Does the right really support free speech?

[Fractal Lifeform]

Both liberals/leftists and conservatives actually used to have the same opinions on it back in 1980-2010: "MUH PRIVATE COMPANY". If this was a different era, they would be asking water companies to cut your water and phone companies to cut your phone lines based on political allegiance. Conservatives have only slightly started budging on recently due to how hard that stance is destroying them, but it's probably too late for this era.

Sure. The Left from what I remember were very into free speech but now they have thrown it all away cause they now have the power. This means that they were only for it cause it allowed them to attack and destroy their enemies.

If this was a different era, they would be asking water companies to cut your water and phone companies to cut your phone lines based on political allegiance.

There is cancel culture where they want to do this. There was a screenshot of leftists wanting some old white people to be cancelled aka lose their job and so on but then found out that they were retired and thus the cancel wouldn't work.

Some British nationalist named Laura believe lost her bank account likely cause of her views. They kept her money away from her for 3 weeks.

Just give it time I say.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

Lol, you cite Republic but you don't even know who wrote it. Plato, the student of Socrates, wrote that dialogue- there are zero known tracts that were written by Socrates, and all of Plato's tracts are near-universally agreed to be Plato inserting his opinions into his former teacher's mouth.

you're being too pedantic. Whether Big Pizza wrote the republic or John wrote it doesn't matter

Republic, because anything that wasn't literally true would cause mental confusion, and that children should be taken from their families and raised collectively so that they think of the State and its rulers as their mother and father) as an ideal tells me how warped your mindset is- or how profound your ignorance of the classics is.

Like I said before, I don't have to agree with 100% of Socrates wrote to take away some knowledge from it. It's like when Ben Shapiro said "this guy reads Nietzsche and he calls himself a Christian?" you moron I can read 2 books

Also, your reading about music is pretty dumb, as The Republic would classify 100% of classical and church music as harmful- only monotonic instrumental music is acceptable, and only for the ruling caste- the warrior and slave castes can't hear music at all, because it might make them think about something besides labor.

Once again, I agree with what he said in spirit. You nitwits think that me citing Socrates must mean that I agree with 100% of what he says. I agree with E. Michael Jones, and he said that, paraphrasing, "any music makes you move the bottom half of your body is wrong."

And now you're gonna say "oh, you must agree with everything E. Michael Jones says! Why do you think that Jews are the eternal enemy of humanity?"

 

[KimCoppolaAficionado]

Once again, I agree with what he said in spirit. You nitwits think that me citing Socrates must mean that I agree with 100% of what he says. I agree with E. Michael Jones, and he said that, paraphrasing, "any music makes you move the bottom half of your body is wrong."

And now you're gonna say "oh, you must agree with everything E. Michael Jones says! Why do you think that Jews are the eternal enemy of humanity?"

I'm not, because the bolded statement is inane enough I hardly need to say anything at all. You'd throw two-thirds of the Classical canon and 90% of traditional music onto a pyre because people dance to it. You literally go above and beyond the moral censorship of the Catholic church in your chosen halcyon days of yore, because you'd deny the peasants the right to harvest and planting dances (and probably ale, too, if I have your number right).
You're a really shitty traditionalist- but an excellent neo-Puritan who's confused about which era he should idolize.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

I'm not, because the bolded statement is inane enough I hardly need to say anything at all. You'd throw two-thirds of the Classical canon and 90% of traditional music onto a pyre because people dance to it. You literally go above and beyond the moral censorship of the Catholic church in your chosen halcyon days of yore, because you'd deny the peasants the right to harvest and planting dances (and probably ale, too, if I have your number right).
You're a really shitty traditionalist- but an excellent neo-Puritan who's confused about which era he should idolize.

Here's the deal, most people can dance to heretical music and be completely fine afterwards. We see an ideal society, so why not move towards it? I know for certain that the mental needs of man were fulfilled better 100 years ago than today. When you look at Maslow's hierarchy of needs you see that today our physiological needs and security needs are fulfilled, but there is no community (love and belonging) and because there's no community there's no esteem or self-actualization. Everybody knows that today people aren't happy, but you think that if everybody were just free to do whatever they want they would be happy. It is this type of cult that is centered around the individual in a narcissistic way that wants you to kick everyone out of your life who would try to put limits on you and only bring in people that cheer you on. By necessity a community needs to have limits, social norms and the like. These anarchist communities that you see Vaush and TJ Kirk lead are totally miserable because they don't care to put limits on anyone.

Ideally, that type of music should not exist, but we live in the real world and do what is practical. In theory I'm against all welfare, but in practice I would implement a full welfare state. But that doesn't mean that in time I wouldn't try to repeal the welfare state. The society which I believe fulfilled all of Maslow's needs was the one between 1880 and 1914. That is the time that we should idolize and romanticize. And yes, there were infidelities in those societies, but military genius Conrad von Hotzendorf had his problems, that doesn't mean we shouldn't idolize him.

I certainly hope that you're not like that idiot @Sayaka lee and believe that in medieval times it was just endless suffering and misery because on both an evolutionary level and cultural level that makes no sense. It is evidently true that humans were happier in the past than today

 

[LeChampion1992]

The right wing is just as censorious as the left. But I think this time around they tend to be less censorious.
then the establishment left.

 

[Syaoran Li]

you're being too pedantic. Whether Big Pizza wrote the republic or John wrote it doesn't matter

Like I said before, I don't have to agree with 100% of Socrates wrote to take away some knowledge from it. It's like when Ben Shapiro said "this guy reads Nietzsche and he calls himself a Christian?" you moron I can read 2 books

Once again, I agree with what he said in spirit. You nitwits think that me citing Socrates must mean that I agree with 100% of what he says. I agree with E. Michael Jones, and he said that, paraphrasing, "any music makes you move the bottom half of your body is wrong."

And now you're gonna say "oh, you must agree with everything E. Michael Jones says! Why do you think that Jews are the eternal enemy of humanity?"

You're a retarded redneck and an edgelord who has no real grasp of history or philosophy outside of /pol/ memes and Chick Tracts.

Here's the deal, most people can dance to heretical music and be completely fine afterwards. We see an ideal society, so why not move towards it? I know for certain that the mental needs of man were fulfilled better 100 years ago than today. When you look at Maslow's hierarchy of needs you see that today our physiological needs and security needs are fulfilled, but there is no community (love and belonging) and because there's no community there's no esteem or self-actualization. Everybody knows that today people aren't happy, but you think that if everybody were just free to do whatever they want they would be happy. It is this type of cult that is centered around the individual in a narcissistic way that wants you to kick everyone out of your life who would try to put limits on you and only bring in people that cheer you on. By necessity a community needs to have limits, social norms and the like. These anarchist communities that you see Vaush and TJ Kirk lead are totally miserable because they don't care to put limits on anyone.

Ideally, that type of music should not exist, but we live in the real world and do what is practical. In theory I'm against all welfare, but in practice I would implement a full welfare state. But that doesn't mean that in time I wouldn't try to repeal the welfare state. The society which I believe fulfilled all of Maslow's needs was the one between 1880 and 1914. That is the time that we should idolize and romanticize. And yes, there were infidelities in those societies, but military genius Conrad von Hotzendorf had his problems, that doesn't mean we shouldn't idolize him.

I certainly hope that you're not like that idiot @Sayaka lee and believe that in medieval times it was just endless suffering and misery because on both an evolutionary level and cultural level that makes no sense. It is evidently true that humans were happier in the past than today

People were truly suffering and miserable back then just as they are now. It just manifested differently.

Your puritan faggotry is based on an idyllic interpretation of history that simply did not exist in real life and edge it up all you want, but the Great Kike in the Sky will still Jew you over one last time when he casts you into the Lake of Fire with all the other "degenerates"

Yahweh is an evil despot who hates us all and wants to see us suffer in the afterlife. There's no escaping it either. Atheists and puritans/traditionalists are both retards who think they can game the system in different ways.

Atheists think they can stick their head in the sand and that if they don't believe in God, then somehow the father of tyrants won't have power over them.

Traditionalists believe that through endless self-induced misery and trying to struggle and live up to what is honestly an outright impossible standard while insisting everyone was genuinely happier this way that Yahweh will take pity on them and spare them. Instead, he'll just throw you in the fires to suffer for all of eternity as well and then take a little extra glee in knowing he duped you into making yourself suffer and be miserable in this life as well as in the afterlife.

Traditionalist morality is a sick Kafkaesque joke. At least I'll have been able to enjoy the mortal life while you will suffer endlessly in both this life and the next, all to appease an abusive tyrant who hates you for simply existing and gets off on seeing you burn forever in eternal torment.

 

[Sage In All Fields]

Instead, he'll just throw you in the fires to suffer for all of eternity as well and then take a little extra glee in knowing he duped you into making yourself suffer and be miserable in this life as well as in the afterlife.

He's proven Himself to be truthful, I don't see what the point of duping humanity would be. God created us because it is befitting of Him to be worshipped by creatures that have the choice to worship besides Him, it would make no sense for Him to punish those who were obedient.

At least I'll have been able to enjoy the mortal life while you will suffer endlessly in both this life and the next, all to appease an abusive tyrant who hates you for simply existing and gets off on seeing you burn forever in eternal torment.

>Burning in hell to spite God
This is potentially the dumbest position I've ever heard expressed, in fact it's basically the line of reasoning satan used. You do realise that it's going to be like, really fucking horrific right? You're not going to get used to the pain like you can in this world.

 

[Syaoran Li]

He's proven Himself to be truthful, I don't see what the point of duping humanity would be. God created us because it is befitting of Him to be worshipped by creatures that have the choice to worship besides Him, it would make no sense for Him to punish those who were obedient.


>Burning in hell to spite God
This is potentially the dumbest position I've ever heard expressed, in fact it's basically the line of reasoning satan used. You do realise that it's going to be like, really fucking horrific right? You've not going to get used to the pain like you can in this world.

I know it's going to be really fucking horrific and that God will make sure you won't be able to get used to the pain. Something that unfathomably and unquestionably evil, tyrannical, and inhumane is right up Yahweh's alley.

God likes hurting people and punishing even the obedient because he is a tyrant and a sadist and is more or less the forerunner of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao. He's the cosmic equivalent of a manipulative abuser and we humans are the abused. The ones who are obedient and faithful have the ultimate case of Battered Wife Syndrome.

The Bible was merely a work of propaganda to get the proles to submit and dupe themselves into thinking they can avoid unfathomable horrific pain. The Bible is the OG Communist Manifesto, Heaven is the OG Worker's Paradise, Satan as the OG capitalist bourgeoisie, "degenerates" as the OG counter-revolutionaries, and Hell as the OG gulag. The demise of paganism and rise of Christianity in Europe was merely the Late Antiquity equivalent of the Cultural Revolution.

Marxism was merely a materialistic attempt at recreating the political success of Christian morality but all focused on the secular and material world.

We're all damned to suffer a truly horrific afterlife and burn in eternal pain that will never abate and beg for mercy from an evil tyrant who will refuse to grant us mercy and gloat as he torments us.

Satan isn't real, he's merely an Emmanuel Goldstein-esque figure to blame all of Yahweh's abuses on.

I'll admit, I may be a bit biased given my personal experiences, upbringing, and the studying I do in my own time to reach these conclusions. But if you want to be a puritan in the vain hope of not being sent to the great gulag down below, then more power to you. I won't stop you.

I'm spiritually blackpilled and the traditionalist Protestant interpretation of the Bible in particular is like the ultimate black pill.

 

[Sage In All Fields]

I know it's going to be really fucking horrific and that God will make sure you won't be able to get used to the pain. Something that unfathomably and unquestionably evil, tyrannical, and inhumane is right up Yahweh's alley.

And your evaluation of that as evil is based on what?

God likes hurting people and punishing even the obedient

You know... except for all the bits where he mercies us and forgives us and gives us life and doesn't birth us straight into hell like He could have had He so wished.

I'll admit, I may be a bit biased given my personal experiences, upbringing, and the studying I do in my own time to reach these conclusions. But if you want to be a puritan in the vain hope of not being sent to the great gulag down below, then more power to you. I won't stop you.

It does sort of sounds like you've just had really bad experiences and feel resentment towards God for those calamities rather than taking it as a test and channeling that energy into something constructive and good that might ultimately be a means of betterment for yourself. I realise that's probably not easy to come to terms with depending on how severe it was but you're not helping yourself by continuing down this path.

For the record I'm not defending the Bible since it's extremely unreliable and chock full of errors especially through the lens of contemporary Christian theology, but I am defending the God of Abraham.

 

[OnMoTi]

I support the concept of free speech. But it's not equally applied in our society.

 

[KimCoppolaAficionado]

I know it's going to be really fucking horrific and that God will make sure you won't be able to get used to the pain. Something that unfathomably and unquestionably evil, tyrannical, and inhumane is right up Yahweh's alley.

God likes hurting people and punishing even the obedient because he is a tyrant and a sadist and is more or less the forerunner of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao. He's the cosmic equivalent of a manipulative abuser and we humans are the abused. The ones who are obedient and faithful have the ultimate case of Battered Wife Syndrome.

The Bible was merely a work of propaganda to get the proles to submit and dupe themselves into thinking they can avoid unfathomable horrific pain. The Bible is the OG Communist Manifesto, Heaven is the OG Worker's Paradise, Satan as the OG capitalist bourgeoisie, "degenerates" as the OG counter-revolutionaries, and Hell as the OG gulag. The demise of paganism and rise of Christianity in Europe was merely the Late Antiquity equivalent of the Cultural Revolution.

Marxism was merely a materialistic attempt at recreating the political success of Christian morality but all focused on the secular and material world.

We're all damned to suffer a truly horrific afterlife and burn in eternal pain that will never abate and beg for mercy from an evil tyrant who will refuse to grant us mercy and gloat as he torments us.

Satan isn't real, he's merely an Emmanuel Goldstein-esque figure to blame all of Yahweh's abuses on.

I'll admit, I may be a bit biased given my personal experiences, upbringing, and the studying I do in my own time to reach these conclusions. But if you want to be a puritan in the vain hope of not being sent to the great gulag down below, then more power to you. I won't stop you.

I'm spiritually blackpilled and the traditionalist Protestant interpretation of the Bible in particular is like the ultimate black pill.

Please stop, you're making the guy who LARPS as a 20th-century Prussian, has the morals of a 17th-century Puritan, and lionizes 11th-century Western Europe as the acme of human existence look more coherent and stable with posts like this.
I'm sorry you have whatever religious hangups you do about Christianity, but having a meltdown at someone because you were raised by Calvinists does not make them look bad.

 

[Syaoran Li]

Please stop, you're making the guy who LARPS as a 20th-century Prussian, has the morals of a 17th-century Puritan, and lionizes 11th-century Western Europe as the acme of human existence look more coherent and stable with posts like this.
I'm sorry you have whatever religious hangups you do about Christianity, but having a meltdown at someone because you were raised by Calvinists does not make them look bad.

Point conceded on that one

 

[Pointless Pedant]

Please stop, you're making the guy who LARPS as a 20th-century Prussian, has the morals of a 17th-century Puritan, and lionizes 11th-century Western Europe as the acme of human existence look more coherent and stable with posts like this.
I'm sorry you have whatever religious hangups you do about Christianity, but having a meltdown at someone because you were raised by Calvinists does not make them look bad.

I didn't realise Christianity Derangement Syndrome was still a thing after Christopher Hitchens died.

 

[GenericReviewerDraco]

I know it's going to be really fucking horrific and that God will make sure you won't be able to get used to the pain. Something that unfathomably and unquestionably evil, tyrannical, and inhumane is right up Yahweh's alley.

God likes hurting people and punishing even the obedient because he is a tyrant and a sadist and is more or less the forerunner of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao. He's the cosmic equivalent of a manipulative abuser and we humans are the abused. The ones who are obedient and faithful have the ultimate case of Battered Wife Syndrome.

The Bible was merely a work of propaganda to get the proles to submit and dupe themselves into thinking they can avoid unfathomable horrific pain. The Bible is the OG Communist Manifesto, Heaven is the OG Worker's Paradise, Satan as the OG capitalist bourgeoisie, "degenerates" as the OG counter-revolutionaries, and Hell as the OG gulag. The demise of paganism and rise of Christianity in Europe was merely the Late Antiquity equivalent of the Cultural Revolution.

Marxism was merely a materialistic attempt at recreating the political success of Christian morality but all focused on the secular and material world.

We're all damned to suffer a truly horrific afterlife and burn in eternal pain that will never abate and beg for mercy from an evil tyrant who will refuse to grant us mercy and gloat as he torments us.

Satan isn't real, he's merely an Emmanuel Goldstein-esque figure to blame all of Yahweh's abuses on.

I'll admit, I may be a bit biased given my personal experiences, upbringing, and the studying I do in my own time to reach these conclusions. But if you want to be a puritan in the vain hope of not being sent to the great gulag down below, then more power to you. I won't stop you.

I'm spiritually blackpilled and the traditionalist Protestant interpretation of the Bible in particular is like the ultimate black pill.

I disagree. Mindlessly worshipping pleasure and hedonism above all else basically gave us a society that proves Jack Chick wasn't entirely wrong (he's still very lame, I'll agree)/Sodom and Gomorrah type garbage like California. People need the "fear of God" or they devolve into the snark bait that spergy moralists made unfunny comics about (yeah I'm aware of the D&D must be banned guy and the Catholic Church's sexual degeneracy, but I prefer people to put on the mask of "morals" rather than take senseless pride in their most debauched desires).

Generic post about the thread and not about Syaoran's galaxy-brained thoughts on the Bible and hateboner for moral spergery: No. American right wingers are censorious speds just like the left; they are just incompetent censorious speds, so the /pol/ faux Catholic edgelords feel safe that their "bread and circuses" won't suffer real consequences.

 

[KimCoppolaAficionado]

I disagree. Mindlessly worshipping pleasure and hedonism above all else basically gave us a society that proves Jack Chick wasn't entirely wrong (he's still very lame, I'll agree)/Sodom and Gomorrah type garbage like California. People need the "fear of God" or they devolve into the snark bait that spergy moralists made unfunny comics about (yeah I'm aware of the D&D must be banned guy and the Catholic Church's sexual degeneracy, but I prefer people to put on the mask of "morals" rather than take senseless pride in their most debauched desires).

Generic post about the thread and not about Syaoran's galaxy-brained thoughts on the Bible and hateboner for moral spergery: No. American right wingers are censorious speds just like the left; they are just incompetent censorious speds, so the /pol/ faux Catholic edgelords feel safe that their "bread and circuses" won't suffer real consequences.

Sadly, given even a cursory review of the personal conduct of many nobles during the Middle Ages (not to mention the Papacy itself throwing parties full of whores and the like under some of the worst popes) and the prevalence of very rude songs, stories, anecdotes, and what court records we have shows that the "fear of God" doesn't actually change the licentious nature of humanity. The idea that, when the Church had massive political power, everyone lived in some kind of benevolent despotism and "sinners" were massive statistical outliers is the result of a deeply-sanitized view of history and a very weak understanding of theology.
I agree very generally with the idea that certain delusions about morality are required for us to exist as a civilization- for example, the delusion that there is something stopping us from killing our neighbor beyond a question of power- but I think reaching the conclusion that THEREFORE, we must all adhere to Judeo-Christian moral codes as interpreted in (insert halcyon period here) is the hastiest of generalizations.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

You're a retarded redneck and an edgelord who has no real grasp of history or philosophy outside of /pol/ memes and Chick Tracts.

lol, advertising hom

People were truly suffering and miserable back then just as they are now. It just manifested differently.

Describe how humans have grown over the past 100 years so that our biology has permitted us to express our feelings differently. You have no grasp on evolutionary psychology

Please stop, you're making the guy who LARPS as a 20th-century Prussian

*Croatian peasant

The Bible was merely a work of propaganda to get the proles to submit and dupe themselves into thinking they can avoid unfathomable horrific pain. The Bible is the OG Communist Manifesto, Heaven is the OG Worker's Paradise, Satan as the OG capitalist bourgeoisie, "degenerates" as the OG counter-revolutionaries, and Hell as the OG gulag. The demise of paganism and rise of Christianity in Europe was merely the Late Antiquity equivalent of the Cultural Revolution.

Communist system. The reason Christians win in Europe is They have won over evolutionary strategies. Christians conquered Europe and did not change people through propaganda

and lionizes 11th-century Western Europe as the acme of human existence

If you do not think so, explain this

 

[KimCoppolaAficionado]

If you do not think so, explain this

I'm sorry, I can't explain your raging autism- science never may be able to do that.

 

[Syaoran Li]

lol, advertising hom

Describe how humans have grown over the past 100 years so that our biology has permitted us to express our feelings differently. You have no grasp on evolutionary psychology

*Croation peasant

Communist system. The reason Christians win in Europe is They have won over evolutionary strategies. Christians conquered Europe and did not change people through propaganda

1. You sir, are an idiot.

2. Evolutionary psychology doesn't work that way, especially on that short of a scale. The expression really manifested differently due to changes in technology, not biology or psychological evolution.

3. You're still a LARPer faggot either way

4. They initially conquered Europe through a mix of political propaganda and military violence, followed by a system of repression, oppression, and suppression to ensure that the propaganda would become self-sustaining after a certain point. By the time all was said and done, the masses of Europe only knew the propaganda of the Church and the nobility that benefited from it. It's no different than the propaganda of the communist parties in the 20th Century but without any real outside forces to break that hold and on a longer timescale.

It took the back-to-back game-changing blows of the Enlightenment, the Industrial Revolution, and the 20th Century to break that system.

5. Everyone was just as miserable in the era of puritanism and traditionalism, but it was not anywhere near as well documented as it is today AND the misery and widespread unhappiness manifested differently than it does today. The only reason society did not collapse despite the unhappiness is because of evolutionary psychology prevents mass suicide from becoming a thing under most conditions AND because suicide is deemed an unforgivable sin and so people's fear of Hell kicked in as well.

 

[GenericReviewerDraco]

Sadly, given even a cursory review of the personal conduct of many nobles during the Middle Ages (not to mention the Papacy itself throwing parties full of whores and the like under some of the worst popes) and the prevalence of very rude songs, stories, anecdotes, and what court records we have shows that the "fear of God" doesn't actually change the licentious nature of humanity. The idea that, when the Church had massive political power, everyone lived in some kind of benevolent despotism and "sinners" were massive statistical outliers is the result of a deeply-sanitized view of history and a very weak understanding of theology.
I agree very generally with the idea that certain delusions about morality are required for us to exist as a civilization- for example, the delusion that there is something stopping us from killing our neighbor beyond a question of power- but I think reaching the conclusion that THEREFORE, we must all adhere to Judeo-Christian moral codes as interpreted in (insert halcyon period here) is the hastiest of generalizations.

I agree with what you're saying, but it feels like its hard to find a secular system of morals that isn't based on "the fear of God" that doesn't violently corrupt itself immediately. Yeah I'm quite aware the "good old days" were pretty fucking shit, but modern people really have become the strawmen of old dead moralfags.

 

[Samson Pumpkin Jr.]

3. You're still a LARPer faggot either way

wrong

1. You sir, are an idiot.

wrong?

4. They initially conquered Europe through a mix of political propaganda and military violence, followed by a system of repression, oppression, and suppression to ensure that the propaganda would become self-sustaining after a certain point. By the time all was said and done, the masses of Europe only knew the propaganda of the Church and the nobility that benefited from it. It's no different than the propaganda of the communist parties in the 20th Century but without any real outside forces to break that hold and on a longer timescale.

Look here, That is why Satan's propaganda is so simple. When you look at the facts, Christianity is the best reason why Russia became a Christian. The king sent his advisers around the world to look for the best religion. It is Christianity. Now the Soviet Union has succeeded Russia in its superior Christian evolutionary strategies. When Russia first emerged, it was under communism. If communism and Christianity were the same, how would Russia feel under communism, not Christianity?

5. Everyone was just as miserable in the era of puritanism and traditionalism, but it was not anywhere near as well documented as it is today AND the misery and widespread unhappiness manifested differently than it does today. The only reason society did not collapse despite the unhappiness is because of evolutionary psychology prevents mass suicide from becoming a thing under most conditions AND because suicide is deemed an unforgivable sin and so people's fear of Hell kicked in as well.

Trannies have higher suicide rates than Jews during the holocaust. People in general have higher suicide rates and drug use. How can you ever call the society we're living in better than the past? By all tangible metrics we're worse off, but you'll wave it because somehow technology changed the way we think? Joe Rogan told me that we have monkey brains, the same monkey brains throughout human history. Nothing has changed,