CHAZ/CHOP: Autonomous No Cop Zone and Commune Declared In Seattle - Render unto Warlord Raz what is owed to Warlord Raz

[Mister Fister]

This but in real life.

 

[Overly Serious]

Mine are the other way; pretty much all of the anarchists I know are anarcho-capitalists who would claim that an archo-socialist or anarcho-communist would be self-contradicting by utilising force on someone who would not go wi the commune.

Well sure - Anarcho-Socialism isn't true anarchy and anarcho-communism is the thing that lasts 5 seconds before turning into communism. I agree with that. But in terms of what people identify as, all the street-protesting types or Antifa types of anarchist are one of those in my experience and the rare anarcho-capitalist is a purely online type who has nothing to do with that and they'd throw out anyone who identifies as one if he did show up. Source: Years of experience with these sorts of mobs. Where on Earth does the notion that Chaz types are usually Anarcho-Capitalists come from? If so, then they are radically different to the usual crop I'm familiar with.

 

[Unarmed Gunman]

I think anarchy is more a critique of government than a specific solution. The main critique being that power is a corrupting force, and therefore the more power is consolidated and centralized the more corrupt and dangerous it becomes. So for instance this group of retards did their thing and it led to the deaths of a few people, which is predictable. But if you contrast that with the number of people killed by the largest and most powerful governments, there is no contest.

The question is, what's worse - ten thousand variations of CHAZ (or whatever ANCAP or Commie or Amish or whatever) all over the world, or the current setup with all-powerful governments like the US, Israel, China, Russia etc. Probably pros and cons to both.

 

[Overly Serious]

I think anarchy is more a critique of government than a specific solution.

There's a whole library of anarchist theory and thought on how Anarchism should be implemented. Now 90% of this boils down to:
1. Create a State.
2. Say it isn't a State.

But it exists, from Kropotkin to Emma Goldman.

Now, none of this is an exaltation of anarchism and indeed for anyone entering debate with them you should probably first consider the wise words below:

But all that said, all I'm remarking on is my surprise at someone associating Anarcho-Capitalists with the Chaz because in my fairly long personal experience, that specific branch of anarchism is the single most hated group by other anachist factions there is. Most protesting anarchist types ime, have always been either anarcho-socialists or anarcho-communists. They don't even like Minarchists and that's about as close to "real" anarchism as you can plausibly argue, imo.

 

[Otterly]

You can’t have anarchy with a population greater than one individual unless the range of movement per individual is so big they never encounter each other. Anarchy isn’t possible for any length of time. A soundcloud rapper will always emerge.
Is government shit? Yeah most are. But humans and any social animal need hierarchy of some kind. In small groups this can be a flattish hierarchy. Past a critical mass and density (uhoh density again…) structure emerges.
Oddly I’ve worked in a couple of departments that pride themselves on flat hierarchies and they were completely dysfunctional. The only time it’s ever worked where I’ve been employed was academia, and that only once with someone brilliant in charge who had no interest in his ego being stroked. Other groups were like little malign terrorist cells, or Venetian duchies.

 

[Dawdler]

Even in small groups a "natural" hierarchy emerges.
There have been plenty of hippy communes that just turn out to be completely tribal after few weeks together.
One man decides all the work and tasks and the rest are just pawns/serfs in the system.

I've worked in flat-hierarchy space and everyone is constantly at each other's throat and will use any fault of others as an advantage.

Best anarchy is wolf pack behavior. Those who don't want to participate leave to form their own pack. That means space and food has to be available.
The survival of wolfcels is however, very poor. Pack provides protection, even from other packs and on your own you are just food.

 

[Skitarii]

The closest example of anarchy is hell.

 

[AnOminous]

Even in small groups a "natural" hierarchy emerges.
There have been plenty of hippy communes that just turn out to be completely tribal after few weeks together.
One man decides all the work and tasks and the rest are just pawns/serfs in the system.

The other option is even worse. You have a few people doing all the actual work and everyone else is worthless parasites. You can't have anything remotely like a commune without a way of gatekeeping and some form of governance, even if it's pure majority voting.

And even then, you need some unbreakable rules to keep the majority from just voting to kill the minority.

That's STILL GOVERNMENT.

 

[Chuckwagon]

Have some more information on Laura/Logan Couch (the troon who supposedly 'founded' CHAZ before being ousted in a Twitter coup, suicidebaiting and all attention being transferred to Warlord Raz):

He was previously active in several Paradox game modding communities, BTW. He first founded 'Bring The War Home', a mod for Hearts of Iron 4 which would be set around a Second American Civil War in the 1970s (very topical considering what he'd do a year later), in ~2019. He proved too insufferable for even the other trannies there, so after interviewing and praising old domestic terrorist Ray Luc Levasseur in late 2020, the rest of the dev team seized on the opportunity afforded by the backlash from other Paradox modders to kick him out. However, still being trannies and ancoms with the atrocious work ethic (or lack thereof) that their kind is known for, they got almost no work done on the mod in the years since even without him weighing them down.

What few devs were still actually doing work flamed out after October 7, 2023 due to being Jews who wouldn't stand for being struggle-sessioned by the rest of the team, which was going full Hasan Piker at the time. The hollow shell of the dev team left after that have pretty much officially called it quits at the start of this year, going on an 'indefinite hiatus', though they have also admitted that they hadn't gotten shit all done since the 2023 debacle. Thus, Hamas can be thanked for killing this tranny mod.

Spoiler: Constant BTWH suicidebaiting, I can't imagine why even other trannies might not like this loser

Spoiler: Other BTWH devs shittalking Couch after getting rid of him

(Yes, the nigger who led this turbogay reenactment of the Ides of March against Couch openly admits to being in a '''''relationship''''' with him at the time.)

After getting kicked out of BTWH, Couch hitched his wagon to 'Just After The End', a prequel/spinoff to the 'After the End' mod for Crusader Kings 2 (which moves the setting to a post-apocalyptic North America that had regressed to medieval conditions, later adding Colombia/Venezuela to the map as well), which was far bigger & more popular than BTWH ever was and had many releases in a ~5 year period from about 2015 to 2020. Unfortunately the mod's CK2 incarnation also eventually fell to tranny drama & infighting after its head mods started trooning out, but I digress as Couch was never involved with their team directly. Development on JATE itself began in 2020, at a time when the mod's founder (a black Californian zoomer convert to Islam) was on the outs with the trannies on the ATE dev team (which he had previously been a member of).

Couch did more tangible work for JATE, creating a self-insert wish fulfilment ancom religion called 'Black Cross' (using black X's as its symbol) strong in Portland & Seattle which would oppose Christian nationalist 'Dominionists' coming from the Idaho Panhandle and which is fated to assimilate into the Gaian religion from base-ATE (basically turbofeminist hippies living in the PNW). However the other devs found his coding to be shitty spaghetti and ultimately cut ties with him entirely after finding out that he was a pedo on top of being a tranny (many such cases). They blame his incompetence for holding back their initial release past its original intended date, and managed said release right after kicking him out.

Spoiler: Couch is unsurprisingly still a far-left, terrorist-worshiping fag even after getting booted from his own mod

Spoiler: JATE devs don't like Couch anymore than the BTWH ones did by the end

Spoiler: Couch's self-insert character can still be found in the released mod, a true & honest woman in Cap Hill

JATE is also all but dead now, with said remaining devs publicly declaring that they're going on an indefinite hiatus of their own at the start of this month and that if they do push out anything else it'll just be one final bugfixing patch, but unlike Couch they at least managed two releases with some meaningful content since they started in 2020. I won't go into further autistic detail on the mods themselves here, both because it's not the thread and because I've done that in the Reddit HOI4 modding thread already over the years. I think it may be relevant to mention, however, that Couch has not in fact killed himself yet (despite his numerous suicidebaiting Tweets & Discord messages) and last posted on Reddit (where he's still active on the same old account going back many years, certainly including the time when both BTWH and JATE were still being worked on) 16 days ago as of this writing.

 

[FILTH Tourist]

The closest example of anarchy is hell.

Even hell has a pecking order. There are no good examples of anarchy working because is more of a state of transition than an actual goverment type. Because structure is inevitable in human groups, either out of necessity to keep order and be productive along side dominate personality types naturally trying to control more submissive personality types.

 

[not william stenchever]

The closest thing to anarcho-capitalism is probably steppe horse lords. And the anarcho part is debatable because everyone gangs up under leaders to prevent other clans from killing them and stealing their herds and then suddenly you have the Yuan Dynasty.

 

[Absolutego]

The closest thing to anarcho-capitalism is probably steppe horse lords. And the anarcho part is debatable because everyone gangs up under leaders to prevent other clans from killing them and stealing their herds and then suddenly you have the Yuan Dynasty.

The capitalism part is also debatable since they had zero respect for property rights, warlords stayed in power via raiding and the resulting loot patronage to their tribe. The Han Chinese deciding it was worth paying protection money to the tribes closest to them to ward off the more brutal tribes further inland was closer to an anarcho-capitalist mindset than the steppe nomads themselves.

 

[Wendy Wheelchair]

No, because the remaining council members are just blase useless fucks instead of crotchety Trotskyists and Capitol Hill will almost assuredly replace Sawant with someone equally extreme/prone to posturing as a revolutionary.

I remember when I was living there and a fat gay beaner ran against Sawant and she claimed he was attacking her for being a woman of color. BTW, wanna guess the race of her husband, the husband she only married after divorcing her Indian husband?

I wondered why this thread was bumped, bloody hell those wheels of justice grind slow.

So, what do we think? They gonna make an example of him or, more or less, let him off with some crappy half arsed punishment and sweep it under the rug?

From the moment they legalized weed, despite the law saying you cannot smoke it in public (like you can't drink in public), Seattle police were ordered to never arrest anyone for smoking in public. They also were ordered to NEVER arrest a homeless person unless they're actually attacking someone. So it's just homeless people literally standing in the middle of the road screaming and police are neutered and can't do anything.

So yeah, they'll brush this all under the rug especially since Seattle is the least-black big city in America yet centers niggers at every opportunity.

"The city also removed tent encampments from the park Wednesday, marking the 76th time it had done so at Cal Anderson in 2023, she said."

You would think after the 5th time these people would take a hint hint hint

As said in the previous thing, homeless people are a protected class in Seattle. Like, I cannot overemphasize how many homeless people sleeping in the little indents of storefront entrances I had to step over on my walk to my bus every morning. I remember in the 2017 mayoral race where it was rice white uber-liberal lady 1 vs rich white uber-liberal lady 2 and they were asked how they were going to solve the homeless problem and they said "Build more houses!" when it's a known fact that a HUGE percentage of the homeless population is not from Seattle and specifically moves to Seattle because they know they won't be arrested for openly doing drugs or sleeping in tents wherever they want. They try to skew this by saying "Where did you live when you lost housing?" with the majority saying King County, but there are so many cases, especially of youth, coming to Seattle for drugs so if they come here for a month to live with a friend then get kicked out, they're considered "from King County" rather than where they actually originated from.

It's weird that 84% of homeless are supposedly from King County when 25% of ALL King County residents WERE BORN OUTSIDE OF THE US.

 

[Crex Crex]

Anarchism can only really exist in a specific type of high-trust, low-population society with a relatively homogenous mindset. That's why most examples of "successful anarchist societies" were either warlord shitholes or tiny villages and tribal backwaters, most of which did actually have a form of hierarchy or were dependent dependent on the outside world.

Anarchists are just like commies in delusionally thinking that if something works for 100 like-minded people in a commune, it will work for everyone. These ideologies are nothing but mental masturbation requiring an impossibly specific set of circumstances and 100% ideological compliance to actually work on any scale.

 

[CaliforniaRaisin]

The other option is even worse. You have a few people doing all the actual work and everyone else is worthless parasites. You can't have anything remotely like a commune without a way of gatekeeping and some form of governance, even if it's pure majority voting.

And even then, you need some unbreakable rules to keep the majority from just voting to kill the minority.

That's STILL GOVERNMENT.

Once, back in the depths of lockdowns, I stumbled across a Twitch streamer preaching the dissolution of government in favor of a money free society where everyone contributes what they can and takes what they need. I asked them something to the effect of "How does that system prevent snowballing abuse and parasitic behavior? What mechanism stops the human nature of selfish desire from depriving others?"

I was immediately banned and the only words spoken by the streamer to that comment was something like "Imagine not understanding that people only behave that way because of capitalism." So at least I learned that the socialist commune utopia is predicated on people (checks notes) "just being good because it's not capitalism".

 

[The Mighty Banth]

Once, back in the depths of lockdowns, I stumbled across a Twitch streamer preaching the dissolution of government in favor of a money free society where everyone contributes what they can and takes what they need. I asked them something to the effect of "How does that system prevent snowballing abuse and parasitic behavior? What mechanism stops the human nature of selfish desire from depriving others?"

I was immediately banned and the only words spoken by the streamer to that comment was something like "Imagine not understanding that people only behave that way because of capitalism." So at least I learned that the socialist commune utopia is predicated on people (checks notes) "just being good because it's not capitalism".

There are hundreds of videos of pet cats, dogs, birds, ect trying to steal the other pet's food even when they have a full, untouched bowl. It's literally a fact of nature, and since commies are atheist, they can't even say humans should be better because of their elevated status.

They should all be forced to harvest crabs in the depth of the Alaskan seas.

 

[Dawdler]

So at least I learned that the socialist commune utopia is predicated on people (checks notes) "just being good because it's not capitalism".

That's actually a very good point.
Marx himself wrote that the socialism is next stage of capitalism.

 

[The Ultimate Ramotith]

Well sure - Anarcho-Socialism isn't true anarchy and anarcho-communism is the thing that lasts 5 seconds before turning into communism. I agree with that. But in terms of what people identify as, all the street-protesting types or Antifa types of anarchist are one of those in my experience and the rare anarcho-capitalist is a purely online type who has nothing to do with that and they'd throw out anyone who identifies as one if he did show up. Source: Years of experience with these sorts of mobs. Where on Earth does the notion that Chaz types are usually Anarcho-Capitalists come from? If so, then they are radically different to the usual crop I'm familiar with.

I should have made that clearer. Your source of anarchists are from CHAZ/CHOP; my source of anarchists is from the Internet. We are actually seeing two different groups.
I was talking in general on how CHAZ/CHOP is a case study against anarchy in itself.

You can’t have anarchy with a population greater than one individual unless the range of movement per individual is so big they never encounter each other. Anarchy isn’t possible for any length of time. A soundcloud rapper will always emerge.
Is government shit? Yeah most are. But humans and any social animal need hierarchy of some kind. In small groups this can be a flattish hierarchy. Past a critical mass and density (uhoh density again…) structure emerges.
Oddly I’ve worked in a couple of departments that pride themselves on flat hierarchies and they were completely dysfunctional. The only time it’s ever worked where I’ve been employed was academia, and that only once with someone brilliant in charge who had no interest in his ego being stroked. Other groups were like little malign terrorist cells, or Venetian duchies.

That reflects in the Benevolent Dictator For Life ideology some software groups have.

The other option is even worse. You have a few people doing all the actual work and everyone else is worthless parasites. You can't have anything remotely like a commune without a way of gatekeeping and some form of governance, even if it's pure majority voting.

And even then, you need some unbreakable rules to keep the majority from just voting to kill the minority.

That's STILL GOVERNMENT.

That is one of my main problems with anarcho-capitalism; that requires that everyone there agree wi the system.

 

[Dawdler]

That is one of my main problems with anarcho-capitalism; that requires that everyone there agree wi the system.

Not only agree, but to actively work on it/problem.
The idea behind "new systems" is that the bottom class will become middle/rich class somehow by some magic idea that everyone is equal and so on.
The only way to approach the enjoyment of life is to either offload the work to the slave classes or automate everything so the basics of life do not take than a few minutes of your life daily.

Realistically, a system that does not exploit everyone cannot exist. Even the richest serve the capitalist system. While it works for them, it is still "one step" ahead of them and they have become the representatives and slaves of it. Personality replaced by accumulation of fiat currency.

Anarchy in it's purest is just starvation and death. To survive this world any advanced species needs organization.
Basic equivalent is insect life. Ants, bees take care of colonies. Moths just shit out kids and die.

Even the birds "found out" that living in "flocks" is better than being alone, yet it's our dumbasses that think they would make it alone in the wild when their life consists around consuming slop in various forms.

The idea that "A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle" is old as dirt and can be found in buddhism to attach yourself to nothing and be ... basically poor.

The issue with that reasoning is - you will create nothing and you will be poor.
Any tribe that strives to "something greater" will just trample you with technology, science and power creep.

In order for anarchy to succeed, every other system would therefore need to die as it's own self sustenance energy is so low it can be overrun by a group of people on a horse.
So in a way, you can conclude, that societies form/exist based more on external pressure than on internal desire.
All the stupid ones died or got absorbed and anarchy is peddled by kids of rich parents that don't need to succeed in and notable form.

 

[Overwritten Tapes]

Anarchy in it's purest is just starvation and death. To survive this world any advanced species needs organization.

In a post apocalyptic world, the only ones who would survive is the ones that band together, doesn't matter how tight or loose the hierarchy is.