The Abortion Debate Containment Thread - Put abortion sperging here.

[Eris!]

I would prefer that, but we have to work inside reality and with the tools we have. Deportation is not an option at this moment, though I'd take that over abortions any day.

If you're not willing to entertain the single actual solution then don't masturbate and pretend at fake "solutions." Just shut up instead. Anything else you have to say on the matter is worthless. Either help or shut up and get out of the way.

I bet that if we banned abortion then there would be similar robber barons who made buku bucks off providing illegal abortions.

Not if we hang them. The problem here is with the state being pussies and engaging in half-measures, not with prohibition itself. Half-measures are worse than doing nothing at all.

Same thing as weed, there are people who have made ridiculous amounts of money off weed despite it still being illegal in many places.

This is not an argument to make it more legal. It is an argument that it is still not effectively illegal enough.
Hang every weed dealer from a tree without a trial and see if there are still weed profiteers.

I don't think there would be thousands of back alley abortions or thousands of unwanted children if we banned abortion but I do think that black market forces would fill the gap, as they did with Prohibition and weed and other drugs. That's important to keep in mind even if the threat is overblown.

I genuinely don't see why that's "important to keep in mind." I don't see how anything you just said is relevant at all. Even if every word is true, it doesn't mean abortion should be legal. Abortion should still be illegal.

I can see it now, headlines 50 years in the future: FAMOUS POLITICIAN'S FAMILY MADE FORTUNE OFF PROVIDING ILLEGAL ABORTIONS.

I can see a better headline: "Baby-murderer hanged by mob."

To some extent, yeah. If nothing else you'd have a lot of pregnant women "accidentally falling" down the stairs. And there will be unscrupulous people who will provide these procedures unregulated.

Who fucking cares?

The upside of having legal abortion is that you can tax it out the ass and you can send regulators to crawl up the asshole of every abortion clinic in the country to give them a hard time and make sure they're up to code

This is so insane I don't even know how to respond. What "code" would you like for baby murder? What level of safety should a baby murderer expect when murdering their baby? How much do you want to tax baby murder?
Do you fucking hear yourself when you say things like this, or do you just say shit?

it is only murder to a small number of people, you included.

...That's not how reality works. Either it's murder and the people who think it isn't murder are wrong, or visa versa. One of us has to be factually right and the other wrong. This is not a matter where multiple viewpoints can be valid at the same time. This isn't "I like Star Wars," this is a matter of fact. It is either murder or it is not murder in actual fact. I think it is murder. I do not think the counterposition is a valid one. I am going to participate in this discussion given that. You're not going to get me to respect your dumb opinion by just demanding respect. You have to actually convince me of it.

You can't legislate something just because you think it's something when the majority of people disagree.

...Why not? Why should you care if the majority of people disagree with the truth?

I would say it's immoral to force women to bear a child that they aren't ready for.

I would agree. Forcefully impregnating a woman via rape would be wrong.
Unfortunately you are a retard and think me doing literally nothing to a person qualifies as me personally forcing her to have a baby somehow. Because you're a retard.

What makes your opinion on morals more correct than that of the majority?

What makes a round earther's opinion more correct than a flat earther's? Being correct. Choosing the position that is actually true in reality. Calling heads when it's heads. Having a rational, coherent, robust worldview which holds up to scrutiny. The guy who calls heads when it's heads wins because... it's heads.


I've never lost an argument so hard that I started questioning "Well what makes true things true?" It's shocking how often my opponents in arguments resort to this. You literally have so little to work with you have to pull at the fundamental fabric of concepts like truth in a desperate attempt to sow enough doubt to not look like a retard.

You can't just say "because I said so",

I provide ample reasoning in every post and yet you and that retard rich evans continually insist that all I offer is "because I said so." Do you think I'll forget my own reasoning and just assume I said that? Do you plan your argumentative moves based on the assumption you're dealing with someone as stupid as you are?

And I've told you many times why a fetus is not a person. It can't survive on its own outside of its mothers body. It isn't human yet.

That is not a convincing or coherent reason. I can think of a half dozen questions that immediately show how absurd that position is. A toddler can't survive on its own without its mother, is it human?

 

[haurchefant]

If you're not willing to entertain the single actual solution then don't masturbate and pretend at fake "solutions." Just shut up instead. Anything else you have to say on the matter is worthless. Either help or shut up and get out of the way.

You keep not reading the site rules, this is how you got banned in the first place:

>We are not a political organization. Your politics are shit and no one cares. Agree to disagree.

Come on man, you've already gotten tagged by Null once

Not if we hang them. The problem here is with the state being pussies and engaging in half-measures, not with prohibition itself. Half-measures are worse than doing nothing at all.

And this is why so few people are taking you seriously, your solution to solving murder is more murder. Come on dude, if you're just going to whine and seethe and put forward unrealistic solutions (breaking site rules) then what are you doing here? Good lord

This is not an argument to make it more legal. It is an argument that it is still not effectively illegal enough.
Hang every weed dealer from a tree without a trial and see if there are still weed profiteers.

They tried that with Prohibition and weed lol, there are people serving life sentences because they dealt drugs, it still hasn't put a dent in the problem. And no, you won't be able to hang them all so you'll have to come up with something else besides murder as a solution.

I genuinely don't see why that's "important to keep in mind." I don't see how anything you just said is relevant at all.

"I was only pretending to be retarded"

Who fucking cares?

>"im not owned! im not owned!!", i continue to insist as i slowly shrink and transform into a corn cob

Come up with something new. Slip on a banana peel, drop your pants, something. Where's the A material?

This is so insane I don't even know how to respond. What "code" would you like for baby murder? What level of safety should a baby murderer expect when murdering their baby? How much do you want to tax baby murder?
Do you fucking hear yourself when you say things like this, or do you just say shit?

If it makes you feel better we can call it the Baby Murder Tax Codes. I'm not a taxation person since I think all taxation is theft but since we tax all services anyway abortion should be heavily taxed too, like cigarettes. Driving up the cost of cigarettes gets lots of people to stop smoking when they can't financially support the habit anymore, it should be like that with abortion as well. I mean, imagine what we could do if made abortion so expensive only rich people could afford it

 

[Eris!]

You keep not reading the site rules, this is how you got banned in the first place:

>We are not a political organization. Your politics are shit and no one cares. Agree to disagree.

Come on man, you've already gotten tagged by Null once

Call the cops I literally don't give a fuck. If you want to stick to pragmatism, then this entire thread is moot because none of us are actually gonna do shit. The way I see it, we're discussing what should be done, not what practically will be done. If you want to know what practically will be done, you're gonna be in a death camp inside of 20 years. This whole thread is basically fantasizing about a world where things are the way they should be, and arguing about what that way is.

And this is why so few people are taking you seriously, your solution to solving murder is more murder.

Ah, Are we playing the game where we pretend there is no difference between killing and murder again? Fun!
This is why no one takes YOU seriously. In a conversation about ethical concepts you don't know basic ethical concepts.

put forward unrealistic solutions

There are no realistic solutions. Any solutions would be dramatically hard and essentially impossible. The things you are proposing are just non-solutions. All of these problems have one solution, and you aren't willing to entertain it. So your entire discussion is pointless because you forbid the actual answers to any of your questions.

"I was only pretending to be retarded"

...or you could engage in good faith and try to explain why it's relevant.

>"im not owned! im not owned!!", i continue to insist as i slowly shrink and transform into a corn cob

Come up with something new. Slip on a banana peel, drop your pants, something. Where's the A material?

...What? Did a markov bot make this post? It has no relationship to what you're quoting.
It's not a rhetorical question. I'm literally asking why I should care.

If it makes you feel better we can call it the Baby Murder Tax Codes. I'm not a taxation person since I think all taxation is theft but since we tax all services anyway abortion should be heavily taxed too, like cigarettes. Driving up the cost of cigarettes gets lots of people to smoke when they can't financially support the habit anymore, it should be like that with abortion as well. I mean, imagine what we could do if made abortion so expensive only rich people could afford it

What kind of insanity leads a person who thinks taxation is theft to propose taxing things? Are you just playing devil's advocate or something? I hate devil's advocates. What is wrong with your brain? Why do you go to "We're taxing things anyway so let's tax this," instead of "we should stop taxing things?"

 

[Muh Vagina]

For all of you who are still screeching that abortion is murder, I urge you to read all the way to the bottom: https://dictionary.law.com/default.aspx?selected=1303

Facts don't care about your feelings.

 

[Eris!]

For all of you who are still screeching that abortion is murder, I urge you to read all the way to the bottom: https://dictionary.law.com/default.aspx?selected=1303

Facts don't care about your feelings.

This is a bad definition which defines murder as being illegal rather than immoral. Probably because it was written by atheists/agnostics who didn't want to appeal to morality in a secular dictionary. It defines state sanctioned genocide as not murder. That's silly.

 

[techno651]

Where is the same passion for maternity leave? A system that promotes parenthood? A foster system that promotes childhood? If you are pro-life, then also press your arguments in settings outside of abortion. If that's your one stop shop, then your argument is simply political and dead.

 

[Eris!]

Where is the same passion for maternity leave? A system that promotes parenthood? A foster system that promotes childhood? If you are pro-life, then also press your arguments in settings outside of abortion. If that's your one stop shop, then your argument is simply political and dead.

We've beaten this dead horse over and over again. I don't have to actively care about your wellbeing to passively care about you being murdered.

 

[haurchefant]

Call the cops I literally don't give a fuck. If you want to stick to pragmatism, then this entire thread is moot because none of us are actually gonna do shit. The way I see it, we're discussing what should be done, not what practically will be done. If you want to know what practically will be done, you're gonna be in a death camp inside of 20 years. This whole thread is basically fantasizing about a world where things are the way they should be, and arguing about what that way is.

>REEEEEE COME UP WITH A DIFFERENT SOLUTION ON MY COMMAND REEEEEE
>that's against site rules chill out
>I WAS ONLY PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED

Uh huh.

Ah, Are we playing the game where we pretend there is no difference between killing and murder again? Fun!
This is why no one takes YOU seriously. In a conversation about ethical concepts you don't know basic ethical concepts.

Wait, are your jimmies actually rustled? holy shit lol

There are no realistic solutions. Any solutions would be dramatically hard and essentially impossible. The things you are proposing are just non-solutions. All of these problems have one solution, and you aren't willing to entertain it. So your entire discussion is pointless because you forbid the actual answers to any of your questions.

I've answered several of these questions already and your jimmies are too rustled for a productive conversation, lol. See my previous posts if you want real answers.

...or you could engage in good faith and try to explain why it's relevant.

Why should I engage in good faith when you're having the same autistic meltdown that got you banned from the site the first time? You're not here for a conversation dude, you just want to tell us how cool murder is except when its a case of murder that you don't like. You can't even be consistent, as soon as I pointed out that you were full of shit you backpedaled like crazy and said this thread is pointless anyway, which is a concept many people have been trying to explain to you for over 50 pages now. Except now its convenient to you to pull it out, so you do.

You've had some retards engage with you but they were at least trying, and you sperged on them just like you're sperging now. You're like the opposite of a Chinese room, if we input different phrases you keep spitting the same words out over and over.

...What? Did a markov bot make this post? It has no relationship to what you're quoting.
It's not a rhetorical question. I'm literally asking why I should care.

You should be banned again for not knowing dril

What kind of insanity leads a person who thinks taxation is theft to propose taxing things? Are you just playing devil's advocate or something? I hate devil's advocates.
What is wrong with your brain?

>I hate devil's advocates
>comes to Deep Thots to debate

"thinking about a "Cock Ring" for the neck that strangles all the blood into your brain and gives you what is essentially a mental erection"

 

[Eris!]

you're having the same autistic meltdown that got you banned from the site the first time?

...What meltdown lol?

Wait, are your jimmies actually rustled? holy shit lol

No lol.
Cool tactic. Call me angry as a defense mechanism.
I don't know why you're exhausting every bad faith tactic under the sun rather than just engaging in good faith. Your entire post is about me and contains not one sentence about abortion.

You can't even be consistent, as soon as I pointed out that you were full of shit

What exactly did you point out, and what exactly is the inconsistency?

You should be banned again for not knowing dril

Ah, you're irony poisoned. It's all starting to make sense.
You are literally pathologically incapable of taking yourself seriously because it terrifies you.

>I hate devil's advocates
>comes to Deep Thots to debate

Arguing for a position you do not actually hold is arguing in bad faith.

 

[haurchefant]

...What meltdown lol?

No lol.
Cool tactic. Call me angry as a defense mechanism.
I don't know why you're exhausting every bad faith tactic under the sun rather than just engaging in good faith.

What exactly did you point out, and what exactly is the inconsistency?

Ah, you're irony poisoned. It's all starting to make sense.
You are literally pathologically incapable of taking yourself seriously because it terrifies you.

Arguing for a position you do not actually hold is arguing in bad faith.

And we're done here. You didn't try at all.

 

[Eris!]

And we're done here. You didn't try at all.

Try what?

Lol okay well your sad attempt at deflection has failed. You tried.
Got any actual arguments, or are you running away like the others did?

 

[haurchefant]

Lol okay well your sad attempt at deflection has failed. You tried.
Got any actual arguments, or are you running away like the others did?

There is no need to be upset. The others probably went to bed if they're in North America, god knows that idiot Hollywood Hulk Hogan will come back tomorrow to sperg out some more about the rape fantasy that he keeps running in his head like a movie

 

[Eris!]

There is no need to be upset. The others probably went to bed if they're in North America, god knows that idiot Hollywood Hulk Hogan will come back tomorrow to sperg out some more about the rape fantasy that he keeps running in his head like a movie

Noticing a distinct lack of arguments in your post. It's almost like you want to gain distance from the arguments above or something, and avoid having to offer rebuttals. When you can't come up with a response, just derail the thread with meta-commentary for a page and hope no one remembers.

 

[haurchefant]

Noticing a distinct lack of arguments in your post. It's almost like you want to gain distance from the arguments above or something, and avoid having to offer rebuttals. When you can't come up with a response, just derail the thread with meta-commentary for a page and hope no one remembers.

I gave you and the thread a genuine response and you sperged out about how we should hang people without a trial, aka murdering them and that the only problem with prohibition and anti weed is that we aren't murdering hard enough. If you want a genuine debate then you'll have to convince me its worth it since I'm your only challenger right now

 

[techno651]

We've beaten this dead horse over and over again. I don't have to actively care about your wellbeing to passively care about you being murdered.

You don't have to???? So the sustenance for your argument can be low-hanging fruit, and you can stop there and be satisfied. What is life worth without well-being? How can we can seperate the two?

I understand your logic and your zeal, but the argument should not be at the point of abortion. Its all threaded together... life and capacity for happiness... that makes it harder to deal with it.

 

[Simulated Banana Flavor]

Why are you like this, @Erischan?

In all sincerity: how/why can you belong to the same forum hosting a thread on the Hartley Hooligans and declare abortion = murder = morally wrong? You truly and honestly think it's better to live as a non-ambulatory potted plant than to never be born?

 

[haurchefant]

Why are you like this, @Erischan?

In all sincerity: how/why can you belong to the same forum hosting a thread on the Hartley Hooligans and declare abortion = murder = morally wrong? You truly and honestly think it's better to live as a non-ambulatory potted plant than to never be born?

he's partially doing it to fuck with people

I think he's also trying to flirt with various posters in this thread by being tsundere

 

[Eris!]

you sperged out about how we should hang people without a trial

That's not sperging out, it's a genuine response.

aka murdering them

It's not murder if it's justified.

and that the only problem with prohibition and anti weed is that we aren't murdering hard enough.

Yes.

What is life worth without well-being? How can we can seperate the two?

Your life is worth something to you. It is worth nothing to me.

I understand your logic and your zeal, but the argument should not be at the point of abortion.

Yes it should. That is the essential issue.

Its all threaded together... life and capacity for happiness... that makes it harder to deal with it.

Happiness is not relevant to this discussion.

Why are you like this, @Erischan?

Like what? I genuinely think I'm acting reasonably. I don't think the reactions to my posts are a reflection on me, but a reflection on the people reacting.

how/why can you belong to the same forum hosting a thread on the Hartley Hooligans and declare abortion = murder = morally wrong?

Because it's murder, and murder is morally wrong.

You truly and honestly think it's better to live as a non-ambulatory potted plant than to never be born?

It's not about what's better. I don't care about what's better. I am not making value judgements about what outcome would be the biggest net win like Utilitarians do. I am a principle-oriented thinker, not an outcome-oriented thinker. Murder is impermissible. It's literally that simple. If you need to murder someone to get a better life outcome or avoid suffering, too bad. Impermissible means impermissible. It means never, under any circumstances, no matter how much you want or even need to.

he's partially doing it to fuck with people

I've said multiple times that I'm not trolling in any way. You are just pathologically terrified of seriousness and so want to pretend I'm not being serious because it gives you an excuse not to be.

 

[haurchefant]

That's not sperging out, it's a genuine response.

It's not murder if it's justified.

Yes.


Your life is worth something to you. It is worth nothing to me.

Yes it should. That is the essential issue.

Happiness is not relevant to this discussion.


Like what? I genuinely think I'm acting reasonably. I don't think the reactions to my posts are a reflection on me, but a reflection on the people reacting.

Because it's murder, and murder is morally wrong.

It's not about what's better. I don't care about what's better. I am not making value judgements about what outcome would be the biggest net win like Utilitarians do. I am a principle-oriented thinker, not an outcome-oriented thinker. Murder is impermissible. It's literally that simple. If you need to murder someone to get a better life outcome or avoid suffering, too bad. Impermissible means impermissible. It means never, under any circumstances, no matter how much you want or even need to.


I've said multiple times that I'm not trolling in any way. You are just pathologically terrified of seriousness and so want to pretend I'm not being serious because it gives you an excuse not to be.

See what I mean?

 

[Eris!]

See what I mean?

No.