Civ 5 Anonymous

How do you guys like to capture AI cities in the early/mid-game?

I'm still playing vanilla (normal difficulty) and my sieges only pan out if I get lucky. The issue is that a single city + ranged garrison attack will cut my ranged units' CS significantly and kill them the next turn if I attack, meaning the total damage I'm throwing at the city drops by I'd say 20% each turn until the city is just outhealing me. This is even without any/many additional defenders harassing me from the sides, and it's more frustrating if the terrain is shit.

I did okay in two games I used Artillery on the offense (used one or two to bombard a city, kept one or two units behind as protection then capped w/ a melee unit at low HP) but I'd like to improve my warfighting in general. I don't use siege weapons pre-Artillery b/c I never have more than 2 -4 Iron.
 
How do you guys like to capture AI cities in the early/mid-game?

I'm still playing vanilla (normal difficulty) and my sieges only pan out if I get lucky. The issue is that a single city + ranged garrison attack will cut my ranged units' CS significantly and kill them the next turn if I attack, meaning the total damage I'm throwing at the city drops by I'd say 20% each turn until the city is just outhealing me. This is even without any/many additional defenders harassing me from the sides, and it's more frustrating if the terrain is shit.

I did okay in two games I used Artillery on the offense (used one or two to bombard a city, kept one or two units behind as protection then capped w/ a melee unit at low HP) but I'd like to improve my warfighting in general. I don't use siege weapons pre-Artillery b/c I never have more than 2 -4 Iron.
Siege units don't cost any iron in the expansions, so they are far more useful. In fact, the only unit types that cost iron now are swordsman and frigates. I pretty much exclusively play with all the DLC, so the tactics I like to use may not work for you. With that being said, sieging a city is still pretty difficult, so I usually start a war, destroy the army of the other civ, maybe take 1 city if I want to annex it and the civ I'm at war with is being stubborn, and take as many cities as possible in the peace deal. Then I start a second war once the treaty ends and finish them off. Mandekalu Cavalry can clean an army and still be useful during city sieges, so I love to play as Songhai for domination victories.


As for sieging a city itself, you need to change your army based on the city, but there is a basic outline of what your army should be like.

Melee units:

Early game-
Of course, you need melee units to capture cities, so bring a few melee units. However, until you reach gunpowder, melee units are crap (Except for swordsmen, and even then they're just okay) so only bring 3-4 unless you have a melee UU. Even then, you should never use warriors for anything other than a meat shield unless you're the Aztecs and have Jaguar warriors. The AI tends to prioritize killing melee units, so feel free to use one as a decoy if you think your siege units might be in danger.

Midgame:
Technicly gunpowder units and melee units are different unit types (Impi do more damage to gunpowder units) but I don't care, so I'm talking about them here.
Melee units are far more useful midgame. The huge power boost they get from guns, combined with the lowered range of machine guns, make melee units viable for making a siege force. They still have trouble when attacking cities, but they clear out enemy forces so easily that creating a large amount of melee units is worth the more difficult siege. Good offensive UUs are sparce for gunpowder units, and the only one I think is worth building extra for wars is the Janissary.

Ranged units:

Early game-
Ranged units should make up the bulk of your army until you reach gunpowder. Composite bowmen and crossbowmen in particular are extremely powerful units, so build plenty of them if you want to siege in the early game. They can also clear out any units around the cities with comparatively little danger.


Midgame-
However, once guns come into play, ranged units take a huge hit in usefulness with the machine gun. The 1 space range is a huge hit to the usefulness of ranged civs. Once I get to the machine gun I never build any new ranged civs, as artillery serve the purpose better.

Mounted units:
Horsemen should usually only be used for clearing out enemy units and stay out of the siege, but that all changes if you have a mounted UU. Mounted UUs have the best bonusus out of any kind of unit type, with the exception of Egypt's pathetic war chariot. I Always build extra mounted units if I have a mounted UU, and if I'm playing as the Mongols, Carthage, or Songhai I make mounted units the bulk of my army and siege force. Mounted units are useless for seiges normally, though.

Siege units:

Siege units are necessary for making sieges with the fewest possible casualties. The boost they have to attacking cities is huge, especially in the early game, and the damage boost adds up quickly. Make sure that at least 3 are sieging the city at the same time. It's fine to have more siege units, but they are costly to make, even without requiring iron, so try to keep the siege unit building to a moderate amount. They also stay useful in each era, so perk/upgrade whoring is much easier with siege units.
 
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Thanks for the tips. Incidentally, I was playing Egypt in my last attempt at a game and was deploying War Chariots instead of Archers. The city I wanted to take was awkwardly placed (coastal next to one Mountain tile next to a river tile and had 11 CS w/ an Archer garrison. I deployed four WCs, lost one and almost lost another to get it to low HP and then come in with a Pikeman to grab it. It was a pretty screwy attack.

I couldn't find a save from when I was attacking it, but here's a screenshot of what it looked like a hundred or so turns later:

2015-10-16_00001.jpg

I had WCs on the two Hills to the north, one on the Dyes tile (lost that one) and another on the Cotton tile. I didn't want to flank out northeast or southeast because the capital was there and I didn't want to get attacked from behind. I was overeager to take it as my third city because of the two new lux and lots of space... I am not proud of my noob attempt. As you maybe guess by the map I had to cross a large lake to reach this side of the continent because it was blockaded by mountains on both sides. Interesting seed.
 
How do you guys like to capture AI cities in the early/mid-game?

I'm still playing vanilla (normal difficulty) and my sieges only pan out if I get lucky. The issue is that a single city + ranged garrison attack will cut my ranged units' CS significantly and kill them the next turn if I attack, meaning the total damage I'm throwing at the city drops by I'd say 20% each turn until the city is just outhealing me. This is even without any/many additional defenders harassing me from the sides, and it's more frustrating if the terrain is shit.

Get a bunch of archers + a horseman and position them out of range of the city. Use a worker to bait a unit out of their city. Shoot the shit out of the unit that took the bait and use your horseman to recapture the worker and retreat. Repeat until all their units are dead, then shoot up the city. Or, since you're playing on vanilla, spam horsemen or swordsmen and beat the shit out of enemy cities.

Having a good early UU makes early game conquest significantly easier.
 
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I bought civ 5, after it installs imma stream it tonight and it'll be great. Expect it at like 7-8 EST
 
ALRIGHT MOFOS WE GONNA START THE STREAM AT 7 PM EST THAT IS IN 1 HOUR
I'm gonna play on normal difficultly and I'm gonna do badly and you guys can yell at me either in stream chat or on skype, pm me for skype or ask on stream I don't care
 
ALRIGHT MOFOS WE GONNA START THE STREAM AT 7 PM EST THAT IS IN 1 HOUR
I'm gonna play on normal difficultly and I'm gonna do badly and you guys can yell at me either in stream chat or on skype, pm me for skype or ask on stream I don't care
Which Civ are you playing?
 
We're starting very soon after I get things ready
 
I did buy Civ 5 and I'm trying to figure out how to use Civ 5 ModBuddy to make a kiwi mod.
This will not be easy because I have zero experience with writing code (civ 5 mods use XML as a language) and I am also really dumb.
I'm also a very visual learner, I can read about shit but I learn way better when I can see it done so I'm forever searching for a fairly comprehensive modding how to video. I found one but it didn't go into much detail
 
I picked up the expansions earlier this week. All these new mechanics + the larger tech tree is pretty overwhelming. I've experimented a bit and the AI seems more intelligent: less random pointless on-and-off wars against everybody for no reason and less flooding the map with crap cities.

I'm closing in one my first victory - aiming for a Science win with Korea, and it's interesting because every AI filled out Tradition and only China has more than like four cities. Everyone on my continent has two or three, and about 300 turns in there hasn't yet been a single war here.

Clumsily managed to navigate my way through the WC to remain host for three votes and get my Freedom made World Ideology, though I forgot to check if the AIs caved to it yet. No useful resolutions I can propose (I'm 10 techs ahead but nobody wants Science Funding; everyone wants Arts) so I just proposed embargoing Mongolia since everyone hates them.

Ethiopia is mass spamming Missionaries and Great Prophets and whoring tons of Wonders. The Maya are also very religious. I've neglected Culture and ignored Faith so I'm only making +80ish/+8 per turn with very few Great Works and no Theming Bonuses.

My army is intimidating anyone from invading (small, but big tech lead) and I should hash out a slow, awkward victory in like 150 turns. I really regret not founding a third city because it could have given me like +1000 as opposed to +700~ Science by now, but there was nowhere safe + with any new lux so I think my happiness would have died (at like 25 now) + I would have been invaded.
 
ADVICE TIME!

Clumsily managed to navigate my way through the WC to remain host for three votes and get my Freedom made World Ideology,
If you're playing to win a science victory, always choose order. The ideologies all work better for different victories. (Autocracy-Domination,
Order-Science, Freedom-Culture) I would also recommend starting at level 3 and working your way up, as the first 2 difficulties present no challenge for you to overcome and improve. As OP as the science civs are, the AI has huge science bonuses, so if you're 10 techs ahead of everyone you need to move your difficulty up.

(I'm 10 techs ahead but nobody wants Science Funding)
Don't even try to pass science funding. The AI is always dead set against it unless they're at least an era behind the pack, and even that's generous in my experience.

Ethiopia is mass spamming Missionaries and Great Prophets and whoring tons of Wonders.
Standard Ethiopia. Some Civs are fierce at pushing their religion. A lot of wonders give religious bonuses as well, so religious civs are usually wonderwhores.

I've neglected Culture so I'm only making +80ish a turn with very few Great Works and no Theming Bonuses.
While culture still matters, cultural victory is now obtained through the new tourism system. You usually won't have to worry about culture outside of a cultural victory unless you're playing on a high difficulty.

I really regret not founding a third city because it could have given me like +1000 as opposed to +700~ Science by now, but there was nowhere safe + with any new lux so I think my happiness would have died (at like 25 now) + I would have been invaded.
Try to found 3-4 cities when playing tall. 2 cities are still acceptable, but the positives heavily outweigh the negatives for founding a good 3rd city, even if other Civs will want to war with you to take it. Happiness is manageable with 3 cities on your own, and is even easier with trade. Use diplomacy for resources and a lack of new luxuries won't be a problem, as you can just trade extra copies away for new resources.
 
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If you're playing to win a science victory, always choose order. The ideologies all work better for different victories. (Autocracy-Domination,
Order-Science, Freedom-Culture) I would also recommend starting at level 3 and working your way up, as the first 2 difficulties present no challenge for you to overcome and improve. As OP as the science civs are, the AI has huge science bonuses, so if you're 10 techs ahead of everyone you need to move your difficulty up.

Is Order really the best? Freedom's bonuses to Specialists and Great Person generation (though I care more about Specialists) is really good and I've only ever played tall, so it works for me. I'd still deal with Order if the AI pushed it on me (as I may have to in the future, since in my experience the AI always loved Order).

I'm still playing on Difficulty 4, and honestly I have a bad habit of rerolling or abandoning my games if they aren't panning out good in the first 150 turns, so you could say my win rate was like 30% in vanilla. This is my third experimental game and first actual attempt to win. I'll move up to 5 when I'm fully comfortable with all the new shit thrown at me... a probable 450-turn Science victory isn't that impressive.

While culture still matters, cultural victory is now obtained through the new tourism system. You usually won't have to worry about culture outside of a cultural victory unless you're playing on a high difficulty.

I've heard people say that the new Culture system is a passive thing most of the time and I prefer it that way (just give me Social Policies) since it's mind-numbing -- e.g. somehow I have 35% influence over the Netherlands with one trade route. A shame since I'd like to try a game with La France.

Try to found 3-4 cities when playing tall. 2 cities are still acceptable, but the positives heavily outweigh the negatives for founding a good 3rd city, even if other Civs will want to war with you to take it. Happiness is manageable with 3 cities on your own, and is even easier with trade. Use diplomacy for resources and a lack of new luxuries won't be a problem, as you can just trade extra copies away for new resources.

I usually aim to have four cities but I usually only get three since I don't like fighting early-game wars for land. I could have sustained a third city assuming my Notre Dame rush still worked, but in hindsight the spot I would have taken (on a nearby landmass in between two CS) would have had piss-poor prod and drained my Happiness to nil as it neared size 20.

Trade is something I have trouble with. I only trade lux if the AI has a spare copy (and they only rarely do) otherwise they will demand everything I have for it. It makes it harder that my starting luck doesn't give me many (or any) spare lux or strategic resources to trade. (As an aside, I've never traded away Aluminum, Uranium or Oil). Lux from CS is unreliable to me because I need to spend so much money or go out of my way to do quests for their alliance. I got lucky with the one Maritime CS I've kept allied with this whole game.
 
Well I just got done with a game. All I can say is with a stronk economy and some freedom, Poland can into space.
Plus the gold helps me deal with Greece and their City State buddies.
 
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