Science Can we have an open debate about IQ, genes, and group differences? - If only null would give us our rainbows back


Ionce spoke to a human geneticist who declared that the notion of intelligence was quite meaningless, so I tried calling him unintelligent. He was annoyed …
– Nobel Prize laureate, Peter Medawar
Of all the endless nature vs nurture arguments, the debate over intelligence and ‘race’ is the most toxic. It also seeps over into wider unease with human genetic research; the fear, for example, that recent advances in ancient human DNA analysis can be used by those with nefarious intentions to resurrect problematic ‘race’ folk theories.

Given this seeming potential for reviving damaging beliefs, some scholars question whether “we would be better off to give up on particular lines of research” in the human sciences, including “the quest to trace patterns of human migration.” Others, meanwhile, argue for “tighter restrictions” on research into cognitive differences between different human populations. That said, the impetus to explore our ancestral evolution and its impacts remains an essential scientific pursuit, as it is at the backbone of research exploring how human differences impact disease and potential targeted cures.

Such arguments about ‘race’, intelligence and possible censorship were of particular concern to US-born and educated New Zealand scientist and intelligence researcher James Flynn, who died in December 2020, aged 86. Flynn was the IQ debate’s great scholarly champion of environment over genes, known for his respectful rebuke of scholars who took a more deterministic view of the complex relationship of intelligence, genes, and the environment.

IQ and tests​

This century-long debate flared in 1969 following the publication of an article in the Harvard Educational Review, in which psychologist Arthur Jensen claimed that observed IQ differences between Blacks and Whites was due mainly to genetics. Jensen further argued for a reset on the poverty reforms that were then rolling out under the Johnson Administration, arguing that compensatory education programs that assumed racial groups were ‘blank slates’ with environment alone the only detriment to equality of performance—Head Start, for example—were destined to fail.

The article caused an uproar that still rages. Jensen, who died in 2012, was widely denounced as a racist, particularly in the popular press and by social scientists. Instead, Jensen’s critics maintained that environmental factors rather than genes passed along in ancestral cohorts almost entirely explained racial disparities in test scores, a radical environmentalist position that few hard scientists hold today.

This was also when the movement to end the use of IQ tests first emerged. Today, persistent differences in SAT or ACT results among races have been cited as a reason to stop using the exam in college admissions. Last May, many University of California colleges announced they was scrapping its SAT or ACT requirement, as have many other American universities.

Flynn vs Jensen​

Having migrated to New Zealand in 1963 “to escape the political repression of the McCarthy era”, Flynn, now based at the University of Otago in Dunedin, responded skeptically to Jensen’s claims. And understandably so. For instance, how could Jensen explain away Flynn’s voluminous documentation that IQ scores among racial and ethnic groups world-wide have risen considerably from one generation to the next? In the 20th century, Flynn discovered, the scores of entire countries rose by more than the Black-White disparity in the entire US. How could that be if IQ was genetically ‘fixed’? He summarized much of this research in a ground-breaking response to Jensen published in 1980.

In 1987, in an article in American Psychologist, Jensen praised Flynn’s criticism of his own work:

… I am asked by colleagues, students, and journalists: who, in my opinion, are the most respectable critics of my position on the race-IQ issue? The name James R. Flynn is by far the first that comes to mind. His book, Race, IQ and Jensen (1980), is a distinguished contribution to the literature on this topic, and, among the critiques I have seen of my position, is virtually in a class by itself for objectivity, thoroughness, and scholarly integrity.
In a study released in 2006, Flynn and a co-author, William Dickens, concluded that Black Americans had gained as many as seven IQ points on Whites since the early 1970s and into the 1990s, a finding that is hard to explain if intelligence is genetically fixed. The theory that Flynn developed was dubbed “The Flynn Effect” by scholars Richard Hernnstein and Charles Murray, co-authors of The Bell Curve: Intelligence and class structure in American life, the 1994 tome that faced similar harsh criticism as Jensen’s earlier expressed views.

In the decades since, numerous explanations of the Flynn effect have been proposed, as well as some skepticism about what has driven it and its implications. For example, there is intense debate about whether the rise in IQ scores corresponds to a rise in general intelligence or only a rise in special skills related to taking IQ tests, as schools have been turned into test-taking hot houses, in part because teacher salaries and administrative jobs are often tied to raising test scores.

Others argue that the Flynn Effect’s observed gains in IQ over time are unrelated to ‘g’ (also known as ‘general intelligence’) that many psychometricians believe is a fairly unchangeable mental capacity. (‘g’-scores are used in many professions to predict performance; e.g., the US military and even the National Football League, with its Wonderlic test, utilize g-weighted tests in their evaluations).

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In parallel with the measured gains in IQ scores, long-term declines have been found for “mental speed, digit span backwards, the use of difficult words, and color acuity, all of which are related to intelligence.” More recently, the Flynn effect appears to be fading, as the IQ measure distance between some populations and others has grown. Research suggests that there is now a decline in IQ scores, in Norway, Denmark, Australia, Britain, the Netherlands, Sweden, Finland, France and German-speaking countries, a development which appears to have started in the 1990s. The Flynn effect appeared to have most influenced people born during the mid-1970s (co-incidentally a period of dramatic social transformation on racial issues), and has significantly declined ever since.

Flynn himself relished the debates that his research had stimulated. A life-long social democrat, he was outspoken in defence of free speech, including the right — indeed, the desirability — of open and honest debate on possible group differences in intelligence.

And this willingness to engage with those holding different opinions readily explains the reaction to news of Flynn’s death by his peers. Cognitive psychologist Steven Pinker, a sharp critic of ‘blank slate’ post-modernist critical theory, immediately expressed sadness at the passing of a “defender of Enlightenment ideals”. Of particular note was the response of The Bell Curve co-author and conservative political scientist Charles Murray:

By America’s current standards of academic discourse, Jim Flynn and I should have been at each other’s throats,” Murray said. “We did in fact have different perspectives, though more nuanced than most people thought.
But those differences hadn’t the slightest effect on Jim’s collegiality toward me or any of the people with whom he disagreed. … How else are you going to learn, Jim thought, except by engaging with people who see things differently? … Jim represented what a scholar is supposed to be—open, curious, passionate about his beliefs but without either self-righteousness or rancor, determined above all else to get it right.

Unfortunately, while scholars are supposed to be open and curious, much of the passion and argument over ‘race’ and IQ has been self-righteous and rancorous. As Flynn himself readily acknowledged, those least open to discussion and most ready to censor opposing opinions, frequently came from his own leftist end of the political spectrum.

These were the ones, he argued, “who boycott debate” and “put their money on indoctrination and intimidation”, thereby “forfeit[ing] a chance to persuade”. (Here, Flynn’s position reflects characterizations of critical theory proponents that conservatives see as promoters of ‘cancel culture’.)

How to argue with a racist​

In his recent bestselling book, How to Argue With a Racist, geneticist Adam Rutherford emphasises the need “to equip [people] with the scientific tools necessary to tackle questions on race, genes and ancestry” and “to provide a foundation to contest racism that appears to be grounded in science”.

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Jim Flynn, too, had long pointed to this danger — that without an understanding of the scientific arguments, “humane-egalitarian” idealists would flounder against informed and articulate racists.

Censoring debate about the subject would then be doubly counter-productive, further removing the knowledge needed to challenge genuinely racist arguments or, more importantly, the political conclusions that arise from racist misinterpretations of human biological research. That’s the thrust of the argument made in GLP founder’s Jon Entine controversial but critically-praised book, 2000 Taboo: Why Black Athletes Dominate Sports and Why We are Afraid to Talk About Them, in which he wrote:

Although discussing racial differences is likely to provoke strong reactions, on balance and in proper context strong emotions are healthy. …
The “why” of human differences–black/white, male/female, Italian/Irish, between Slavic ethnic groups or one African tribe and another–is likely to remain only crudely measurable. Race–marked by skin color, ethnicity, and geography–is a fuzzy concept. …The challenge is in whether we can conduct the debate so that human diversity might be cause for celebration of our individuality rather than fanning distrust.
In one of his last essays on this topic, Flynn re-emphasised what “Those who want to forbid discussion and scientific investigation ignore”, for instance, the ability to defend your position with facts “rather than just right opinion” and the opportunity to hone your argument by having its weaknesses revealed. “[T]ruth gains vitality from being challenged rather than being an unquestioned inheritance,” he argued.

To kill an idea is to forfeit all rewards that may flow from reaction to that idea. If I had not read about [research into group differences], with its emphasis on IQ and the general intelligence factor, I would never have documented massive IQ gain over time, or urged a revolution in the theory of intelligence, or connected cognitive gains and moral gains …
In contrast to Flynn, those who argue against open discussion of contentious science fear it will breathe new life into socially harmful ideas, akin to publicising the details of how to build “massively destructive bombs” or to create “deadly viruses”. And on their side of the argument is the undeniable fact that past beliefs about racial superiority/inferiority caused incalculable harm.

Nevertheless, the analogy with socially destructive bombs and viruses implies that everyone, regardless of existing political beliefs or values, would suffer through public debate of sensitive issues. Yet is this really the case? If, for example, evidence of genetic differences between racial populations was more widely discussed, would this inevitably lead more people to become racists? We believe not; the egalitarian moral belief that people should be treated equally is not dependent on people actually being equal in all respects.

Of course, given the odious history of twisted interpretations of Darwinian theories of ‘race’, some form of use or abuse analysis of proposed research is warranted. As part of this, though, the detrimental consequences of creating taboos on discussion must also be taken into account (for instance, conceding the argument to racist ideologues who may present themselves as simply telling the unpalatable ‘truth’ that others are too scared to discuss).

In the absence of a scientifically accurate account of racial diversity, we cannot adequately challenge pseudo-scientific racist arguments. In addition, avoiding discussion of human biological diversity may limit our understanding of the genetic basis of disease and hamper medical research that could improve peoples’ lives.

Genes do not determine values or identity​

The problem here is egalitarians tying their political values to actual facts about human biology; the mistaken belief that moral equality is dependent on all people being biologically or psychologically the same. Yet as Pinker argued in The Blank Slate: The modern denial of human nature, when scientific evidence appears to conflict with political values, “people are tempted to suppress the facts and to clamp down on debate … leav[ing] us unequipped to deal with just those problems for which new facts and analyses are most needed”.screen shot at am

Geneticist David Reich has made much the same point about those who decry genetic research into human diversity as inherently racist. The “well-meaning people” who deny likely genetic differences between different human populations, Reich suggested, “are digging themselves into an indefensible position, one that will not survive the onslaught of science”.

And Flynn too emphasises where attempts at censorship miss their mark: “Suppressing free inquiry is by its nature an expressive of contempt for truth by power. The truth can never be racist.”

With regard to intelligence research, far from being ‘massively destructive’, such studies could, in future, prove hugely beneficial, especially in education. Without a clear understanding of human cognitive development, and how it is determined by both genes and environment, we are hamstrung in our attempts to improve an existing education system that persistently frustrates so many. Indeed, by ignoring the biological side of the interplay between genes and environment, we may be simply setting up many young people to fail, generation after generation. Those promoting practical uses of “personal genomics,” for instance, see the potential for tailoring education to reflect the needs and the abilities of individual learners, rather than forcing all learners into a one-size-fits-all system.

As for Flynn, he admitted to having “no illusions … that the debate over race and IQ will end.

And I do not deny that it could have social and political consequences. Perhaps someday we will conclude that a portion of the present gap will prove to be genetic in origin. I do not want to sugar the pill but will only say I am not too alarmed.
Yet even if the “worst case scenario” of ineluctable differences in cognitive ability proved to be the case (which is far from certain), this does not destroy the humane-egalitarian desire to create a better future society. After all, if everyone had a decent standard of living, much of the heat linking biology with racial inequality would fade — a point Flynn illustrated with joking reference to his own Irish ancestry:

Assume that the lower job profile of Irish Americans compared to Chinese Americans is due in part to genes: I do not know one Irishman who cares (the English would be a different matter).
For the first time in history science, promises a glimpse of how the world’s different populations — popularly and simplistically called races — have evolved. Going forward, the tsunami of information genetic research is now unlocking will revolutionize medicine, as we develop targeted, personalized response to diseases based on individual and group inheritance. Research on the brain is just part of that mostly-promising and optimistic enterprise.

In his reflections on Human Diversity, a book that came out shortly before Flynn’s death, Charles Murray pointedly suggested that many of those most opposed to research on the brain and IQ mistakenly equate human intelligence with human worth. That’s understandable. With these caveats in mind, it is perhaps fitting here to leave the last word to Murray, Flynn’s supposed great adversary: in losing Jim Flynn, he says, “We have lost an exemplar”.
 
Academics still arguing that humans are interchangeable and programmable to the point where any group of humans can do the same as any other group?
Evolution stopped at the spinal cord, don't you know, and also, only in humans. Dogs and bears and birds all have various intelligence dependent upon their breed or subspecies, but not humans, because reasons. Kenyans are naturally faster than whitey because of genetics, but no one is smarter than anyone else because of genetics, because that's illegal science.
The issue is intelligence is more seen as this "stat" where every thing can be defined in simple terms. High intelligence, low intelligence and so on is bull.
It's not "bull"; high IQ is strongly correlated with positive life outcomes, from lifetime income to criminal proclivity. The point is that certain tasks require a minimum intelligence to even be able to do, just as slam dunking on a regulation net requires a certain combination of physical prowess and height to be able to do. Anyone can do a layup; not just anyone can slam dunk.

High intelligence tends to be very useful in a wide variety of professional applications, and because truly intelligent people are rare, the competition to employ them is fierce.
 
Are you asking me personally? I'm not disagreeing with anybody that IQ is insignificant. It IS significant; however, the first topic that comes up with IQ is race, when it's more than just race, but other aspects that are important. You say severe malnutrition, heavy metal poisoning, and injury, but then say having a good teacher "does nothing in adulthood." Well, what about child- and teenhood? That's a whole decade and a half. You're barely an adult in your mid-20s. The brain doesn't even reach peak development until then.

There's also aspects like fitness (which heightens brain function) and diet. It's not just a matter of severe malnutrition, but also if the kid is getting the right carbs, less sugars, healthy fats, etc.. Not to mention social and emotional factors such as family and faith structures. You have so many little things that watering it down seems a disservice. Treat your kid right and immerse them in a good faith, family, social, and education structure and--barring genetic defects and intellectual disabilities--they'll be okay.

Pushing all that aside, my main concern is when people start treating a low IQ as a death sentence, or as something that devalues the person instead of looking at the whole person. It's definitely not a death sentence, and it's definitely not the person's fault if they have a low IQ. That burden belongs on the parents. It gives my Christian upbringing a kneejerk reaction because it's simply not grounds to treat low IQ people as lesser beings. That's why I said being different is okay. I don't mean it in the SJW way, I mean it in the "don't treat low IQ people as destructive mongrels on society and give them basic human decency" way.

Christian upbringing in the USA is as good an indicator of intellect as melanin.

Christian morality has been a rock around Science for ages. No wonder why the Fuhrer tried to do away with it.

It is a full on emotions over reason doctrine that devalues in group preference to benefit (((outsiders))) and it was based on and made by (((out group members))).

Asians who lack it are considered smarter.

*Tips fedora*

Obviously there are a lot of genetic and environmental and evolutionary forces involved.

-different genetics.
-different environment

Niggers (tm) seem the second least evolved group after abbos. If those are even human, though both may not be.

They are very well adapted to stone ahe conditions. Yellows and whites had to think on the winter, blacks had to run fast, grow up fast, get muh dick in fast.

A different approach for a different environment.

Of course, intelligence does not equal good morals. Look at George Soros and the (((chosen))) parasites.
Nor does it equal wisdom.

For negroes, thus a solid family sructure and strict religions may work better.

Do an easy on the brain hard on muscles job, have a firmly enforced code that isn't hard to understand, and a negro can prosper and be a productive member of society.

This of course relates to less generic ethnic groups. A slav will be less intelligent but more violent than a german, with a rounder head.
 
I will summon the non-arab squid-ink enthusiast and Wolfram Mathematica connoisseur, Nassim not-an-arab Nicholas Taliban. He disproved the imbeciles who are pushing IQ science. If you like fat tails, antifragility, n-word swans and having skin in the game follow his ramblings on medium.com.

 
Christian upbringing in the USA is as good an indicator of intellect as melanin.

Christian morality has been a rock around Science for ages. No wonder why the Fuhrer tried to do away with it.

It is a full on emotions over reason doctrine that devalues in group preference to benefit (((outsiders))) and it was based on and made by (((out group members))).

Asians who lack it are considered smarter.

*Tips fedora*

Obviously there are a lot of genetic and environmental and evolutionary forces involved.

-different genetics.
-different environment

Niggers (tm) seem the second least evolved group after abbos. If those are even human, though both may not be.

They are very well adapted to stone ahe conditions. Yellows and whites had to think on the winter, blacks had to run fast, grow up fast, get muh dick in fast.

A different approach for a different environment.

Of course, intelligence does not equal good morals. Look at George Soros and the (((chosen))) parasites.
Nor does it equal wisdom.

For negroes, thus a solid family sructure and strict religions may work better.

Do an easy on the brain hard on muscles job, have a firmly enforced code that isn't hard to understand, and a negro can prosper and be a productive member of society.

This of course relates to less generic ethnic groups. A slav will be less intelligent but more violent than a german, with a rounder head.
What the fuck is this schizo shit?

Christianity isn't perfect, but it doesn't justify the schizo shit of believing places that don't exist, being dishonest and changing that narrative when you need a relation with another country, even more when it didn't had a real investigation and was made on the spot to remove old relations.

Winters aren't the only things that are hard to survive, lack of food, extreme sun and more are things which are common in other countries and can kill you as easily, that theory just makes sense when you don't account the environment destruction of africa after his heydays (which was part of the climate cycle), other difficulties that related to africa like the more dangerous animals which had more knowledge around humans, thus were more dangerous for us and the minimal time of separation that happened. The difference isn't really big and running speed is just a variable which is simpler in general, unlike intelligence which has a lot of factors, even more when these aspects aren't a general part of a complete population.
Evolution stopped at the spinal cord, don't you know, and also, only in humans. Dogs and bears and birds all have various intelligence dependent upon their breed or subspecies, but not humans, because reasons. Kenyans are naturally faster than whitey because of genetics, but no one is smarter than anyone else because of genetics, because that's illegal science.

It's not "bull"; high IQ is strongly correlated with positive life outcomes, from lifetime income to criminal proclivity. The point is that certain tasks require a minimum intelligence to even be able to do, just as slam dunking on a regulation net requires a certain combination of physical prowess and height to be able to do. Anyone can do a layup; not just anyone can slam dunk.

High intelligence tends to be very useful in a wide variety of professional applications, and because truly intelligent people are rare, the competition to employ them is fierce.
The problem of this is that the test doesn't show this with the low correlations and really variable aspects of it, unless a person is really shitty at making the test, it doesn't mean much thanks to his flawed nature, it's like using a broken ruler and using it to force extreme exaggerations on many aspects.

The differences in birds and other animals are more extreme because they were separated for longer, had more variations and could drop those aspects, most humans didn't had the time to do those variations and they didn't had a real reason to do it, so it's a dumb aspect on the first place to try to search these excessive differences.

Something that isn't always true too, intelligence in animals is just seeing if they appease to humans, something which shows unfamiliarity against humans and if they recognize you as a threat or a friend, but it doesn't reflect on a intellectual variation.
I will summon the non-arab squid-ink enthusiast and Wolfram Mathematica connoisseur, Nassim not-an-arab Nicholas Taliban. He disproved the imbeciles who are pushing IQ science. If you like fat tails, antifragility, n-word swans and having skin in the game follow his ramblings on medium.com.

I already explained why Taleb is shit on the other post.
 
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Fellas please, all this discussion about science and methods and research, I just want an official study to come out saying "Niggers are retarded" is that so much to ask?
Starting with the widespread use of standardized mental tests in World War I, average ethnic and racial group differences were found. Especially vexing has been the cause(s) of the 15-point Black–White IQ difference in the United States.
Rushton, J. & Jensen, Arthur. (2005). Thirty Years of Research on Black-White Differences in Cognitive Ability. Psychology, Public Policy, and Law. 11. 235-294. 10.1037/1076-8971.11.2.235.

 
I can’t remember where I read it but apparently IQ amongst blacks dropped in the past 50 years.
 
Honestly, I loved learning this little tidbit. Prior to it, the only ideas I was exposed to were "women are just as smart as men, but held back by the patriarchy" and "women are dumb." Neither really sat right me; I'm a woman so the latter is obviously depressing, but the first one did not seem to be true, as it was pretty clear there weren't as many female intellectuals and I had my doubts that "patriarchy" was the only explanation.
Instead, I discovered this alternative explanation, which made a lot of sense and was sort of freeing in a way. It doesn't preclude the idea of female geniuses, it just means there's fewer of them. Which is perfectly fine. So what? Just don't prevent those people from doing whatever they want. But pushing every woman into scientific fields is going to fail, and if the IQ distribution explanation is never acknowledged, people will naturally consider less savory explanations for the failure.

it's even more irritating than this.

there was actual real discrimination against women in higher education for a long time; if the universities exclude women, and the professions exclude women, you're not going to have any female university graduates or professionals. But since university education and the professions opened to women slowly and unevenly and the progress was different in different countries, you can actually *very easily track* where female accomplishment was stymied due to discrimination and where there just isn't going to be very much female accomplishment because of fundamental differences in ability.

There's soft bias against women, there's an unequal distribution of domestic work, and only women can have babies, sure. That's not why there are fewer women astrophysicists. If it were why, there would also be fewer women on the Supreme Court.
 
The problem of this is that the test doesn't show this with the low correlations and really variable aspects of it, unless a person is really shitty at making the test, it doesn't mean much thanks to his flawed nature, it's like using a broken ruler and using it to force extreme exaggerations on many aspects.
Do you actually think the net result of 300 years of study into the topic is a bunch of "broken rulers"?

What's more likely; that the foremost experts on Earth can't figure out how to make a test that correlates well to real-world achievements and economically useful skills, or that claiming they "can't" is a fucking cope by post-modernist academics after blacks kept coming back with <85 scores and the assorted ways they kept trying to explain it away weren't convincing enough?

IQ research isn't the third rail of psychology because it's uncertain; it's because the undeniable conclusions of said research are politically inconvenient in a society that's trying to convince people that race is only skin deep.
 
it's even more irritating than this.

there was actual real discrimination against women in higher education for a long time; if the universities exclude women, and the professions exclude women, you're not going to have any female university graduates or professionals. But since university education and the professions opened to women slowly and unevenly and the progress was different in different countries, you can actually *very easily track* where female accomplishment was stymied due to discrimination and where there just isn't going to be very much female accomplishment because of fundamental differences in ability.

There's soft bias against women, there's an unequal distribution of domestic work, and only women can have babies, sure. That's not why there are fewer women astrophysicists. If it were why, there would also be fewer
wouldn't that make the cultural factors more important?
there are less woman on supreme court, with that flawed logic (and the aspects you are talking about) you could explain why there's less woman in these kind of jobs, that's a reflection of those aspects and more with those values.

I'm not saying that's the real reason, but that you are just seeing specific cultural factors by ironically increasing them and seeing them as more important, thus blaming third ones.

What really happens is that female culture (which is artificial, it can be seen anywhere except in developed countries, taking care of kids and more it's a natural instinct between men and women, so it isn't a point) doesn't develop learning, it increases leisure and reflects on an inherent value by disregarding our monogamy (thus our mutuality around works), it's a behavior based around just following the line rather than helping have more united experiences in childhood with other people which could generate interests and capacity (hobby groups, learning places and more united experiences with more naturally concurring groups which boys have, something which makes them superior by the basis of there being discussion and real respect between peers), thus reducing interest and the closing of a lot of interest and aspects, even more when they had separations which are made by other factors and with a culture which reflects this difference to extreme levels of uncompatibility, living in a fight instead of a united experience where people stick together.

This mixed with the IQ shit i was talking about reflects this perfectly, if IQ is education, IQ reflects the timeline of woman, they study until university and stop on that level to do other things (which could refer to extreme insecurities or closed interests which reflect on more isolated aspects of society, even more when this didn't happened in the past, even if they were a lot of more destructive restrictions), while men are used based around physical strength, thus never getting an education or given more education because of the real benefits and respect in male groups (which are organic instead of artificial, thus more significant).

This can be seen on competition, competition between men it's done as a way to improve themselves, it's something which is done to help each other and reflect to other people, in comparison women don't have this education, thus using this energy wrong (which reflects around estrogen and testosterone causing aggression and emotional aspects in general, their androgenic emotional reactions are really equal, but in women it's pent up rather than used), fighting each other rather than helping each other or with other people in general, something that can be seen on the less critical and closed circles made by these insecurities which permeate by this lack of experiences of life (which could be seen on that book about a women trying to be a men, it isn't that they broke down by being different, but that they haven't learned the self respect needed to not use external validation and the different education in youth, even more when in the end of that book she understood those aspects and grew thanks to it, reflecting on those learnings and getting that respect and male socialization).
 
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Do you actually think the net result of 300 years of study into the topic is a bunch of "broken rulers"?

What's more likely; that the foremost experts on Earth can't figure out how to make a test that correlates well to real-world achievements and economically useful skills, or that claiming they "can't" is a fucking cope by post-modernist academics after blacks kept coming back with <85 scores and the assorted ways they kept trying to explain it away weren't convincing enough?

IQ research isn't the third rail of psychology because it's uncertain; it's because the undeniable conclusions of said research are politically inconvenient in a society that's trying to convince people that race is only skin deep.
Yes, even more when most studies are shit and stretched a shitty test. This isn't post modernism because it shows genetics, i have shown that the test has low correlations with real biological aspects and basis.

IQ is post modernism, it reflects specific personal aspects to reflect onto people rather than a real biological difference, that humans aren't that different isn't my problem, even more when it doesn't reflect anything.

Even more when the point of finding a capable person it's retarded because you can just test them on the job you want them to do, it's useless in his maximum definition, if someone can't do a job, you can see it, you don't need a test to sell, which in your logic would stop existing, which isn't the case at all.

Blacks don't even come with 85 except in the U, there's studies which show that they come with 95 (this is with malnutrition and other problems, they just picked people who atleast finished high school and didn't picked retarded children on africa) and more in any other place (even africa) except canada and other first world countries who just let them do more stupid shit and don't educate them by believing that they will suffer if they don't pass a shitty test.

And as the final phrase, yes, it's the third rail because it has the same baseless route of psychology and tries to mix shit where there isn't a case.

Obviously we are different, but those differences are made as a basis for an ambient, if all human ambients require intelligence, reducing it is retarded on all parts of the planet, it's a trait which will mantain the same. Saying otherwise would be like saying that cocodriles without teeth or tigers without lungs could exist
 
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IQ is post modernism, it reflects specific personal aspects to reflect onto people rather than a real biological difference, that humans aren't that different isn't my problem.
You're right; we are all capable of being Albert Einstein. There is no such thing as being objectively smart or dumb, and to say there is an objective standard is post-modernism.

Go back to Reddit, you fucking retard.
 
You're right; we are all capable of being Albert Einstein. There is no such thing as being objectively smart or dumb, and to say there is an objective standard is post-modernism.

Go back to Reddit, you fucking retard.
No nigger. Not everyone can be einstein, but most people could get better, even more when you are talking about reddit science which doesn't account these genetics and the real basis of them.

Einstein was extremely well educated and got a lot of support from his family, even if he was extremely smart on a lot of parts and had a lot of advantages, it had education for this purpose, denying otherwise is still reddit, even more when they suck the dick of these shitty tests 24/7 except in lefty subs where they say "they are true, but i like dumb people" instead of seeing the real deal.
 
wouldn't that make the cultural factors more important?
there are less woman on supreme court, with that flawed logic (and the aspects you are talking about) you could explain why there's less woman in these kind of jobs, that's a reflection of those aspects and more with those values.

I'm not saying that's the real reason, but that you are just seeing specific cultural factors by ironically increasing them and seeing them as more important, thus blaming third ones.

What really happens is that female culture (which is artificial, it can be seen anywhere except in developed countries, taking care of kids and more it's a natural instinct between men and women, so it isn't a point) doesn't develop learning, it increases leisure and reflects on an inherent value by disregarding our monogamy (thus our mutuality around works), it's a behavior based around just following the line rather than helping have more united experiences in childhood with other people which could generate interests and capacity (hobby groups, learning places and more united experiences with more naturally concurring groups which boys have, something which makes them superior by the basis of there being discussion and real respect between peers), thus reducing interest and the closing of a lot of interest and aspects, even more when they had separations which are made by other factors and with a culture which reflects this difference to extreme levels of uncompatibility, living in a fight instead of a united experience where people stick together.

This mixed with the IQ shit i was talking about reflects this perfectly, if IQ is education, IQ reflects the timeline of woman, they study until university and stop on that level to do other things (which could refer to extreme insecurities or closed interests which reflect on more isolated aspects of society, even more when this didn't happened in the past, even if they were a lot of more destructive restrictions), while men are used based around physical strength, thus never getting an education or given more education because of the real benefits and respect in male groups (which are organic instead of artificial, thus more significant).

This can be seen on competition, competition between men it's done as a way to improve themselves, it's something which is done to help each other and reflect to other people, in comparison women don't have this education, thus using this energy wrong (which reflects around estrogen and testosterone causing aggression and emotional aspects in general, their androgenic emotional reactions are really equal), fighting each other rather than helping each other or with other people in general, something that can be seen on the less critical and closed circles made by these insecurities which permeate by this lack of experiences of life (which could be seen on that book about a women trying to be a men, it isn't that they broke down by being different, but that they haven't learned the self respect needed to not use external validation and the different education in youth, even more when in the end of that book she understood those aspects and grew thanks to it, reflecting on those learnings and getting that respect and male socialization).
whoa that's long

I'm not reading it to see if you understand what I wrote I'll just repeat what I said in a very simple way

In the past, all institutional higher education and all the professions were closed to women. Today, certain professions are nearly 50% female and display high levels of female accomplishment. Other professions remain mostly male. I do not think that male domination of certain fields can be explained purely by bias, because if it could, then you wouldn't have tons of massively successful female lawyers and judges.
 
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whoa that's long

I'm not reading it to see if you understand what I wrote I'll just repeat what I said in a very simple way

In the past, all institutional higher education and all the professions were closed to women. Today, certain professions are nearly 50% female and display high levels of female accomplishment. Other professions remain mostly male. I do not think that male domination of certain fields can be explained purely by bias, because if it could, then you wouldn't have tons of massively successful female lawyers and judges.
What i'm talking about is that there's cultural parts which are repeated between females which make them not choose those careers thanks to not having complete developments around his interests and personal experiences, male bias isn't the problem, but that they don't get that education and development of interests because of the separation act which through personal stereotypes and social fears (normally by a lack of touch between people on less toxic social situations based around hard work, for example men relationships) cause them to not follow them on the first place, even more when the careers they choose are based around giving money, not an interest.

I understand that it can be long, but that's what i wanted to say, your point is correct, but just reflects a social aspect which has no basis on biology.
 
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