Dragon Ball Thread - RIP Akira Toriyama

[Gordumb Bumway]

Bringing up DBM again because it's finally at the finale of the tournament after like 20 fucking years, and they revealed Goku's new ultimate transformation a while back. (Like 5 years after the end of Super) and now we actually have a colored version for it it's literally just as UI as people accused it of being.

Salagir and Asura are just going to have to accept that people that see an augmented base form for Goku will compare it to UI, Even though in the context of the story this form is practically just the same thing as Ultimate Gohan except through training rather than being unlocked. In some of these panels it really does look similar to UI. It especially looks like it in that cover because of the highlights in the hair.


What is the really dumb part IMO is what they decided to name the form.

>"We shouldn't bother to name this form"
>Proceeds to name it
Yes, the form is actually called "Normal Super Saiyan" aka SSJN. I get what they were going for but it's such a lame name lol.

What I find more humorous is the culmination of the I'K'L plotline. Which Salagir intended as a gag but decided to turn it into...something.
Why is this androgynous (which I found humorous with the confusion and praises of femboys of the comments, and all of its features are female and only its pronouns are male lol) in a superhero getup with the number two? I didn't see any explanation for this, it really does remind me of the Gammas from the series that shall not be named in the comment section.


In an act of mercy from our dear authors, the pozzdroid gets annihilated by the GOAT true and honest woman lover Yamcha 26 pages from her birth, thankfully sparing us from yet another multi-month tournament derailment.

Their moderators are also pedophiles, (at least one of them)

That's terrible but not surprising, do you know that backstory of that?

NGL I'd hate Super too if I was some French faggot making a webcomic and I got banished into nigh complete irrelevancy because Super, Daima and Heroes all came along and made your dogshit look even worse. (Even fucking Heroes is more coherent, and that's just promotional manga for an arcade game.)

DBM is interesting because it came out during the drought before DBS began, and the first episode of the animated adaptation was able to get 5 million views 12 years ago, which is nothing to sniff at. I do wonder just how much attention it has retained, because the ceiling for videos recapping recent parts can barely get a few hundred thousand views.

The DBM fanbase does love to act smug and pretend that it is much better than official product, but it really isn't (Except maybe Super's version of BoG and ROF lol.) The story is hard carried by what is IMO really good art but the actual story isn't all that interesting and is filled with a lot of questionable decisions I'm sure you are familiar with. DBGT and DBS, despite having many flaws, are far more interesting to me with the concepts, plots, and premises it puts forward than DBM doing "What if Broly, who isn't the movie Broly, but basically the movie Broly but not really killed all the heckin Z fighters?" Don't get me wrong, that's fine for a fan work, but the problem comes when people start sniffing their farts and thinking their fan manga is the next Macbeth or whatever.

Actually scrap that DBM is the best Dragon Ball product ever because it gave us this glorious image.

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

That's terrible but not surprising, do you know that backstory of that?

That I do, in fact, an argument can be made for Asura himself (the main artist) being a pedophile.
Well, "argument". Bro drew nude from the back art of a "chibi" version of Phipsil in his more realistic style.
But when you draw a chibi character in his style, what you're actually doing is drawing a nude 8 year old.
Queue the "UHM ACTUALLY IT'S ACTUALLY AN ADULT WOMAN WHO IS JUST BEING DRAWN IN THE BODY OF A CHILD SO UHM GET HECKIN OWNED CHUD." which was used as a defense by Salagir (Laurent Gomez) himself over on Kanzenshuu. (Salagir also once had a small meltdown in the DBM comments about the idea that Marine LePenn would win in France despite him no longer living in France and the total ban of political discussion in his comment section)


I don't know if he's retarded, or he's just pretending not to know the difference between a hyper-deformed chibi version of a character and the naked child that Asura drew (That you can still see a modified version of on the penultimate page of that Chibi Son Bra comic).

The moderator in question is that Zen Buu faggot who is constantly on the verge of a nervous break down because the story he jannies for gets criticized.
I won't post the actual image, but I can post the faggot mod discussing it and seemingly being on the verge of "ouuggghhhing" at it


End of the day, if this is the sort of stuff that Asura is happy to show publicly, who fucking knows what he draws in his spare time.

 

[Rick The Stick]

hard carried by what is IMO really good art

This is one of the things that bugs me most. A lot of art in DBM is fucking great, but it's surrounded by absolutely dogshit plots, even by fanfic standards, and paneling.

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

This is one of the things that bugs me most. A lot of art in DBM is fucking great, but it's surrounded by absolutely dogshit plots, even by fanfic standards, and paneling.

Honestly, I think that Asura's dogshit panelling is one of the worst parts of DBM. Like it's clear he's a talented artist, but you've got dickriders frequently saying how it looks "better" than the original manga, when not only does it not look better than something that had 15 pages drawn a week without a single break (compared to 3 a week), the panelling is often outright bad. Akira Toriyama imo is pretty well renowned as possibly the best panelist in manga, or at the very least he's way up there.
Compare say, this

To this



Note that Asura basically just did a 3x3 page spread with Goku and Vegeta punching each other in the face over and over, while Toriyama's work is extremely dynamic and exciting, with each panel flowing well into the next, drawing the eye to the elements on the page just as the story requires.

 

[Echinacea]

I think abour the saiyan tuffles conflict a lot

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

I think abour the saiyan tuffles conflict a lot

the funniest part about the conflict is that going by the official timeline, after King Retard Monkey genocides the tuffles, like, the very same year, King Cold arrives and goes "it's free real estate" and conquers the Saiyans.
One can only imagine that the Tuffles may have had some sort of advanced technology in place to prevent such a thing occuring or were a valued trade partner considering their technology..

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

the funniest part about the conflict is that going by the official timeline, after King Retard Monkey genocides the tuffles, like, the very same year, King Cold arrives and goes "it's free real estate" and conquers the Saiyans.
One can only imagine that the Tuffles may have had some sort of advanced technology in place to prevent such a thing occuring or were a valued trade partner considering their technology..

Unpopular opinion I'm sure, but I'd like to see a political Dragon Ball story, kinda like the Star Wars prequels.

 

[Gravityqueen4life]

I think abour the saiyan tuffles conflict a lot

Not much to think about. The Saiyan's chimped out and genocided the Tuffles.

Are Tuffles even part of the cannon anymore? You dont hear much about them. Its like they dont want to remind people of what the Saiyan's did because white washing them would be more difficult. They probably would say the Tuffles were racist and using Saiyan's as slaves or something.

 

[Galax27]

the funniest part about the conflict is that going by the official timeline, after King Retard Monkey genocides the tuffles, like, the very same year, King Cold arrives and goes "it's free real estate" and conquers the Saiyans.
One can only imagine that the Tuffles may have had some sort of advanced technology in place to prevent such a thing occuring or were a valued trade partner considering their technology..

Or the Saiyans were considered a valuable asset..
A soldier just smart enough to leave cities/technology/nature intact for higher sale value, while being strong enough to wipe out populations and love it? Seems like a fantastic muscle for your galactic planet selling business.

 

[PS1gamenwatch]

It is the birthday of the VA of Videl and Pan

 

[Gondolindrim]

Have I ever done my rant about how Whis and Beerus ruined the franchise by being these nonsensically powerful characters who only seem to exist to solve plot points and bitch out Goku and Vegeta?

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

Have I ever done my rant about how Whis and Beerus ruined the franchise by being these nonsensically powerful characters who only seem to exist to solve plot points and bitch out Goku and Vegeta?

Beerus and Whis were fine when they were first introduced in BoG, but they became substantially less OK in every entry following. Where it becomes more and more nonsensical the longer things go on that Beerus would have been satisfied with a battle against Super Saiyan God Goku when he's currently stronger than UI Goku without ever having trained.
In the movie, they were clearly at a similar level, at this point though It'd be like if Perfect Cell fought a Saibaman and went "Yes, I am satisfied with this and my desire to destroy Earth placated.." after winning.

 

[Echinacea]

the funniest part about the conflict is that going by the official timeline, after King Retard Monkey genocides the tuffles, like, the very same year, King Cold arrives and goes "it's free real estate" and conquers the Saiyans.
One can only imagine that the Tuffles may have had some sort of advanced technology in place to prevent such a thing occuring or were a valued trade partner considering their technology..

i laughed during the frieza fight when you're supposed to feel bad for the saiyans and vegeta. They had it coming. My head canon is king cold and frieza were starting to get annoyed with them being all "muh saiyan pride motha focka"

Not much to think about. The Saiyan's chimped out and genocided the Tuffles.

Are Tuffles even part of the cannon anymore? You dont hear much about them. Its like they dont want to remind people of what the Saiyan's did because white washing them would be more difficult. They probably would say the Tuffles were racist and using Saiyan's as slaves or something.

I find the idea of an advanced civilization being wiped out by dumb violent chimps to be rather poignant. Also, genociding the tuffles was hardly the only time saiyans pulled that shit

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

Or the Saiyans were considered a valuable asset..
A soldier just smart enough to leave cities/technology/nature intact for higher sale value, while being strong enough to wipe out populations and love it? Seems like a fantastic muscle for your galactic planet selling business.

Saiyans did not leave cities/technology/nature intact.
Their favorite strategy involved turning into laser beam ape Kaiju and killing everyone and destroying everything.
A literal hyperchimpout.

Regardless, it can't just be that King Cold valued the Saiyans as military assets, otherwise he simply would have invaded when the Tuffles still owned the planet, but instead he seemingly took control the moment that the Saiyans were in charge. My theory is that Cold would've been wary of attacking the Tuffles directly because they in flashbacks are shown to have scouter tech and shit like that, and he might've just considered them too useful to risk direct conquest. (Or wary of some sort of Tuffle Gigaweapon, that they have two of in non-canon stuff, Hatchiyack and Baby)
The Saiyan Tuffle War raged from Age 720 to 730.
The Saiyans then got conquered by Cold in Age 731.
Sad!

 

[Friendly Primarina]

The Saiyan Tuffle War raged from Age 720 to 730.
The Saiyans then got conquered by Cold in Age 731.
Sad!

It was that recent? God, I need to watch GT again. It's clearly been too long. I thought it was decades or centuries beforehand Unless I'm mistaken, that's just six years before Goku was born

 

[Cave Fisher]

Unpopular opinion I'm sure, but I'd like to see a political Dragon Ball story, kinda like the Star Wars prequels.

I'm actually surprised they never ONCE elaborated on that side of the worldbuilding, because on one hand, of course that's what the series is interested in, but on the other hand, WHO the hell is Frieza selling planets to? Vegeta scolds nappa for destroying a city because of the "resale value" and stuff, but for Frieza to bother selling planets would when he was the strongest person awake in the universe for a good amount of time would have to imply there's civilizations out there that he just doesn't wanna tell "Hey. Give me whatever I want or I'll send the Ginyus to kill you all" for some reason.

Have I ever done my rant about how Whis and Beerus ruined the franchise by being these nonsensically powerful characters who only seem to exist to solve plot points and bitch out Goku and Vegeta?

I don't know, but that's why I still hate the divinity system. Whis and Beerus were good in BoG, where Beerus was clearly meant to be stronger than Goku but no overwhelmingly, and for Whis to be notably stronger than him, to instill the "there's always someone stronger" message and get Goku and Dragon Ball in general back in the game, so to speak. But in Super, they're set as some kinda hard cap where despie Goku unlocking some new rainbow color transformation and killing universes, he'll always be weaker than Beerus at like 0.7% power, and he and Whis only really serve to show up every now and then, immediately solve the problem, remind you they can immediately solve the problem anytime they want, and/or make the whole cast, usually Vegeta, their bitches and they can't do anything about it, and the only time Beerus gets taken down a peg for being a sociopathic asshole is when he's near Zeno, who's an even bigger sociopathic asshole that's entirely liable to kill the entire multiverse milliseconds after the End of Z because he's bored Goku went off to train Uub.

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

I'm actually surprised they never ONCE elaborated on that side of the worldbuilding

Then you aren't paying attention.
Being surprised that Akira Toriyama didn't expand on worldbuilding is like being surprised that wood burns when you set it on fire. It's just something that he doesn't ever do. He was the sort of guy to get a cool idea and then run with it with little thought as to how it works.
Also, Dragon Ball Super's manga literally did elaborate on this side of the worldbuilding under Toyotaro's direction, and it was kinda shit. Saiyans go around genociding planetary populations so that other races that have lost their home planets can colonize them.

Zeno, who's an even bigger sociopathic asshole that's entirely liable to kill the entire multiverse milliseconds after the End of Z

The most fascinating part about this is that this aspect of the world building was utterly ignored outside of a single villain in fucking Heroes of all things, who absolutely loathed gods and the status quo and actually wanted to kill Zeno and all the other gods to free the universe from what was effectively tyranny by all powerful incompetence.
In the end, Gogeta is used to beat him, and when said villain goes "You have the power to defeat the Gods, why do you live under this status quo...?" Gogeta pretty much just says "Status quo good lol" and then kills him.
Hearts was a real nigga. He then proceeds to do nothing but help out in the proceeding arcs despite literally being dead.

 

[Lone Star]

worldbuilding

This is the same series where the divine hierarchy changes every other arc after Kami was introduced, with the top of the pecking order changing as the plot demands.

 

[Symbol of the Chud]

This is the same series where the divine hierarchy changes every other arc after Kami was introduced, with the top of the pecking order changing as the plot demands.

Toriyama is the only author who ever got away with introducing God, then God's Boss (Yemma), then God's Boss' Boss, who has a Boss we don't canonically see, who has a Boss we do see, who has a Boss that got absorbed off screen, who has a counterpart who is vastly superior to him, who has a boss he is terrified of.
Zeno is God's Boss' Boss' Boss' Boss Boss' Boss.

 

[Gordumb Bumway]

Hearts was a real nigga. He then proceeds to do nothing but help out in the proceeding arcs despite literally being dead.

Hearts is unironically a tragic hero trying to liberate the universes from petulant, incompetent tyrants. I loathe Zeno as a character and it's even worse that we were forced to tolerate two of him after the future one vaporized the future timeline (and thus Future Gohan and everyone in the afterlife too.) It makes them look moronic when you think that the GoDs were dying and the angels were shutting off, and the Grand Priest either didn't notice or didn't care? Do these chumps do anything? Surely they would care because they care about the universe ratings because it's made to seem that it matters that Universe 7 and Universe 9 are among the lowest ranked universes. And Zamasu killing all the mortals and GoDs would surely lower the ratings dramatically...

The Zenos are the Toriyama appearance/power trope subversion taken to the greatest extreme except they have no charm and are very annoying.

he and Whis only really serve to show up every now and then, immediately solve the problem, remind you they can immediately solve the problem anytime they want,

Another reason Zeno sucks, because Goku literally has him in his back pocket with that button. The only reason that Zeno isn't called for every serious threat as a favor is because Goku and Vegeta are battle junkies. Now there's nothing wrong with that for their characters, but Toyotaro just needs to write that button out of the story because it serves literally no positive benefit. Have Goku step on it as a gag or something.