plenty of them. Just saying.)

 

[Gustav Schuchardt]

If my interpretation of the document is correct, wearing a gas mask or respirator is the best way to avoid the virus, not handwashing.

Why didn't they tell us this earlier?

Edit: still wipe down your mask and wash your hands, it still helps *some*.

There's more bad news actually. Back in the old days hand sanitizers used to be mostly 60%+ ethanol. Antibacterial handwashes contained triclosan which was very effective. Hard surface sanitizers contained bleach. Now if it was still like that then there's a good chance coronavirus would not persist on hands or hard surface. However, it's not. Hand sanitizers moved to be 'alcohol-free' which meant they are a dilute solution of benzalkonium chloride. Antibacterial handwashes dropped the triclosan because the FDA banned it and are now no more antimicrobial than soap - they wash away microbes but they do not inactivate them. Hard surface sanitizers are mostly benzalkonium chloride too because that's more green or some shit.

So most households, even ones which had a stock off 'antibacterial' stuff even before the shit hit the fan have a bunch of stuff which is not effective in inactivating the virus. How do I know that? Well look at this

https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/S0195-6701(20)30046-3/pdf
https://web.archive.org/web/2020022...fection.com/article/S0195-6701(20)30046-3/pdf



The important part

The analysis of 22 studies reveals that human coronaviruses such as Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) coronavirus, Middle East Respiratory Syndrome (MERS) coronavirus or endemic human coronaviruses (HCoV) can persist on inanimate surfaces like metal, glass or plastic for up to 9 days, but can be efficiently inactivated by surface disinfection procedures with 62-71% ethanol, 0.5% hydrogen peroxide or 0.1% sodium hypochlorite within 1 minute. Other biocidal agents such as 0.05-0.2% benzalkonium chloride or 0.02% chlorhexidine digluconate are less effective. As no specific therapies are available for SARS-CoV-2, early containment and prevention of further spread will be crucial to stop the ongoing outbreak and to control this novel infectious thread.

The original version of hand sanitizer with 60%+ alcohol would have inactivated the virus. The new one with benzalkonium chloride does not. The old version of surface sanitizers with bleach would have inactivated the virus, the new one with benzalkonium chloride would not.

There is some evidence that triclosan would have inactivated coronavirus were it still present. E.g. here

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19692148
https://web.archive.org/web/20120120070354/https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19692148

RESULTS:
When tested as directed, common household disinfectants or antiseptics, containing either 0.050% of triclosan, 0.12% of PCMX, 0.21% of sodium hypochlorite, 0.23% of pine oil, or 0.10% of a quaternary compound with 79% of ethanol, demonstrated a 3-log reduction or better against MHV without any virus recovered in a 30-second contact time.

CONCLUSION:
Common household disinfectants and antiseptics were effective at inactivating MHV, a possible surrogate for SARS-CoV, from surfaces when used as directed. In an outbreak caused by novel agents, it is important to know the effectiveness of disinfectants and antiseptics to prevent or reduce the possibility of human-to-human transmission via surfaces.

Now there were issues with triclosan so I'm not entirely convinced that banning it from hand washes was a bad idea. If you wash your hands you can remove microbes down the drain even if they are not inactivated. Still wiping down all your surfaces, some contaminated with the virus, with an agent that doesn't inactivate that virus means you're merely spreading it around. Phasing out ethanol from hand sanitizer and bleach from surface sterilizers was a much more questionable move.