Wuhan Coronavirus: Megathread - Got too big

[Non-Expert!]

Small businesses are not going to survive state mandated closures and most shops are small businesses. The people they employed lost their jobs and they aren't getting paid. Large conglomerates and the like aren't suffering and will be the recipients of bailouts from governments. People worked through various pandemics all throughout history. The US didn't bring the economy to a screeching halt during the Spanish Flu and the states didn't form "alliances" to defy the Federal government. A prolonged lockdown is more likely to cause your children harm than not.

So much stuff is gone already. This isn't about "my children." This is about the state in which we (Gen-X-ers and Boomers and remaining silents) are leaving for them.

Catch is, it also looks like COVID also can leave some people totally gimped out. So long term, death aside, the could-have or should-have-died, who survive this damn thing, stand to be an economic drain on healthcare systems and Social Security for decades.

Also, for talent retention ... People in their 50's and 60's tend to be at the top of their careers with decades of experience, and one minor age-related medical hiccup. When one of these guys goes out, he is very difficult to replace, in specialized fields. So it is a very tricky balance.

So basically some companies sent their employees home, before March 13th.

A lot of stuff is gone. The only thing that actually can't be embellished, worked-around, reworked, reinvented, is death. So we should be invested in keeping people alive long term. Maybe things will get better than they were before.

However ingenuity underlies the human spirit. We will make it. We have dramatically evolved over the past 5 centuries. And we will continue to do so, if we can manage to stay un-disabled, and alive. We are guaranteed change in life.

I just think that cobbling together a sick workforce, short term, will be disastrous, long term.

 

[MediocreMilt]

Not in the USA.

Trump can not force the hands of Cuomo at. al. This is not a dictatorship. Presidential powers are limited.



People are dying already. So some were not saved. Do they count? Or do we need more to die, to fulfill the quota necessary to protect our real estate investments?

We should take volunteers, like folks who want to exercise their freedom to assemble in the pews of a megachurch. Maybe even a millionaire, or two.

Actually if you ever met my mother, it would be immediately apparent, as to what is stopping me.



Yes, every single one of them.



"colossal pulsating pussies that jump every time someone coughs."

AWESOME.



Absolutely. Clearly you are one of the "many."



That is debatable. Spend some time in Newark, and you will see just how far we've evolved.

Can we get back to those massive pussies that jump when people cough?

Whoa cool!

I think we're watching a Kiwi's mind unravel in real time in the thread

 

[Kornheiser]

So why do states not want to open up in a month if death and infected rates start to go down? Is this all about blue states wanting to hurt Trump? They can’t arrest everyone if loads of people say screw you to the state governments and ignore the lockdowns.

 

[JosephStalin]

So why do states not want to open up in a month if death and infected rates start to go down? Is this all about blue states wanting to hurt Trump? They can’t arrest everyone if loads of people say screw you to the state governments and ignore the lockdowns.

Just politicians trying to fuck with the people. How else can you explain two governors forbidding people from buying garden seeds and seedlings in stores at the start of the gardening season? The people know the only one in their corner is President Trump. Agree pushback will grow beyond the ability of these oppressive state governments to deal with it before long.

 

[Feline Supremacist]

So much stuff is gone already. This isn't about "my children." This is about the state in which we (Gen-X-ers and Boomers and remaining silents) are leaving for them.

Catch is, it also looks like COVID also can leave some people totally gimped out. So long term, death aside, the could-have or should-have-died, who survive this damn thing, stand to be an economic drain on healthcare systems and Social Security for decades.

Also, for talent retention ... People in their 50's and 60's tend to be at the top of their careers with decades of experience, and one minor age-related medical hiccup. When one of these guys goes out, he is very difficult to replace, in specialized fields. So it is a very tricky balance.

So basically some companies sent their employees home, before March 13th.

A lot of stuff is gone. The only thing that actually can't be embellished, worked-around, reworked, reinvented, is death. So we should be invested in keeping people alive long term. Maybe things will get better than they were before.

However ingenuity underlies the human spirit. We will make it. We have dramatically evolved over the past 5 centuries. And we will continue to do so, if we can manage to stay un-disabled, and alive. We are guaranteed change in life.

I just think that cobbling together a sick workforce, short term, will be disastrous, long term.

Don't count on "herd immunity" to this virus. And don't listen to this boomer who wants to send kids to the front line to acquire this elusive "herd immunity:"

Get this ... his solution is to open schools to infect children, and those with parents over 45 would get some kind of magic pass, to keep their kids at home.

Just give it a little time. There is always a "workaround." Here is a suggestion, put people like him on the front lines. Anybody enthusiastic about building potential herd immunity can volunteer as a candystriper in a local ICU.

The world would be a better place if medical researchers refrained from making business projections, and business people refrained from volunteering youth (and school staff) to get infected with a potentially lethal virus.

Sorry, just bitter. Some of us actually have faced a lifetime of disability, already, due to the actions of boomers who preceded us. When I had my kids I made a promise to myself and them that they would be spared such a fate, and then it is like what the fuck? This shit again?

Sorry this guy is losing his shirt, but human lives are more important than his stock portfolio, especially when it comes time to children and young adults who have their whole lives ahead of them.

You wrote all of the above and I highlighted the parts about "the children". So yes, it was all about your children. You sound like every feel good advert and news clip, that we will "get through this together because we're in it all together", etc.

We haven't evolved in the past 500 years into anything special in fact you can say the opposite is true, that more defective people are passing on their inferior genes because medical technology is keeping them alive, whereas in the past they wouldn't have survived infancy or childhood. In addition, the chinks seemed to have devolved into a hybrid Florida Man and Peking Man. We'll make it unless some exceptional chink starts WW3 because he insists on having bat soup with powered rhino horn and tiger penis appetizers.

A prolonged lockdown will not save us from Corona-chan and could make things worse. Sweden isn't locked down and it's coping better than we are.

 

[Spoonge]

Society simply cant survive a 6 month quarantine. The only people that are trying for one are radical ancaps, radical commies and people that want the stock market to crash so they can buy up everything they can from panicking boomers and ride it all the way back to the top.

And as one of the people squarely in the last category, I wholeheartedly support a long quarantine. 6 months? fuck it, 8! Maybe 10, just to make sure. We dont that scary coof to come and get our children. Won't somebody think of the children?

 

[remiem]

So why do states not want to open up in a month if death and infected rates start to go down? Is this all about blue states wanting to hurt Trump? They can’t arrest everyone if loads of people say screw you to the state governments and ignore the lockdowns.

Because there's ample evidence of what happens if you get even one person in an area that is carrying it, see the cluster in Newfoundland- 130-something cases connected to one positive person at a funeral- AND we know there's a lot of asymptomatic or low symptom carriers. You get a cluster and/or a massive boom.

How is that in any way hard to understand? The rates could be going down but the second you open the floodgates of 'return to normal' you will have the exact issue crop up that spawned this lockdown solution in the first place. A single dumbass will go out and infect a few people, who infect a few more, who infect a few more and they won't immediately show symptoms to they keep spreading it around until there's suddenly a huge uptick in cases. Your local hospital gets overwhelmed, it starts spreading like crazy, and *bam* you have a giant cluster.

I don't have a solution for this but the reason anywhere is hesitant to open back up is because the reason for the lockdown is NOT to STOP the spread, it's too late for that, it's to SLOW it so the medical systems aren't swamped to the point that the death rate skyrockets because instead of having a manageable number of cases you have so many overwhelming the system that the ones who might survive aren't getting needed care. Especially if you go the route of return to normal when it's almost summer and suddenly everyone is congregating at the usual summer activities of pools, theme parks, bbq's, flea markets, church fundraisers, etc. and doing so with gusto after not being able to properly socialize for several months/weeks.

 

[Kornheiser]

I also noticed that recovery rates aren’t being mentioned. I know why tptb won’t tell the general public but it would reduce the doomer narrative and bring some optimism.

 

[Feline Supremacist]

Because there's ample evidence of what happens if you get even one person in an area that is carrying it, see the cluster in Newfoundland- 130-something cases connected to one positive person as a funeral- AND we know there's a lot of asymptomatic or low symptom carriers. You get a cluster and/or a massive boom.

How is that in any way hard to understand? The rates could be going down but the second you open the floodgates of 'return to normal' you will have the exact issue crop up that spawned this lockdown solution in the first place. A single dumbass will go out and infect a few people, who infect a few more, who infect a few more and they won't immediately show symptoms to they keep spreading it around until there's suddenly a huge uptick in cases. Your local hospital gets overwhelmed, it starts spreading life crazy, and *bam* you have a giant cluster.

I don't have a solution for this but the reason anywhere is hesitant to open back up is because the reason for the lockdown is NOT to STOP the spread, it's too late for that, it's to SLOW it so the medical systems aren't swamped to the point that the death rate skyrockets because instead of having a manageable number of cases you have so many overwhelming the system that the ones who might survive aren't getting needed care. Especially if you go the route of return to normal when it's almost summer and suddenly everyone is congregating at the usual summer activities of pools, theme parks, bbq's, flea markets, church fundraisers, etc. and doing so with gusto after not being able to properly socialize for several months/weeks.

Some guy on Fox had a solution: test everyone, quarantine the infected and keep testing until they were no long carriers. Apparently someone has or is developing a rapid test that can be used on the fly, like a pregnancy test except for corona. He suggested schools and businesses use the test whenever someone is suspected of being ill. If you visit Aunt Sally at the rest home they should test you before you go in. If you're a chink coming in on the Wuhan Express you must be tested before stepping off the plane. I didn't see the whole thing but it's a step in the right direction. This ever expanding lockdown isn't going to work.

Testing is absolutely essential as is quarantining the ill and the most vulnerable if we're to recover the economy. The problem is people are beginning to see the lockdown as an end and not a means to an end. Call it the FEMA camp narrative. I'm not saying they're right, just that it's out there.

 

[Rudy Russo]

Hmmm. Interesting... sort of like a looser... Confederation of States... of America... hmmm. Never seen anything like this pop up before.

Can we have a Shermans march to the sea and burn down NYC?

 

[MediocreMilt]

Can we have a Shermans march to the sea and burn down NYC?

Nah. Let's just build wall.

 

[Coleslaw]

The people know the only one in their corner is President Trump. Agree pushback will grow beyond the ability of these oppressive state governments to deal with it before long.

Now do you see why the Chinese people aren't going to overthrow Xi?

 

[remiem]

Some guy on Fox had a solution: test everyone, quarantine the infected and keep testing until they were no long carriers. Apparently someone has or is developing a rapid test that can be used on the fly, like a pregnancy test except for corona. He suggested schools and businesses use the test whenever someone is suspected of being ill. If you visit Aunt Sally at the rest home they should test you before you go in. If you're a chink coming in on the Wuhan Express you must be tested before stepping off the plane. I didn't see the whole thing but it's a step in the right direction. This ever expanding lockdown isn't going to work.

Testing is absolutely essential as is quarantining the ill and the most vulnerable if we're to recover the economy. The problem is people are beginning to see the lockdown as an end and not a means to an end. Call it the FEMA camp narrative. I'm not saying they're right, just that it's out there.

There's supposed to be a Canadian blood test based one but Health Canada won't certify it, because I assume it's not as accurate as they want. There's also a second one that's a little box that requires swabs still. The second cube one has been certified by health Canada but currently all the units are spoken for to the point that BC isn't able to get one.

I'm not saying forever lockdown, I don't think anyone really wants that, but you still need to provide some additional wiggle room where there's less risk and time for the items required to mass and effectively test the population to be made. There's already been crazy strides medically in this already, a month or two more of social distancing and other measures to have an effective / expedited system that can be rolled out before returning things to as normal as they can be will not end the world.

 

[JustWhy]

I left all that shit, to save my last remainings of sanity for like 3 weeks, then I come back to civilisation to look what's up, and what the fuck happened?
Like about 2milionish+ confirmed cases, God only knows how many uncorfimed, almost 1/3 are from USA (wtf?), my country is logistical/political mess more than always, most I feel sorry for health care service.

When it will end for good?

 

[Without A Gout]

Nah. Let's just build wall.

You're missing the forest for the trees here.

Destroy the bridges and tunnels and make it into a hybrid of The Division and Escape From New York.

 

[remiem]

I also noticed that recovery rates aren’t being mentioned. I know why tptb won’t tell the general public but it would reduce the doomer narrative and bring some optimism.

There's been a bigger push to bring up recovery but the MSM is slowly now pushing the articles about 'possible reinfection' and some people who were positive 'not having antibodies' so they might be able to be reinfected that have apparently cropped up in South Korea/China/Japan.

You also need to consider China and Iran for certain are lying about their numbers, both dead and recovered. So really the numbers we have globally don't mean much, except for the known dead in places that are more likely to be honest about it- and even some of those will be dubious.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

What would an 18+ month lockdown achieve, anyway?

The complete destruction of every economy and government on earth? I love how a bunch of jackasses are talking about "Stocks and housing market" when talking about keeping this all extended and don't seem to understand that most small businesses are performing on thin margins and the longer this shit goes on the more of those places will shutter, and eventually we are going to completely fuck up our agricultural businesses with this, and "not planting crops" or "Raising cattle" isn't solvable by going "BRRRRRRRRRR" on a money printer.

 

[Techpriest]

>Virus will become more nasty and lethal.
>Virus will spread asymtomatically.

Pick one and only one toaster-head.

Right now it’s spreading asymptomatically and symptomatically, and the delay in symptoms means it can spread more rapidly. The big worry I have is that mutates to be more lethal while keeping that symptom delay of around a week or so on average. That’s longer than most influenza strains and this motherfucker has proven itself to be a contagious fucker. If it’s more lethal and better at spreading than the flu then we’re in for some real pain. This virus crosses species barriers pretty easily too by multiple reports, which increases the chances we’ll see a more lethal strain.

Hopefully it won’t mutate to be more lethal, but hope only goes so far.

 

[roxitp0w3rwuzdabest420]

So why do states not want to open up in a month if death and infected rates start to go down? Is this all about blue states wanting to hurt Trump? They can’t arrest everyone if loads of people say screw you to the state governments and ignore the lockdowns.

infection rates went down BECAUSE of the lockdowns. Someone said we may need multiple lockdowns over the course of a year or so to keep hospitals from over following. Kind of like putting your car in neutral and rolling down a hill. You have to tap on the breaks every once in a while to prevent it from speeding out of control. People forget if hospitals overflow it's not just covid patients that die. It's the 50 year old who has a heart attack the 20 year old who gets into a car accident. That's the problem with hospital overflow. People die who wouldn't normally because they can't receive the care they normally would.

 

[EmuWarsVeteran]

Well seeing the TDS outbreak I now agree this thread should be rated as plagued. Jfc how did so many kiwis go full lolcow?

Reminder: PANDEMICS kill people. That is inevitable. There is a percentage of the population that WILL die and it is unavoidable. And do take into account that one of my loved ones was recently one such case and I assure you not a day goes by when I don't ask myself if I could've saved them if only I had woken up earlier. I have more dead loved ones that that, but that one still hurts a lot. So don't fucking come and call me heartless or talk about life>money because I FUCKING KNOW BUT I ALSO STUDIED THIS SHIT AND KNOW YOU'RE BEING A DUMBFUCK.

Not. Everyone. Can. Be. Saved. From the ones that get worse too fast to the ones that do it slowly but don't respond to any treatment people fucking die and there's nothing anyone can do about it. Lockdowns are there to protect the healthcare system and ensure it's correct functioning and supply. They ensure the most people can be saved. But once the healthcare system and its supply have been ensured, they become pointless. They only hurt. Because the second they are lifted you WILL get a spike and there ain't nothing no one can do to fix it. You can't just keep everyone trapped for months. Because then the famine will kill more people than the pandemic ever could.

It's fucked up. It's scary. No one wants to admit people have to die. But that's the truth. Pandemics kill people. Famines kill more. It's a balancing act of how many you can save. And lockdowns need to start falling progressively. Specially on rural and suburban areas. They've done their part. Time for us to do ours.

And talking about lifted lockdowns. Here in spain people are going to work. I thought about showing you the number of petty questions and complaints we got today but I remembered that would be power leveling. People are on edge in the hospital. Everyone knows the spike is coming but no one wants to say it out loud. We'll have to see how many get infected it's too soon to tell but it's still already on that point where we don't know how hard it's habbening but it's habbening. Good thing is since most complaints and questions took two seconds to pass I got extra time to get up to date. Pity TDS was all I saw. Hospital is ready, I think, but we still don't like what's coming. And honestly we still don't have enough ventilators because madrid keeps hogging them. I hope whoever pacted with cuomo realizes that's exactly what will happen to them. NYC is never giving those supplies back, you've been left to die, hope selling your soul to the slaver was worh it.

Right now it’s spreading asymptomatically and symptomatically, and the delay in symptoms means it can spread more rapidly. The big worry I have is that mutates to be more lethal while keeping that symptom delay of around a week or so on average. That’s longer than most influenza strains and this motherfucker has proven itself to be a contagious fucker. If it’s more lethal and better at spreading than the flu then we’re in for some real pain. This virus crosses species barriers pretty easily too by multiple reports, which increases the chances we’ll see a more lethal strain.

Hopefully it won’t mutate to be more lethal, but hope only goes so far.

If it mutates to be more lethal it will be a single new outbreak not just magically turn all preexisting cases into lethal mode, and indeed people infected with the less lethal strain have a high chance of being immune against the lethal strain too.

If this was more lethal it would be contained extremely easily, just like what happened with SARS. If anything it's lack of severity is what makes it so scary.