BG3 rant with spoilers, don't click if you don't want spoilers

I would like to go on record that there is romance done well and romance done poorly, and neither bother me. Worst case scenario is that I roll my eyes for a few minutes, but there is nothing egregiously offensive going on. We're all adults and we can deal. The worst case scenario is tolerable and the best case scenario is genuinely touching. I'll take that spread and those odds.
 
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strawberry15 said:
Fuck it, after fiishing pillars of eternity 2, kingmaker, wotr, expeditions rome, gonna play bg1 and 2 and 3 again.
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I love Wrath of the Righteous. First off, perfect name. Second, obscene power fantasy with obscene power levels, fun to do once in a while. If all campaigns go this route, there is a fail, but the occasional indulgence into munchkinism is fun. Third, the available paths actually all have convincing arguments. If you are convinced that morality matters, the moral paths all have compelling arguments and likewise for the powerhungry/ruthless paths. The choices are substantive and meaningful. Four, lots of optional content that *can* be skipped, but is an obvious handicap if you do, as you miss out on treasure and xp. If you truly want to play the "fuck everyone else's goals, I have my own" angle you *can* but this is disadvised only for the reason that it meaningfully reduces your chance of success at your own goal.

There's woke shit that can be seen and done without, but it is within levels that can be stomached. To their credit, they actually took some woke shit out of the book and dice when transcribed to cRPG.

I lost ALL respect for Paizo when they capitulated to the critics of "Agents of Edgewatch" who complained that it was insensitive to real world events to run a campaign where enforcers of the law are unironic heroes. This is a fundamentally stupid gripe for many reasons. Hell, even if you think that LEOs are overwhelmingly corrupt/evil (this is neither accurate nor my position), it still works if you operate on the principle that the PCs are the exception.

I still love their CRPGs.
 
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Rick Nekieta said:
I love Wrath of the Righteous. First off, perfect name. Second, obscene power fantasy with obscene power levels, fun to do once in a while. If all campaigns go this route, there is a fail, but the occasional indulgence into munchkinism is fun. Third, the available paths actually all have convincing arguments. If you are convinced that morality matters, the moral paths all have compelling arguments and likewise for the powerhungry/ruthless paths. The choices are substantive and meaningful. Four, lots of optional content that *can* be skipped, but is an obvious handicap if you do, as you miss out on treasure and xp. If you truly want to play the "fuck everyone else's goals, I have my own" angle you *can* but this is disadvised only for the reason that it meaningfully reduces your chance of success at your own goal.

There's woke shit that can be seen and done without, but it is within levels that can be stomached. To their credit, they actually took some woke shit out of the book and dice when transcribed to cRPG.

I lost ALL respect for Paizo when they capitulated to the critics of "Agents of Edgewatch" who complained that it was insensitive to real world events to run a campaign where enforcers of the law are unironic heroes. This is a fundamentally stupid gripe for many reasons. Hell, even if you think that LEOs are overwhelmingly corrupt/evil (this is neither accurate nor my position), it still works if you operate on the principle that the PCs are the exception.

I still love their CRPGs.
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I believe WotR is a better game than Kingmaker overall. But the ompnions of Kingmaker is better and the story is more managable. so i like both games for different reasons.
Expeditions Rome is not a bad game overall but i believe they had some very questionable decicions while making it unlike the pf games, i have never finished it before. Pillars of Eternity has a very good setting and i liked first game, but found the mechanics, story, companions of second game lacking in many regards and basically force myself at this point. tbh i am forcing myself to play it at this point and i am not that far from the start lol.
 
strawberry15 said:
I believe WotR is a better game than Kingmaker overall. But the ompnions of Kingmaker is better and the story is more managable. so i like both games for different reasons.
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My chief gripe with Kingmaker, which infuriates me to no end, is if abilities that target evil do not affect the Lantern King and his minions, how narrow is your definition of evil? Destroying and upsetting countless lives "for the lulz" is incredibly fucking evil without regards to whatever copes the perpetrator possesses. He isn't tying shoelaces together. He has no fucking limits. Don't tell me his perspective is too nuanced to be affected by "Smite Evil." If he isn't evil, evil is a meaningless word.
 
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Rick Nekieta said:
My chief gripe with Kingmaker, which infuriates me to no end, is if abilities that target evil do not affect the Lantern King and his minions, how narrow is your definition of evil? Destroying and upsetting countless lives "for the lulz" is incredibly fucking evil without regards to whatever copes the perpetrator possesses. He isn't tying shoelaces together. He has no fucking limits. Don't tell me his perspective is too nuanced to be affected by "Smite Evil." If he isn't evil, evil is a meaningless word.
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My biggest issues are lack of scrolls and kingdom system. hate the system in wotr as well but that is another matter. Playing as wizard in kingmaker is not very rewarding because you lack enough variety of scrolls to learn spells so being a sorc. is better.
 
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Rick Nekieta said:
a) What you cited is enough. I really have no desire to hear of anyone's bedroom activity or speak of my own. To some degree, I have to give allowances that others think differently, but I can certainly speak up when it reaches extreme levels.

b) There is also Halsin going on about his time as a sex slave, everyone throwing themselves at you constantly, Astarion being the epitome of the bisexual letch and the fanbase that goes along with that, etc. I will give PARTIAL credit for the fact that they deconstruct Halsin's experience as traumatic, not salacious, and Astarion's experience as extremely evil, not some cutesie character trait. I will give them credit for deconstruction SOME of the overromanticization of lechery, but they are guilty of overromanticizing it in other domains.

c) Not wanting to be a front row spectator to someone else's sexual activity is NORMAL AND HEALTHY.
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If you want to argue it has too much sex jokes then that's fine. But degeneracy at least need to:
1. Be outside of classic western values.
2. Be depicted as normal/heroic.
TLOU2 is classic case of this.
 
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Only companion I didn’t want to murder was Minthara, a mildly enjoyable rpg but they really dumbed everything they possibly could down. Sad when the “best” modern rpg is barely an rpg with a super stale selection of similar routes you can take
 
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wtfNeedSignUp said:
If you want to argue it has too much sex jokes then that's fine. But degeneracy at least need to:
1. Be outside of classic western values.
2. Be depicted as normal/heroic.
TLOU2 is classic case of this.
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I'm entirely unfamiliar with TLOU2 or what the common takes on it are. The only thing I know is Joel's fate and how they wrote it upset a lot of people and it was explained to me why. In short, he fell to a trap that he explicitly avoided in the first one, spotting the trap from the outset and killing the would be offenders. I'll have to look into this later. Oh, and the main char is a muscle mommy who is in love with another woman going up against another muscle mommy antagonist who kidnapped her beau if I am not mistaken? I might be off on a detail or two.
 
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What i don't understand is how this game became so popular based off a series that seemingly neither the players nor the devs actually played?
 
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To play devils advocate for Sarevoks fate in Baldur's Gate 3. You didn't have to redeem him in 2. It was a choice.
 
Evil Peter Griffin said:
To play devils advocate for Sarevoks fate in Baldur's Gate 3. You didn't have to redeem him in 2. It was a choice.
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Even still, it is the KIND of monster he became and HOW Orin was created that undermines the ending slide of an unredeemed Sarevok. An unredeemed Sarevok still goes into the world and does a million things. He doesn't hunker down in a small lair under the city, live over 100 more years and do *that* in the ending slide of the unredeemed Sarevok.
 
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Rick Nekieta said:
Even still, it is the KIND of monster he became and HOW Orin was created that undermines the ending slide of an unredeemed Sarevok. An unredeemed Sarevok still goes into the world and does a million things. He doesn't hunker down in a small lair under the city, live over 100 more years and do *that* in the ending slide of the unredeemed Sarevok.
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Is the Sarevok we see in 3 the same one from 1?
 
Evil Peter Griffin said:
Is the Sarevok we see in 3 the same one from 1?
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If one is to believe his exposition, yes. You could theorize he is a lunatic that is skinwalking the original and the original passed away at an old age in some far off land, but that falls under fan theory. He purports to be the original Sarevok and confirmably IS the grandfather/father of Orin. Sarevok was literally a one in a million physical specimen (18/00 str with 18 endurance ALONE is over 4 mil to one odds, 17 dex on top of that means literal powerball odds) so his physiology being duplicated in a stranger by way of random odds effectively discounts that theory and confirms it is meant to be the original Sarevok.
 
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Rick Nekieta said:
If one is to believe his exposition, yes. You could theorize he is a lunatic that is skinwalking the original and the original passed away at an old age in some far off land, but that falls under fan theory. He purports to be the original Sarevok and confirmably IS the grandfather/father of Orin. Sarevok was literally a one in a million physical specimen (18/00 str with 18 endurance ALONE is over 4 mil to one odds, 17 dex on top of that means literal powerball odds) so his physiology being duplicated in a stranger by way of random odds effectively discounts that theory and confirms it is meant to be the original Sarevok.
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I assumed he was some kind of shadow or remnant of the original. Doomed to serve his father for eternity.
 
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Evil Peter Griffin said:
I assumed he was some kind of shadow or remnant of the original. Doomed to serve his father for eternity.
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The only problem with this theory is that the remnant could not have created a human daughter or human granddaughter. That point of lore would have required the original human Sarevok.
 
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