Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

[Ghostse]

R1 merch did even worse than TFA toys apparently, and that's saying something, with the only thing that moved from that movie being t-shirts. And as for TFA, there was also that huge warehouse filled to the brim with unsold BB-8 merch that was talked about briefly a few years back. Hell, the most moved TFA merch was just Kylo Ren shit and clothing items. But they overestimated its merch value so damn much that you had aisles of unsold TFA merch that stayed sitting there for years collecting dust. And that's without getting into what a complete disaster TLJ was for merch, especially with the Rose Tico toys. Only thing that did worse around that time was the Forces of Feminism doll line that tried to be Barbie for Star Wars. What the fuck were they thinking? I mean we know what they were thinking, but fuck that's just AAA idiocy right there.

I still remember when my local Toys R Us closed down. Most of the other toys had been cleared out but by the end all that was left were toy stack pyramids of unsold Disney Wars shit. Hell they barely touched the SW aisle. There was no Kylo Ren shit left though, but everything else was just stacks and stacks of TFA, TLJ and expensive interactive Yodas.

Edit:
Also the most telling sign of how fucked Disney Wars merch is should be the fact that merch for Plan IX barely even exists. They instead switched to making OT merch to tie-in with the film with only limited release crap to go with it, like shirts and Nacho fighters. The lack of presence of IX merch is the most damning sign of the state Disney left things in.

Its gotten so bad that even the Lord himself has had enough of their shit.

https://wdwnt.com/2020/08/video-massive-lightning-bolt-strikes-star-wars-galaxys-edge-at-walt-disney-world/

https://www.deseret.com/entertainment/2020/8/14/21368807/star-wars-galaxys-edge-lightning-strike-video

That bolt ended up frying the "Black Spire" of Galaxy's Edge (that stupid black rock tower next to the Ithorian store) which is the "heart of the planet and holy idol of protection and worship" in the park's crummy planet setting of not-Tatooine Batuu.

R1 was not a kids movie, there weren't any likeable characters other than K2SO, and I have no idea why you'd even put out merch for that.

 

[Cyril Sneer]

Says the smugposter who unspoilered his diatribe on purpose and who gets so pissy with disagreement that he tries to force people into avoiding talking about waifu author and revenge rates days after the argument.

Completely backward, unsurprisingly. I want people to talk about Traviss's writing, in detail, citing specific quotations to justify their positions rather than simply smugposting vague diatribes about how she's the devil.

You are your strawman.

You are your own caricature.

R1 was not a kids movie, there weren't any likeable characters other than K2SO, and I have no idea why you'd even put out merch for that.

The Black Series toys aren't marketed towards children, at least nominally.

 

[Adamska]

Spoiler: Autism Fight

Completely backward, unsurprisingly. I want people to talk about Traviss's writing, in detail, citing specific quotations to justify their positions rather than simply smugposting vague diatribes about how she's the devil.

You are your own caricature.

The Black Series toys aren't marketed towards children, at least nominally.

Rubber and glue stopped working past elementary school, which conveniently is when you found your waifu's books. And you aren't the reasonable one like you desperately trying to frame yourself, since you refuse to show basic niceties like spoilering this shit like I will now do, and willingly ignoring the works of others which violently and in sheer majority disregard your apocrypha.

When the large majority of all of the fictional works goes against the point you speak of, you're just plain wrong. When you have to willfully ignore what the creator has on purpose stated happened in the ultimate arbitration of the film, you are dishonest. This was why I stopped even bothering with this and am now just doing it because if I can speak ill of Filoni and not have to deal with a simp, I should damn well be able to do it with Traviss. When Asoka fanboys have more consideration than you, you fucked up.

Your entire position is like only using George Lazenby to analyze James Bond and getting salty and telling others that they're wrong when people bring up Connery or Moore... or Ian Fleming's original take.

Its fucking nobody. Just some one off fodder character from the Vader comics from like 2 years ago that Vader tried to kill for 2 pages. She actually wants to kill Luke because he's Vader's kid so she's gonna drown him, but then she'll have a change of heart and teach him Force things I'm sure. Luke is also revealed to love sand and like deserts now... "No pun intended" she says during this seemingly tense moment. Holy fuck these writers.

As expected, the audience for this is smaller than usual but the consoomers are praising this for finally filling all the supposed plotholes in the OT and "finally making Luke less of a gary stu". Holy fuck, these people make me sick.

And I was right again. Seriously, once you know how these hacks think, you can expect them to keep doing it until they either kill the product or get so little money that they have to do something new.

And are you sure the "audience" isn't just more botnets that haven't been caught yet? I know a couple of tens of thousands of copies get "sold", but they tend to molder in stores, so you don't know how many actual people bought these items. Or how many are just payed like a dollar per article to pretend to like what they didn't buy.

 

[Creep3r]

And are you sure the "audience" isn't just more botnets that haven't been caught yet? I know a couple of tens of thousands of copies get "sold", but they tend to molder in stores, so you don't know how many actual people bought these items. Or how many are just payed like a dollar per article to pretend to like what they didn't buy.

The audience for it this time around outside of reddit is far smaller than what I've ever seen before, small enough that its almost believable in how minuscule it is. As a sign of how buttfucked things are, even SW.com's pages don't get any comments anymore.

The Clone Wars Rewatch: Desperate "To Catch a Jedi" | StarWars.com

Ahsoka makes an unlikely ally in another apprentice who understands what it's like to be wronged.

www.starwars.com

 

[Adamska]

The audience for it this time around outside of reddit is far smaller than what I've ever seen before, small enough that its almost believable. As a sign of how buttfucked things are, even SW.com's pages don't get any comments anymore.

The Clone Wars Rewatch: Desperate "To Catch a Jedi" | StarWars.com

Ahsoka makes an unlikely ally in another apprentice who understands what it's like to be wronged.

www.starwars.com

Then that means I was right again, and most of the "fans" were merely fake accounts made by the company, bots paid for .50 per, or paid shills.

Once the money dried up, note how conveniently the audience collapsed for this.

 

[Ghostse]

The Black Series toys aren't marketed towards children, at least nominally.

I should probably rephrase that as "its own merch line".

I don't consider the Black Series as a film's merch since the figures span the whole timeline. But again, I can only see K2SO and maybe the Heavy Weapons Guy moving merch. Maybe Raddus and Antoc Merrick appearing as some filler.

 

[Creep3r]

Then that means I was right again, and most of the "fans" were merely fake accounts made by the company, bots paid for .50 per, or paid shills.

Once the money dried up, note how conveniently the audience collapsed for this.

This seems to be the only person left alive who regularly comments on SW.com anymore.

https://www.starwars.com/news/star-wars-the-clone-wars-stories-of-light-and-dark-audiobook-cast-revealed-exclusive

Every few pages only has him posting. And each post he makes is just "awesome/great article".

Funny thing is that even their last fan is bailing on them too.

 

[Mississippi Motorboater]

Basically, the decline in SW toy sales came after TLJ. That was when Disney practically dropped all pretense of wanting the fans to be happy and openly dissed the male SW fan demographic. Force Awakens was decent but boring, Rogue One was a nice little experiment, but The Last Jedi was an open insult, so fans took their wallets and left. Which explains why the toys for that line and future Disney SW toys sold like spoiled milk. Because Disney, quite literally, told the fans to get fucked, and they did. Disney at the time still had the parks feeding them money, so they felt secure in telling the old guard SW fans to get lost, then the parks closed, and now Disney's in trouble, to the point where now, they've approved of a new Black Series toyline focusing on the OT characters as a weak attempt to get the old fans back, along with the Mandalorian and Season 7 of Clone Wars. It's somewhat working, but time will tell if people will buy the classic SW toys.

R1 merch did even worse than TFA toys apparently, and that's saying something, with the only thing that moved from that movie being t-shirts. And as for TFA, there was also that huge warehouse filled to the brim with unsold BB-8 merch that was talked about briefly a few years back. Hell, the most moved TFA merch was just Kylo Ren shit and clothing items. But they overestimated its merch value so damn much that you had aisles of unsold TFA merch that stayed sitting there for years collecting dust. And that's without getting into what a complete disaster TLJ was for merch, especially with the Rose Tico toys. Only thing that did worse around that time was the Forces of Feminism doll line that tried to be Barbie for Star Wars. What the fuck were they thinking? I mean we know what they were thinking, but fuck that's just AAA idiocy right there.

I still remember when my local Toys R Us closed down. Most of the other toys had been cleared out but by the end all that was left were toy stack pyramids of unsold Disney Wars shit. Hell they barely touched the SW aisle. There was no Kylo Ren shit left though, but everything else was just stacks and stacks of TFA, TLJ and expensive interactive Yodas.

There are a number of factors for why the current Star Wars merch isn't selling well and hasn't done well since 2016, a lot of them having to do with the quality of the films...but even moreso to do with their inability to resonate with kids, thanks to the figures or characters having the "toyetic" value that makes them easy for manufacturers to market. In fact, from a toy perspective, there is so much wrong with current Star Wars, that it's no wonder kids aren't buying them.

Keep in mind, this is all through hypothetical lens of kids parting with their allowance to buy toys, not just collectors.

1. Characters Having Bland, Non-Toyetic Designs: I'm going to be frank, here. The new protagonists' costumes fucking suck. They aren't cool from the perspective of a very young kid. I'm not saying that they need to be decked out in gaudy Power Rangers costumes, but fuck me are they wearing the blandest, unexciting costumes. This is because Disney/LFL and their filmmakers opted to go for the OT's "used future look" again (in spite of it not really making sense in-universe), or at least their incredibly poor perception of that aesthetic. However hard they were attempting to shrink away from the PT aesthetically and ape the OT, the ultimate issue they've created is that the protagonist's costumes don't really lend themselves to toyetic molds. You look at any of the boring shit that Rey, Finn and Poe wear across these movies, and it's just endless repeats of the same minimalistic, contemporary clothing. Again, fine for adult collectors and Disney Drones, but not kids who are looking for figures to vicariously have adventures through. And the aliens are just as bad, if not worse. Part of this has to do with the new movies shrinking from Aliens in more prominent roles and not background characters (leading to a very stale, human-centric experience as Rogue One so effectively shows), but it also has to do with most of the aliens being beige and brown butt-faced aliens that don't lend themselves to toys at all. As a toy manufacturer, what are you supposed to do with these designs? What kind of high-demand action figures are the assholes in Maz's Castle or the Space Casino going to make? Fucking none, that's what. You put them against aliens like the Torgruta, the Geonosians, the Zabrak, or even the feral creatures like the Ep. II Arena Beasts or Boga, and there's no contest which designs are going to entice a kid to buy them. Ultimately, it makes sense why kids flocked to Kylo Ren and Phasma back in 2015, because they actually look like they would make for decent fucking toys. Is anyone going to make that case for Finn's 15th Leather Jacket variant, or Rey's 3rd White Bedsheet Ensemble, or Poe's Nathan Drake Cosplay? Of course not, which is why in spite of Hasbro overstocking them in stories, hoping they'll be the big sellers, they continue to maintain a steady relationship with the rusty pegs of the clearance aisle.

2. The Lack Of New Designs: As anyone who lived during the peak of He-Man or Transformers' popularity knows, the thing that encourages kids to scoop up new toys is the inclusion of new designs. The ST and the Standalone Spin-Offs have been characterized by a heavy reliance on the iconography and designs from the OT, to the point where there's been little variation in stuff like ships and figures. TIE Fighters, X-Wings, Stormtroopers? They're iconic, but that's the problem. They're old news. And most of the new ST versions have, what, a paint job to distinguish them from the old version? That kills any incentive to spend one's allowance or convince one's parents to buy one. New designs are what convince kids to part with their money...that was true of the OT and of the PT. With every movie, there was something new to gawk at, some new alien or enemy type or ship to fawn over. Darth Maul, General Grievous and the Prequel ships didn't take off because they were Sonic Recolors of existing designs, they were new designs. Fuck, I remember coming out of ROTS as a kid and begging my dad to get me Anakin's Yellow Eta-Class Jedi Interceptor, because it was a new design...and kids in my class were going nuts over the new Clone Tanks and ARC-170's. Fuck, I don't even like Kylo Ren's design, but I absolutely understand why it was the big seller back in 2015; for most kids, his design was probably edgy and intriguing...and above all, new. This is the most basic aspect of toy production--fuck, some companies like Hasbro and Mattel even introduced new characters in their respective shows just to whore them out on store shelves. People joke all the time about how George Lucas became enveloped in the SFX and toy marketing side of Star Wars, but he was at least good at it. You can't deny that in every one of his films, there was something new that you wanted a toy of, and he was dead against treading old ground for this reason. Even he complained that TFA was too referential to the OT in a visual sense, citing that "there weren't enough new ships, new planets, new aliens, etc"...and he was fucking right. And even the few new designs that are in the ST--like the Knights of Ren, Zori Bliss, and the like--- suffer from a huge incentive-killer that makes their new designs worthless:

3. New Designs For Characters That Don't Do Anything Cool: Now, this is literally me talking from my perspective as a kid during the PT era, but I'm sure anyone with a basic grasp of kids' toys can relate to this point: what if Darth Maul and his double-bladed lightsaber were introduced in The Phantom Menace, but he didn't do any of the acrobatic and lethal moves that he's iconic for? As a kid, you'd think: "Oh....well, he looks cool, but that's about it." Ladies and gentleman, I give you the primary downfall for Kylo Ren and his Crossguard Lightsaber. Remember all of the hype for this thing in the Teasers for TFA? Yeah? Remember how five years later, Kylo hasn't done dick to warrant that lightsaber's existence? Outside of shallow aesthetics, what has that lightsaber contributed to the choreography or lethality of the fights he's been involved with? This is emblematic of the ST's sparse few new character designs in a nutshell; they don't do anything. As a kid, one of the chief incentives to get a figure is to replicate the character's action on-screen in your own play-room: to re-enact any of the PT Lightsaber duels, to recreate Jango Fett's weapons showcase on Kamino, to replicate shit like Grevious spinning his lightsabers or Yoda countering Dooku's blows at mach speed. Now, take a moment, and think about all the new designs for the ST---the Knights of Ren, Captain Phasma, the Red Stormtroopers from TROS---and ask yourself: aside from standing around like band extras, what cool shit do they do to encourage a kid to buy figures of them? And yes, I'm well aware that the OT Era was filled with what could be generously called "cool extras" that didn't do a whole lot in the actual films--the Bounty Hunters, the Imperial Guards, the denizens of Mos Eisley and Jabba's Palace---but the problem is that the ST rides on that kind of appeal, instead of balancing it with the action appeal that the PT achieved. And that's a fucking awful approach to take in a generation of short attention spans and capeshit. Countless other franchises from Power Rangers to Transformers have upped their game to retain the attention span of their child audience, and the fact that Disney/LFL are just relying on nostalgic branding and character approaches from the 80's proves how out of touch and behind they are.

4. Failing To Rise And Meet The Competition: There's another tactic in selling toys where Disney/LFL have failed spectacularly, and that's taking measures to keep the Star Wars brand relevant and popular in the face of competition, something that George was faced with doing once or twice himself. See, back in 2002, when Attack Of The Clones came out, Star Wars Merch wasn't taking off like it did during the release of TPM...not because of reception to the film, mind you (as at the time the film was considered something of an improvement over its slow-paced and Jar Jar-filled predecessor), but because Star Wars was now competing with the merchandise juggernaut that was Sam Raimi's Spider-Man. You gotta remember that this early phase of Marvel Movies like X-Men and Spider-Man were extremely merch-driven, and at the time the latter was dominating toy sales because it was the latest fad with kids. To help bolster the new Ep. II designs with children, George commissioned Cartoon Network to produce some action-focused shorts with characters and Clone Troopers performing frenetic feats of superhero antics that would excite children into getting into the Clone Wars era, and the surrounding merchandise. Genndy Wars was a direct response to the competition on the toy market, and a smart one at that: Star Wars is popular, but so is a ton of other shit...and kids move through exciting fads really quickly, as 80's toy collectors are no doubt extremely aware. Disney/LFL was so arrogant in believing that nothing could challenge the nostalgia and popularity inherent to Star Wars that they just dumped the ST designs unceremoniously with nothing but TFA to push it...and I, for the life of me, don't know why someone in market research didn't look at the actual film, and warn Disney about the lack of action set-pieces that took advantage of their "new" designs and characters, and how their own capeshit was going to eat those toys alive in less than a year...which is exactly what happened. When you have Marvel characters doing more impressive shit in countless movies surrounding Star Wars releases, the latter becomes old news, especially when the characters and designs aren't doing something equally or more impressive. Now, to their credit, Disney/LFL actually tried to put forward media initiatives to push their toys just like George did with Genndy Wars...the difference is that they were of a far-lower effort, and fucking AWFUL. Forces Of Destiny and Resistance were cheap, crap shows animated on a shoe-string budget and pulling in garbage ratings. They not only failed in raising excitement or intrigue in the ST Era designs and characters, but they even got their exclusive toylines cancelled due to low sales.

You'll have no shortage of Disney Drones out there who will constantly shriek about how: "Star Wars was PLUMMETING into irrelevance before Disney saved it!!!1!" But they say this in complete ignorance of how much better Star Wars was selling, even in a period with no movies. People forget that in 2011, the Star Wars brand made half a billion dollars in toy sales alone, setting records for most merchandising revenue sold during a non-film period, when there was little more than TCW on TV and the occasional LucasArts game to generate excitement. Because even then, George and the people around him knew how to market and sell toys to kids efficiently, how to capture their imagination and reel them into the coolness of the brand. Disney/LFL can't even do that despite having the advantage of releasing a new Star Wars film every year for the past four years, having a wealth of mainstream buzz and hype to ride off of and enough resources to pump out a Genndy-wars style show every year.

They don't understand what kids want, how they think, or what appeals to them...the same way they don't understand the appeal behind Star Wars supplementary material like comics and novels. They're absolutely fucking clueless, and their five-year reign of diminishing returns and floundering toy sales are proof of that.

As expected, the audience for this is smaller than usual but the consoomers are praising this for finally filling all the supposed plotholes in the OT and "finally making Luke less of a gary stu". Holy fuck, these people make me sick.

Placating to that cabal of retards might actually be a smart move, considering they're the sparse few multi-celled organisms on planet earth who are still buying these comics.

Remember, this is the same audience that lapped up Doctor Aphra and the Whitewashing Of Crylo Ren comics, while also currently touching themselves to the bland and uninspiring character descriptions for the upcoming High Republic. This is the rock-bottom of the fandom, the batch that keeps these floundering, rapidly-cancelled comic lines on their last malnourished legs. Of course, they don't have any standards.

 

[Creep3r]

And the aliens are just as bad, if not worse. Part of this has to do with the new movies shrinking from Aliens in more prominent roles and not background characters (leading to a very stale, human-centric experience as Rogue One so effectively shows), but it also has to do with most of the aliens being beige and brown butt-faced aliens that don't lend themselves to toys at all. As a toy manufacturer, what are you supposed to do with these designs? What kind of high-demand action figures are the assholes in Maz's Castle or the Space Casino going to make? Fucking none, that's what. You put them against aliens like the Torgruta, the Geonosians, the Zabrak, or even the feral creatures like the Ep. II Arena Beasts or Boga, and there's no contest which designs are going to entice a kid to buy them.

But fam, don't you want your very own foreskin monster toys for your tots?!

They're super trendy according to Mr. Abrams!

The funniest thing is that one of the last nu-SW mobile games (which got shut down last month) re-introduced Orange Yoda's castle scene but replaced all the ugly nu-aliens with classic ones, none of which were in the movie...

Not a single nu-shitter, instead an Ithorian, a Rodian, a Nikto and a Kubaz with a weirder snout, but while still lowering the saturation. Its like it suddenly hit them after 5 years that making veiny ballsack aliens isn't the best way to sell toys.

 

[Ghostse]

There are a number of factors for why the current Star Wars merch isn't selling well and hasn't done well since 2016, a lot of them having to do with the quality of the films...but even moreso to do with their inability to resonate with kids, thanks to the figures or characters having the "toyetic" value that makes them easy for manufacturers to market. In fact, from a toy perspective, there is so much wrong with current Star Wars, that it's no wonder kids aren't buying them.

Keep in mind, this is all through hypothetical lens of kids parting with their allowance to buy toys, not just collectors.

1. Characters Having Blandm, Non-Toyetic Designs: I'm going to be frank, here. The new protagonists' costumes fucking suck. They aren't cool from the perspective of a very young kid. I'm not saying that they need to be decked out in gaudy Power Rangers costumes, but fuck me are they wearing the blandest, unexciting costumes. This is because Disney/LFL and their filmmakers opted to go for the OT's "used future look" again (in spite of it not really making sense in-universe), or at least their incredibly poor perception of that aesthetic. However hard they were attempting to shrink away from the PT aesthetically and ape the OT, the ultimate issue they've created is that the protagonist's costumes don't really lend themselves to toyetic molds. You look at any of the boring shit that Rey, Finn and Poe wear across these movies, and it's just endless repeats of the same minimalistic, contemporary clothing. Again, fine for adult collectors and Disney Drones, but not kids who are looking for figures to vicariously have adventures through. And the aliens are just as bad, if not worse. Part of this has to do with the new movies shrinking from Aliens in more prominent roles and not background characters (leading to a very stale, human-centric experience as Rogue One so effectively shows), but it also has to do with most of the aliens being beige and brown butt-faced aliens that don't lend themselves to toys at all. As a toy manufacturer, what are you supposed to do with these designs? What kind of high-demand action figures are the assholes in Maz's Castle or the Space Casino going to make? Fucking none, that's what. You put them against aliens like the Torgruta, the Geonosians, the Zabrak, or even the feral creatures like the Ep. II Arena Beasts or Boga, and there's no contest which designs are going to entice a kid to buy them. Ultimately, it makes sense why kids flocked to Kylo Ren and Phasma back in 2015, because they actually look like they would make for decent fucking toys. Is anyone going to make that case for Finn's 15th Leather Jacket variant, or Rey's 3rd White Bedsheet Ensemble, or Poe's Nathan Drake Cosplay? Of course not, which is why in spite of Hasbro overstocking them in stories, hoping they'll be the big sellers, they continue to maintain a steady relationship with the rusty pegs of the clearance aisle.

2. The Lack Of New Designs: As anyone who lived during the peak of He-Man or Transformers' popularity knows, the thing that encourages kids to scoop up new toys is the inclusion of new designs. The ST and the Standalone Spin-Offs have been characterized by a heavy reliance on the iconography and designs from the OT, to the point where there's been little variation in stuff like ships and figures. TIE Fighters, X-Wings, Stormtroopers? They're iconic, but that's the problem. They're old news. And most of the new ST versions have, what, a paint job to distinguish them from the old version? That kills any incentive to spend one's allowance or convince one's parents to buy one. New designs are what convince kids to part with their money...that was true of the OT and of the PT. With every movie, there was something new to gawk at, some new alien or enemy type or ship to fawn over. Darth Maul, General Grievous and the Prequel ships didn't take off because they were Sonic Recolors of existing designs, they were new designs. Fuck, I remember coming out of ROTS as a kid and begging my dad to get me Anakin's Yellow Eta-Class Jedi Interceptor, because it was a new design...and kids in my class were going nuts over the new Clone Tanks and ARC-170's. Fuck, I don't even like Kylo Ren's design, but I absolutely understand why it was the big seller back in 2015; for most kids, his design was probably edgy and intriguing...and above all, new. This is the most basic aspect of toy production--fuck, some companies like Hasbro and Mattel even introduced new characters in their respective shows just to whore them out on store shelves. People joke all the time about how George Lucas became enveloped in the SFX and toy marketing side of Star Wars, but he was at least good at it. You can't deny that in every one of his films, there was something new that you wanted a toy of, and he was dead against treading old ground for this reason. Even he complained that TFA was too referential to the OT in a visual sense, citing that "there weren't enough new ships, new planets, new aliens, etc"...and he was fucking right. And even the few new designs that are in the ST--like the Knights of Ren, Zori Bliss, and the like--- suffer from a huge incentive-killer that makes their new designs worthless:

2. New Designs For Characters That Don't Do Anything Cool: Now, this is literally me talking from my perspective as a kid during the PT era, but I'm sure anyone with a basic grasp of kids' toys can relate to this point: what Darth Maul and his double-bladed lightsaber were introduced in The Phantom Menace, but he didn't do any of the acrobatic and lethal moves that he's iconic for? As a kid, you'd think: "Oh....well, he looks cool, but that's about it." Ladies and gentleman, I give you the primary downfall for Kylo Ren and his Crossguard Lightsaber. Remember all of the hype for this thing in the Teasers for TFA? Yeah? Remember how five years later, Kylo hasn't done dick to warrant that lightsaber's existence? Outside of shallow aesthetics, what has that lightsaber contributed to the choreography or lethality of the fights he's been involved with? This is emblematic of the ST's sparse few new character designs in a nutshell; they don't do anything. As a kid, one of the chief incentives to get a figure is to replicate the character's action on-screen in your own play-room: to re-enact any of the PT Lightsaber duels, to recreate Jango Fett's weapons showcase on Kamino, to replicate shit like Grevious spinning his lightsabers or Yoda countering Dooku's blows at mach speed. Now, take a moment, and think about all the new designs for the ST---the Knights of Ren, Captain Phasma, the Red Stormtroopers from TROS---and ask yourself: aside from standing around like band extras, what cool shit do they do to encourage a kid to buy figures of them? And yes, I'm well aware that the OT Era was filled with what could be generously called "cool extras" that didn't do a whole lot in the actual films--the Bounty Hunters, the Imperial Guards, the denizens of Mos Eisley and Jabba's Palace---but the problem is that the ST rides on that kind of appeal, instead of balancing it with the action appeal that the PT achieved. And that's a fucking awful approach to take in a generation of short attention spans and capeshit. Countless other franchises from Power Rangers to Transformers have upped their game to retain the attention span of their child audience, and the fact that Disney/LFL are just relying on nostalgic branding and character approaches from the 80's proves how out of touch and behind they are.

3. Failing To Rise And Meet The Competition: There's another tactic in selling toys where Disney/LFL have failed spectacularly, and that's taking measures to keep the Star Wars brand relevant and popular in the face of competition, something that George was faced with doing once or twice himself. See, back in 2002, when Attack Of The Clones came out, Star Wars Merch wasn't taking off like it did during the release of TPM...not because of reception to the film, mind you (as at the time the film was considered something of an improvement over its slow-paced and Jar Jar-filled predecessor), but because Star Wars was now competing with the merchandise juggernaut that was Sam Raimi's Spider-Man. You gotta remember that this early phase of Marvel Movies like X-Men and Spider-Man were extremely merch-driven, and at the time the latter was dominating toy sales because it was the latest fad with kids. To help bolster the new Ep. II designs with children, George commissioned Cartoon Network to produce some action-focused shorts with characters and Clone Troopers performing frenetic feats of superhero antics that would excite children into getting into the Clone Wars era, and the surrounding merchandise. Genndy Wars was a direct response to the competition on the toy market, and a smart one at that: Star Wars is popular, but so is a ton of other shit...and kids move through exciting fads really quickly, as 80's toy collectors are no doubt extremely aware. Disney/LFL was so arrogant in believing that nothing could challenge the nostalgia and popularity inherent to Star Wars that they just dumped the ST designs unceremoniously with nothing but TFA to push it...and I, for the life of me, don't know why someone in market research didn't look at the actual film, and warn Disney about the lack of action set-pieces that took advantage of their "new" designs and characters, and how their own capeshit was going to eat those toys alive in less than a year...which is exactly what happened. When you have Marvel characters doing more impressive shit in countless movies surrounding Star Wars releases, the latter becomes old news, especially when the characters and designs aren't doing something equally or more impressive. Now, to their credit, Disney/LFL actually tried to put forward media initiatives to push their toys just like George did with Genndy Wars...the difference is that they were of a far-lower effort, and fucking AWFUL. Forces Of Destiny and Resistance were cheap, crap shows animated on a shoe-string budget and pulling in garbage ratings. They not only failed in raising excitement or intrigue in the ST Era designs and characters, but they even got their exclusive toylines cancelled due to low sales.

You'll have no shortage of Disney Drones out there who will constantly shriek about how: "Star Wars was PLUMMETING into irrelevance before Disney saved it!!!1!" But they say this in complete ignorance of how much better Star Wars was selling, even in a period with no movies. People forget that in 2011, the Star Wars brand made half a billion dollars in toy sales alone, setting records for most merchandising revenue sold during a non-film period, when there was little more than TCW on TV and the occasional LucasArts game to generate excitement. Because even then, George and the people around him knew how to market and sell toys to kids efficiently, how to capture their imagination and reel them into the coolness of the brand. Disney/LFL can't even do that despite having the advantage of releasing a new Star Wars film every year for the past four years, having a wealth of mainstream buzz and hype to ride off of and enough resources to pump out a Genndy-wars style show every year.

They don't understand what kids want, how they think, or what appeals to them...the same way they don't understand the appeal behind Star Wars supplementary material like comics and novels. They're absolutely fucking clueless, and their five-year reign of diminishing returns and floundering toy sales are proof of that.



Placating to that cabal of retards might actually be a smart move, considering they're the sparse few multi-celled organisms on planet earth who are still buying these comics.

Remember, this is the same audience that lapped up Doctor Aphra and the Whitewashing Of Crylo Ren comics, while also currently touching themselves to the bland and uninspiring character descriptions for the upcoming High Republic. This is the rock-bottom of the fandom, the batch that keeps these floundering, rapidly-cancelled comic lines on their last malnourished legs. Of course, they don't have any standards.

Good post. I hadn't considered the marketing aspects of Gennedy Wars. Lucas for his flaws really understood, and more importantly as you point out, took time to CONTINUE to understand, the market.

Only thing I'd counter on you is the "used future' look being an issue. Luke wears (essentially) three outfits: Tatooine Robes, Flight Suit, and his ROTJ outfit. None of them are particularly off-the-wall for people in the 70s/80s. Now granted that's two more outfits than MaRey has in her movies. I think the problem is, as you said, the costumes they did use for everyone was completely lifeless.

But that's a great summary of just how Disney expected the money printer to just continue to run not realizing (or maybe more of KKK not realizing you needed to do more than create a story team that looks like its staffed with The View's rejects) all the work that went into making it continue to just print money.

It was like they only characters that would appeal to adult collectors, while doing everything in their power to drive off existing fans.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Part 2:

And still couldn't defeat the Mandos in the end without sacrificing a huge part of their own forces to do it. It's as if the Americans simultaneously nuked the Fifth Fleet in addition to Hiroshima and Nagasaki at the end of WWII.

According to the synopsis on Wookieepedia, it seems more like most of the Mandalorians simply weren't interested in the Sith cause.

You claimed that the strike against the Dark Underlord (calling such a brief operation a "campaign" is extremely misleading) brought the New Sith Wars to an end, even though it actually took place centuries before the Seventh Battle of Ruusan, which actually ended the New Sith Wars. That's sloppy. Very sloppy.

LOL no.

Dooku was meeting with Darth Sidious even before Qui-Gonn was killed, actually. And, as he states in Open Seasons #4, after Galidraan he refused to ever undertake another mission for the Jedi, so his departure from the Order was already pretty much set in stone at that point.

Don't bring that Mouse-speak in here.

Your thought processes are hilariously simplistic.


Exact words, please.

The games do that because they tend to focus more on making the player feel powerful than respecting the lore.

Color me doubtful that Mandalore the Ultimate was personally capturing all of those Jedi that Demagol went through trying to narrow down the source of Force powers.


Despite Jedi being "thick as Mynocks" on the front lines even in the very early days of the Mandalorian War (according to Knights of the Old Republic #8), they don't seem to have been that much of a problem for the Mandalorians to deal with, either on the battlefield or in terms of holding them prisoner.


It's made pretty clear in Boba Fett: Enemy of the Empire that Vader is earnestly trying to kill Fett (though Vader also acknowledges that Fett might kill him instead):

View attachment 1521485


Ultimately, Fett does get the opportunity to kill Vader, but decides against it, since it wouldn't be to his ultimate benefit in the long run:

View attachment 1521487

You just have to accept that these gratuitous insta-kill Force-powers you love so much simply aren't reconcilable with G-Canon and/or good storytelling.

Not really. The Mandalorians were actually dealing with in-fighting of their own during the Great Crusade, and for that matter, the Sith are the last people to have any grounds to criticize about getting eradicated by the Jedi.

Yes, that's precisely the point. Jedi and Sith get distracted all the damn time.

View attachment 1521489

They'd be just as likely to let you die so as to take your place in the ranks.



View attachment 1521488

The nature of the True Mandalorians' clients is rather vague. It's widely stated that Jaster Mereel's vision for the Mandos was as an honorable mercenary army, but there's no information on who they were fighting or whom they were fighting for and why. Of Jango's True Mandalorians, we only know that they took up a contract with the Governor of Galidraan to put down some armed rebellion, and the Governor himself seems to be on good terms with the Republic and acting within his rights (other than lying about the Mandalorians, of course), since the Jedi don't seem to give a shit about prosecuting him for having those rebels killed.

"Most SW EU fans"? Did you take a poll?

Stop getting so bent out of shape about fictional people.

You've never heard the retort "the Empire did nothing wrong"?

If they believe that they are working towards a greater good then they are, in fact, moral people, just after a different fashion than the morality of the Jedi.

Lucasfilm-approved trumps Lucasarts-approved.

Leia is one woman. Also, she ends up getting captured by the Imperials and having to be rescued by Fenn. While she certainly fights earnestly alongside the Mandos in defeating the Imperial garrison at Keldabe, it's mostly the Mandalorians themselves who are responsible for liberating their planet.

Vosa is also nuttier than a bag of squirrels.

And this was, from their point of view, a moral and noble cause.

It's not an opinion. It's a mystic vision from God, essentially.

And so they are extinct, while the Mandos still endure.

In other words, Mandalore the Indomitable is the Good Jew to your SS Hauptsturmführer.

Vallorum didn't send Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan to Naboo in the capacity of military commandos. They were explicitly sent as ambassadors to negotiate with the Trade Federation.

Yeah, that's the problem with them Mandos, boy! Don't know their place! They's just too damn uppity!

The Mandalorian portrayal of being Sith-allied nomads intent on galactic conquest ruins their character when in previous portrayals, they were friendly, honorable soldiers who only fought against the Jedi in the Clone Wars because of interplanetary politics.

The Mandalorian raid on Coruscant in Tales doesn't appear to have been a loss. They suffered little in the way of casualties, captured a powerful new weapon and withdrew of their own accord in good order.

Anderson's Mandalorians are more like Mongols, TBH.

I said that you should have "kept it on your chest" because your arguments are terrible, not because your post was long.

TFA and R1 figures were infamous shelf-warmers in their own right.

Again, we play this long song and dance........

Spoiler: MANDO MADNESS 2: ELECTRIC BOOGALOO

So? The Mandalorians were sacrificing their entire army to stop Revan, which was why they focused on that idiotic final charge at Malachor V. Don't try to sugar-coat things, both sides were treating their soldiers like disposable pawns. Revan just had more soldiers and the Mass Shadow Generator. Hence why many Mandalorians were deserting during that final stretch of the war, only to later surface as bandits who preyed upon farmers, Wookiees, and Rakatans. When a warrior race whose soldiers are indoctrinated to die for Mandalore start breaking ranks and fleeing the battlefield, that's because they know fighting Revan was a fool's errand and they decided to take their armor, training, and weapons so they can pick on small-time communities far from prying eyes.

That doesn't excuse poor performance in the Great Galactic War against the Republic and the Jedi. The Jedi weren't too thrilled about the Clone Wars either, but they still gave it their best shot.

Er, no. Again, what I said was that the Mandalorians helped the Jedi fight the Sith and bring the war to an end. That doesn't cover precise details, but the general thrust is still sound, is it not?

LOL yes.

Not really. Dooku even took a mission to Baltizaar after Galidraan, and continued to discuss Jedi matters with Sifo-Diyas. Again, the main reason Dooku even sought Sidious out was to kill him for Qui-Gon's death. Palpatine met with him as a Senator before the Battle of Naboo, not after. It was only after Qui-Gon's death did Dooku finally go rogue. Angered that the Jedi weren't seeking the second Sith Lord when his apprentice died fighting the first, Dooku left the Order to avenge Qui-Gon personally and kill the second Sith Lord himself. Then Darth Sidious revealed himself to Dooku and the two had a nice chat where the latter discovered that Sidious also wants to get rid of the corrupt Republic that both of them despised. That was when Dooku became a Sith.

I will bring in Mouse-speak whenever I want. That, and Seasons 1-5 of Clone Wars is still canon to Legends.

Simplistic, but accurate. The Jedi won more wars than the Mandalorians, and they have a more successful track record, while the Mandalorians have gone through several upheavals because A) they got nearly obliterated multiple times, and B) they had their own ideological battles that split the clans even further leading to more strife. Heck, go play the Bounty Hunter game and try fighting Komari Vosa as Jango Fett. The fact that a failed Jedi PADAWAN is the final boss in a videogame where Mandalore himself is the main character goes to show the power discrepancy between the two sides. Jango wipes out everyone from local kings, Senators, Hutt gangs, Republic militia, drug cultists, and yet the final boss is a Jedi who failed Jedi school and never became a knight. And she still gave Jango hell before getting beaten by Jango and strangled by her secret love Count Dooku.

Dude, it's in the fucking synopsis for Legacy of the Force:

"The novel starts off with Jaina Solo contemplating on what kind of monster that her brother, Jacen, has become, and that one day, she will have to kill him. But not before she is properly trained by Boba Fett to neutralize Jacen."

Legacy of the Force: Revelation

Legacy of the Force: Revelation is the eighth novel in the Legacy of the Force series. It is a paperback by Karen Traviss and was released February 26, 2008. An exclusive hardcover edition of the book was published by the Science Fiction Book Club. The audio version is narrated by Marc Thompson...

starwars.fandom.com

That, and you have some gall requesting direct words when you keep claiming Lucas is shitting on the Jedi with the Prequels, when in reality he keeps SHILLING for them and presenting them as heroes while beating people in the skull over how emotions and attachments that go out of control can doom you in the end.

The lore shows that the Mandalorians have no counter for things like Force Choke, Force Lightning, Force Crush, Life Drain, and other wonderful tricks the Sith use the Force for. The lore also shows that the Mandalorians got eradicated by the Jedi TWICE, despite leading Republic troops with subpar equipment against armies of Supercommandos. The lore also includes stuff from works like The Force Unleashed, the Jedi Knight games, the Dark Empire and Tales of the Jedi comics, among others, where the Jedi are far more OP than the Mandalorians ever were.

Mostly because those early Jedi volunteers were students, not experienced knights. When Revan's movement got bigger though, they had no problems eradicating Mandalorians from one battlefield to the next. Which is why the Mandalorians went from a galactic empire of their own to a bunch of mercenaries working for criminal scum or random galactic players for pay.

Except G-canon GAVE US those Force Powers to begin with. Vader was killing people without even moving his hands in ESB. Meanwhile, G-canon's only display of Mandalorians has them losing to battle-hardened Jedi or blind men rather easily. Which is why the EU had to go overtime to compensate and say that SOME Mandalorians are a match for Jedi. If you wanted Jedi-killing Fett action, you have to peruse sources outside of G-canon. If anything, it's the Mandalorian stuff that is not represented in G-canon, whereas Vader killing people with a glare through a skype chat is one famous example from G-canon of the power of the Dark Side. And of course, we see in games like Jedi Academy, the Episode III game, and Force Unleashed how a Sith can easily dispose of Mandalorians. Which again means that Vader was holding back. If he wasn't, Fett's neck would have snapped a few seconds after Vader made eye contact, just as Admiral Ozzel's windpipe did.

There was no infighting within the Mandos during the Exar Kun Wars and the Mandalorian Wars. They were all united under Mandalore the Indomitable/Mandalore the Ultimate, and they were still beaten by Jedi. Only in the SWTOR era was there dissent on a large scale outside of minor individuals, where Jicoln Cadera formed a Mandalorian group that was supposed to ally with the Republic in opposition to Mandalore the Vindicated's stance of supporting the True Sith Empire.

Jedi and Sith get distracted all the time? So do Mandalorians. Jango was distracted for a moment, which led to a beast hitting his jetpack and causing it to malfunction, leading to Mace subtracting a head from him. Boba was distracted, and he was stabbed in the back by a blind man. Being distracted isn't exclusive to Jedi and Sith. Mandos get distracted too, even the best of them. Which led to their humiliating defeats in G-canon, which explains why C-canon works had to go overdrive to show that they weren't nobodies and that they were legitimate threats against Jedi. To people who haven't played the Bounty Hunter game or read the novels and comics, Jango was some scrub who put up a decent fight against Kenobi before losing a head to Mace Windu.

That's the problem: Jango's Mandos went to work with random governments in the Republic. Many of which have corruption in the ranks. It would have been better for Jango to set up a relationship with the Senate or the Jedi Order to fight and defend the Republic from threats within itself. Not only would that fulfill Jaster's wish that the Mandalorians be honorable mercenaries, but it would also mean fat wads of cash because the central government on Coruscant pays more than local authorities do. Instead, Fett went into business with local governments, which like the Trade Federation, have their own share of corruption. He should have walked away from the job when his assignment read "kill political dissidents here" because such a job violates the basic dignities and rights of Republic citizens. Maybe he could have gone to Naboo or Alderaan and played bodyguard to rich nobles for fat wads of cash, or played shining knight in white armor by working for the Jedi for pay. After all, the Judicials were starving for competent soldiers, and 300 Mandalorians coming to Coruscant would be a Godsend to them.

That, and people who commit war crimes like massacring rebels without trying to capture them alive first would just get Jango Fett a death sentence or imprisonment for life from Republic courts. Him getting enslaved was rather fortunate, as he was later able to escape his captors and retake his armor and gear. If the courts in the Republic caught wind of Fett's men slaughtering political dissidents, he'd either get a life sentence in a maximum security prison, (which means no way out) or a firing squad, which is what "democracies" do to people who slaughter political dissidents.

Most SW EU fans-as in fans of things like KOTOR, the Jedi Knight games, the Force Unleashed games, and a million other games and comic books based on the Jedi portraying them as awesome, which would get Karen Traviss to call them Nazis for liking Jedi like Revan, Kyle Katarn, Starkiller, the Clone Wars Jedi, among others.

Then why are you so bent out of shape with the Jedi? They're slaves of the people who lead clone soldiers who are slaves of the people's representatives to war. If you want to bitch about people enslaving the clones, go point your finger at Papa Palpatine who created the whole mess to begin with, and he was the clones' slave master, as EPIII so painfully proved.

Yes, the retort "The Empire Did Nothing Wrong!" is used by Imperial fans to justify the Empire's actions. But even as an Empire fan, I find that statement to be false. Even the people who use that slogan (Like Generation Tech's fanbase) know it's a joke because they watch videos from GT about the Empire's MANY flaws. Thrawn was a walking, talking mouthpiece used by Zahn to poke holes at the Emperor's strategy during the OT and highlight the Empire's flaws.

Nope. The Sith themselves would tell you that morality is a lie told by the weak to hold back the strong. They believed in bringing a greater good, but they see that as a byproduct of them gaining power. And they're honest about that.

Lucasfilm approved of Jedi propaganda that portrayed the Jedi as the good guys, not only in the OT and Prequels, but also in many books, games, comics, and novels where some clones even refuse to carry out Order 66 because those Jedi are just so gosh-darn good!

And the Mandalorians would have been crushed by Imperial reinforcements had the Rebels not distracted them during the Galactic Civil War, or defeated them on Endor, causing a massive Imperial Civil War. So again, the Mandalorians have the Rebels to thank that Darth Vader or some other general didn't just turn up on Mandalore after the Suprema's death.

So? The fact that a Jedi dropout who's nuttier than a bag of squirrels killed 20 Mandalorians kinda shows how strong the Jedi are. That even the drop-outs of Jedi High School manage to score an A in fighting Mandalorians. And again, Vosa's the final boss in Jango Fett's game, which goes to show the power discrepancy between the two peoples. A Jedi washout is the final boss in a game where you play exclusively as Mandalore himself.

Nope. Again, as with the Sith, the Neo-Crusaders would laugh at the idea of morality and see it as something the weak use to hold power over the strong. They're the kind of guys who would nuke a city to blow up a shield device. Which is what made them excellent villains and foils to the heroes. The only morality they ascribe to is worshiping the strong, which is why Canderous served Revan.

Mystic vision from God? Last I checked, God didn't give out mystic visions to random Admirals in Star Wars. It's probably more along the lines of a misinterpreted vision.

Er, no. The Sith still exist as of the end of Legacy Era Star Wars. After the Empire nearly destroyed the Mandalorians when the latter fought for the Alliance.

Again, insinuating that Jedi fans are Nazis goes to show how lost you people are. Many fans of the Jedi also love guys like Han Solo, Wedge Antilles, Lando Calrissian, and a whole host of non-Force sensitives who were just as pivotal to the plot as the Jedi were.

Valorum sent Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon to negotiate with the Trade Federation, and by "negotiate", he means to threaten them with Jedi carving them up like walnut pie if they didn't back off. Which is why the Neimoidians were scared shitless when the ambassadors turned out to be Jedi. You only send in guys with lightsabers if you think you'll need force. Otherwise, a Senator would have sufficed, since the TF wouldn't dare strike down an elected representative from another world lest they gain more enemies in the Senate.

That's actually the problem with the Mandalorians who keep fighting the Jedi. They bite off more than they can chew. Killing a random Jedi in the middle of a war where the rest of the Jedi are fighting someone else, that works. But just setting the stage for the arena into Jedi vs. Mandos? It turns into a slaughter that favors the Jedi. It's the same as some random smuggler trying to pick on a Sith. We all saw how helpless Han Solo was against Vader, and unless you're the Voidhound (SWTOR Smuggler character) or something, most smugglers would get killed. And of course, every time the Mandos fought the Jedi, they nearly get eradicated. Jango should have read up on Mandalorian history so he'd know what happened at Malachor V. Then perhaps he'd have avoided fighting the Jedi on Galidraan and he'd still have the True Mandalorians remain alive.

Except the portrayal of Mandalorians as war-hungry allies of the Sith came BEFORE the Clone Wars media was even released. Tales of the Jedi was made in the early 90s. The Clone Wars stuff came out early 2000s. So the war-hungry Mandos came first, and Traviss' Mandalorians were anomalies that the rest of the canon doesn't match up with. The backstory concerning that whole split between the True Mandalorians and the Death Watch was released to the public almost a decade after Tales of the Jedi hit shelves. And even then, Jango was willing to kill dissidents on the orders of some governor, so even if it wasn't a Death Watch trap, the True Mandalorians aren't necessarily friendly folks all around. More like a PMC that fights for money. After all, they're the kind of society that burped out Montross. Just as the Jedi burp out Sith now and then, so too do Mandalorians burp out ruthless killers like Montross, Pre Vizsla, and yes, Boba Fett and Jango Fett. Especially since during his pursuit of the Bando Gora, Jango Fett slaughtered the security detail of some Senator then slaughtered prison guards to spring a prisoner he needed for an exchange. How many of those senatorial and prison guards were just honest, decent men who honestly believe they're just keeping society going? Jango Fett was one of the "good" Mandalorians, and even he slaughters armies of innocents just doing their job, just so he can get to the target.

As far as I can tell, the only time the Mandalorians were objectively good was when they allied with the Alliance to Restore the Republic, with the intent to fight the Empire and free the galaxy from its grasp. At that point, they were Braveheart-style freedom fighters fighting against a corrupt government alongside the Jedi and the Alliance. Then that reverted back to them being assholes who kill people for pay when Boba Fett took over and signed the Mandalorians on with the likes of the Yuuzhan Vong and Natasi Daala. Which is NOT a good track record at all.

The Mandalorians still failed to defeat the Jedi in Coruscant during the Exar Kun War. And their losses on Onderon were so severe that Mandalore the Ultimate had a LOT of rebuilding to do afterwards.

So? The Mongols were badass. Also, both the Mongols and the Celts were written off as barbarian scum by civilizations like China and Rome, so doesn't it blur the lines between the two?

Says the guy who keeps insisting the Jedi were wrong to lead the clones and keep their casualties to a minimum. Again, practice what you preach. Most of your arguments here are so horrible they make Filoni groupies look like sane individuals.

TFA and Rogue One still moved a lot of Stormtrooper figures. Rey figures and figures of the "good guys" on the other hand, didn't sell as well as Death Troopers did.

 

[Cyril Sneer]

Rubber and glue stopped working past elementary school, which conveniently is when you found your waifu's books. And you aren't the reasonable one like you desperately trying to frame yourself, since you refuse to show basic niceties like spoilering this shit like I will now do, and willingly ignoring the works of others which violently and in sheer majority disregard your apocrypha.

You should really open yourself to the possibility that people might defend things that you hate for reasons other than childhood sexual fixation. The world would probably make more sense to you in consequence.

When the large majority of all of the fictional works goes against the point you speak of, you're just plain wrong.

@LORD IMPERATOR's one-dimensional adolescent power fantasy cherry-picking does not accurately represent "the fictional works" in question.

When you have to willfully ignore what the creator has on purpose stated happened in the ultimate arbitration of the film, you are dishonest.

As far as the creator is concerned, a Mandalorian can take on Force-users on even terms and kill them. Trying to weasel out of acknowledging this overriding canonical truth is dishonest.

This was why I stopped even bothering with this and am now just doing it because if I can speak ill of Filoni and not have to deal with a simp, I should damn well be able to do it with Traviss. When Asoka fanboys have more consideration than you, you fucked up.

Filoni's detractors generally have the basic decency to point to specific incidents or quotations involving their criticism of his writing. Not so with the anti-Traviss NPCs, who never manage to get further than "Mandalorian Woman Bad!"

I should probably rephrase that as "its own merch line".

I don't consider the Black Series as a film's merch since the figures span the whole timeline.

I guess that makes sense.

But again, I can only see K2SO and maybe the Heavy Weapons Guy moving merch. Maybe Raddus and Antoc Merrick appearing as some filler.

The Kung Fu monk guy was also really hard to find. Not!Kyle, Not!Jan and Not!Rohm Moc all pegwarmed terribly (though the various Stormtrooper variants seemed to sell well enough).

 

[Kiwi Lime Pie]

Based on the first half I watched, I'd say that as a whole the show is pretty solid and easily the third best thing Disney made for the franchise. It suffers mainly from sameyness though, since the sets and the challenges change fairly little. The highlights are mainly the trivia games.

I was able to watch two of episodes (6 & 7, I believe) you posted before having to stop on account of the repetitive nature of the show. I'll repeat my positives that Mr. Best really seems to enjoy the role of master Beck and it shows in these episodes. But the camp humor still gets a bit over the top sometimes, and at inopportune times. Additionally, the lack of variety in the Jedi Temple challenges make that part of the show little more than an obstacle course with what seems to be a 5-minute time limit. Nevertheless, this is one of the few things currently active within the SW franchise that looks and feels like something in-universe.

Ahsoka living through the OT era and beyond might have worked if she admitted she felt it was best to stay in hiding the whole time given her connection to Anakin/Vader. That would plausibly explain her absence in the OT and her refusal to get involved when it could have made a difference. Instead, Disney wants her to be the center of attention even if it means shitting on the OT characters and time line. It's bad enough that people insist an unnamed, gray-haired, grizzled soldier is proof that Rex was on Endor during RotJ.

 

[Ghostse]

The Kung Fu monk guy was also really hard to find. Not!Kyle, Not!Jan and Not!Rohm Moc all pegwarmed terribly (though the various Stormtrooper variants seemed to sell well enough).

I could see Jackie Chan moving some units, he was different at least.

Storm/Rebel/Droid troopers will move units because even if its a design used only in a specific film, you can put them in anywhere. You can always find a use for more grunts. And again, I guess like Black Series, I don't really consider *Troopers tied to a single-film's "merch"; if its not a named character, I don't think it counts.

Captain Phasma - definitely TFA/TLJ merch
Duck Storm Trooper - Generic Starwars Merch

also a little finer point on why I separate black series: You'll have people interested in Black Series releases just because its the next number/those are the figures released this year; you could have Black Series from the holiday special, and they'd move units.

 

[White Devil]

"Mandalorian Woman Bad" made me lol.

 

[Adamska]

Spoiler: Autismal Slapfight

You should really open yourself to the possibility that people might defend things that you hate for reasons other than childhood sexual fixation. The world would probably make more sense to you in consequence.

I also gave religious reasons, but you ignored those since the desire to pork Traviss clearly seems more accurate based on response.

@LORD IMPERATOR's one-dimensional adolescent power fantasy cherry-picking does not accurately represent "the fictional works" in question.

Even though he's showing using the actual creator's own words why you're wrong, and how you keep blithly ignoring that Sidious and the Republic used the clones.

Keep bitching at Fleming for not using Lazenby as the model for Bond chief.

As far as the creator is concerned, a Mandalorian can take on Force-users on even terms and kill them. Trying to weasel out of acknowledging this overriding canonical truth is dishonest.

Nice goalpost shift. Also nice attempt to project your own refusal to accept that most creators rejected Traviss' takes and that hers fall flat in what came before and after. I'm not the one who keeps trying to accuse the Jedi of being slavemasters for the clones, despite the movie telling any 5 year old kid that the Republic and Palpie did that.

Filoni's detractors generally have the basic decency to point to specific incidents or quotations involving their criticism of his writing. Not so with the anti-Traviss NPCs, who never manage to get further than "Mandalorian Woman Bad!"

Intentional denseness is why most people give up with you given how desperately you ignore the creator's own words and final sayings due to them pissing you off. Nice fake attempt to pretend you actually have a burden of proof that would stop you from pitching a fit; you pissed away any chance of that when you deny what Lucas et al. for SW state in their own words.

I usually stop bothering with people like you, but nah. I'm going to keep going because again: If I can actually talk about Filoni's fuck ups freely, I well on deserve that with Traviss and her own hatred of the base lore freely, without some sped flinging spaghetti for the author he wants to worship and/or fuck.

I was able to watch two of episodes (6 & 7, I believe) you posted before having to stop on account of the repetitive nature of the show. I'll repeat my positives that Mr. Best really seems to enjoy the role of master Beck and it shows in these episodes. But the camp humor still gets a bit over the top sometimes, and at inopportune times. Additionally, the lack of variety in the Jedi Temple challenges make that part of the show little more than an obstacle course with what seems to be a 5-minute time limit. Nevertheless, this is one of the few things currently active within the SW franchise that looks and feels like something in-universe.

If they went to a different planet every now and again for the physical challenges or changed them up, the show would have a longer shelf life. And you are completely right on the comedy; it keeps waffling between sarcastic humor and camp, and they struggle at times to dial it in.

I still want a second season though, at least because there is still some hope for this show... oh no they're just going to fuck it up now that I said that.

Ahsoka living through the OT era and beyond might have worked if she admitted she felt it was best to stay in hiding the whole time given her connection to Anakin/Vader. That would plausibly explain her absence in the OT and her refusal to get involved when it could have made a difference. Instead, Disney wants her to be the center of attention even if it means shitting on the OT characters and time line. It's bad enough that people insist an unnamed, gray-haired, grizzled soldier is proof that Rex was on Endor during RotJ.

It's Filoni failing to understand simple concepts like arcs, mortality, and casting. Filoni is the main driving force, and he's mainly helped by him kissing Kennedy's ass so much and whining to her about dissidents. Filoni is basically Randal Weems from Recess, and Kennedy his Ms. Finster.[/quote]

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

"Mandalorian Woman Bad" made me lol.

It made me lol too, until I realized that..I hate the "Star Wars Fanbase" jerking off Boba Fett and the only reason the "Mandalorian" shit is at all popular is because a bunch of idiots like Boba Fett for some reason.

 

[White Devil]

It made me lol too, until I realized that..I hate the "Star Wars Fanbase" jerking off Boba Fett and the only reason the "Mandalorian" shit is at all popular is because a bunch of idiots like Boba Fett for some reason.

Because he looked cool as shit in the Holiday Special and ESB. Rule of cool is that simple. It was lightning in a bottle.

Ironically, I don't care much for Fett in general, I think the PT retconning ruined a lot of his character. I do think Mandos are rad though as I've said before. Not on the autistic Traviss can do no wrong levels but they've always appealed to me.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Because he looked cool as shit in the Holiday Special and ESB. Rule of cool is that simple. It was lightning in a bottle.

Ironically, I don't care much for Fett in general, I think the PT retconning ruined a lot of his character. I do think Mandos are rad though as I've said before. Not on the autistic Traviss can do no wrong levels but they've always appealed to me.

I thought Fett was cool, Django Fett was a fucking stupid ass Idea that didn't need to exist.

Them not really being Mandolorians, and making up a whole planet of super mercs who could fight the Jedi with no force sensitivity is asinine and goes way to far just to jerk off to an armor design.

 

[White Devil]

I thought Fett was cool, Django Fett was a fucking stupid ass Idea that didn't need to exist.

Them not really being Mandolorians, and making up a whole planet of super mercs who could fight the Jedi with no force sensitivity is asinine and goes way to far just to jerk off to an armor design.

I don't see how it goes too far though, there has been plenty of societies in real life history that have had reputations as "super mercs". The Danes were famously hired around the world as the best warriors money could buy once upon a time and Mandos have a very similar culture to the old Scandinavian one. I don't religiously read up on the behind the scenes like some people do but I would not be surprised at all if they were directly based on them.

And really, making Force sensitives neigh unkillable just gives things a Superman complex and that shit is not fun, but it is boring. I can buy a warrior who has trained his entire life, and has trained in a team his entire life, with good gear, can take down a Jedi simply because there is more to a fight than being a living magic 8 ball. There's no drama in the whole only a Jedi can kill a Jedi thing and I don't understand why someone would want to read about these perfect creatures who can do no wrong and not be killed. I like the Mandalorians because they show that god can bleed.