Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

[Blamo]

At least they tried with Finn, which is why he's a better character in TFA. But they immediately undercut their efforts by giving him ridiculous, Whedonesque dialog to Poe and then Rey. For all the shit Lucas takes about stilted dialog look at how damaging that "natural" (aka smarmy) style is.

Having people talk like that breaks the "historical drama" attitude the OT and the PT had. A big reason for the OT's long term viability is the fact that they spoke the language of Star Wars instead of what would have been considered cool at the time. Snark will date your media really hard in the long run.

Contrast that maREYsue, who is shown to be doing cool things right from the get go. Her environment doesn't seem to bother her very much at all. She actually looks to be enjoying it. Obviously they wouldn't dare show her being vulnerable. They could never have dreamed of having some white dude tell her she had to stay.

Rey.... what did she wanted? All she did was living alone and collecting junk. She had no dreams or ambitions. The OT characters in comparison had future plans other than the plot. If the opening scene didn't happen the characters would be still trying to achieve their goals and not just exist until the bad guys start the plot. A big problem with superheroes and that kind of story telling is that they are extremely passive and reactive, that is why they don't make compelling movie worlds.

I will also blame this on a more trope based story telling, you are checking boxes without thinking about how those elements will interact.
I haven't watch much of the ST, but the Force Awakens was enough to feel that there is no chemistry between the characters.

Contrast this how nicely Leila, Han and Luke contrasted and boosted their own roles. Sometimes an actor/character shines best when facing with a opposite. See how Star Trek's Spock is emotionless in contrast with Kirk's bold presence. While Spock was more emotional when Pike had a less defined presence on the screen.

The cost of that environment is immediately apparent on Luke in a couple of scenes. Him flying his model T-16, dreaming of better things. Asking Owen about leaving and his frustration at being told "one more year". His aunt letting us know his friends are gone and he is now lonely. Luke's life was not glamorized, it was shown to be drudgery - even if it did obviously give him some skills he would use later on.

Exactly. You can set the tone or help reinterpret a movie just by some acting and prop work. A reason why SW can be watched multiple times is the fact that you can change your understanding just by noticing new things or looking at things from a different lens.

Many movies miss out on the potential of the medium by having things filled up by product placement or cheap references.
I reckon that many movies are simply made with a formulaic script in mind, that is not really personally inspired and just work with tropes.

Perhaps that is just my own bias at play.

 

[Creep3r]

"Accidents" happen all the time in the workplace.

"Very convenient accidents!"

I'm surprised the New Republic didn't just produce Venator-class Star Destroyers. I mean, come on, they're the symbol of the Old Republic fleet during the Clone Wars, they were even called "Jedi Cruisers", and they can hold tons of fighters while still having the capability of glassing a planet.

View attachment 2270278

You'd think for a state that fancies itself as a successor to the Republic of old, they would utilize symbols of said Republic.

Or, if it were me, just paint the Star Destroyers red.

I can't believe that a group like the New Republic would be so thin-skinned as to not want to use Star Destroyers, just because their enemies used them as tools of oppression. I mean, wouldn't it be a stronger message for freedom and liberty if they were using tools once used to enforce a fascist regime as tools of bringing democracy to the galaxy? What stronger message is there to show how freedom has triumphed over tyranny than by putting the symbol of liberty on things that were once used to enforce the tyranny of the Sith?

View attachment 2270346

Like I said before, they did use Star Destroyers early on, one of the most recurring ones was even named after Mon Mothma. But internal political tensions, "reluctant to join" thin-skinned sectors, and the continued activity of the Imperial Remnants didn't make it easy to use them. But they did produce new ships made out of the same frames and materials as the Star Destroyers and even altered the ones they had somewhat later on but with rounder or less "pointy" designs because of political tension, to the point that they renamed most of them "Battle Carriers".

Not as imposing a name but I guess that's what happens when you try to please everyone, including thin-skinned sectors...

@jspit2.0 went into extra detail about it here:

https://kiwifarms.st/threads/star-w...rise-of-skywalker-spoilers.32492/post-9233743

In contrast to Disney's nuNew Republic that had nuMon Mothma "de-weaponize" the nuNew Republic and completely scrap all ships and weapons they had cuz reasons.

And I never understood why they called themselves the New Republic. If it were me, we'd just have the state be named the Galactic Republic and denounce the Galactic Empire as an illegitimate state created by a political fraud. What better way to thumb your nose at the Empire than by saying that their state wasn't legitimate in the first place, and ignoring the three decades of tyranny than by saying that the Galactic Republic is back in order and that the Empire was never legal?

Considering how corrupt and useless the Republic and its senators were prior to the Empire, wanting to distance themselves from that government too seems like a given.

 

[Gar For Archer]

Having people talk like that breaks the "historical drama" attitude the OT and the PT had. A big reason for the OT's long term viability is the fact that they spoke the language of Star Wars instead of what would have been considered cool at the time. Snark will date your media really hard in the long run.

Rey.... what did she wanted? All she did was living alone and collecting junk. She had no dreams or ambitions. The OT characters in comparison had future plans other than the plot. If the opening scene didn't happen the characters would be still trying to achieve their goals and not just exist until the bad guys start the plot. A big problem with superheroes and that kind of story telling is that they are extremely passive and reactive, that is why they don't make compelling movie worlds.

I will also blame this on a more trope based story telling, you are checking boxes without thinking about how those elements will interact.
I haven't watch much of the ST, but the Force Awakens was enough to feel that there is no chemistry between the characters.

Contrast this how nicely Leila, Han and Luke contrasted and boosted their own roles. Sometimes an actor/character shines best when facing with a opposite. See how Star Trek's Spock is emotionless in contrast with Kirk's bold presence. While Spock was more emotional when Pike had a less defined presence on the screen.

Exactly. You can set the tone or help reinterpret a movie just by some acting and prop work. A reason why SW can be watched multiple times is the fact that you can change your understanding just by noticing new things or looking at things from a different lens.

Many movies miss out on the potential of the medium by having things filled up by product placement or cheap references.
I reckon that many movies are simply made with a formulaic script in mind, that is not really personally inspired and just work with tropes.

Perhaps that is just my own bias at play.

I’m not even a Star Wars fan, but from a storytelling standpoint Luke’s introduction is so incredibly well-done. Without any exposition, they’re able to tell you exactly what you need to know about him and his background, as well as do some interesting worldbuilding. The line that really stuck out to me was how he’d basically wanted to go to Stormtrooper school - it showed how for probably the vast majority of the galaxy’s people, the Empire was kinda just this ambivalent governing body whose actions had little effect on the average-joe moisture farmers who’d never even dream of leaving their own planet.

 

[Blamo]

And I never understood why they called themselves the New Republic. If it were me, we'd just have the state be named the Galactic Republic and denounce the Galactic Empire as an illegitimate state created by a political fraud. What better way to thumb your nose at the Empire than by saying that their state wasn't legitimate in the first place, and ignoring the three decades of tyranny than by saying that the Galactic Republic is back in order and that the Empire was never legal?

Isn't the republic from the PT era, a new republic on it's own. Palpatine said that" the Republic that lasted a thousand years" quite often. I presume the Ruusan reformation era came with a new Constitution of it's own. For example the army was abolished, Jedi lost their political roles etc.

Not to mention, many of the statesmen from the Republic era are either long dead or sold out to the Empire. It would be like trying to remake the Roman Republic after Caesar, the system itself was corrupted and dangerous precedents were set. Civilization thrives on a lot of "yeah let's not do this" rules that are not explicitly written down, but everybody considers at least subconsciously.

I guess the Galactic Empire was an enough of an upset that it warranted starting over. Just like how the French are on their 5th republic at this point.

Bonus point: the old republic was really human and inner rim centric, the new republic worked on to remedy those old injustices that led to the CIS back in the day.

 

[TheAmbiguousLurker]

They're hyping up a new cameo for tomorrow's Bad Batch episode. Can't wait for the Galaxy to be even smaller!

 

[jspit2.0]

They're hyping up a new cameo for tomorrow's Bad Batch episode. Can't wait for the Galaxy to be even smaller!

Who is it this time!!!

It's like name that Pokemon.

 

[Blamo]

They're hyping up a new cameo for tomorrow's Bad Batch episode. Can't wait for the Galaxy to be even smaller!

Imagine making a show and having so little faith in it, that only characters from better things can sell it.

Shouldn't a cameo be an easter egg that adds to the experience of attentive fans, instead of a main attraction?

 

[jspit2.0]

Imagine making a show and having so little faith in it, that only characters from better things can sell it.

Shouldn't a cameo be an easter egg that adds to the experience of attentive fans, instead of a main attraction?

It would be one thing if it was integral to the story, but here, replace Tarkin or Kanan with generic character A and what is the difference, really?

 

[Creep3r]

They're hyping up a new cameo for tomorrow's Bad Batch episode. Can't wait for the Galaxy to be even smaller!

Who is it this time!!!

It's like name that Pokemon.

Well we know Assoka, the mando ginger and Vader are a given (Baby Leia too probably whenever Bail Organa shows up). When though is anyone's guess.

According to Wookieepedo, the last episode was mostly just Rex and Fallen Order wanking with a Galaxy's Edge/Disney park reference...

Only thing that's certain is that episode 12 will take place on Ryloth, which means one of these will be a mandatory cameo...

Heck maybe all three will appear and be revealed to live in the same village... Make them cousins while you're at it Filoni! Or throw Aayla Secura in there too since you also want Plo Koon to survive for some fucking reason!

It would be one thing if it was integral to the story, but here, replace Tarkin or Kanan with generic character A and what is the difference, really?

Exactly. Filoni's cameo wank adds nothing other than cheap nostalgia, self-fellating (since its mostly his own creations) and they all do absolutely nothing memorable to the point where their roles could've been filled by any generic new character. At this point, its just a cheap distraction from the lackluster plot.

Most articles and subreddits talking about the last episode mainly talk about Rex, Fallen Order references and the Dianoga "baptizing" the muscle clone rather than the actual plot or its characters.

 

[Uranus Pink]

Well, the problem was the Star Destroyers were specifically used by the Empire as symbols of oppression.

The other than the Alderaan being turned into a well deserved asteroid fold, the OT been remarkably skimpy on showing the Empire oppressing the nonhumans. If anything those non-Mon Calamari xenos are butthurt cause as long as the vintage hardware stays in service with the various refits, and rebuilds that's NR tax money not going into buying their ships. Nevermind them completely missing the part of "refits and rebuilds" could have been done at their shipyards had put in the bribes bids to get the jobs. Plus part of doing that is remaking the "symbols of oppression" into "symbols of [insert word here]" with NR oversight to try and keep most equipment somewhat standardized across the fleet.

Politically even the idea of homogenized fleet was incendiary, as seen in the Black Fleet Crisis. We also witness Borsk Felya and other non-humans weaponize the Human Rebels ties to the Empire.

Boo fucking hoo again other than the Mon Calamari and Bothan spies, the OT utterly failed at showing the non humans fighting the Empire. So for the lazy do fucking nothing xenos reeing over "symbols of oppression" when they couldn't be arsed to lift a finger to help the Rebellion. Something George could've rectified with the Special Editions but didn't.

They wound up doing exactly what you describe, using them. But moving forward they continued to operate more like a lose confederation than a true successor to The Old Republic. It was the Galactic Alliance that actually followed the Old Republic with its more direct control of resources.

Better if the fall of the Empire ushered in several successor "Republics" of the Old Republic in addition to the Imperial Remnants the Rebellion turned New Republic had to contend with.

 

[jspit2.0]

Well we know Assoka, the mando ginger and Vader are a given (Baby Leia too probably whenever Bail Organa shows up). When though is anyone's guess.
View attachment 2270706
According to Wookieepedo, the last episode was mostly just Rex and Fallen Order wanking with a Galaxy's Edge/Disney park reference...

Only thing that's certain is that episode 12 will take place on Ryloth, which means one of these will be a mandatory cameo...
View attachment 2270720
Heck maybe all three will appear and be revealed to live in the same village... Make them cousins while you're at it Filoni! Or throw Aayla Secura in there too since you also want Plo Koon to survive for some fucking reason!
View attachment 2270723View attachment 2270724


Exactly. Filoni's cameo wank adds nothing other than cheap nostalgia, self-fellating (since its mostly his own creations) and they all do absolutely nothing memorable to the point where their roles could've been filled by any generic new character. At this point, its just a cheap distraction from the lackluster plot.
View attachment 2270743
Most articles and subreddit talking about the last episode mainly talk about Rex, Fallen Order references and the Dianoga "baptizing" the muscle clone rather than the actual plot or its characters.

It can be frustrating, because we know Jon Favreau understands how to tell stories.

Star Wars is just so fucking charged. On one end you have Filoni and originally Iger, though I think he's mostly out of it at this point, pulling on one end to hedge every bet and just rehash the same plot. On the opposite end is Kennedy and her team. Who want something new and don't understand why it keeps turning out like shit.

Someone mentioned a successor to Star Wars back pages ago. I don't know that Star Wars could be made today. Battlestar Galactica remake was amazing despite flubbing the ending and was very much a successor to Babylon5/DS9. Defiance was a successor for Farscape before the creator abandoned the show around season two.

Star Wars is unique in that it is one of the few SciFi shows without a clearly progressive universe. Even if George intended it to be politically charged, it never wound up that way. Add to that its unique creativity and I think the closest thing to Star Wars will be a spiritual successor. For my ticket, I'd say Farscape. Oozing creativity, fun, largely apolitical.

The other than the Alderaan being turned into a well deserved asteroid fold, the OT been remarkably skimpy on showing the Empire oppressing the nonhumans. If anything those non-Mon Calamari xenos are butthurt cause as long as the vintage hardware stays in service with the various refits, and rebuilds that's NR tax money not going into buying their ships. Nevermind them completely missing the part of "refits and rebuilds" could have been done at their shipyards had put in the bribes bids to get the jobs. Plus part of doing that is remaking the "symbols of oppression" into "symbols of [insert word here]" with NR oversight to try and keep most equipment somewhat standardized across the fleet.

Well, the OT had limits on what you can show in six hours. What we saw was them blow up a planet, dissolve the Senate, mercilessly conqueror a diverse colony that didn't break any laws, and occupy a planet full of non-humans they hunted.

Then there's the implications. Taxation without representation, massacres, et cet.

I completely agree its irrational, but that's the flip side of democracy. Especially one with different species.

Boo fucking hoo again other than the Mon Calamari and Bothan spies, the OT utterly failed at showing the non humans fighting the Empire.

Better if the fall of the Empire ushered in several successor "Republics" of the Old Republic in addition to the Imperial Remnants the Rebellion turned New Republic had to contend with.

Well, they did, with independent systems being courted by the New Republic. That's something Han complains about in the Thrawn trilogy. Leia going on diplomatic missions.

 

[Sneed F91]

Rey.... what did she wanted? All she did was living alone and collecting junk. She had no dreams or ambitions.

Rey wanted to find her family in TFA, but that's thrown out the window as soon as orange lady Yoda with the asshole eyes tells her they're not important. That should have been the end of it but they instead doubled down on it in TLJ when she's still trying to find her family but Kylo tells her they're dead (how does he know that?). The small minority of people who actually paid attention to what was going on in TFA other than "OMG MY NOSTALGIA" already knew this so it was a complete waste of time. And then Plan IX happened.

What completely baffles me is that Finn is also an orphan but is not allowed to ask what happened to his family or even bother searching for them, not that the movies really had the time to go into that anyways.

 

[draggs]

What completely baffles me is that Finn is also an orphan but is not allowed to ask what happened to his family or even bother searching for them, not that the movies really had the time to go into that anyways.

Despite being the actual everyman bright eyed and bushy tailed Luke Skywalker character, finding himself as an independent adult and being thrown into adventure with his friends... Finn is a nigger and so we cannot waste time on him. We have flat as a board in the front and the back, squareheaded, grimacing white gurl to focus on

Finn was the hero of TFA and should've been the hero of the trilogy. Change my mind

 

[Drag-on Knight 91873]

Rey wanted to find her family in TFA, but that's thrown out the window as soon as orange lady Yoda with the asshole eyes tells her they're not important. That should have been the end of it but they instead doubled down on it in TLJ when she's still trying to find her family but Kylo tells her they're dead (how does he know that?). The small minority of people who actually paid attention to what was going on in TFA other than "OMG MY NOSTALGIA" already knew this so it was a complete waste of time. And then Plan IX happened.

Orange Yoda was baffling from a design perspective. Disney is the company that popularized big eyed cartoons and big eyes are indicative of expression. Her eyes are small, which usually means secretive, untrustworthy, and implicitly evil. Goofy goggles do not help since she doesn't have them on all the time. Compounded with being irrelevant to the plot and creating BS plot threads ("That's a story for another time."), she doesn't work as a wise old person trope.

 

[Starscreams Cape]

Only thing that's certain is that episode 12 will take place on Ryloth, which means one of these will be a mandatory cameo...
View attachment 2270720
Heck maybe all three will appear and be revealed to live in the same village... Make them cousins while you're at it Filoni! Or throw Aayla Secura in there too since you also want Plo Koon to survive for some fucking reason!

Aayla Secura...now that's a name I haven't heard in a very long time.

Gotta say, I always thought she was a hottie.

 

[Blamo]

Finn was the hero of TFA and should've been the hero of the trilogy. Change my mind

Not a fan of the casting, but at least the character had potential. It could have been a Kyle Katarn-ish character. Ex-storm trooper turning Jedi. It felt like it was implied in the TFA, I mean you don't hold your ground against a force sensitive without some of your own precog even for a little.

Star Wars is unique in that it is one of the few SciFi shows without a clearly progressive universe. Even if George intended it to be politically charged, it never wound up that way. Add to that its unique creativity and I think the closest thing to Star Wars will be a spiritual successor. For my ticket, I'd say Farscape. Oozing creativity, fun, largely apolitical.

Actually politics is not a dirty words, it's just a world view. Star Wars is very heavily feels based on early American political ideas. It's basically Hot Rod fixing vagabonds vs Uppity British snobs in their Jaguars. It's heavily based on individual freedom and self mastery. IMHO

 

[Molly White's Breast Milk]

Someone mentioned a successor to Star Wars back pages ago. I don't know that Star Wars could be made today. Battlestar Galactica remake was amazing despite flubbing the ending and was very much a successor to Babylon5/DS9. Defiance was a successor for Farscape before the creator abandoned the show around season two.

Star Wars is unique in that it is one of the few SciFi shows without a clearly progressive universe. Even if George intended it to be politically charged, it never wound up that way. Add to that its unique creativity and I think the closest thing to Star Wars will be a spiritual successor. For my ticket, I'd say Farscape. Oozing creativity, fun, largely apolitical.

You want a real successor to Star Wars?

Yeah yeah, "fuck off weeb!", I hear you saying. Look past it being anime, Legend of the Galactic Heroes is Star Wars for adults. I pray to Odin every night that pedowood never finds out about it and remakes it into some woke bullshit.

 

[Creep3r]

You want a real successor to Star Wars? View attachment 2271087

Yeah yeah, "fuck off weeb!", I hear you saying. Look past it being anime, Legend of the Galactic Heroes is Star Wars for adults. I pray to Odin every night that pedowood never finds out about it and remakes it into some woke bullshit.

Well it is a great series, but can it really be called a "successor" when both franchises were born around the same period (1976 (yes I'm counting the novelization) and 1982) and that it ended just two years after ROTJ? Also I think they announced that it was getting a sequel, so expect a bastardized woke incarnation to not be too far behind.

But as far as decent successors go, weeb shit probably seems to be the only option as far as I can tell since most former SW fans seem to have gone off to scifi/fantasy weebshit or 40k (and I really don't consider 40k a good successor to SW and is pretty much its own thing, so that just leaves weebshit).

 

[Grave Ghost]

Star Wars is just so fucking charged. On one end you have Filoni and originally Iger, though I think he's mostly out of it at this point, pulling on one end to hedge every bet and just rehash the same plot. On the opposite end is Kennedy and her team. Who want something new and don't understand why it keeps turning out like shit.

Someone mentioned a successor to Star Wars back pages ago. I don't know that Star Wars could be made today. Battlestar Galactica remake was amazing despite flubbing the ending and was very much a successor to Babylon5/DS9. Defiance was a successor for Farscape before the creator

I've honestly just came to terms that Western Culture is dying and we won't see anything that isn't cape shit tier again unless something happens that knocks the woke people off their pedestal.

 

[Godzilla@1989]

I honestly felt annoyed Filoni brought back Ahsoka for no reason in Season 7 and it really makes her both a idiot and a coward during the whole Order 66.

As much as I’m not fond over Filoni Wars, the season five finale should have ended that series because it at least should her fate ambiguous and it at least had the sense to have Anakin find another reason to turn on the Jedi.

Well, until Rebels came and went.