Dr. Who

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AnOminous said:
It would actually have been a brave move to have a black Doctor in the '80s or '90s. Now it's just "oh another one of these." The most annoying thing about wokeshit is retards acting like they're being innovative by doing something that's been done over and over.
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Yeah I agree, but I suppose for me I tune a lot of it out or simply don’t watch it. Something that really irritated me a lot when I watched Doctor Who is something that I guess isn’t quite “wokeshit” although to me it feels like it. It’s the constant “pacifist” “nonviolent” fuckshit. The Doctor basically semi-causes half of the shit that happens in an episode by not actively engaging the enemy or simply by not killing them immediately or in the previous arc. I know that for the sake of the show he can’t just do that because it’d be a short episode, but the show doesn’t really ever call him out on this. If anything it applauds him.
 
The Gene Genie said:
The Doctor basically semi-causes half of the shit that happens in an episode by not actively engaging the enemy or simply by not killing them immediately or in the previous arc.
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The Doctor has never had qualms about killing what needed killing even if he preferred to solve things diplomatically. That's novel shit. He didn't genocide the Daleks, but he had no problem killing individuals that were an active threat. He's never been a pacifist.

And by that I mean the actual Doctor, not this nu-Who soyboy.
 
Unlike most I am not even mad that the 13 is a woman. What pisses me off is that Chibnall and Jodie were the ones to do it.

Moffat has been hyping a female doctor since that parody he did. Before BNew Who was even a thing.

Jodie’s is basically playing granny. She even dresses like a grandma, because God forbid men being attracted to women (never mind that 5, 9,10, and 11 were pretty boys. And Since 9 they had lots of tumblr fangirls ). She is playing a grandma doing a very very poor Tennat impression.

At least Moffat gave Missy some kind of Mary Poppins deal to his female master. The first female doctor deal is literally a granny that just wants to hang out with her “fam“. No clever jokes or the doctor having to cope with such a big change. Nothing.

What a waste. I won’t ever forgive Chibnall for wasting the idea of a female Doctor with the blandest doctor ever just so he could virtue signal his shit politics.
 
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6MillionCoofs said:
RTD isn’t writing like he did in 2005. Had a talk about Who on Christmas with the family. His writing, style and structure is way different than it was.

If it was the same as ot was, I’d not be hating it.
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I agree. He's a different man in Doctor Who Unleashed than he was in Confidential, he was always progressive but modern Russell looks anxious and frantic to insert social issues at the cost of a smooth story. Just look at the change to his attitude towards Davros. In the Confidential episode about Journey's End he basically expressed with a sparkle in his eye that Davros is perfect as-is for the revival and that the new detail they added (the body horror under his clothes) was meant to respectfully compliment the character's legacy, not overwrite it. Now he seems frantic to "improve" and apologize for the past that's not even totally his. His style might have changed with age but I think his partner dying destabilized him and more susceptible to modern world politics than he already was and his writing will suffer for it.
 
BroccoliBrainMkII said:
he was always progressive but modern Russell looks anxious and frantic to insert social issues at the cost of a smooth story.
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Which he wasn’t originaly. Not that he did not insert social issues or Who wasn’t woke as fuck for it’s time but the stories were designed with the social issues in mind as opposed to now where it feels like they are being forced in.

I assume other people in the writing room were checking his work and ironing out the forced bits

And most of the old writers are not there any more
BroccoliBrainMkII said:
Just look at the change to his attitude towards Davros. In the Confidential episode about Journey's End he basically expressed with a sparkle in his eye that Davros is perfect as-is for the revival and that the new detail they added (the body horror under his clothes) was meant to respectfully compliment the character's legacy, not overwrite it. Now he seems frantic to "improve" and apologize for the past that's not even totally his.
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That’s what makes me annoyed by the change. I vividly remembet how happy he was with Davros in 2005 era. I know he does not genuenly feel that Davros needs to not be in a chair. I have no problem with people being woke. I have no problem with works being woke. I have a problem with people not being honest in what they think. And I can just tell RTD does not believe some of thevshit he’s saying.
BroccoliBrainMkII said:
but I think his partner dying destabilized him and more susceptible to modern world politics than he already was and his writing will suffer for it.
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Oh absolutely, i’ve watched a fair bit of his other stuff. His writing has never been the same since. He hasn’t been either. And that’s sadly really understandable.

The fact that he did not really want to be back writing Who it seems and he lost his partner while still involved with Who stuff at the time probably does not help either.

Being back has got to be hard on him.
 
Vesperus said:
Remember when the Doctor Who Christmas specials reliably brought in over 12m viewers?
4.73m
Kek.
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12 million was the higher end and Wikipedia (suspect as ever) claims this last one was 7.3 million. The mismatch is because the 4.73 is the overnight, the total figures used tend to be a week's worth. However that is still pathetic compared to;


  • 1. Voyage of the Damned (2007) 13.31 million
  • 2. The Next Doctor (2008) 13.10 million
  • 3. A Christmas Carol (2010) 12.11 million
  • 4. The End of Time – Part 1 (2009) 12.04 million
  • 5. The Time of the Doctor (2013) – 11.14 million
  • 6. The Doctor, the Widow and the Wardrobe (2011) 10.77 million
  • 7. The Snowmen (2012) – 9.87 million
  • 8. The Christmas Invasion (2005) 9.84 million
  • 9. The Runaway Bride (2006) 9.35 million
  • 10. Last Christmas (2014) 8.28 million
  • 11. The Return of Doctor Mysterio (2016) 7.83 million
  • 12. The Husbands of River Song (2015) 7.69 million
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For viewing ease have it by year
  • The Christmas Invasion (2005) 9.84 million The Runaway Bride (2006) 9.35 million
    Voyage of the Damned (2007) 13.31 million
    The Next Doctor (2008) 13.10 million
    The End of Time – Part 1 (2009) 12.04 million
    A Christmas Carol (2010) 12.11 million
    The Doctor, the Widow and the Wardrobe (2011) 10.77 million
    The Snowmen (2012) – 9.87 million
    The Time of the Doctor (2013) – 11.14 million
    Last Christmas (2014) 8.28 million
    The Husbands of River Song (2015) 7.69 million
    The Return of Doctor Mysterio (2016) 7.83 million
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When this CW looking thing is eating your lunch on viewing figures in an episode that introduces a new Doctor (see the 13.10 figures for The Next Doctor) you should be ashamed.

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Flexo said:
Well a couple of things.
1) All 3 shows had a 'duo' structure. Doctor + Companion - Two Brothers - Detective + Sidekick.
2) All 3 shows had (apparently) super hot guys in them that made the entire tumblr website wetter than Niagara falls, so pairing all the husbandos together made a collective squeal that could be heard for miles.
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And two of them were written by the same creator, which tied them together.
 
SherlockMexicano said:
I don’t know man. But I am guessing he had more fangirls than capaldi. Capaldi is a good actor but he replaced Matt Smith, and compared to him he is more like a granpa.
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Other than the Jew honker he has a sort of rugged good looks.
 
SherlockMexicano said:
Unlike most I am not even mad that the 13 is a woman. What pisses me off is that Chibnall and Jodie were the ones to do it.
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I don't think anyone particularly cared until a female doctor was solely about being a female doctor. Except for me. I'd honestly prefer it if the doctor were white and male just because I want cultural appropriators not to have things that they think they're entitled to. I don't think "representation" is important, at all. And anyone who says it is, is a mediocre human being that can't do better than "I feel good because a certain TV character looks like me".

Like the whole "it's about time" thing. Why is it "about time"? There is literally nothing important about the Doctor being female, except for the fact that culture warriors and their entirely arbitrary elevation of a character to enough power that if a woman isn't that thing, there's isn't equality of some shit.

But that's really where we are in culture. I don't know where I read it, but it's basically that "progressives" let white men live in their heads all day long. They've elevated to white men to such a status that anything white men have (when it achieves a perfectly arbitrary amount of prestige, attention and money) that some "oppressed" minority must have it or else it's still a white supremacist patriarchy.

No, sometimes a character is just white and male. And maybe if your minority character can't stand on their own merit instead of the reflected glory of previous incarnations, maybe it's because you focused on the "minority" character part and not the part where you develop the character.
 
AnOminous said:
Other than the Jew honker he has a sort of rugged good looks.
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He does. I don't think he is ugly, or anything. I enjoyed his good acting skills so I don't care.

I just think that Doctor Who lost all the Tumblr fangirls once Matt Smith left because it was the first time the main lead wasn't a pretty young man since Eccleston.

Not a bad thing mind you. The classic doctors weren't young pretty boys, save for 5 and 8, either.

My point is that many new who fans didn't get used to the doctor being an older guy. Specially the fangirls. But I personally don't care because, I just like the sci Fi stories
 
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SherlockMexicano said:
I just think that Doctor Who lost all the Tumblr fangirls once Matt Smith left because it was the first time the main lead wasn't a pretty young man since Eccleston.
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One of the worst things that ever happened to Doctor Who is that they needed to pander to fandom shipping.

I was never a fan of Old Who, but New Who was always so cringe to me when the subject turned to whatever pretty young girl was swooning over the Doctor, because first of all, I think the trope of extraordinarily old being falling for dewy ingenue is fundamentally gross. We could turn that discussion to the acceptance of grooming, but I don't really want to go there right now. Second, though, is that it assumes that someone that old can even fucking relate to someone that much younger.

There was one scene in Capaldi's run where he called a couple of people "screaming kids" because they were threatening each other with war, and finally and for once, somebody wrote the Doctor as someone who is his age: someone with a perspective of centuries, who's seen the fallout from war and how unpredictable and ugly it is.

That's who the Doctor should be. Him and plenty of other modern writers of characters in TV shows that seem to think all of these older characters aren't complete without a love interest, or can't conceive someone their own age exists, but is an appropriate companion. Even River Song, though contrived to be old, still felt kind of icky because the Doctor knew her as a baby.
 
The Gene Genie said:
If they were going that route they should’ve just done Richard Ayoade,
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Gods yes. I would sell your soul to have Richard Ayoade play the Doctor. Especially if they had him play against type and not like Moss.

AnOminous said:
The Doctor has never had qualms about killing what needed killing even if he preferred to solve things diplomatically. That's novel shit. He didn't genocide the Daleks, but he had no problem killing individuals that were an active threat. He's never been a pacifist.

And by that I mean the actual Doctor, not this nu-Who soyboy.
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2 things always made the Doctor the best IMO:
1) He was well traveled enough to be wary of judgement. Some of the best sagas were of him weighing things carefully and trying to sus out the truth rather than just jumping to conclusions because he understands that you can be manipulated into doing something awful that way.
2) Not necessarily pacifist, but I always loved when he would arrange things such that the villain might be given a chance if they choose correctly, but destroyed if they didn't. It's more of a challenge to tell a story that way and it's one of the reasons I forgive the episode with the Silent and moon landing more than others.

Not A Bunny said:
Like the whole "it's about time" thing. Why is it "about time"? There is literally nothing important about the Doctor being female, except for the fact that culture warriors and their entirely arbitrary elevation of a character to enough power that if a woman isn't that thing, there's isn't equality of some shit.
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It all makes sense when you apply this one rule:

Social Justice is an attempt to apply communism to social capital.

And yes, fiction and works of culture have social capital just like people do. Corporations like to call them "brands" and "cultural penetration" but it's all just social capital - your experience and feelings towards it.

Wells something like Dr. Who - it got its social capital over 60 years now. It goes back generations and it something grandparents and youth alike can connect over. It's social capital is immense.

But it's all social capital devoted to white men. So we've got to try and swap out minorities into it so they can have some of that social capital now. The problem is - it doesn't work that way. You can't cheat this stuff.
 
SherlockMexicano said:
I don’t know man. But I am guessing he had more fangirls than capaldi. Capaldi is a good actor but he replaced Matt Smith, and compared to him he is more like a granpa.
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AnOminous said:
Other than the Jew honker he has a sort of rugged good looks.
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I prefer to call it a distinguished Grecian profile. Some men don't lose their attractiveness or dashing-ness as they age; Capaldi definitely has his fangirls, I assure you.

I liked Capaldi's last season best out of the new series partly because of his age. Whatever sex appeal he may have had for his audience, it wasn't part of the plot. They'd brought back the Doctor-companion dynamic that I knew and loved from classic Who: the slapdash/brilliant eccentric taking an ordinary young human on awesome adventures, with the Doctor as a sort of teacher/avuncular figure. Absolutely not a love interest, which would be a stupidly imbalanced relationship, as has been mentioned.

This new Doctor (14? 15?) is the first one I've seen played by someone younger than me, and that just feels weird. The Christmas special felt weird, like I'm far too old to be watching this shit. Has there ever been a musical episode before? Is Doctor Who just going to be this Disneyfied from now on or will actual science fiction make an appearance at some point?
It was ... OK overall, I guess, though the new Doc and companion haven't really distinguished themselves yet.

On the subject of black Who: it should have been Lenny Henry, as per this sketch he did in 1985: https://youtu.be/60shMyabeMo?si=JggPdME6ueHYjolY
 
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