Canada is a failed state

[Ser Prize]

Just so you guys understand, Canadian healthcare isn't just terrible. It's terminal. It's doomed.

Here's a little study that we discussed when I had an health economics class:

https://www.cia-ica.ca/docs/default-source/2013/213075e.pdf?sfvrsn=2

The conclusion is dire and EVEN if the various provinces' healthcare systems implement the report's suggestion, healthcare expenditure will still increase by a predicted 50%. Healthcare is alreade most provinces' biggest expenditure. Where will the extra 50% come from?

Nowhere. It'll come from nowhere. The system is doomed and always was. It was built on a hospital-centric basis. Thst made sense in the 60s and 70s when contagious diseases killed more people. But over time people started dying more and more from degenerative type diseases- cancer, heart attacks, etc. That's best tackled by a primary-care focused system.

Why was it not transitionned long ago to that? Well, when it was still feisable, there wasn't the price pressure needed to signal a need to reallocate resoyrces because it's socialized. Now? It'd take at least a decade to properly transition everything and during that time care would suffer. It's political suicide.

It's terminal and you all better take the appropriate steps to prepare for a for-profit system to emerge within 20 years at the latest or expect ever decreasing quality and speed of care as funding becomes increasingly anemic.

I figured it was fucked. Hopefully this teaches people that this single payer shit doesn't work long term.

 

[Sweetpeaa]

In terms of Doug Ford's negligent style of running the province of Ontario even despite a ''super majority'' he shouldn't get too comfortable. He's barely anywhere to be found most of the time. They're going to replace him with an ''Ernie eaves type'' if this shit keeps up. Mike Harris also had a ''super majority'' and look what happened to him.

With all the issues I have with the Tory's I think the one thing they're adept at doing both here and across the pond is turning on their own party leader and booting them out after repeated fuck ups no matter how much power in terms of a majority they have. The most infamous example




Edit: If only Federal liberal's in Canada used the Tory method to vote out Trudeau. He should have been gone after the SNC-Lavalin affair scandal alone.

 

[OutInTheRain]

I always thought the Raybold-Wilson thing was a failed attempt at a cabinet revolt. It's odd, if Jean Chretien passed gas in an elevator, then Martin and half the cabinet was ready to give him the boot. You would think after ALL the scandals and mismanagement someone would be working to give him the boot.

 

[Butterschmalz]

I always thought the Raybold-Wilson thing was a failed attempt at a cabinet revolt. It's odd, if Jean Chretien passed gas in an elevator, then Martin and half the cabinet was ready to give him the boot. You would think after ALL the scandals and mismanagement someone would be working to give him the boot.

bro you cant even mention the word immigration on r/canadahousing when it comes to discussing the housing crisis. we re too far gone. grow a beard and convert to islam.

 

[OutInTheRain]

That's because you're on Reddit. All Reddit is retarded, and Canadian subs are just proof that leafs by and large...and since it's Reddit extra large, are the worst posters on the internet.

 

[Just_Somebody]

So I got an EKOS government funded poll. It's nice that they dropped the whole "Long COVID is super duper real you guys. Super serial" bullshit at the end.

I'm doing my part to ensure that poll numbers push away from reimplementing lockdowns.

 

[doesnotglow]

I don't live in Canada anymore but the issues there are very interesting to follow as Canada exists on the bleeding edge of neoliberal societal and economic decline.

Here is my thesis for the brief pitiful extinction of Canada in the coming years.

1. The healthcare system reaches critical levels of collapse in the coming months. Mass exodus of doctors, nurses, and other healthcare professionals. They will either be people retiring, people switching to private practices (where legal), or they will move south to seek accurate pricing for their labor.

2. Temporary tax increases will be negotiated to provide relief funding for the healthcare system. Capital gains tax increases. Income tax increases. Climate change taxes. Luxury housing taxes. Wealth taxes. Corporate tax increases. Labor will be targeted the most, as it always is. Canadians view the healthcare issues to be exclusively an issue of funding, not an issue of demographic, social, and economic decline. Liberal governments will be unwilling to cut as it violates their core ideals, and conservative premiers increasingly dependent on elderly sick people will avoiding cutting for votes. They cannot borrow to fund it in this risky credit environment. In some provinces they may cut funding to some areas such as education to prop up healthcare, but this will only accelerate decline.

3. Tax increases backfire. Doctors make high wages, and the decision to tax their lifestyle more provides the final push to leave the country. Environmental taxes cause the final extinction of resources extraction and manufacturing, the backbone of Canada's Congo tier resource economy. These taxes will make Canada completely uncompetitive, reducing investment and destroying the economy further. Taxes collected will decrease leading to the inability to service the national debt in a raised interest rate environment, leading eventually to a credit rating downgrade, which will tank the loonie hard. The GDP per capita will fall drastically and Canada will be unable to bridge the gap by printing money and borrowing. Canada is run by the most degenerate neoliberals on planet Earth who prioritize foreign industries to domestic at every turn, in no possible scenario will Canada become an innovator instead of a service sector consumer usury economy. Canada's cultural revolutions prioritizing natives at every turn makes land projects uninvestable, and Canada's increasingly South-Africanesque apartheid employment laws will push qualified people out of the country. No project requiring any substantial amount of land in Canada will ever be built again as it will run afoul of environmental and native restrictions. Canada cannot industrialize further. Economic growth is finished.

4. None of the social systems have improved, and have become increasingly worse leading to more extreme measures and doubling down in the way only Canadians are capable of doing. A devalued loonie massively increases the costs of the sacred healthcare system which imports all equipment and supplies as Canada makes nothing except generic drugs. They will try to destroy the loonie to absolve debt, and possibly introduce a new currency or use a foreign globocoin currency.

5. A decision is made to destroy the medical cartels and decrease licensing standards across industries, which will cut the standards for doctor licensing, opening up the ability to replace doctors with low priced third world labor, as has been done already with nursing. The existing good doctors flee south of the border seeking better wages and an environment of competency. The healthcare system gets worse and worse due to the inadequate standards of new doctors.

6. Old money starts to flee. People make the realization that the decline of Canada is substantial enough that it is not worth living there, and that even with the overpriced assets they have accumulated, their health is at critical risk as any problem requiring immediate care will be inadequate. They also do the math that taxes are high enough that even if they migrate to countries with private healthcare, they will come out ahead due to paying less taxes.

7. Quality immigrants start to flee the country, either going back to the countries they came from, or they move south. This will leave only the most burdensome third world wageslaves working at tim hortons and hospitals, workers who are not net tax contributors.

8. Total collapse of the welfare state. Canada does not collect enough tax to fund the social programs it used to and it cannot borrow to fund them. Third world slaves start to flee.

9. Border tightening attempting to stop the bleed. Ineligibility to obtain passports, "environmental lockdowns", more virus lockdowns. The establishment of a "maple curtain".

10. Some form of failed state authoritarian socialism mixed with Caribbean money laundering where capital can abuse Canadians as slaves and move freely and Canadians are completely locked into the country with no escape. New currency. Total corporate management. Complete restructuring of a command economy. Argentina level disaster run by the WEF. Nothing of Canada is left. It's a completely hollowed out nexus of global sin.

At every stage of this process more and more people will leave Canada, and more third world labor will be brought in. The monetary instability could topple this at any time. At any point the country could collapse due to regional strain between the regions. Most importantly if at any point Canada's third world money laundering housing market is threatened by foreign investors removing capital the country will collapse instantly. There is no process that can save Canada at this point. The country is just fucked. Healthcare will play the most important piece of this decline. Canadians have a religious relationship with their failing healthcare and the socialism required to prop it up will only perpetuate the total collapse of the country.

 

[Bored Gamer]

To be fair, every country is going to turn into a failed state someday.

 

[Sweetpeaa]

Here we go how it began



Where we are



The mess and the debt



You hear that? we're in a worse position than the U.S even though many seem to deny it's in the same boat. As parts of this article mention a recession is pretty much guaranteed in Canada. Cheap credit is the glue holding the house of cards together in Canada.

And finally, the ''new worker'' in Canada. That's why 'diversity' has been pushed for years.

 

[Jetpack Himmler]

Pardon the following wall o' text, but this was something that was eating away at me for a long time and the Farms seemed like a the best place to vent it out because there are too few places where I can have an honest discussion. So without further ado...

One observation I have made of Canada is thatour national "identity" is centered around anti-American chauvinism. However, but you see how many Canadians are mindlessdrones that bleatthe same drivel ad infinitum to a particular stimulus upon closer inspections. "#CdnMediaFailed" recentlytrended on Twitter againbecause Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's recenttrip to Costa Rica made the news and the TruAnons (his most ardent supporters)went ballistic and tried to divert attention to Ontario Premier Doug Ford. Canadians show deference to authority by nature and both the mainstream/legacy media and the intellectual establishment are in lockstep with the leftist orthodoxy that dominates the mainstream Canadianculture. Genuine critical thought is disdained because Canadian pride hinges on our unearned sense of superiority over the Americans. In the case of our “illustrious” prime minister’s $250K+ trip to a tropical paradise, it never enters the left’s mindsthat he incessantly lectures Canadians on our carbon dioxide emissions, but his actions never match his words.

I should not begrudge the man for taking a vacation as it is his right or touring the country as it comes with the job. However, recent news articles revealed that he has spent all but eleven days of July 2022 flitting around the country and now jets off halfway across the hemisphere. Curious how Parliament declared a “climate emergency” yet he acts as if there isn’t one by emitting hundreds, if not thousands of times the amount of CO2an average Canadian does in a year. One would expect even the most ardent environmentalist in the Liberal-dominated establishment to question his commitment to the cause, but the left either responds with silence or deflection. Similarly, the left never holds federal NDP leader, Jagmeet Singh, to account as he criticizes Trudeau for not doing enough for working class Canadian during question period yet votes with the Liberals every. . . single. . . time out of cowardice.

Another observation of mine is how Laurentian Elites of Ottawa have extremely conformist mindset on the country and an outdated“one size fits all” approach to solving its problems. This usually results in increasing the size of a bloated and unwieldy bureaucracy, throwing money at it in hopes that it will disappear of its own accord, or ignore it altogether. Take note of the extreme delays at our airports and passport offices, our behemoth of a federal government has been slow to act. They have done virtually nothing aside from creating another committee to discuss the problem rather than take action. My theory why Canadians, particularly on the increasingly extremist left, tolerate this is that they cannot accept that thegovernment they electedisnot nearly as capable as it pretends to be. Doing so would cause them to spiral into astate of existential despair.

Trudeau infantilizes his base with soft-spokenplatitudes that are ultimatelymeaningless, but designed to placate the wounded egos of the left-wing.Canadian deferral to authority leads many to believe that so-called experts in the government and civil service can solve any problem through fiat and sheer willpower.I imagine that is why he is going whole hog on his climate agenda by placing a hard cap on O&G emissions and fertilizer. It will make the base self-satisfied, but at the cost of creating more hardship for working and middle-class Canadians. Inflation is already a major issue and proceeding on this will not only lead to more food insecurity, but possibly more hunger abroad as Canada is a net food exporter.

The million question is, “all for what?” Canada only produces less than 2% of all global emissions. Energy-hungry nations such as China, India, Indonesia, etc. are all making up the difference by buildings hundreds of coal-fired plants, so all of the Liberals’ climate policies are for naught. Imagine the hubris of believing that a comparatively insignificant country like ours can solve a global problem.

That collective existential dread shared by the Canadian left drives them to believe that our nation is a major presence on the world stage, but is in truth nothing more thana bit player. For example, the Canadian government’s initial refusal to return a gas turbine to Gazprom when our country had no leverage on Russia.This upset the European Union, namely Germany as their “green” policies left them highly dependent on Russian natural gas for heating thus a stoppage would lead to popular uprising and a stoppage of all aid to Ukraine. This would have not been a problem had Canada the increased capacity to export liquified natural gas to offset Europe’s dependence on Russia for its energy needs, but theLiberal government is too committed to its own green utopian fantasies to realize it. Trudeau’s increasingly feckless behavior on the world stage has seen Canada increasingly isolated from international alliances because our allies view as toounreliable.I doubt that our self-styled “betters” realized how alone Canada is at the moment.

Yet I cannot bring myself to anger, if anything, I cannot help but laugh at the absurdity of these state of affairs. I could probably speak endlessly on our current government’s countless scandals and follies, but that would take months to list and analyze them all in detail.The simple truth is that Canadians’ deference to authority (or the so-called “experts”) have rendered then gullible simpletons driven by histrionics, as evidenced by the persistence of the Trudeau government. Many of my countrymen are desperate to believe this fantasy that Canada is still a respected middle power that wields great influence across the world. The ugly truth is that Canada is a nation in interminable decline; the TruAnons may pull out all the lists and charts that suit their confirmation biases, but our institutions are slowly crumbling and our social cohesion is coming undone.

Canadians will never address the flaws within our system because doing so would require admitting that we are no better than our southern neighbor.Our political and cultural establishment are fools driven by ideology (as opposed to science) and their own greed. Indeed, Ottawa’s(and every provincial capital, by extension) relationship to the nation is a parasitic one. The establishment thrives offthe hard work of honest working and middle class citizenswhile contributing nothing but empty platitudes and slogans in return. Canada is not so much a constitutional monarchy as it is a kakistocracy dominated by the inept who cling to power appeal to a substantial minority’s vanity and nostalgia. There will be hard times coming and hard decisions to be made in the coming years, but I am not so certain that Canadians will be able to make them because of their inherent weakness. Too many want to live a life of comfortable ignorance because the brutal reality that every belief they hold dear is a fabricationis too horrifying for them to even contemplate.

There is some hope as I see that some are slowly awakening to the coming storm, but I also fear that it may be too little too late.

 

[DiscoRodeo]

This unironically speaks volumes about the state of the labour market.

The other is that, in part, "new jobs" is occurring due, in part, to boomers retiring. At the start of the pandemic, a lot of boomers who could retire, did. You have cases where airlines forced people out of employment or offered incentives for early retirement (to try and cut costs to reflect demand at the time, causing another crisis when demand rose again later), you have cases where boomers who were planning on saving up more or working longer retired because "fuck it, Ill be out of work for a year or so during this pandemic anyways", and you have cases where boomers retired from white collar jobs, only to become consultants, take lower paying jobs with more flexibility, etc.

I know in the project management/BA side of things, there are tons of jobs to be filled from older project managers retiring, because there just aren't people experienced enough to replace them.

Now, here's the problem with the majority of these new jobs. They tend to be filled by migrant workers (ergo, are usually shit ones, in call centers, where you are not technically employed, but instead on contract, seasonally, where you get burnt out and theyre designed to burn you out, where you have to have 24/hour open availability, the "McJob", etc).

They may be higher level jobs that boomers once filled (project management, QA analyst management, different bureaucratic positions, etc), and these jobs have another type of immigrant that usually fills them;

or they tend to be jobs in the gig labour economy.

This means that a plethora of people, are still shit out of luck. New jobs are either new McJobs, gig jobs, or higher level corporate jobs- there's little to nothing inbetween that offers a decent wage. All, or nothing is the current mantra of the system.

Now, more places are willing to train in a desperate attempt to fill in that white collar labour shortage, but theyre also equally, if not more so, willing to simply import the labour rather than train. Some people may get ahead and wind up in an analyst position in some cushy firm, but its still stark because, even with "jobs" there is still a major skills gap, and the majority of Canadians just aren't ready for an information economy, and because millennials have been locked out of the market for so long due to boomers holding on to their positions for dear life, that skills gap in replacing the retirees is just so stark that it actually causes major problems and we're seeing that now.

Take note of the extreme delays at our airports and passport offices, our behemoth of a federal government has been slow to act.

Here's where I blame the federal government entirely, not for causing the problem of boomers retiring during the pandemic (though shutting us down certainly didnt help), but failing to anticipate the problems and actually do anything. They effectively just shoved a ton of money into airlines hands to "keep them afloat and fix the problem" and neither actually worked. Would have been better if there were some stipulations of "use some of this money to retrain Canadians".

Let alone, in other sectors of the economy, that would have been very helpful. Instead, we will simply import this labour, as opposed to training it domestically, when we can't find someone to manage the bureaucracy.

On Canadians never addressing their flaws? Absolutely. I was black pilled years ago, and its why I left the country.

In part, I unironically think that Canada is going to realize that it has a brain drain problem over the next few years - decades. Doctors moving south due to burnout, techies moving abroad due to better opportunities, higher wages, less "cucked" populace, etc. The fed has largely destroyed or let the communities I grew up in get destroyed. Theyve actively suppressed any real sense of nationalism we have, and instead want to rely on breeding a sense of division with the US to prevent people from moving there. Honestly though, if push comes to shove (as with the Fed's response to the Truckers, who kept the economy running), other than my own local communities, friends, and family- why should I give much of a fuck about propping up the Canadian state? Theyre in it for themselves, and sadly, I do think that a lot of people are coming to the realization that not only will the state not necessarily have your back, they will sell you out, with a smile, while accusing you of bigotry for not allowing your 12 year old son to cut off his dick.

And I get it, stick around to help your local community, not everyone can move out, etc, but its like: Some of the things that prevent brain drain are, a) decent quality of life, b) higher wages than the competitor, c) a sense of patriotism or loyalty to your community;

but on those three things, we're really lacking right now, and I don't think that the state seems to realize that importing labour to solve all of Canada's problems, calling random people bigots for whatever flavour of the week thing is going on, or that due to the way our economy is being (mis)managed, the dollar is doing worse and worse, that they will have problems with people who can afford to just leaving in the future.

House pricing alone in the states or Europe is basic reason enough.

 

[Jetpack Himmler]

@DiscoRodeo

All of what you said reminds me of what I saw on a channel called "Economics Explained" that went into detail on why Canada's economy is stagnating, and addressed the brain drain. One the points he made was that tens of thousands of Canadians moved to the United States every year while maybe seven thousand Americans move to Canada. Another point he made was that Canadians are by and large less productive than Americans and another aspect of Canada that cripples our economy is lack of capital. Businesses in Canada don't have as much money to invest in themselves as American businesses do because--in part--of the tax burden. It is amazing to behold how paternalistic the federal government is towards its citizens given their (and the civil service's) incompetence. This deference to authority is the reason why the left in Canada have the crackpot belief that the Canadian people cannot be successful without the federal government to prop them up.

For example, the supposed purpose of Bill C-11 An Act to amend the Broadcasting Act and to make related and consequential amendments to other Acts is to force platforms like YouTube to alter their algorithms to make Canadian creators more visible to a Canadian audience. However, many Canadian YouTubers--notably J.J. McCullough--argue that they are already successful because they already reach an international audience. While some on social media scream, "censorship!" I suspect the true intentions behind the act are more insidious. Non-Leaf members of this board may not know this, but Canadians pay more than countries for substandard phone and data plans because of a government-backed oligarchy of Bell, Telus, and Rogers under the pretense of protecting Canada's interests. I imagine the federal government will allow the unholy trinity to keep hosing Canadians while they gleefully allow the feds use the CRTC to control what content they can view.

A TruAnon can use Schitt's Creek as a justification for Bill C-11, but here are two facts: 1) the stars Catherine O'Hara and Eugene Levy also work in the United States, and 2) it wouldn't have become as big a hit internationally without Netflix (an American company). Also, don't get me wrong, I believe that cultivating homegrown productions is a good thing, but there needs to be a focus on international markets. The CBC has too narrow a mandate, and frankly, they are shitty at their jobs.

Canadians seriously need to wake up to the fact out government and institutions are not benevolent. If anything, Justin and his caucus have proven to be spiteful and downright psychopathic in their treatment of us Leafs.

 

[OutInTheRain]

The brain drain is what has allowed this state of affairs to go on for so long. The US acts as a social pressure release valve for the Leafs and honestly most of the world. If aspirational Leafs were forced to stay in our terrible country, then there would be more organized opposition to the government. As it stands now, it's "fuck it, time to bail."

Canada has always been a hotbed of corruption that waxes and wanes with various governments, and in all honesty, it's the only way to do business now. You start something up and suddenly every level of government shows up with it's handout. If you're still successful, they'll change the rules on you. On the east coast in one of the cities there was a pre-hipster style coffee place, think 2006 era. It became quite popular, and started pulling business away from the Tim's in the area. They would also do live music on Saturday nights. So the owner of the Tim's franchises lobbied the town council to put a license fee for live music in small venues. Non-compliance was a $500 fine. Town council didn't tell anyone, and then waited something like 8 months, and then hit them with a cumulative fine for each violation.

That's how business is done is Canada.

 

[Raoul_Duke]

So from what I'm gathering, Canada is something along the lines of a resource extraction mafia state?

 

[doesnotglow]

Here's some basic brain drain math for the field of medicine. Let's compare a specialist making $500k in Canada and the US. Let's say Toronto vs. Dallas. Two mid tier global cities, and yes Toronto is a mid tier city.

In Ontario you pay a tax rate of 45.62%, meaning you take home $271,883, but that's CAD, so in USD you make $210,256 post tax.

In Dallas you pay a tax rate of 32.79%, meaning you take home $336,045 USD.

In the US you take home an extra $125,789 USD per year.

And what's interesting is that US jobs often pay strictly higher dollar amounts in USD, so they make more in numeric terms and substantially more after conversion.

Here's where shit is fucked.

The benchmark detached home price in Toronto is $1,362,598 CAD, in Dallas you are looking at $450,000 USD.

On mortgage calculators you are looking at $2,563 USD per month in Dallas at 4.24% rate 20% down 30y. In Toronto you pay $5,877 CAD = $4,544.89 USD per month.

So in Toronto you get $17,521 - 4,544.89 = $12,976 USD per month post tax and mortgage.

In Dallas you get $28,003 - $2,563 = $25,440 USD per month post tax and mortgage.

So in Dallas you make roughly double, an additional $12,464 per month, for an average ass house.

But then you consider working conditions and QoL. In Canada you will work to the bone in a failing socialist system where your wages will not stay competitive, your work will be harder, and you live in a frozen shithole most of the year. In Dallas you will not deal with the shitty hospitals and failing funding. Most importantly in the US your family will have top tier insurance in addition to your extra income and you will not die in a hospital hallway after waiting three days for surgery. But yes you will die of heat for a few months per year in Dallas.

Think of what you can do with all that extra money. Invest it. Buy another house. Go on a vacation to escape heat. etc... With basic compounding interest those investments will dwarf what you can invest in Canada. You can pay cash for your kids at the Ivy League.

Many Canadians don't do these basic calculations, probably because they can't do grade school math. But it is very important that they do, because doctors are smart people who will do these calculations and act. With such high tax rates and a weak currency you have to substantially increase payment in numeric terms above what US doctors make for it to be worth it, which will never happen. ever. The further the loonie falls, the higher the taxes get, and the more house prices diverge in the US and Canada will make this situation degrade further.

 

[DiscoRodeo]

For example, the supposed purpose of Bill C-11 An Act to amend the Broadcasting Act and to make related and consequential amendments to other Acts is to force platforms like YouTube to alter their algorithms to make Canadian creators more visible to a Canadian audience. However, many Canadian YouTubers--notably J.J. McCullough--argue that they are already successful because they already reach an international audience. While some on social media scream, "censorship!" I suspect the true intentions behind the act are more insidious. Non-Leaf members of this board may not know this, but Canadians pay more than countries for substandard phone and data plans because of a government-backed oligarchy of Bell, Telus, and Rogers under the pretense of protecting Canada's interests. I imagine the federal government will allow the unholy trinity to keep hosing Canadians while they gleefully allow the feds use the CRTC to control what content they can view.

Peterson talked about this at one point, and his argument essentially was that "it may have had a place in the past, but not so much any more". Basically, in the past, Canada didn't really have the infastructure to compete with Hollywood, people couldn't just film themselves, people couldnt become their own streamers, Canadian cable companies just didnt have enough money for pilot episodes, etc

and so had to be protected.

Now? Who gives much of a fuck, anyone can film a youtube film, movies are, while not easy to produce, the cost of indie production has largely fallen through, etc.

Where things do get sinister is that the original justification applies to youtube, tiktok, and the web in no way whatsoever. Canadians on youtube are in the same exact boat as Americans, and its pure merit, rather than circumstance. Id fear government propaganda more, at that point, and there's plenty of it.

The brain drain is what has allowed this state of affairs to go on for so long. The US acts as a social pressure release valve for the Leafs and honestly most of the world. If aspirational Leafs were forced to stay in our terrible country, then there would be more organized opposition to the government. As it stands now, it's "fuck it, time to bail."

Canadians have always lived and worked in the US. I don't think that it would be fair to say that we've had a brain drain for a long time though. Dynamic wise, it used to be that wages wern't that different between Canada and the US, that the culture in Canada may be better overall, that the healthcare offset some of the other issues, or that your sense of national pride or familial landscape was enough of a factor that you didn't move.

The difference between the Canadian markets and US markets (or even EU markets) was much more marginal.

Over the past decade? Not so much any more. The healthcare in Canada sucks, globohomo is abundant here in more ways than anywhere else- hell, covid alone, if I wanted to avoid some of the insanity I could just move to a red state and get more money for doing so. The benefits that made Canada worth picking over other nations, let alone sense of national pride, purpose, and loyalty? That being gone (or stomped on, ironically, by the Canadian government), that's the problem, and what will fuel the brain drain.

The benchmark detached home price in Toronto is $1,362,598 CAD, in Dallas you are looking at $450,000 USD.

Housing. Housing. Housing. Housing. That is probably the biggest factor pushing people away. If you earn 100k more, that is significant, but honestly- if I could sacrifice that to live in the time of my childhood (safe neighborhood, decent house I could pay off, family and neighbors Ive known for years, etc) Id sacrifice the 100k. The money is one matter, but its all the other additional marginal things that add up. The fact that you just can't buy a house here? Thats damning unto itself.

And then you add on that the US has so much more going on for it culturally right now, even amid the chaos. And yeah, the weather is better as well.

 

[Sweetpeaa]

Here's some basic brain drain math for the field of medicine. Let's compare a specialist making $500k in Canada and the US. Let's say Toronto vs. Dallas. Two mid tier global cities, and yes Toronto is a mid tier city.

In Ontario you pay a tax rate of 45.62%, meaning you take home $271,883, but that's CAD, so in USD you make $210,256 post tax.

In Dallas you pay a tax rate of 32.79%, meaning you take home $336,045 USD.

In the US you take home an extra $125,789 USD per year.

And what's interesting is that US jobs often pay strictly higher dollar amounts in USD, so they make more in numeric terms and substantially more after conversion.

Here's where shit is fucked.

The benchmark detached home price in Toronto is $1,362,598 CAD, in Dallas you are looking at $450,000 USD.

On mortgage calculators you are looking at $2,563 USD per month in Dallas at 4.24% rate 20% down 30y. In Toronto you pay $5,877 CAD = $4,544.89 USD per month.

So in Toronto you get $17,521 - 4,544.89 = $12,976 USD per month post tax and mortgage.

In Dallas you get $28,003 - $2,563 = $25,440 USD per month post tax and mortgage.

So in Dallas you make roughly double, an additional $12,464 per month, for an average ass house.

But then you consider working conditions and QoL. In Canada you will work to the bone in a failing socialist system where your wages will not stay competitive, your work will be harder, and you live in a frozen shithole most of the year. In Dallas you will not deal with the shitty hospitals and failing funding. Most importantly in the US your family will have top tier insurance in addition to your extra income and you will not die in a hospital hallway after waiting three days for surgery. But yes you will die of heat for a few months per year in Dallas.

Think of what you can do with all that extra money. Invest it. Buy another house. Go on a vacation to escape heat. etc... With basic compounding interest those investments will dwarf what you can invest in Canada. You can pay cash for your kids at the Ivy League.

Many Canadians don't do these basic calculations, probably because they can't do grade school math. But it is very important that they do, because doctors are smart people who will do these calculations and act. With such high tax rates and a weak currency you have to substantially increase payment in numeric terms above what US doctors make for it to be worth it, which will never happen. ever. The further the loonie falls, the higher the taxes get, and the more house prices diverge in the US and Canada will make this situation degrade further.

I know someone who moved to Houston before the pandemic. They bought a house easily but there are draw backs like the crime. Most of the crime in Texas is from ''you know who'' and they're pretty bold and opportunistic with it. White's are always an easy target. Most Canadians aren't familiar with this version of crime and it can be quite intimidating.

 

[kim foxx]

there is also the issue of texas being on track to be the california of the 21st century. much like how california received 250k new residents every year from 1960-2010, texas is blowing up the same way.

 

[TurdFondler]

With regards to Canadian companies being less productive, there are insane barriers to inter provincial trade and a reluctance by industry to modernize. The government doesn't help companies invest in developing tech and processes, and the mafia state makes sure startups do poorly.

I was an independent contractor and it really blackpilled me. There's supposed to be a fair bid system on jobs. Truth was the chosen company would get the details months in advance and the bid would go live online like 36 hours before the deadline. Good luck doing a 200 hours of work in 3 days including pricing, estimating and engineering prints. In the off chance the bid went up fairly, the wording made sure only a certain contractor with a closed distributorship got it. It's completely fucked.

The jobs now aren't the same either. Boomers used to be able to do entire careers in retail complete with pension and benefits. That is rarely the case anymore. So only immigrants aiming to get a foot in the door can afford to take those jobs.

If we want to stop the brain drain we have to offer a first world standard of living. But it's not happening this generation. Instead everything is going go get shittier year over year, prices are going to go up and you'll see even more tent encampments.

 

[OutInTheRain]

Truth was the chosen company would get the details months in advance and the bid would go live online like 36 hours before the deadline. Good luck doing a 200 hours of work in 3 days including pricing, estimating and engineering prints. In the off chance the bid went up fairly, the wording made sure only a certain contractor with a closed distributorship got it. It's completely fucked.

All those wind farms in Ontario were like this. They picked chosen companies to win the bid, and in return they would provide kickbacks to the OLP.