General Discussion for Virtual Youtubers / Vtubers / Chuubas - it's okay to be a simp for 2D, just don't thirstpost.

[Pierrot Lunaire]

Watching the NijiEN debut made me realize how much Kiara got carried by Hololive's reputation. Gura, Calli and Ina would've become popular just the same if they debuted in NijiEN instead of HoloEN based on their roommates, and Ame would probably get popular as well due to her gremlin personality, but can you imagine Kiara without Hololive?

 

[ice_cream_cone]

The thing is, Holo seems to have a strategy to pick people based in their skills or personality, not just they're successful streamers or not
There's also the option of the members reccomendation or opinion, so EN2 talent pool should still be good

Hololive is also believed to choose talent based on how they fit on the group, right? Group dynamics and all that. Which is a suspected reason why only one of Senzawa or Nyanners can get in, because they do almost the same thing? I don't know if this is true but I really like this idea. Kind of like a MOBA esports team where you can't just sign up the superstars and expect to win.

 

[Takodachi]

but can you imagine Kiara without Hololive?

I can

 

[Town Drunk]

Watching the NijiEN debut made me realize how much Kiara got carried by Hololive's reputation. Gura, Calli and Ina would've become popular just the same if they debuted in NijiEN instead of HoloEN based on their roommates, and Ame would probably get popular as well due to her gremlin personality, but can you imagine Kiara without Hololive?

People keep underestimating the chicken. She was very popular at debut, I think is second only to Calli in SCs, and her fan base is devoted. I understand why she gets on some peoples nerves, but she has an appeal to a lot of people. I think if she was indie she'd be less subbed, but she'd do pretty well.

 

[Avokado]

I wonder if we will ever see some HoloJP learn Indonesian with Duolingo.

Meanwhile, the Kensetsu story arc continues

 

[Scale Smerch]

I think it's really unfair to consider Hololive and any of its branches to be the new norm and not what it is - a massive fluke.

And that's not dunking on any of them at all, nor is it undermining management decisions, but if a world pandemic hadn't hit at the exact same time the algorithm started vomiting Rushia clips into people's recommended feed, they'd have never taken off the way they did.

Hololive are not runaways in the talent department, either. Talking about 'occupied territory' is bizarre as most people enjoy variety of the same thing. Many subscribe to multiple ASMR channels, good APEX V-Tubers, Minecraft streamers, singers etc, so saying that Amelia 'covers' the Gremlin schtick is unfair when half of this forum can't stand Ame when she rages at games.

It was very clear they weren't aiming for Holo numbers because that's literally an impossibility, but NijiEN do look like they'll take off after getting settled. What we've seen of them has been really positive.

Agreed, Hololive shouldn't be treated as the norm, however for good or bad circumstances have made them that way. I don't think anyone will deny HoloEN was a guinea pig: they showed there's both a market for English chubas and a market which can rival JP in terms of profits. Without them the indie scene wouldn't have exploded, Vshojo wouldn't be a thing, and Niji never would've made this EN branch (at least right away). Every corporate EN chuba will be compared against them because they're all designed to tap into the black swan which let HoloEN thrive.

While I also agree that Niji never expected to get the massive numbers HoloEN did, never think they don't want to try; the whole purpose of this group is to test the waters. As mentioned though we'll know what to expect in the next 6-12 months after we see what these girls can do day-to-day. Every talent always takes some time to fully come into their own.

HoloEN 2 will do well, just look at how well HoloID gen 2 did.

I expect this too, it's just an open question of how well. Not to be a doomer, I'm just interested on getting some additional data which lets us glean a sense of the overall EN viewership base (since it's currently unclear how much additional growth potential exists).

 

[Cubanodun]

but can you imagine Kiara without Hololive?

Not that hard considering how her roommate was/is very public about the shit she do, Hololive just humbled her a little about it after several meltdowns

 

[kuuu]

Nijis can into ES too.

 

[Scuttle]

Watching the NijiEN debut made me realize how much Kiara got carried by Hololive's reputation. Gura, Calli and Ina would've become popular just the same if they debuted in NijiEN instead of HoloEN based on their roommates, and Ame would probably get popular as well due to her gremlin personality, but can you imagine Kiara without Hololive?

The same can be said for many members of Hololive. The brand carries them massively above where they would be if the YT algorithm hadn't done what it did.

And that's totally fine, because people found it and stuck around because they love it, but people also need to be conscious of the fact that they are essentially supporting a company that got very lucky, and other companies are not 'lesser' or lacking in talent because they didn't get that lucky break.

People say 'Oh, Ina is a professional artist, Calli can rap, Ame plays games well (I guess), Kiara is Trilingual'; but none of these talents would inherently translate to views and subs if they weren't a part of Hololive. I'm still desperately trying to figure out what exactly it is that Lamy and Nene do that made them such huge standouts at auditions.

Nijisanji has equally-if-not-more talented members in every department, it's just that the company they work for didn't get as lucky. That's it. That's literally the beginning and end of it. All this 'If they're in Niji it must be because Holo didn't want them' and questioning the talent pool they came from is just asinine at best.

NijiEN have just as much of a fighting chance of cultivating a solid core fanbase as anyone. It may not be as big as Holo, or grow as quickly, or reach those numbers, but I don't think that was ever in their business projections to do so (and if it was then Ichikara higher-ups need firing immediately).

People keep underestimating the chicken. She was very popular at debut, I think is second only to Calli in SCs, and her fan base is devoted. I understand why she gets on some peoples nerves, but she has an appeal to a lot of people. I think if she was indie she'd be less subbed, but she'd do pretty well.

If Kiara was an Indie: She wouldn't be Kiara, she wouldn't have Huke-papa, her rig and model would look a lot cheaper, she wouldn't have Calli to do the whole TakaMori thing with, and she'd have no HololiveJP to be the bridge to for millions of people.

She would be a German who could speak Japanese and English.

 

[Town Drunk]

Agreed, Hololive shouldn't be treated as the norm, however for good or bad circumstances have made them that way. I don't think anyone will deny HoloEN was a guinea pig: they showed there's both a market for English chubas and a market which can rival JP in terms of profits. Without them the indie scene wouldn't have exploded, Vshojo wouldn't be a thing, and Niji never would've made this EN branch (at least right away). Every corporate EN chuba will be compared against them because they're all designed to tap into the black swan which let HoloEN thrive.

While I also agree that Niji never expected to get the massive numbers HoloEN did, never think they don't want to try; the whole purpose of this group is to test the waters. As mentioned though we'll know what to expect in the next 6-12 months after we see what these girls can do day-to-day. Every talent always takes some time to fully come into their own.



I expect this too, it's just an open question of how well. Not to be a doomer, I'm just interested on getting some additional data which lets us glean a sense of the overall EN viewership base (since it's currently unclear how much additional growth potential exists).

Isn't Niji kind of quantity over quality anyway? If you have 30 talents bringing in 50K a month each, or 300 talents bringing in 5K a month each, the results are the same. Not saying Niji is trash, its just a different business model. Throw everything at the wall and hope something sticks. Some will rise to the top. Ironmouse, nyanners, etc.

Edit: just realized Mouse and Nyanners are Vshojo not Niji. Which shows how much I actually can be bothered to watch Niji. Tell me how great one piece is and i'tll tell you I don't have 500 hours to watch it.

 

[Wandering Lurker]

The Niji's should had done it 3 hours earlier

I do have to wonder what they were thinking. I'm sure this was planned weeks ago so they had no idea they'd be competing against Gura and Ame who schedule late. However shitpost review is the same time every saturday. Unless they think Coco has no EN fans....

Really this was poor scheduling on Nijisanji/Ichikara's part. They had a whole period Thursday and Friday night where there wasn't really any HoloEN streams. While I might be dumb wanting Nijisanji to consider a completely different company's talent's scheduling that same company is primarily why we have so many EN vtubers (not) debuting as indies now in the first place.

30 minute debuts are kinda dumb, there is no time to learn much about em. 3rd Niji debut vs Coco and her husbando soundboard meme review hmm..

I actually like the 30 minute debuts. It keeps the talents from being exhausted and its less dead air. If they want to talk more with their viewers afterward they can just do a guerilla zatsu stream, Like what Elira is doing right now as of this post.

While I also agree that Niji never expected to get the massive numbers HoloEN did, never think they don't want to try; the whole purpose of this group is to test the waters. As mentioned though we'll know what to expect in the next 6-12 months after we see what these girls can do day-to-day. Every talent always takes some time to fully come into their own.

I don't think Niji is ever really concerned with numbers considering they have some livers in their main JP branch who get almost as many views as JP Indie vtubers (and that's not mentioning Nijisanji ID or Korea numbers). The ENs will probably fair being slightly above EN Indie vtuber numbers and Niji will release another wave of them despite numbers in like 3 months.
Also Walfie found another girl to simp for along side Amelia

 

[Takodachi]

Nijis can into ES too.

The Spanish feels rough, as if she was reading straight from GT or DeepL.
And why in god's green earth would you want to pander to the bean demographic, specially when a huge chunk of them (at least the ones into weeb shit) know English for the most part.

 

[kuuu]

And why in god's green earth would you want to pander to the bean demographic

Because others are doing it. Like something that has to be in your portfolio even if you don't ever come back to revisit it.

 

[RiverBear]

Ok I can watch the niji debut now so anyone got the timestamp for the Gura gif

Around 17:40

Also, don't double post. Thank you

The Spanish feels rough, as if she was reading straight from GT or DeepL.
And why in god's green earth would you want to pander to the bean demographic, specially when a huge chunk of them (at least the ones into weeb shit) know English for the most part.

Because Coco and Nene have proven that the Spic crowd have very deep pockets if you pander to them

They're most likely trying to beat Cover to the punch

 

[reinigen]

Wasn't Loserbait thought to be in Holo-En to some capacity? Glad to see that he shares the same opinion we do.

 

[Takodachi]

View attachment 2174517

Wasn't Loserbait thought to be in Holo-En to some capacity? Glad to see that he shares the same opinion we do.

I dont like to share an opinion with an ENVtuber, so just out of spite I now fully support the tranny shark.

 

[Renmai]

If Kiara was an Indie: She wouldn't be Kiara, she wouldn't have Huke-papa, her rig and model would look a lot cheaper, she wouldn't have Calli to do the whole TakaMori thing with, and she'd have no HololiveJP to be the bridge to for millions of people.

She would be a German who could speak Japanese and English.

That is true for all of them exact Gura. You can look up sachiowo and demondice's social blade stats, they're decent but wouldn't ever stand out. Being a toxic gremlin on twitch is a dime a dozen and Cali isn't hitting #1 on itunes without Hololive's exposure.

I don't think Kiara is a natural streamer, she is there to be the translator and the extrovert surrounded by introverts. She makes $$ bank though so I guess Cover choose right again.

Back on NijisanjiEN, I'm amused that mermaid girl has the most subs even though she couldn't even debut. I guess weebs really go for the quiet uwu shy girls lol. Character design matters.

 

[Pierrot Lunaire]

Isn't Niji kind of quantity over quality anyway? If you have 30 talents bringing in 50K a month each, or 300 talents bringing in 5K a month each, the results are the same. Not saying Niji is trash, its just a different business model. Throw everything at the wall and hope something sticks. Some will rise to the top. Ironmouse, nyanners, etc.

As someone who generally prefers Nijisanji to Hololive I don't get the impression of quantity over quality, if they were that lax Marine and Pekora would've gotten in as both are Nijisanji rejects. I get the impression they care more about variety, lots of niji vtubers have their own niches and some like Toko and Fumino Tamaki barely even play games. I'm just speculating, though.

 

[Wandering Lurker]

View attachment 2174517

Wasn't Loserbait thought to be in Holo-En to some capacity? Glad to see that he shares the same opinion we do.

I remembered a discord message appeared from him on Amelia's COD stream ages ago, informing her to adjust her game audio. rrat: I could honestly believe he's Jenma.

 

[Scuttle]

That is true for all of them exact Gura. You can look up sachiowo and demondice's social blade stats, they're decent but wouldn't ever stand out. Being a toxic gremlin on twitch is a dime a dozen and Cali isn't hitting #1 on itunes without Hololive's exposure.

I don't think Kiara is a natural streamer, she is there to be the translator and the extrovert surrounded by introverts. She makes $$ bank though so I guess Cover choose right again.

Back on NijisanjiEN, I'm amused that mermaid girl has the most subs even though she couldn't even debut. I guess weebs really go for the quiet uwu shy girls lol. Character design matters.

To be fair, she only has the most subs because YouTube's Anti-Bot protection software didn't nuke her subscribers from orbit two days ago like it did for the other two (Elira went from 16-7K, Pomu 13-6K, Finana 15-14K). She's actually the slowest riser and the debut thing certainly may not help.

But yes, you see the point: Hololive as a brand is bigger than the individuals. That's why Indies go to the big companies in the first place. Nene's past life had 1K subscribers and she reached 90K after her debut solely for existing. Demondice is oozing with talent but no one found them. Keekihime existed in totally different pop culture circles that largely evaded us.

And yet look at Calli now. 25x DemonDice's subs despite sticking to her exact philosophy and not really changing. Any talk about talent levels and hard work etc become redundant.