Better Call Saul

In all truth Chuck's death had no impact despite how shocking and emotional it was. You could say that Jimmy's actions were deeply affected by it and that was its legacy, but it feels more like the writer's room decided it.
I think the show should have ended with a wrap-up episode where both Saul and Kim ended up paying for their crimes.

Most of what followed was pure surplusage and flailing around because they basically wrecked the show with the death of Howard, who utterly didn't deserve the evil shit that was done to him, largely just for fun, by these two scumbags.
So Jack Welker's gang was their copout.
I think that actually worked really well, because here you have an "actual, literal Nazi" and with the way Walt was, the literal NAZI was a more honorable person than Walt. He even let Walt keep a barrel of his cash because Todd had a soft spot for him. Walt did so many utterly vile things in S5 and while my top is murdering Mike, for telling him the truth about what a piece of shit he was, basically selling Jesse into slavery was the worst.

That said, S5 had some of the best moments in the show in it, like when Hank finally realized Walt was Heisenberg, on the crapper, and had taunted him about it to his face "you got me," while leaving a book that basically identified him right out in the open. The sheer arrogance of Walt was amazing, and I loved all the Chekhov's gun moments.

I was on [certain forum] and we'd figured out between us exactly what was going to happen in the finale episode, because of what the characters would do, and also because the title was "Felina," obviously a reference to the Marty Robbins song (and an anagram for "finale"), and since there was nobody else he could save, it was obviously Jesse, even though he actually came there to kill him, too.

I think the first half of S5 was questionable, but the last half was phenomenal, with many scenes that actually just scrambled my brain. The scene where he kidnapped his own infant daughter actually bluescreened me. I had to go back and watch it again because that just fucked my shit up. It was such a vile act. At least he left her at a fire station, realizing that was too vile even for him.

Even to give such an evil character a partial redemption arc was a tremendous act of storytelling.

My favorite part of that, and one that made me verklempt, was when he finally admitted to Skyler that "I did it for me."

She needed to hear that so much. Telling her that was showing he loved her, even at his very worst and most murderous version of himself.
I don't really buy Vince as this "auteur" trying to move away from BB's mistakes when it's clear that he's more than happy to just make crowd pleasing slop except for when he tried to subvert expectations at the very end.
I actually don't think Vince did subvert expectations much. That was a Rian Johnson thing. You could usually go into a BB episode knowing what was going to happen in general but still be shocked by HOW it happened. You just had to have paid attention, and I like a show that rewards paying attention.

I actually do think Vince is exactly the auteur his reputation is. Chekhov's guns all get fired, sometimes literally years later, characters act consistently, color symbolism applies to characters, even minor characters get respect. Even minor characters were played phenomenally well, like Bogdan the car wash guy. . ."FUCK YOU! AND YOUR EYEBROWS!"

Vince has an enormous skill for getting actors to give their best performances, even in minor roles. That's what I admire about Tarantino, too, who got phenomenal lifetime best performances out of actors like Pam Greer, John Travolta, and Robert Forster, often when they'd been considered over the hill.
 
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who utterly didn't deserve the evil shit that was done to him, largely just for fun, by these two scumbags.
To me it's so off character for them that its impossible to not see the strings hanging above. Same with Walt declaring he did it for himself. And I wouldn't consider Walt's plans involving kids particularly heinous. I'm glad you haven't watched House, or you'd think he was literally Hitler.
 
To me it's so off character for them that its impossible to not see the strings hanging above. Same with Walt declaring he did it for himself.
I disagree. They were all terrible people from the very beginning. Saul actually struggled before giving in to his evil nature, while Walt eagerly embraced it. Walt still loved Skyler, even though he arguably shouldn't have because she was about as bad as he was. He didn't break bad. He just actually was bad. Even Jesse pointed this out, and Jesse was kind of a dumbass.

Walt's belief he was doing it for his family was so obvious that Gus even used it in his manipulation and overt threats. He actually believed this lie he told himself to justify what he was doing. It was only when he had to face imminent death that he recognized why he actually did what he did, and it was for himself.

It wasn't out of character. It was the culmination of his character.

It took the events of Ozymandias to shatter him so completely that he finally realized it.
 
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Mad Men was also a very popular show on AMC, but it didn't last as long. The Walking Dead was popular during the time the zombie craze was in a full cultural renaissance during the early-2010s. However, it's still on the air and it's getting worse and worse by 2014 onward that it should've ended by the third season.
I tried watching it a few years ago on streaming, and I dropped it a couple of episodes into Season 2. Darabont not being with the show at that point is not coincidental IMO
 
I tried watching it a few years ago on streaming, and I dropped it a couple of episodes into Season 2. Darabont not being with the show at that point is not coincidental IMO
Season 2 was pure retardation and then everything after that was at least semi-retarded. They tried to rescue it by bringing back actual actors like Lennie James, but then they turned him into some kind of Yoda joke.

Great idea of getting rid of Darabont, the dude who turned Shawshank Redemption into one of the most well regarded films of all time. Great jerb Homsar.
 
Season 2 was pure retardation and then everything after that was at least semi-retarded. They tried to rescue it by bringing back actual actors like Lennie James, but then they turned him into some kind of Yoda joke.

Great idea of getting rid of Darabont, the dude who turned Shawshank Redemption into one of the most well regarded films of all time. Great jerb Homsar.
You mean Darabont, the man who made the 80's blob :mad:
 
A reminder that Gus can predict the future and laid down a gun in the middle of nowhere because he knew he would need that to kill somebody weeks later Tuco style.

It's unfathomable to me how some people can give this season a pass. Every episode is shit, nothing is salvageable.
guessing the guy who's investigating your "Build giant superlab under the laundry" project wasnt a good enough tell?
That final season killed the show in an absolutely spectacular way. I think it was the worst way for a show to end. It wasn't particularly newsworthy bad like I've heard of GoT, it was a whimper for a show that had been excellent up to that point. You can feel they didn't know where to take the plot after Nacho escaped, and I'm still sure that the ending wasn't what they had planned.

Gus killing Nacho is pretty out of character, and Howard's death was very, very jarring. They didn't know how to wrap loose ends apart from "lol he was shot to death". It's notable that of all threads this one died so quickly when the show had a lot to talk about still. I'm still not convinced at all about Jimmy's cuck out, and his bizarre detachment from Chuck went from understandable to unrealistic after a while. They rushed his downfall hard from real life pressures including the taxi guy's actor leaving (I don't care what people here said, the first actor clearly was aiming for a completely different type of role) and Odenkirk having a heart attack.

In all truth Chuck's death had no impact despite how shocking and emotional it was. You could say that Jimmy's actions were deeply affected by it and that was its legacy, but it feels more like the writer's room decided it.
Gus knew if Nacho got captured he'd squeal. he wanted to set up Nacho to go out in a blaze of glory and wash his hands of the thing
 
In my mind, BCS isn't canon to BB. I could never buy that the Saul we see in BCS is the same person we see in BB—the "God, you're killing me with that booty" problem. Saul Goodman was conceived as a comedic side character, and he should have been left at that. Actually, the original idea they had for BCS probably would have worked better: a comedic sitcom.

On BB: I never forgave Vince Gilligan for gaslighting the hell out of the show's fans. First, he gaslighted fans for continuing to cheer for Walt in later seasons. He said he couldn't understand how anyone could root for Walt, all while continuing to write the character in such a way that made it easy to do. They never stopped portraying Walt as something of an antihero. BB's writers were good—they knew exactly what they were doing. They could have easily done more to completely smash any lingering sympathy for the man and have viewers united in rooting for his downfall.

Second: Skylar and the accusations of misogyny against viewers for hating her. Again, the writers knew what they were doing. The first season she was purposely written to be a cold, nagging, and controlling bitch, because that was one of the things that made viewers sympathize with Walt and spurred him to break bad. Though the writers made an earnest effort to make Skylar more sympathetic later, it's like the old saying goes: you never get a second chance to make a first impression. We hated Skylar because Vince wanted us to hate her.
 
In my mind, BCS isn't canon to BB.
BCS and El Camino are basically retcons of BB. But they are close enough that you can close your eyes in a few places and ignore them. BCS really only works if you watch it after BB and not chronologically. If someone were to edit all of BCS, BB, and El Camino together so that all scenes were chronological the series would probably be awful.
Second: Skylar and the accusations of misogyny against viewers for hating her. Again, the writers knew what they were doing.
They had scenes of her smoking when pregnant. And screaming like a psychotic freak and acting schizophrenic. Then remaining with Walt and helping him launder money and basically embracing being a cartel member. There was almost no scene on the show where she is written to be sympathetic. Even the scene where Walt steals their baby from her is literally for her benefit and she plays along later on the phone.

Her last scene is her taking piles of drug money and continuing to cover for Walt even.
 
Though the writers made an earnest effort to make Skylar more sympathetic later, it's like the old saying goes: you never get a second chance to make a first impression.
First impression: she shocked a man with fake bacon on his 50th birthday because she decided for him he should start eating it. There's no way any man's opinion watching that wouldn't be what a controlling bitch.
 
First impression: she shocked a man with fake bacon on his 50th birthday because she decided for him he should start eating it. There's no way any man's opinion watching that wouldn't be what a controlling bitch.
That scene was stolen from The Sopranos (like half of the scenes in Breaking Bad). Carmela replaces Tony's bacon with low fat turkey bacon and he doesn't notice. Lots of Walt recovering from cancer scenes are ripped from scenes of Tony recovering from Uncle Junior shooting him. Walt's crazy fugue state was stolen from Junior wandering around Newark. Walt throwing pizza on the house was taken from Tony angrily taking the pizza back.

Not very much of Breaking Bad is original.
 
That scene was stolen from The Sopranos (like half of the scenes in Breaking Bad). Carmela replaces Tony's bacon with low fat turkey bacon and he doesn't notice.
Except he does notice and even that cerebral palsy kid he had noticed and said it tasted like Band-Aids. So it wasn't stolen because it was totally different even if it referenced. It's called context. Try being less autistic.
 
Except he does notice and even that cerebral palsy kid he had noticed and said it tasted like Band-Aids. So it wasn't stolen because it was totally different even if it referenced. It's called context. Try being less autistic.
Vince Gillian is on record saying that that scene and many others are right from The Sopranos. Some of them are so obvious like the pizza one that they don't even need to be acknowledged. You sound mentally disturbed that someone mocked your favorite show.
 
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Vince Gillian is on record saying that that scene and many others are right from The Sopranos. Some of them are so obvious like the pizza one that they don't even need to be acknowledged. You sound mentally disturbed that someone mocked your favorite show.
No you sound not disturbed, but just kind of autistic, that you constantly madpost about a show you apparently hate. Why did you even watch it long enough to know all these details about why you hate it so much? It's kind of funny.

How is it "mentally disturbed" to point out that why the lifting of the scene was obvious, he did something different with it?

Seriously just calm down. The show's been over. Where did Vince Gilligan touch you?
 
It's probably Ernie.
Ernesto Fring was one of the most underrated characters in BCS. I would unironically like to see a sequel where he, having failed as a lawyer, picks up the pieces of his dead father's drug empire.
 
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the literal NAZI was a more honorable person
*Neo-nazi. Actual members of the NSDAP weren't psychotic murderers like the US made everyone believe, they were a very sophisticated bunch, as you'd expect 20th century Germans to be. Neo-Nazis however are just violent thugs that loosely adapt this deeply vilified and murderous ideology (even though communism was much worse and is somehow celebrated), so Jack was even lower than an actual Nazi.
 
*Neo-nazi. Actual members of the NSDAP weren't psychotic murderers like the US made everyone believe, they were a very sophisticated bunch, as you'd expect 20th century Germans to be. Neo-Nazis however are just violent thugs that loosely adapt this deeply vilified and murderous ideology (even though communism was much worse and is somehow celebrated), so Jack was even lower than an actual Nazi.
Some of them were, though. Look up Oskar Dirlewanger. He may not be representative of the entire class, but they didn't do anything about him either. And I'll agree, Jack was more of a prison gang leader, not some political Nazi, but he was definitely introduced as a Nazi, compared to Walt in his conduct, and one of the last people willing to do business with Walt before Lydia became his connection, and of the two, Jack was the better person.

Walt had degenerated to that level at that point in the series.
 
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