Fallout series

[millais]

The Enclave is like the ultimate culmination of the Deep State and glow-in-the-dark alphabet agencies. So they would be against Trump.

 

[Snekposter]

I think everyone would be against him for the simple fact that solving problems makes it less likely the world of Fallout even happens.

 

[Fougaro]

You know guys, with us being in such New Vegas mood and all. I really had this weird idea.

How you imagine each major reaction of Fallout New Vegas would react to 2020 and our own political factions? Such as Trump, Antifa, the EU, the UN, and etc.

Maybe this is inspired with those NV videos that show what each major leader thinks of the other faction, exposing their flaws but still not beyond complimenting them on what they do right. Thats what made NV's factions so complex and, well, human. None of them are purely good or evil (tho the legion comes dangerously close to it).

Besides I get a kick at seeing people talking about each faction

As for Mr. House: He would have some initial sympathies for Trump being a fellow business man and entrepreneur until he'd realise that in the end Trump is all bark but no bite. He would't see Antifa or BLM any different from the raiders and chem-addicted savages that roam and terrorise the wastelands. As for the EU and UN, he'd see them the same as the old pre-war America: Entities based on ideals that are doomed to fail.

When you think about it, it's hard to tell since the Fallout setting would be different if it was like real life. A real life NCR would be basically CHAZ. The Legion would either steamroll their way to the Pacific or disintegrate, depending if an IRL Caesar would form the Legion according to its real counterpart or if he too would be a Romanboo that misunderstood Roman history. In the end, the former United States would be conquered and reunified by the Institute.

 

[CWCissey]

As for Mr. House: He would have some initial sympathies for Trump being a fellow business man and entrepreneur until he'd realise that in the end Trump is all bark but no bite. He would't see Antifa or BLM any different from the raiders and chem-addicted savages that roam and terrorise the wastelands. As for the EU and UN, he'd see them the same as the old pre-war America: Entities based on ideals that are doomed to fail.

When you think about it, it's hard to tell since the Fallout setting would be different if it was like real life. A real life NCR would be basically CHAZ. The Legion would either steamroll their way to the Pacific or disintegrate, depending if an IRL Caesar would form the Legion according to its real counterpart or if he too would be a Romanboo that misunderstood Roman history. In the end, the former United States would be conquered and reunified by the Institute.

Nah I'd say the NCR would just be drawn towards the neolib end of American politics, they'll just be the coastal elites.

If any faction is CHAZ/Antifa it would be The Railroad.

 

[Fougaro]

Nah I'd say the NCR would just be drawn towards the neolib end of American politics, they'll just be the coastal elites.

If any faction is CHAZ/Antifa it would be The Railroad.

I'm thinking less of ideology but how things would turn out in practice. Based on what I know of California, a real NCR will immediately become CHAZ the moment they inevitably run out of someone else's money. Unless of course the nuclear holocaust and the harsh post-apocalyptic reality has culled all the retards and the NCR is like: "Let's try it again, but this time without communism!".

 

[WinchesterPremium]

I'm thinking less of ideology but how things would turn out in practice. Based on what I know of California, a real NCR will immediately become CHAZ the moment they inevitably run out of someone else's money. Unless of course the nuclear holocaust and the harsh post-apocalyptic reality has culled all the retards and the NCR is like: "Let's try it again, but this time without communism!".

California did become CHAZ. That's why you have to spend the first two games gunning down folks. It only manages to become a respectable nation after the player character guns down most of the bad guys for them.

 

[The handsome tard]

You know, I wil confess, I LIKE Fallout 4, I dont love it like I love 1-NV. I really think it had great concepts and characters that just didnt reach their full potential. (tho it does help Im currently playing with it filled to the brim with mods that actually make it far more enjoyable).

One of the things that just boggles my mind is why Bethesda didnt take any hints from New Vegas. Its still technically a Fallout game and, despite not being made by them, it was still a by product of their engine. Obsidian did show you can do great with their outdated engine and that was done only in 18 months! Bethesda had years of preparation and examples on how to do Fallout properly.

Imagine, a Fallout game with the mechanics of 4 with the RPG elements off NV (Fallout 4 New Vegas not withstanding), how great would that be?
And honestly, the mechanics of NV wouldnt be hard to put in 4, especially things like faction reputations. Its such a small thing but it goes a long way, especially since F4 did had its fair share of factions, like the Minute Men, the Institute, the Railroad, the BOS and a few smaller ones. Personally I would have prefered if the Gunners were an actual faction that you could make friends or enemies out of (or remain neutral the entire way). Hell, why not give the raiders some complexity? They could still be assholes to shoot at but they could at least have smaller different versions to show even the raiders have their own factions and groups.
Seriously, why hasnt Fallout had a Raider companion yet? At most we had Jericho from 3 and thats it, Fallout 4 could have used of one that could at least show that the raiders have their own power structure and arent as mindless as they seem, just extremely hostile to anyone who isnt them.
And man, am I the only one who cant stand how comically useless speech is in 4? Seriously, speech barely has any impact anymore, the only reason you would ever invest in Charisma at all are for perks for your settlements. As far as I know, there are no SPECIAL unlocked dialogue, something even F3 had. It ironically makes the Sole Survivor seem like such a stale piece of white bread and Im not even asking for low intelligence lines (tho it would be hilarious to see the VAs reading those outload).

Recently I livestreamed a F3 challenge, "Unarmed only" challenge to be specific and I did enjoy just how I could build a character around the fact he can only use his fists. It made me think if I could do the same for 4 and I actually cant...the solo survivor doesnt leave much to the imagination and his/her quest for Shawn feels like it runs against the desire to play the game. I know that RPGs have this thing where the main quest really makes it clear how time is running out and you gotta hurry aaaand then you run off to do only God knows how many side quests for what could be months in-game time and then you return to the main quest and they act like it has been just a couple of minutes.
However F4 really somehow makes that even worse. I personally "paused" the main quest at when you gotta go to the Glowing Sea, I sort of made this headcanon that the solo survivor needs to get ready for it, which allows him to have time to meet all factions and build some of the settlements. But I know deep down that, given the character's pre-established motivations, he probably wouldnt fuck around with settlements and the other factions and just make a B-line towards the Glowing Sea. The plot wants to move forward but it cant because I want to play the game.
At least F3 and NV were easier to justify exploring the maps in your head, you could say it was all to search for your Father/Benny ultimately but TSS's motivations to do so are simply because me, the player, want to play the fucking game. That destroys the immersion.

So yeah, F4 is still a fun game (especially with mods) but it really felt like Bethesda streamed lined the experience far too much and it doesnt feel like the result of several years worth of developtment. I know they had the graphics to work with but I do think that fleshing out the world and fitting it with the Fallout lore was just as important...because if New Vegas has shown anything, we are willing to accept weaker graphics if we are offered a great and varied lore and characters to interact with.

 

[Notgoodwithusernames]

NCR would be pro-Biden, the Legion would be pro-Trump and House would be the galaxy brained centrist.

In all seriousness while I can't speak for NCR and Legion, House, being a Howard Hughes esque mid-20th century style visionary, would be incredibly disappointed in real life 2020, here we have all this technology and so much potential and we're holding ourselves back arguing over bullshit that doesn't really matter (like muh colonialism) to us in the 21st century instead of trying to make the 21st century the best it can be.

Mr House is Moviebob if he had the actual intellect to back up his BS

 

[Dom Cruise]

You know, I wil confess, I LIKE Fallout 4, I dont love it like I love 1-NV. I really think it had great concepts and characters that just didnt reach their full potential. (tho it does help Im currently playing with it filled to the brim with mods that actually make it far more enjoyable).

One of the things that just boggles my mind is why Bethesda didnt take any hints from New Vegas. Its still technically a Fallout game and, despite not being made by them, it was still a by product of their engine. Obsidian did show you can do great with their outdated engine and that was done only in 18 months! Bethesda had years of preparation and examples on how to do Fallout properly.

Imagine, a Fallout game with the mechanics of 4 with the RPG elements off NV (Fallout 4 New Vegas not withstanding), how great would that be?
And honestly, the mechanics of NV wouldnt be hard to put in 4, especially things like faction reputations. Its such a small thing but it goes a long way, especially since F4 did had its fair share of factions, like the Minute Men, the Institute, the Railroad, the BOS and a few smaller ones. Personally I would have prefered if the Gunners were an actual faction that you could make friends or enemies out of (or remain neutral the entire way). Hell, why not give the raiders some complexity? They could still be assholes to shoot at but they could at least have smaller different versions to show even the raiders have their own factions and groups.
Seriously, why hasnt Fallout had a Raider companion yet? At most we had Jericho from 3 and thats it, Fallout 4 could have used of one that could at least show that the raiders have their own power structure and arent as mindless as they seem, just extremely hostile to anyone who isnt them.
And man, am I the only one who cant stand how comically useless speech is in 4? Seriously, speech barely has any impact anymore, the only reason you would ever invest in Charisma at all are for perks for your settlements. As far as I know, there are no SPECIAL unlocked dialogue, something even F3 had. It ironically makes the Sole Survivor seem like such a stale piece of white bread and Im not even asking for low intelligence lines (tho it would be hilarious to see the VAs reading those outload).

Recently I livestreamed a F3 challenge, "Unarmed only" challenge to be specific and I did enjoy just how I could build a character around the fact he can only use his fists. It made me think if I could do the same for 4 and I actually cant...the solo survivor doesnt leave much to the imagination and his/her quest for Shawn feels like it runs against the desire to play the game. I know that RPGs have this thing where the main quest really makes it clear how time is running out and you gotta hurry aaaand then you run off to do only God knows how many side quests for what could be months in-game time and then you return to the main quest and they act like it has been just a couple of minutes.
However F4 really somehow makes that even worse. I personally "paused" the main quest at when you gotta go to the Glowing Sea, I sort of made this headcanon that the solo survivor needs to get ready for it, which allows him to have time to meet all factions and build some of the settlements. But I know deep down that, given the character's pre-established motivations, he probably wouldnt fuck around with settlements and the other factions and just make a B-line towards the Glowing Sea. The plot wants to move forward but it cant because I want to play the game.
At least F3 and NV were easier to justify exploring the maps in your head, you could say it was all to search for your Father/Benny ultimately but TSS's motivations to do so are simply because me, the player, want to play the fucking game. That destroys the immersion.

So yeah, F4 is still a fun game (especially with mods) but it really felt like Bethesda streamed lined the experience far too much and it doesnt feel like the result of several years worth of developtment. I know they had the graphics to work with but I do think that fleshing out the world and fitting it with the Fallout lore was just as important...because if New Vegas has shown anything, we are willing to accept weaker graphics if we are offered a great and varied lore and characters to interact with.

I don't hate Fallout 4 but it was a bit disappointing, all of the Minecraft style shit does nothing for me, I know this is just a matter of personal taste and for some that's the main draw of the game, but for me I would have liked it a lot better had it just been like Fallout 3 but with better graphics, I just found all the settlement building and crafting irritating.

 

[WinchesterPremium]

Seriously, why hasnt Fallout had a Raider companion yet? At most we had Jericho from 3 and thats it, Fallout 4 could have used of one that could at least show that the raiders have their own power structure and arent as mindless as they seem, just extremely hostile to anyone who isnt them.

Didn't they have one in the theme park DLC?

 

[Dreamer]

Didn't they have one in the theme park DLC?

The dlc doesn't really help since its written just as well as the base game. It attempts to give raiders some personality but they're still just bloodthirsty maniac who kill for fun only now they have 3 subfactions with 1 identifying quirk each. Its still >what do they eat, and doesn't really let you be the bad guy since bethesda chickened out of the player being responsible for anything actually evil. Imo.

 

[Exceptionally Exceptional]

Finally decided to venture to the Pitt in TTW (seriously, Fallout 3 works better as DLC for NV than it did as it's own game) and I'm struggling here. On the one hand Ashur seems to genuinely want things to get better. On the other hand he's going about it in the worst possible way imaginable by aligning himself with vicious psychopaths and enslaving people.
Even Caesar's Legion looks benevolent in their treatment of slaves by comparison.
And it's hard not to notice that the slaves seem to be recieving almost none of the benefits here. The Raiders seem to have decent food while the slaves are forced to eat slop made of irradiated water and trog guts. Then there's the fact that they're being worked to death and shot if it's percieved they're "slacking off" by their drugged up overlords who look for any excuse to kill.

Even if a cure is found I'm pretty sure the raiders would never let things change. Quite a few of them show an absolutely insane amount of disdain for the slaves, despite a few of their own having come from their ranks.

In the end I think I'm going to have to put a bullet through this faggots skull. If he had at least provided better food, medical care, reasonable working conditions, and forbid his men from just murdering slaves like they were animals, maybe I would have been able to swallow the shit and agree it's for the best. But really, it doesn't look like it is. Fuck, even one of his own fucking men, Werhner, realized nothing is going to change under Ashur and tried to overthrow him.


This is the closest Bethesda got to the nuance of New Vegas, and it's still insanely unsatisfying with how limited everything is. Why can't I convince Ashur that there's a better way or at least to tell his men to stop being absolute shitheads?

 

[Mola Ram]

Finally decided to venture to the Pitt in TTW (seriously, Fallout 3 works better as DLC for NV than it did as it's own game) and I'm struggling here. On the one hand Ashur seems to genuinely want things to get better. On the other hand he's going about it in the worst possible way imaginable by aligning himself with vicious psychopaths and enslaving people.
Even Caesar's Legion looks benevolent in their treatment of slaves by comparison.
And it's hard not to notice that the slaves seem to be recieving almost none of the benefits here. The Raiders seem to have decent food while the slaves are forced to eat slop made of irradiated water and trog guts. Then there's the fact that they're being worked to death and shot if it's percieved they're "slacking off" by their drugged up overlords who look for any excuse to kill.

Even if a cure is found I'm pretty sure the raiders would never let things change. Quite a few of them show an absolutely insane amount of disdain for the slaves, despite a few of their own having come from their ranks.

In the end I think I'm going to have to put a bullet through this faggots skull. If he had at least provided better food, medical care, reasonable working conditions, and forbid his men from just murdering slaves like they were animals, maybe I would have been able to swallow the shit and agree it's for the best. But really, it doesn't look like it is.


This is the closest Bethesda got to the nuance of New Vegas, and it's still insanely unsatisfying with how limited everything is. Why can't I convince Ashur that there's a better way or at least to tell his men to stop being absolute shitheads?

The only reason to side with Ashur is that Wernher is obviously worse. The Pitt gets completely overrun by trogs and it's implied Wernher sees Ashur's child as nothing but a blob of meatloaf from which he can extract the cure. It's nowhere near as nuanced as the hype (oh, gee, the guy who recruited you for the mission turns out to have a secret agenda and isn't as squeaky clean as he pretends, how novel) and is reflective of Bethesda's usual dunderheaded writing.

 

[Prophetic Spirit]

Finally decided to venture to the Pitt in TTW (seriously, Fallout 3 works better as DLC for NV than it did as it's own game).

EDIT: Holy fuck, i don't see the first line, fucking blinded of not sleeping in 2 days.
Yeah, that mod is a must-like in my playthoughs; i can't play Fallout 3 of it's own anymore.
At least Rebuilding the Capitol (a TTW ported mod from FO3) was good; sadly the investment feature goes to being generic too quickly and the Post-Ending mod is beatiful; no NCR and no Legion in my Anarchist playthroughs.

 

[Exceptionally Exceptional]

The only reason to side with Ashur is that Wernher is obviously worse. The Pitt gets completely overrun by trogs and it's implied Wernher sees Ashur's child as nothing but a blob of meatloaf from which he can extract the cure. It's nowhere near as nuanced as the hype (oh, gee, the guy who recruited you for the mission turns out to have a secret agenda and isn't as squeaky clean as he pretends, how novel) and is reflective of Bethesda's usual dunderheaded writing.

Honestly this is why I hope Microsoft actually hires on the old Obsidian team who made NV to do all the writing from now on. Bethesda's writing is servicable for a first draft, but it needs refinement.
Imagine if New Vegas had been so myopic. You'd have to choose either NCR or Legion with no other options like Mr House or an independent Vegas.

And I can't entirely blame Werhner if he does view the baby as nothing more than a means to a cure. Ashur's paternal feelings towards his child is actively slowing down the research into the cure. If the cure meant his daughter had to die to obtain it he wouldn't be willing to make that sacrifice and everything he worked towards would be for nothing, creating a diseased nation doomed to die.

Really, either way you look at it the Pitt is totally fucked in the end. And Bethesda needs a writing room tard wrangler.

 

[The handsome tard]

Finally decided to venture to the Pitt in TTW (seriously, Fallout 3 works better as DLC for NV than it did as it's own game) and I'm struggling here. On the one hand Ashur seems to genuinely want things to get better. On the other hand he's going about it in the worst possible way imaginable by aligning himself with vicious psychopaths and enslaving people.
Even Caesar's Legion looks benevolent in their treatment of slaves by comparison.
And it's hard not to notice that the slaves seem to be recieving almost none of the benefits here. The Raiders seem to have decent food while the slaves are forced to eat slop made of irradiated water and trog guts. Then there's the fact that they're being worked to death and shot if it's percieved they're "slacking off" by their drugged up overlords who look for any excuse to kill.

Even if a cure is found I'm pretty sure the raiders would never let things change. Quite a few of them show an absolutely insane amount of disdain for the slaves, despite a few of their own having come from their ranks.

In the end I think I'm going to have to put a bullet through this faggots skull. If he had at least provided better food, medical care, reasonable working conditions, and forbid his men from just murdering slaves like they were animals, maybe I would have been able to swallow the shit and agree it's for the best. But really, it doesn't look like it is. Fuck, even one of his own fucking men, Werhner, realized nothing is going to change under Ashur and tried to overthrow him.


This is the closest Bethesda got to the nuance of New Vegas, and it's still insanely unsatisfying with how limited everything is. Why can't I convince Ashur that there's a better way or at least to tell his men to stop being absolute shitheads?

Im going to play Devil's Advocate here and say Bethesda CAN have moments of moral ambiguity beyond the one you just said. One example is the finale of Far Harbor's main quest.
Spoilers for those who still didnt play Far Harbor but intend to:

Spoiler: Spoilers

DiMA, the head synth of Acadia (the only by synth for synth home for synths, none of that railroad stuff) hid his own memories from himself (the reason is pretty long so I wont bother explaining), once you recover them he realizes that he came up with a plan to replace the mayor of Far Harbor with an identical synth who would have its memories wiped out to properly replace the woman (and he made it clear that they abhore senseless killing and mind wiping a synth, so it made DiMA come off as a disgusting hypocrite). The reason he did that was to make peace between the citizens of F.H and the synths of Acadia and it worked (but he was so horrified at himself that he decided to remove those memories and hide them away).
With the truth exposed, you are given a few options (tho there are more on the grand scheme but only the ones available right away), expose DiMA and his lies to the people of Far Harbor, which could risk destroying Acadia as the mob at the town will feel understandably frightened of the synths (it would lead to Kasumi, the girl you came to F.H to look for, getting killed and thus failing the whole mission), you convince DiMA to willingly give himself in to the people of Far Harbor so only he suffers the consequences and Acadia doesnt (DiMA gets executed no matter what but Acadia is saved. Oh and you actually need a high speech check for this...yeah, wow, your speech actually is worth jack in Far Harbor) and finally you can keep the secret and DiMA decides to suggest you help him replace the leader of the Children of Atom (yeah, they return in F4...but now as a generic evil doomsday cult instead of the weird but ultimately harmless cult in Megaton) as this would help bring peace too.

And Im not even considering the Brotherhood of Steel and RailRoad getting involved, the children of atom questlines and endings where you can nuke them, Far Harbor, both and etc.

Say whatever you want about Bethesda, things like these show that they HAVE the potential of being NV good when they really want to.

Do you bring DiMA to justice at risk of destroying a community of innocents? And even if Acadia is spared, should DiMA pay for what was a misguided but ultimately still well intended attempt at creating actual peace (things are legit peaceful, not buts)? And if his plans actually work at bringing peace, is it worth it to sacrifice the flawed leaders of both communities? Just how far would you go for peace, one built on lies but peace none the less? And for justice?

The only way of acheiving a peaceful ending between the 3 factions requires it to be built on lies. Does that really make it peace? How long will it last? Does this mean you and DiMA are no better than the Institute now? Suddenly all your morals are questioned for what truly is the greater good and what sacrifices must be taken to achieve it.

Its legit genius from Bethesda and it makes me wonder where the hell was this type of writing through the most of Fallout 4.

 

[Trainfucker]

Am i the only one that likes the simple “Good vs Evil” main quest of Fallout 3?

It has brilliant twists and leaves you excited wondering what is going to happens next (for me the important part in a story).

Leave the moral ambiguity for the side quests IMO.

 

[Ruin]

Am i the only one that likes the simple “Good vs Evil” main quest of Fallout 3?

It has brilliant twists and leaves you excited wondering what is going to happens next (for me the important part in a story).

Leave the moral ambiguity for the side quests IMO.

I think a lot of Fallout 4's plot problems could have been fixed by making the Brotherhood of steel the only joinable faction, making the Institute slightly more evil, and the finale being a brotherhood vs Institute fight.

Yea it would have been a rehash of Fallout 3's Brotherhood vs Enclave conflict but the five way faction thing they tried to do was too messy and their writers weren't talented enough to write a morally gray faction like the Legion.

 

[Mola Ram]

Its legit genius from Bethesda and it makes me wonder where the hell was this type of writing through the most of Fallout 4.

Far Harbor is so far beyond the writing of Fallout 3 and 4 I seriously wondered if they found some New Vegas guys to ghostwrite it. There are no good answers for how to resolve DiMA's situation, just what you can live with. They even put a human face on the Children of Atom, which until Far Harbor functioned on the level of a cartoon.

 

[Trainfucker]

I think a lot of Fallout 4's plot problems could have been fixed by making the Brotherhood of steel the only joinable faction, making the Institute slightly more evil, and the finale being a brotherhood vs Institute fight.

Yea it would have been a rehash of Fallout 3's Brotherhood vs Enclave conflict but the five way faction thing they tried to do was too messy and their writers weren't talented enough to write a morally gray faction like the Legion.

The problem was that the factions where just on a sliding scale from good to bad which completely removes all moral ambiguity and just makes you want to pick either the railroad or the minutemen and then get bored of the game.