Newman's Own
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2020
Diseased #Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!
- Thread starter Done
- Start date
A nameless trool
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2020
This is why you need a mailing list. Just add a page at the end of your book saying: if you enjoyed it, sign in here to learn when the next one is coming out.
Add some mispellings so it is more EXTREME!
Cyb3rWulf and MagickC.A.T.S and VltraD3vi1 would do a great series of cyberoccultist antiheros
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Pilule Noire
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2020
You don't really think @FROG is the boss man here, do you? I mean logically the real boss man is some shadowy figure at IGG, whoever gave the 'big men' (ROFL) of ComicsGate their special privileges.
That's the real guy, the corporate boss at IGG - Frog and Malin are just that boss's dull-witted henchmen. They're just doing his bidding of pushing for CG-IGG exclusivity and an unending KS boycott.
Frog doesn't really care on a personal level, a Spawn toy was all it took for him to hand his money to KS. He's just following orders from his shadowy IGG boss, who is the real boss.
I mean that IGG boss, the REAL big boss, could press a button on his computer and pretty much end ComicsGate. And what the fuck could Frog do about it, absolutely shit all. Except cry loudly, and encourage his retarded underlings to cry loudly with him, and bang their feet and pull their hair. That's all he could do, he lives completely in the palm of their hand.
And I mean CG must be a tasty little racket for the IGG corporation. nearly $9m raised, they take 5% of every crowdfund, so nearly half a million? And they're doing fuck all except building a digital money bucket.
The dull-witted henchmen do all the work for them! Tasty little racket for the corporate bosses at IGG.
Mister Dongs
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2020
My apologies for being late in recapping the Kickstarter Treason, but to go from Eric Weathers to Leroi to Rob Arnold to a JACK show is like the Bataan Death March of Comicsgate stream viewership:
In a place where nothing interesting ever happens, "Comicsgate's letterer" Eric Weathers' channel, things started innocently enough. A placid "chillstream" where the author of Battle Brick Road (now 16 months in with no fulfillment date listed on his campaign and Von Klaus (only now fulfilling Monster M.D, launched in April 2019) take turns appreciating each other as professional comic creators. It's at the 37 minute mark though that Weathers finally asks the question of "....but can we make more?" and loads up Billy Tucci's Shi: Omnibus campaign on Kickstarter.
Eric Weathers looks lustfully upon the $26,886 Tucci has raised in addition to his Frog-launched IGG crowdfund. I suspect the money raised for Battle Brick Road has run out at this point, explaining why Eric is continuing to take lettering commissions on even the most obscure CG projects like "MAVRICS: Origins V1" instead of completing his well overdue project. An extra $26,000 gross would go a long way towards putting any financial trouble he's having to rest. Billy Tucci's allowed on the biggest Comicsgate platofrms around and he's on Kickstarter. Looks to be working out really well for him. And hey, what purpose does it really serve the Comicsgate cause to cede the biggest crowdfunding platform to the SJWs? They should contest these people for the Kickstarter customer's dollar. Von Klaus supports Eric in "storming the beaches of Kickstarter SJWs". Still, this stream had only 10-15 viewers tops and would have without a doubt sunk beneath the waves of the ocean of low-effort Youtube livestream content had it not been for a handful of loyalists in the chat:
Leroi starts this episode of The Chat (Jul 24th) as a man torn between two worlds - split between loyalty to Comicsgate creators he hopes to get further inroads with and loyalty to Comicsgate dogma. At first the idea was met with hostility, but Eric Weathers and Eddie Winkler join the show to sell their vision of Comicsgate expanding into new markets with hundreds of thousands of new potential customers.
The audience, made up of both customers and creators, are of vividly split minds on this. Hardline CG customers who, possessing the power of the wallet and the luxury of dictating standards, one would expect to hold firm to 'CG principles', some instead lent support for moving into Kickstarter, while quiet newcomer creators that haven't really had any controversy like Kenneth Rocafort say that Comicsgate must be IGG only because of the persecutions suffered by Kickstarter. Eventually Leroi and the rest of "The Chat" take the position of supporting Comicgaters' IndieGogo projects and neither supporting nor condemning any additional forays into Kickstarter crowdfunding.
DangerVanessa adds a story about how she's single now after she found out the marine she was dating did a background check on her criminal history, which was repeated by Vanessa as "testing for the prospects of marriage". This has nothing to do with Kickstarter, I just wanted to put it in here.
After arguing with Leroi (who to his credit joins to stand up for Weathers against Jon Malin) on Rob Arnold, third most famous Comicsgate Australian's show, Jon Malin fires up a livestream to shut this shit down once and for all. Malin describes a poison trickling through the Comicsgate community, one that eats away at the roots that keep the entire tree upright. He speaks of course of the Kickstarter Treason. Comicsgate was, in no small part, solidified as a movement in protest to how Jon and RIchard C Meyer were gatekept from Kickstarter. That purpose helps bind the entire phenomena together and not going to help anyone undermine and eventually destroy it by supporting any Comicsgater who dips their wick in Kickstarter.
However it was too little too late as Keung Lee, author of Battle Maiden Knuckle Bomb, released this brief video registering his opinion on Malin's diktat. After expressing his deep friendship to the Graveyard Shift creator, affirming his gratitude and loyaties to Comicsgate and his lack of intent to join Kickstarter at present, he begins listing his objections. In point form:
07/27/2021 - JON MALIN - THERE WILL BE BLOOD
The stream opens with Jon Malin talks about business, his aspirations for Godlike, the rationale behind his current business strategy in front of an open page for the mailing list for "Godlike" and in whatever other way he can kills time until any of the people he sent the stream link turn up so he can address the Kickstarter Treason.
Unfortunately for Malin, after an hour only Anna shows up and as usual has no idea what's happening or why it matters. Malin sighs audibly and wonders out loud if he can get Shane Davis, nobody's first choice, to show up on the stream. Anna understands Kickstarter is bad, but wonders why anyone would want to use it. Malin explains for Anna's benefit: He and Meyer were booted off Kickstarter and so everyone in Comicsgate boycotted Kickstarter in solidarity, to a degree where now any comic campaign launched on IndieGoGo is automatically suspected of being Comicsgate. Kickstarter has changed management, but Jon does not care because he is still mad and now IndieGoGo is considered "Comicsgate turf" and that is important. But now some Comicsgaters are considering branching out into Kickstarter. Some will find success Malin concedes, but this is irrelevant as he contends that upholding the boycott of Kickstarter is a core Comicsgate value.
Within five minutes of Jon sending the invite, Shane Davis turns up. He too as usual has no idea what's going on and asks for an explanation of what is happening. Anna thankfully cuts off Shane's stupid question to ask an even more stupid but less repetitive question of "Is there something that is beneficial about going to Kickstarter versus Indiegogo? Do they have a larger audience? Do you get a larger percentage?". Malin explains that there's a new audience out there and that is appealing to any entrepreneur, but the real problem in Malins estimation is the wave of people who declare themselves Comicsgate and launch a campaign with no preparation, no marketing platform; they then fail and ask themselves what happened, and now some creators are now asking about going to Kickstarter. Anna hazily recalls something about Doug TenNapel going to Kickstarter, which gets Jon Malin to immediately explain that Earthworm Jim is a household name, and also Doug has 30, maybe 40 (?) years in the industry. The point is just because Doug TenNapel found success there doesn't mean you will, listener.
Jon uses this to segue into articulating his theory of Comicsgate's initial success, describing the strife and conflict surrounding Jawbreakers: Lost Souls as a lightning rod of controversy that harnessed the attention of thousands of people and then consolidated it around a protest movement in a way that the comic book scene on Kickstarter has yet to be able to manage. Creators looked at Jawbreakers, saw the money and flocked to Comicsgate on Indiegogo. Now creators are looking at the supplementary money of simultaneous Indiegogo + Kickstarter campaigns and contemplating flocking there as well. And while the pursuit of profit is completely natural Malin concedes, he argues this act damages the integrity of Comicsgate as protest movement, and without the protest element Malin, in not so many words, believes Comicsgate will succumb to teleological entropy and as a result eventually no longer be able to fund creators. Therefore Malin will oppose any Comicsgate creators migrating or having anything to do with Kickstarter in any way, to the fullest of his ability.
Anna 'contributes' by repeating her original dumbass question if Kickstarter has a bigger audience, or if it has a built in shipping calculator or something. Why are these creators going to Kickstarter? Shane Davis says he 'thinks' there are more people on Kickstarter and begins a stream-of-consciousness weighing of the issues as he sees them - the idea of pursuing new customers and 'not liking playing defense vs offense' against the reality that a likely majority of existing Comicsgate backers either being opposed to buying from Kickstarter or too lazy to set up a second crowdfund account to buy comics. Shane also does not like the prospects of smaller Comicsgate creators having to now compete against Kickstarter creators as well if the CG customer base is led towards browsing Kickstarter.
Malin picks up on this and dangles the threat of disaffected Comicsgate zealots over any of these vulnerable, at-risk smaller CG creators if they think about moving to Kickstarter. Is the risk of losing your established customers chasing new customers *really* worth the risk? Isn't that what the mainstream did? The average diehard Comicsgate zealot has been radicalized against Kickstarter beyond all reason Malin points out. And you're going to have to make a variant campaign to get on Kickstarter anyway, so why not just launch that campaign on IndieGogo friend? Frog joins and takes the stance of "fuck Kickstarter. Unless my friends want to use it, in which case I'll support them", Malin explains to Frog his motive, which is to maintain the ideological integrity of Comicsgate for years to come. Which until this point has survived in immaculate condition according to Jon. Frog invites Jon to scroll through the Kickstarter comics page to show that most of the projects there make no money; the grass isn't always greener on the other side.
Cecil joins and, doubtless to Frog's chagrin, immediately brings the subject to Kickstarter using, "Comicsgate Kings" guest, non-Comicsgater Billy Tucci. Clint Stoker and his video about testing the waters in Kickstarter is then mentioned, which surprises Malin. Malin loads up Clint Stoker's video "To Supplement with Kickstarter or Not?". Stoker on the video says that there is a cessation of hostilities and overt activism on Kickstarter's part, to which Malin argues that simply no longer actively attacking him is insufficient - he wants an apology. Back on the efapped video, Sweetcast questions the value of Comicsgate's arguable self-ghettoization regarding crowdfunding and the ideological consistency of continuing to use 'woke' platforms like Twitter and Youtube to market oneself while boycotting Kickstarter. Cecil's retort is that there is no alternative to Twitter while Frog adds that IndieGoGo has been very accomodating to Comicsgate and is perplexed that anyone would want to feed their competition. Stoker's next argument is that he could use his Kickstarter campaign to draw attention to his IGG platform. Malin rails on about this being similar to an argument Rob Arnold made about how he'd use Kickstarter but promised not to lead IGG backers to it. Malin retorts that this just sounds like weak justification for what Stoker's actual goal is - making money on Kickstarter - and Jon says Clint Stoker may as well just own it. Frog pleas that making oneself vulnerably to Kickstarter, a company with a history of prejudice against Comicsgate, isn't worth the possible $9000.
And you'll have to go to the trouble of making an alternate cover too, Shane Davis adds.
Clint Stoker has had a lot successful on Indiegogo and "more power to him", Malin says, if he wants to go to Kickstater, but moving to Kickcstarter is actively participating in the dissolution of Comicsgate and he won't have anything to do with that. Malin will be fine, and everyone on the panel will be fine - it's the small creators who will suffer. It's at this point that Clint Stoker appears in the chat and is called upon by the panel to join them and explain himself, but Stoker declines to offer himself up to the mob. Anna again asks why anyone would join Kickstarter if they were turned away Zack and Jon Malin, while Cecil explains Billy Tucci is exempt from these standards that he's "old". Jon Malin is silent regarding the Tucci Question.
The show takes a break for the next 15 minutes as the men discuss Anna's delightful quirkiness and unboxing videos, followed by reading some superchats and re-emphasis on the importance of building a platform. Eric Weathers (who Frog and Malin are unaware of started this) superchats two dollars asking for everyone to watch Keung Lee's rebuttal to Jon Malin's argument. Frog very graciously reads out a chat by yours truly, wherein I point out that the majority of Comicsgate campaigns (64.28%) launched in 2021 have made under $10,000, and that going on Kickstarter may be the difference between a solvent and insolvent project. Additionally, Jon Malin's "Comicsgate Presents" program is only netting around $1000 dollars per guest spot - the cost benefit analysis any prospective creator is going to make is if they are able to make more than $1000 running a campaign on Kickstarter and that all of Jon Malin's sperging is going to be jettisoned when smaller creators apply basic arithmetic to their financial situation.
Jon answers by way of repetition: if you go on Kickstarter, he will not promote your Indiegogo. Up to you, but you better have a marketing plan because if people aren't signing up for your IGG campaign then they aren't for your Kickstarter either. Next is Mike S Miller to show up in the chat, questioning Malin's past edicts regarding crowdfunding.
Smiller's provacteurism is brushed away with a video about Mike's wife dancing and switching into how David Finch is doing in terms of building his channel before launching a campaign. Frog talks about Jim Lee's affair in the 90s. The stream seems like its winding down when Shane Davis asks about how IndieGogo is being set up as a single point of failure in all this. Jon says Youtube is the single point of failure. So actually there's multiple points of critical failure in the proscribed Comicsgate business model, which is... better than only one? This is followed by digressing about Friday Night Tights and Frog's problem with Az.
The subject of FNT leads to a larger discussion on the merits of outrage being utilized by large corporations as a form of outrage marketing - Frog questions the effectiveness of the current outrage trend of griping about He-Man given that a second rate, nearly 40 year old IP like MOTU is now #6 on Netflix. After reading some superchats. Jon thanks everyone for showing off and signs off.
Frog tries to a follow up dramastream afterwards but Anna puts her foot down that she doesn't want to talk about any more drama; he then gives in to Anna's demand and spends two hours making small talk over Flynt Flossy vids (here)
However, Frog does take to twitter afterwards to give a more substantial answer, which is that while he doesn't support Comicsgaters going to Kickstarter and hopes they stick with IGG, it's not his place to issue edicts on what smaller creators can or cannot do.
In a place where nothing interesting ever happens, "Comicsgate's letterer" Eric Weathers' channel, things started innocently enough. A placid "chillstream" where the author of Battle Brick Road (now 16 months in with no fulfillment date listed on his campaign and Von Klaus (only now fulfilling Monster M.D, launched in April 2019) take turns appreciating each other as professional comic creators. It's at the 37 minute mark though that Weathers finally asks the question of "....but can we make more?" and loads up Billy Tucci's Shi: Omnibus campaign on Kickstarter.
Eric Weathers looks lustfully upon the $26,886 Tucci has raised in addition to his Frog-launched IGG crowdfund. I suspect the money raised for Battle Brick Road has run out at this point, explaining why Eric is continuing to take lettering commissions on even the most obscure CG projects like "MAVRICS: Origins V1" instead of completing his well overdue project. An extra $26,000 gross would go a long way towards putting any financial trouble he's having to rest. Billy Tucci's allowed on the biggest Comicsgate platofrms around and he's on Kickstarter. Looks to be working out really well for him. And hey, what purpose does it really serve the Comicsgate cause to cede the biggest crowdfunding platform to the SJWs? They should contest these people for the Kickstarter customer's dollar. Von Klaus supports Eric in "storming the beaches of Kickstarter SJWs". Still, this stream had only 10-15 viewers tops and would have without a doubt sunk beneath the waves of the ocean of low-effort Youtube livestream content had it not been for a handful of loyalists in the chat:
Leroi starts this episode of The Chat (Jul 24th) as a man torn between two worlds - split between loyalty to Comicsgate creators he hopes to get further inroads with and loyalty to Comicsgate dogma. At first the idea was met with hostility, but Eric Weathers and Eddie Winkler join the show to sell their vision of Comicsgate expanding into new markets with hundreds of thousands of new potential customers.
The audience, made up of both customers and creators, are of vividly split minds on this. Hardline CG customers who, possessing the power of the wallet and the luxury of dictating standards, one would expect to hold firm to 'CG principles', some instead lent support for moving into Kickstarter, while quiet newcomer creators that haven't really had any controversy like Kenneth Rocafort say that Comicsgate must be IGG only because of the persecutions suffered by Kickstarter. Eventually Leroi and the rest of "The Chat" take the position of supporting Comicgaters' IndieGogo projects and neither supporting nor condemning any additional forays into Kickstarter crowdfunding.
DangerVanessa adds a story about how she's single now after she found out the marine she was dating did a background check on her criminal history, which was repeated by Vanessa as "testing for the prospects of marriage". This has nothing to do with Kickstarter, I just wanted to put it in here.
After arguing with Leroi (who to his credit joins to stand up for Weathers against Jon Malin) on Rob Arnold, third most famous Comicsgate Australian's show, Jon Malin fires up a livestream to shut this shit down once and for all. Malin describes a poison trickling through the Comicsgate community, one that eats away at the roots that keep the entire tree upright. He speaks of course of the Kickstarter Treason. Comicsgate was, in no small part, solidified as a movement in protest to how Jon and RIchard C Meyer were gatekept from Kickstarter. That purpose helps bind the entire phenomena together and not going to help anyone undermine and eventually destroy it by supporting any Comicsgater who dips their wick in Kickstarter.
However it was too little too late as Keung Lee, author of Battle Maiden Knuckle Bomb, released this brief video registering his opinion on Malin's diktat. After expressing his deep friendship to the Graveyard Shift creator, affirming his gratitude and loyaties to Comicsgate and his lack of intent to join Kickstarter at present, he begins listing his objections. In point form:
- "IndieGoGo vs Kickstarter" is a pointless, stupid battle that benefits none of its participants, reminiscent of "Marvel vs DC" or "Nintendo vs Sony" fanboy tribalist mentality, while the true winners are those that enjoy the benefits of the best of both worlds.
- Jon's edict in reaction to Leroi's show was, in his view, clearly tribalistic in that nature. This sort of thinking , and not the interest in Kickstarter, is what "needs to be uprooted immediately" in Keung's estimation.
- Keung doesn't like Facebook, much like how Jon does not like Kickstarter. However what drives his decision making process is not whether or not he likes Facebook but whether using and advertising on Facebook can benefit him and his business or not.
- From a long-term perspective, keeping all of Comicsgate's eggs in one basket by relying solely on IndieGogo is to court disaster. All it takes is one wrong hire on IndieGogo's part and it could be just as hostile as Kickstarter is/was, as @Pilule Noire describes.
07/27/2021 - JON MALIN - THERE WILL BE BLOOD
The stream opens with Jon Malin talks about business, his aspirations for Godlike, the rationale behind his current business strategy in front of an open page for the mailing list for "Godlike" and in whatever other way he can kills time until any of the people he sent the stream link turn up so he can address the Kickstarter Treason.
Unfortunately for Malin, after an hour only Anna shows up and as usual has no idea what's happening or why it matters. Malin sighs audibly and wonders out loud if he can get Shane Davis, nobody's first choice, to show up on the stream. Anna understands Kickstarter is bad, but wonders why anyone would want to use it. Malin explains for Anna's benefit: He and Meyer were booted off Kickstarter and so everyone in Comicsgate boycotted Kickstarter in solidarity, to a degree where now any comic campaign launched on IndieGoGo is automatically suspected of being Comicsgate. Kickstarter has changed management, but Jon does not care because he is still mad and now IndieGoGo is considered "Comicsgate turf" and that is important. But now some Comicsgaters are considering branching out into Kickstarter. Some will find success Malin concedes, but this is irrelevant as he contends that upholding the boycott of Kickstarter is a core Comicsgate value.
Within five minutes of Jon sending the invite, Shane Davis turns up. He too as usual has no idea what's going on and asks for an explanation of what is happening. Anna thankfully cuts off Shane's stupid question to ask an even more stupid but less repetitive question of "Is there something that is beneficial about going to Kickstarter versus Indiegogo? Do they have a larger audience? Do you get a larger percentage?". Malin explains that there's a new audience out there and that is appealing to any entrepreneur, but the real problem in Malins estimation is the wave of people who declare themselves Comicsgate and launch a campaign with no preparation, no marketing platform; they then fail and ask themselves what happened, and now some creators are now asking about going to Kickstarter. Anna hazily recalls something about Doug TenNapel going to Kickstarter, which gets Jon Malin to immediately explain that Earthworm Jim is a household name, and also Doug has 30, maybe 40 (?) years in the industry. The point is just because Doug TenNapel found success there doesn't mean you will, listener.
Jon uses this to segue into articulating his theory of Comicsgate's initial success, describing the strife and conflict surrounding Jawbreakers: Lost Souls as a lightning rod of controversy that harnessed the attention of thousands of people and then consolidated it around a protest movement in a way that the comic book scene on Kickstarter has yet to be able to manage. Creators looked at Jawbreakers, saw the money and flocked to Comicsgate on Indiegogo. Now creators are looking at the supplementary money of simultaneous Indiegogo + Kickstarter campaigns and contemplating flocking there as well. And while the pursuit of profit is completely natural Malin concedes, he argues this act damages the integrity of Comicsgate as protest movement, and without the protest element Malin, in not so many words, believes Comicsgate will succumb to teleological entropy and as a result eventually no longer be able to fund creators. Therefore Malin will oppose any Comicsgate creators migrating or having anything to do with Kickstarter in any way, to the fullest of his ability.
Anna 'contributes' by repeating her original dumbass question if Kickstarter has a bigger audience, or if it has a built in shipping calculator or something. Why are these creators going to Kickstarter? Shane Davis says he 'thinks' there are more people on Kickstarter and begins a stream-of-consciousness weighing of the issues as he sees them - the idea of pursuing new customers and 'not liking playing defense vs offense' against the reality that a likely majority of existing Comicsgate backers either being opposed to buying from Kickstarter or too lazy to set up a second crowdfund account to buy comics. Shane also does not like the prospects of smaller Comicsgate creators having to now compete against Kickstarter creators as well if the CG customer base is led towards browsing Kickstarter.
Malin picks up on this and dangles the threat of disaffected Comicsgate zealots over any of these vulnerable, at-risk smaller CG creators if they think about moving to Kickstarter. Is the risk of losing your established customers chasing new customers *really* worth the risk? Isn't that what the mainstream did? The average diehard Comicsgate zealot has been radicalized against Kickstarter beyond all reason Malin points out. And you're going to have to make a variant campaign to get on Kickstarter anyway, so why not just launch that campaign on IndieGogo friend? Frog joins and takes the stance of "fuck Kickstarter. Unless my friends want to use it, in which case I'll support them", Malin explains to Frog his motive, which is to maintain the ideological integrity of Comicsgate for years to come. Which until this point has survived in immaculate condition according to Jon. Frog invites Jon to scroll through the Kickstarter comics page to show that most of the projects there make no money; the grass isn't always greener on the other side.
Cecil joins and, doubtless to Frog's chagrin, immediately brings the subject to Kickstarter using, "Comicsgate Kings" guest, non-Comicsgater Billy Tucci. Clint Stoker and his video about testing the waters in Kickstarter is then mentioned, which surprises Malin. Malin loads up Clint Stoker's video "To Supplement with Kickstarter or Not?". Stoker on the video says that there is a cessation of hostilities and overt activism on Kickstarter's part, to which Malin argues that simply no longer actively attacking him is insufficient - he wants an apology. Back on the efapped video, Sweetcast questions the value of Comicsgate's arguable self-ghettoization regarding crowdfunding and the ideological consistency of continuing to use 'woke' platforms like Twitter and Youtube to market oneself while boycotting Kickstarter. Cecil's retort is that there is no alternative to Twitter while Frog adds that IndieGoGo has been very accomodating to Comicsgate and is perplexed that anyone would want to feed their competition. Stoker's next argument is that he could use his Kickstarter campaign to draw attention to his IGG platform. Malin rails on about this being similar to an argument Rob Arnold made about how he'd use Kickstarter but promised not to lead IGG backers to it. Malin retorts that this just sounds like weak justification for what Stoker's actual goal is - making money on Kickstarter - and Jon says Clint Stoker may as well just own it. Frog pleas that making oneself vulnerably to Kickstarter, a company with a history of prejudice against Comicsgate, isn't worth the possible $9000.
And you'll have to go to the trouble of making an alternate cover too, Shane Davis adds.
Clint Stoker has had a lot successful on Indiegogo and "more power to him", Malin says, if he wants to go to Kickstater, but moving to Kickcstarter is actively participating in the dissolution of Comicsgate and he won't have anything to do with that. Malin will be fine, and everyone on the panel will be fine - it's the small creators who will suffer. It's at this point that Clint Stoker appears in the chat and is called upon by the panel to join them and explain himself, but Stoker declines to offer himself up to the mob. Anna again asks why anyone would join Kickstarter if they were turned away Zack and Jon Malin, while Cecil explains Billy Tucci is exempt from these standards that he's "old". Jon Malin is silent regarding the Tucci Question.
The show takes a break for the next 15 minutes as the men discuss Anna's delightful quirkiness and unboxing videos, followed by reading some superchats and re-emphasis on the importance of building a platform. Eric Weathers (who Frog and Malin are unaware of started this) superchats two dollars asking for everyone to watch Keung Lee's rebuttal to Jon Malin's argument. Frog very graciously reads out a chat by yours truly, wherein I point out that the majority of Comicsgate campaigns (64.28%) launched in 2021 have made under $10,000, and that going on Kickstarter may be the difference between a solvent and insolvent project. Additionally, Jon Malin's "Comicsgate Presents" program is only netting around $1000 dollars per guest spot - the cost benefit analysis any prospective creator is going to make is if they are able to make more than $1000 running a campaign on Kickstarter and that all of Jon Malin's sperging is going to be jettisoned when smaller creators apply basic arithmetic to their financial situation.
Jon answers by way of repetition: if you go on Kickstarter, he will not promote your Indiegogo. Up to you, but you better have a marketing plan because if people aren't signing up for your IGG campaign then they aren't for your Kickstarter either. Next is Mike S Miller to show up in the chat, questioning Malin's past edicts regarding crowdfunding.
Smiller's provacteurism is brushed away with a video about Mike's wife dancing and switching into how David Finch is doing in terms of building his channel before launching a campaign. Frog talks about Jim Lee's affair in the 90s. The stream seems like its winding down when Shane Davis asks about how IndieGogo is being set up as a single point of failure in all this. Jon says Youtube is the single point of failure. So actually there's multiple points of critical failure in the proscribed Comicsgate business model, which is... better than only one? This is followed by digressing about Friday Night Tights and Frog's problem with Az.
The subject of FNT leads to a larger discussion on the merits of outrage being utilized by large corporations as a form of outrage marketing - Frog questions the effectiveness of the current outrage trend of griping about He-Man given that a second rate, nearly 40 year old IP like MOTU is now #6 on Netflix. After reading some superchats. Jon thanks everyone for showing off and signs off.
Frog tries to a follow up dramastream afterwards but Anna puts her foot down that she doesn't want to talk about any more drama; he then gives in to Anna's demand and spends two hours making small talk over Flynt Flossy vids (here)
However, Frog does take to twitter afterwards to give a more substantial answer, which is that while he doesn't support Comicsgaters going to Kickstarter and hopes they stick with IGG, it's not his place to issue edicts on what smaller creators can or cannot do.
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NasserRabadi13
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- May 27, 2020
I... I have over 1,000 people on my newsletter.
That's already in there.
YesNoMaybe
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 19, 2019
The "Build Your Platform" talking point is such bs.
NSA
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2017
Reminder that Zack took himself off Kickstarter under the ASSUMPTION they were going to ban his campaign eventually, they didn't actually kick him off.
Insert 'they can't cancel you if you cancel yourself first' meme template here.
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
Also a reminder that Zach abandoned Comicsgate and the thousands of people who donated to fund his lawsuit that started it all in the first place. But you're all still supposed to sacrifice a chunk of your revenue for the guy who's all but said that he's embarrased by you.
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Sex Cannon Lupa
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2021
After sifting through this mass of autism, it's clear the only person with common sense here is Anna. I'm terrified of getting a sassy response from Pieman, but it seems to a humble normie like myself that being comicsgate only seems to benefit the same five or so people. Imagine not using kickstarter and leaving money on the table because some 60-year-old beanie-wearing Youtuber told you not to.
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
Indeed, what a dark day it is.
Newman's Own
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2020
Maybe they aren't buying your new stuff because they realised how "good" your old stuff is.
I had no idea. I got to the party after and just assumed it was true that KS tanked his project and forced him to go to IGG.
Malin's mad that his buddy 'almost' got rejected by the hot chick so no ones allowed to talk to the hot chick.
Exactly.
It's okay when Billie does it, because reasons.
Frog is gonna Frog.
"We don't pay them" unless there's a sweet ass Spawn figure to buy or Billie Tucci is running a campaign over there or you know any time it's inconvenient not to.
"They do not deserve 7% of your vital customers money" but woke censorious YouTube "deserves" to take a 30% tithe on every superchat and makes KS looks saintly by comparison. But that's different because ... reasons.
Also, what customers? The whole reason to use KS to is to reach an untapped NEW customer base separate from the IGG/ComicsGate base.
"Find another way." Easy to say when you're doing over a million a year in business but not so easy when you're trying every "way" you can think of and still coming up without enough to pay your artist his charitable page rate let alone hire Kyle Ritter, Jae Lee or Dale Keown.
Just find another way...
And all this because an autistic guy who abandoned CG two years ago almost got canceled by KickStarter a hundred years ago.
Does anyone doubt that when Ethan eventually decides to release a CyberFrog board game or whatever and the money left on the table by not going to KS is HUGE he won't have a change of heart about the platform?
After all, they are under new management.
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2019
It's only a matter of time before we have our own crowdfunding platform.
Seize the means and all that.
Seize the means and all that.
- Joined
- May 21, 2020
Anyway I launched my official ComicsGate Kickstarter for DEUS VULT this morning as a second chance for folk who want to get in on the book as we're going to print now. Enjoy!
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2020
Hey @FROG, I saw you name show up on the "thank you" list at the end of the new Suicide Squad flick. How does that work?
Newman's Own
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2020
A nameless trool
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2020
9th legion centurion 002
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2020
Jon Malin sounds like a bigger piece of shit than Zack himself. Bancroft is more relevant than Malin when it comes to helping smaller creators get funded. Kickstarter won't let you run multiple unfulfilled campaigns, maybe that's why the big dogs of CG use it. I would say it's all fake outrage, but the guy is easily triggered by the word faggot, so maybe the zealotry is real.
NSA
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2017
ALSO a reminder that Tim Lim; an outspoken Trump fan; who literally made Trump-themed comics; has run 5 successful Kickstarter campaigns without getting kicked off. That kind of screws up the victim narrative CG likes to trot out.
Just incase anyone is still believing the "Zack got kicked off Kickstarter" narrative: Allow Ya Boi to set the record straight:
Time stamp: 2:17
Damn that Kickstarter! Their approval process takes too long! How dare they!
Miniluv
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2021
I'm not sure if Smiller was exaggerating the "25k subs before you launch" bit, but I do remember Malin proclaiming some kind of sub threshold you needed to have before you could launch a successful campaign. I thought it was 10k, but I don't recall exactly what number he pulled out of his ass. Let's say it's the low end and you must have 10k subs before you launch. What CG creators have more than 10k YouTube subs?
That would be Ethan, Zack, and Cecil. I'm sure there's got to be more but I can't seem to think of one.
Anna doesn't really create shit but she's in the CG inner circle and has over 200k subs.
Zack doesn't even acknowledge the existence of CG but is still revered as its patron saint and the entire reason behind the anti-Kickstarter aspect of it.
Cecil is a sad, mentally challenged drunk, his book is late and gay but he still manages to have almost twice as many subs as Jon Malin.
That's right, Coach Malin doesn't even have 10k subs.
Shane Davis, Art Thibert, the Diaz brothers, Andy Smith, Kelsey Shannon, Graham Nolan, Charlie's London and pretty much everyone else that enjoys promotion from the CG big dogs are well below Malin's magic sub number yet most seem to have launched some successful campaigns (yes, success is relative here but they still got exposure from the big table). It's almost as if Jon Malin is full of shit and likes to hear himself bluster.
Woe betide the small CG creator who dares cross the picket line trying to expand his audience and make money on KS. Coach Malin is just not going to use his immense influence in CG to help you promote your project. Good luck getting those Magic Cop numbers without going on his channel!
That would be Ethan, Zack, and Cecil. I'm sure there's got to be more but I can't seem to think of one.
Anna doesn't really create shit but she's in the CG inner circle and has over 200k subs.
Zack doesn't even acknowledge the existence of CG but is still revered as its patron saint and the entire reason behind the anti-Kickstarter aspect of it.
Cecil is a sad, mentally challenged drunk, his book is late and gay but he still manages to have almost twice as many subs as Jon Malin.
That's right, Coach Malin doesn't even have 10k subs.
Shane Davis, Art Thibert, the Diaz brothers, Andy Smith, Kelsey Shannon, Graham Nolan, Charlie's London and pretty much everyone else that enjoys promotion from the CG big dogs are well below Malin's magic sub number yet most seem to have launched some successful campaigns (yes, success is relative here but they still got exposure from the big table). It's almost as if Jon Malin is full of shit and likes to hear himself bluster.
Woe betide the small CG creator who dares cross the picket line trying to expand his audience and make money on KS. Coach Malin is just not going to use his immense influence in CG to help you promote your project. Good luck getting those Magic Cop numbers without going on his channel!
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2020
This might be a dumb question but is there a reason none of the CG guys are using Alterna? I get it that EVS is building his own publishing label, and the big names can get their six figure campaings, but what does the rest of them have (besides dying campaigns)? There's a small publisher right there willing and able to publish CG works, if they meet Peter's standards of course, and nobody has to worry about shitty or months delayed shipping. I mean if you want to "build a platform" getting a few indie published one shots that people can look at is hardly anything to sneer at.