Adventure Time/Fionna and Cake

gaystoner

Little People Big World
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Jul 27, 2020
so I grew up watching Adventure Time and always felt it was a show that was made to blur the realm of 'for kids and adults' without it becoming a sex pest show. just good natured fun...and now on HBO Max there is a 'follow up' series Fionna and Cake which is about...well no spoilers.

Basic premise when AT first came out was Fionna and Cake was the 'gender swapped' versions of the show and then later appearances with 'cliff hanger' esque teasers that Adventure Time has become known for.

and now we have Fionna and Cake..full blown series. Very fun..no spoilers but it's an interesting web of connections.

Here's the intro

 
I absolutely hate Adventure Time. The animation was alright for the first season. But that second season was garbage. I wouldn't say that it was "bad" but it was way worse than what it was like before.

The third season was also not so good. The animation was once again sub par and the plotlines were way too juvenile for it to be enjoyable to watch. Adventure Time has a rather large following for a show that is for kids.
 
I gave up at some point because i got tired of CN advertising every episode as some sort of great revelation just to have it be a random access humor filler episode. There was a lot of good things but not enough to keep me tuning in.
 
I will go against the grain here. Adventure Time is arguably my favorite show, typically in competition with King of The Hill. I love the cast and I have grown more of an appreciation for it and its story as time has gone on.

I like to think of AT as a show about growing up and maturing. In the first seasons, we see an immature 12 year old punching things to solve all his problems, trying to hook up with his baby sitter/mother figure as he doesn’t understand that the relationship would never work out. The kid is a puppy dog, rarely questioning authority and beating up the “bad” guys with little remorse.

By the end of the series, Finn has done a 180. He progressively starts challenging Bubblegum more till they are on equal footing. Ice King goes from a villain to pound on, to a sick man that Finn has learned to deal with in non-lethal ways. By the end, Finn is the one being the adult and trying to resolve conflicts through talking, while his adult figures act way more immature.

I like how the show progressively matures Finn. He grows to get over Bubblegum. He then has a relationship with FP, but being immature at the time, manages to mess up and hurt her. Episodes like All the Little People, Fire and Ice and Another Way, depict Finn’s early immaturity in a dark way. He tries to meddle with people without understanding the consequences, only to then get burned and have to live with the horrid things he has done. This is then capitalized on in later seasons with Finn making up with FP, but not getting back together. He instead makes a mature apology and they learn to respect each other, while acknowledging the damage cannot be undone. Finn also Carrie’s these lessons into his relationship with Huntress Wizard, choosing to let things play out rather than forcing a relationship to complete himself.

Finn’s relationship with the Ice King is another strong point. He goes from pounding on him to progressively getting softer. I like how in later seasons, Finn grounds him or puts a dirty sock on his nose rather than punching him. It shows how much he has matured and acknowledges Ice King for the mentally unwell man he is. Simon cannot control his actions, and learning that, Finn (along with Marceline and others) learn to accommodate him more.

For further examples of maturity, the end of season 6 gives Finn an ultimatum. He can live on Ooo or transcend to Godhood and live forever. In earlier seasons, Finn likely would have become a God, but by season 6, Finn understands the world more, and decides that living with purpose and companionship is more important. By the end of the series, the distinctions really become apparent as Finn, the once child that beat things up, argues with “mature” Bubblegum over not starting a war and just trying to work her family problems out.

I really appreciate Finn’s journey throughout the show. It is on of AT’s strongest points as we follow this child grow and start seeing his wacky world from a different point of view. I know people hate how he didn’t end up with someone, but it feels semi-fitting given all the build up. Finn learned to live with himself and his friends, maturing past them in many ways. He didn’t need a partner by that point.

Jake - Was never the biggest character, but I do appreciate how he grew/un-grew throughout the course of the series. Jake gradually gained a larger perspective on life himself given his kids and him being a brick. I like episodes like Ocarina where Jake’s pup learns that his dad his good as is. It had a sweet ending, to the point that even Tarantino considered it a masterpiece. Him gaining a better relationship with his brother Jerome was also a good development.

Flame Princess - Pretty much never had an issue with her. FP going from Finn’s girlfriend to finding herself and reforming the Fire Kingdom was a great storyline.

Ice King - Next to FP, the most consistently great character. Everyone who has seen the show knows why Simon’s story hits. Betty and Marceline work as great side pieces to Simon. Marceline embraces the new, while Betty refuses. They both feel like realistic reactions to the situation of dealing with Dementia.

Marceline - Outside of Simon, Marceline really lacked as a character. Her defining trait early on was poorly written Rebecca Sugar daddy issues plotlines. While I appreciate the duality of Simon Vs Hudson in being a father, not enough time is ever really given to Marceline’s childhood or this concept. Weirdly, Finn had a better daddy issues plotline, as we saw him go through all stages of excitement, dissapointment and acceptance. We also got a much better redemption for Martin given his trauma of losing a kid likely causing him to be the way he is.

Bubblegum - The idea of the mother figure being deconstructed to show she has many flaws is interesting. Early AT already had signs of her controlling nature. The later seasons took the idea too far by having her be a dictator, a genocider, and an obnoxious Reddit atheist.

I love AT and think it is looked over too often, especially given that most dropped off before the end where many of the mistakes get rectified. I grew up with it, so probably some bias, but I do think it deserves to go up as a prime example of western animation.

I will probably write more later, but will stop for now.
 
Adventure Time is the beginning of the end, the primary children's cartoon that wasn't actually meant for children, but for stunted adults, and as it progressed this fact was more apperant as it became too convoluted and dealt with topics that aren't fitting for children.

I watched it in Uni, the first seasons were alright and the odd reference or adult joke were nice, but as it progressed the lore felt complicated for the sake of being complicated and the show started a weird focus on relationship drama with seeding the current year norm of "how dare a boy fall in love and be loved back?!". I think I quit with some weird episode of Finn getting his hand back with making out with a flower or some shit.
 
Adventure Time seemed to become aggressively pretentious as it went on. There's a difference between genuinely growing up with your audience and then slowly pivoting into being actually a show for overgrown adult babies who clap their hands when girls kiss on screen while simultaneously watching hours of deep lore YouTube videos about a setting that was clearly intended to be nonsensical.

It should have stayed a goofy brainchild of Ward, a mishmash of all his favorite things with a Betty and Veronica element about whether or not Finn is going to choose the kindhearted princess or the rough and tumble vampiress gf. When it tried to be more it became insufferable.
 
a weird focus on relationship drama with seeding the current year norm of "how dare a boy fall in love and be loved back?!". I think I quit with some weird episode of Finn getting his hand back with making out with a flower or some shit.
This is exactly what killed it for me too. The one where he gets his hand back was so bad, there's literally a part where Lumpy Space Princess forces herself on him, his flower arm rots off afterwards, and it's played off like it's not a big deal. This is after all the episodes shitting on Finn for falling in love mind you. At some point after the second or third season, the show goes out of it's way to humiliate and lower Finn constantly for no reason and it got bad enough with that episode that I had to drop it entirely.
 
I gave up at some point because i got tired of CN advertising every episode as some sort of great revelation just to have it be a random access humor filler episode. There was a lot of good things but not enough to keep me tuning in.
this was when the west discovered you could claim to be plot heavy if only 99% of your episodes were filler.

Say what you will about Rick and Morty but there I understand the suffering required to make that man literally shoot their plot device out of the fucking multiverse so they never had to do that again
 
I watched it in Uni, the first seasons were alright and the odd reference or adult joke were nice, but as it progressed the lore felt complicated for the sake of being complicated and the show started a weird focus on relationship drama with seeding the current year norm of "how dare a boy fall in love and be loved back?!".
It should have stayed a goofy brainchild of Ward, a mishmash of all his favorite things with a Betty and Veronica element about whether or not Finn is going to choose the kindhearted princess or the rough and tumble vampiress gf. When it tried to be more it became insufferable.
Once again, I want to point out that Finn was 12 while the two early love interests were 18 (Both technically 1000+). The age gap would have caused massive issues and if they actually went through with Finn and them having a romance, it would be a pretty clear groomer situation. In hindsight, I am sort of glad someone on the staff realized how weird this love triangle was and put an end to it.

Fionna & Cake really highlights why this never should have happened. Someone thought it was a good idea to have an episode that contains a date where an 18 year old man takes a 13 year old girl to his bedroom. While thankfully a twist, the lead up was creepy as hell in hindsight.
 
Once again, I want to point out that Finn was 12 while the two early love interests were 18 (Both technically 1000+). The age gap would have caused massive issues and if they actually went through with Finn and them having a romance, it would be a pretty clear groomer situation. In hindsight, I am sort of glad someone on the staff realized how weird this love triangle was and put an end to it.

Fionna & Cake really highlights why this never should have happened. Someone thought it was a good idea to have an episode that contains a date where an 18 year old man takes a 13 year old girl to his bedroom. While thankfully a twist, the lead up was creepy as hell in hindsight.
First of all, if a romance has unfortunate implications them don't fucking write it. In case of Bubblegum at least it was apperant she sees herself more as Finn's mom while he thinks of her as a love interest due to not really understanding what he is going through. But with Flame Princess it was just relationship drama that is way too complicated for kids, and set the modern standard of any modern animation kicking the balls of any man trying to get into a opposite sex relationship while not keeping the same standard for girls (that are usually lesbian because god forbid the creator waifu gets violated).
 
I think I watched most of it through the first few seasons, usually on in-demand on cable.
I wandered off after Jake had puppies with Princess Rainicorn, probably caught a few bits here and there after that? Didn't specifically have strong feelings against it or anything, just ended up dropping cable and it wasn't worth digging up online.

I liked the silly adventures with stretchy dog Bender stuff, sorta ehh on the long term drama. The early big reveal when we find out that Ice King wore glasses (among other revelations) was neat and I'm glad I caught that as it aired not expecting anything like that beyond what had been hinted at in freeze frame type stuff.

I really liked LSP being dumb and obnoxious. Like the one with her and Turtle Princess and her ringtone is HEY GURRRRL HEY GURRRL HEY GURRRL and then she answers and immediately gets HEY GURRRL
 
I watched the first two episodes of F&C and it seems interesting. Haven't watched the second two yet as I'm not the primary AT fan in the house, but I feel like I can surmise what is going to happen.
 
First of all, if a romance has unfortunate implications them don't fucking write it. In case of Bubblegum at least it was apperant she sees herself more as Finn's mom while he thinks of her as a love interest due to not really understanding what he is going through. But with Flame Princess it was just relationship drama that is way too complicated for kids, and set the modern standard of any modern animation kicking the balls of any man trying to get into a opposite sex relationship while not keeping the same standard for girls (that are usually lesbian because god forbid the creator waifu gets violated).
Flame Princess was never going to work out. She was fire, she was figuratively and literally going to burn him. The age of the two being so young, along with their individual baggage, was a recipe for disaster. Finn was filling a void because he never fully got over Bubblegum, a fact that became more apparent with the Lemongrab episode after the break up, plus Breezy, where he took to hook up culture and got burned hard for it. Meanwhile, FP was an nuke waiting to go off, always trapped in a bubble making her vulnerable to emotion.

Neither should have ever been in a relationship at that point. As I get older, I actually respect the show for having Finn mess up that bad and having to learn from it. Season 5 and 6 are Finn’s low point. I hated it when watching initially, but it grows Finn into a stronger character come season 8 when he matures fully and is actually able to confront FP about it. He then handles the relationship with Huntress Wizard way better in the last seasons.

Season 5 apology vs 8 really shows how far he has come:

I can get the episodes not being for kids, but I disagree with the notion that they were just kicking Finn given the progression of the show. Finn was like 13 when him and FP got together. Him messing up is not that surprising and I think it worked in favor of his growth.
 
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