Fallout series

The only justification for super mutants that aren't sterile is a single line fom Marcus in Fallout 2 when asked if super mutants are really sterile.
"Nope. Well, not now. It takes a few years after bein' dipped to get the juices flowing again. Why?"

One problem with that though.
"While Marcus says that he is no longer sterile, Chris Avellone, who wrote that dialogue, confirmed that Marcus was only joking and that super mutants remain entirely sterile."

Could be a retcon of a retcon, but still stands.
They're still infertile. Even Fallout 3 and Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel noted that. The Fallout 3 mutants have to kidnap people and dip them to make more mutants, while the Fallout: BoS mutant leader is trying to solve the fertility crisis. And in New Vegas, the most they do is scrounge up a small number of their fellow mutants in small settlements, they can't breed more.
 
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I thought the main problem with Super Mutants is that they can't impregnate people? They're firing blanks! That's why if you have a female Chosen One in Fallout 2 who becomes Francis' gimp, she does not get pregnant, despite the fact that no condom on Earth can fit a Super Mutant's loins.

Most of these devs only pay attention to the parts of the lore they care about. The ones they don't care about are conveniently forgotten.


Nah nah if you read the autistic lore they wrote they handwave it as a fucking super mutant scientist using a clone embryo or some shit from the New California protag to impregnate the lone wanderer's mother

Still makes it creepy and fetishy as fuck
 
Nah nah if you read the autistic lore they wrote they handwave it as a fucking super mutant scientist using a clone embryo or some shit from the New California protag to impregnate the lone wanderer's mother

Still makes it creepy and fetishy as fuck
Ways that they could do this without forced super mutant impregnation:

Your character is actually James or Catherine having changed their name and identity.

Aliens transfer your consciousness into a new body.

Time travel shennanigans. You get sucked through a portal the second you leave Vault 101 which shits you out In New California (just remove the fucktarded bullshit about being a clone of the Vault Dweller) and you get shat back the moment you're done.

But no, some people are just obsessed with rape.
 
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I would argue that Caesar is more clever than he is actually intelligent

The man read about a society that was successful because of its free citizens, robust public sphere, and military that
constantly adapted to use the best technology. He took this history and created a despotic kingdom that successfully uses machetes against laser machine guns. There's a good mixture of retarded and genius in that man.
 
Played the multiplayer mod for New Vegas today, The installation was fast, but the way you actually get in game is aids. It's pretty much in the same state as Skyrim Together's current release.
 
The man read about a society that was successful because of its free citizens, robust public sphere, and military that
constantly adapted to use the best technology. He took this history and created a despotic kingdom that successfully uses machetes against laser machine guns. There's a good mixture of retarded and genius in that man.
That's because they're less Rome and more "nomadic raiders with Roman drill and discipline". They're continually on the march, continually fighting or drilling, and while they may not use most chems, stuff like healing powder, the bitter drink, and hydra see extensive use among their ranks. They may not be Rome itself, but Gaius Marius would shed a single manly tear of appreciation at seeing how wonderfully the Legion campaigns. Caesar flat-out admits to the Courier the current Legion is just an end to a means for him, and as soon as he takes New Vegas he'll reform them into something truly Roman instead of what they are now. Its ironic really that the Legion are no different from the barbarians that conquered Rome in that regard.
Caesar: "That's right. Decades of warfare, absorbing lesser tribes, gathering power. Forging the dross into a vast, razor-sharp scythe. My Legion's expansion has never ceased. Much of the Utah and Colorado, and all of Arizona and New Mexico, are mine. We have cities of our own, but nothing compared to Vegas. Finally, my Legion will have its Rome."
Caesar: "The NCR has all of the problems of the ancient Roman Republic - extreme bureaucracy, corruption, extensive senatorial infighting. Just as with the ancient Republic, it is natural that a military force should conquer and transform the NCR into a military dictatorship. Thesis and antithesis. The Colorado River is my Rubicon. The NCR council will be eradicated, but the new synthesis will change the Legion as well... ...from a basically nomadic army to a standing military force that protects its citizens, and the power of its dictator."
And some cut content from Sawyer:
The additional Legion locations would have had more traveling non-Legion residents of Legion territories. The Fort and Cottonwood Cove made sense as heavy military outposts where the vast majority of the population consisted of soldiers and slaves. The other locations would have had more 'civilians'. It's not accurate to think of them as citizens of the Legion (the Legion is purely military), but as non-tribal people who live in areas under Legion control.
While Caesar intentionally enslaves NCR and Mojave residents in the war zone, most of the enslavement that happens in the east happens to tribals. As Raul indicates, there are non-tribal communities that came under Legion control a long time ago. The additional locations would have shown what life is like for those people.
The general tone would have been what you would expect from life under a stable military dictatorship facing no internal resistance: the majority of people enjoy safe and productive lives (more than they had prior to the Legion's arrival) but have no freedoms, rights, or say in what happens in their communities. Water and power flow consistently, food is adequate, travel is safe, and occasionally someone steps afoul of a legionary and gets his or her head cut off. If the Legion tells someone to do something, they only ask once -- even if that means an entire community has to pick up and move fifty miles away. Corruption within the Legion is rare and Caesar deals with it harshly (even by Legion standards).
In short, residents of Legion territories aren't really citizens and they aren't slaves, but they're also not free. People who keep their mouths shut, go about their business, and nod at the rare requests the Legion makes of them -- they can live very well. Many of them don't care at all that they don't have a say in what happens around them (mostly because they felt they never had a say in it before the Legion came, anyway)."
Long story short, he's almost certainly going to pause and reform and rebuild his army after conquering actual civilized areas. Remember, unless Meyer is Sheriff of Primm and gets them to resist, in a Legion victory it stays open as a trading post with constant Legion presence... not exactly what you would expect from the Legion as we see it, now is it? Add in the fact that the Legion is already capable of operating along modern lines with their current Roman-styled organization and hierarchy and you have the makings of a truly Roman military, armed and equipped with modern weapon and equipment. Especially if Caesar can "convince" the Gun Runners at their factory to provide for the Legion.

Remember, Caesar taught the Blackfoots small-unit tactics and firearms maintenance and care when he started out, so it isn't like he has some hate-boner for firearms. I've posted elsewhere in this thread about Caesar being ruthlessly pragmatic in how the Legion operates instead of stupid, so I won't repeat myself there again. Long story short, less about hating guns and more about logistics, resupply, and potential slave uprisings being a bitch. With control over Vegas and an expansion of merchants (see Dale Barton at the camp), all three of those issues are mitigated, so a modern-style reformation isn't exactly impossible, and almost certain to happen among the veterans.
 
Obviously you can draw historical parallels any which way given the length and breadth of history, but Caesar's Legion (at least of what you can see in FNV) always reminded me more of the Zulu kingdom under Shaka's despotic military reforms, more than Rome's Late Republic or Early Empire.

An entire nation under arms, conquering and assimilating all the other tribes and nations in its path, who are rendered into either warriors or slaves. The military might of the warriors built upon physical toughness, endurance and mobility on the march, and discipline, plus the aggressive melee centric fighting style prevailing against foes with weaker ranged weaponry (swap out assegais/knobkerries for machetes/thermal lances/ballistic fists). The conquest providing the engine of growth for the economy as well, such that the leader's capital resembles and functions basically as an impermanent armed camp or temporary bivouac more than a city.
 
That's because they're less Rome and more "nomadic raiders with Roman drill and discipline". They're continually on the march, continually fighting or drilling, and while they may not use most chems, stuff like healing powder, the bitter drink, and hydra see extensive use among their ranks. They may not be Rome itself, but Gaius Marius would shed a single manly tear of appreciation at seeing how wonderfully the Legion campaigns. Caesar flat-out admits to the Courier the current Legion is just an end to a means for him, and as soon as he takes New Vegas he'll reform them into something truly Roman instead of what they are now. Its ironic really that the Legion are no different from the barbarians that conquered Rome in that regard.


And some cut content from Sawyer:

Long story short, he's almost certainly going to pause and reform and rebuild his army after conquering actual civilized areas. Remember, unless Meyer is Sheriff of Primm and gets them to resist, in a Legion victory it stays open as a trading post with constant Legion presence... not exactly what you would expect from the Legion as we see it, now is it? Add in the fact that the Legion is already capable of operating along modern lines with their current Roman-styled organization and hierarchy and you have the makings of a truly Roman military, armed and equipped with modern weapon and equipment. Especially if Caesar can "convince" the Gun Runners at their factory to provide for the Legion.

Remember, Caesar taught the Blackfoots small-unit tactics and firearms maintenance and care when he started out, so it isn't like he has some hate-boner for firearms. I've posted elsewhere in this thread about Caesar being ruthlessly pragmatic in how the Legion operates instead of stupid, so I won't repeat myself there again. Long story short, less about hating guns and more about logistics, resupply, and potential slave uprisings being a bitch. With control over Vegas and an expansion of merchants (see Dale Barton at the camp), all three of those issues are mitigated, so a modern-style reformation isn't exactly impossible, and almost certain to happen among the veterans.
Basically, the Legion has more in common with Augusto Pinochet and other third-world dictators than any barbarian tribe, as much as NCR fans would like to say otherwise. They patrol their territory and collect taxes, as well as kill troublemakers. So long as you nod your head and do as you're told, you're allowed to carry on with your business. And I'm sure that if these civilians contributed to the Legion in some way, they'd get rewarded by Caesar one way or another.

If I were to create say, Legion civilians in the Fort, I'd mostly have rich and smart folks running around in the camp paying tribute to Caesar. Some brahmin rancher paying tribute in the form of beef and other food goods for the army, some ex-Enclave guys who come by to "donate" newly-made plasma rifles and power armor to Caesar's elite guard, and I'd even have them hang around the slave pens after their "audience" with Caesar where they'll be buying newly-captured NCR slaves from some Legion troops auctioning them off for some money. The brahmin rancher will buy some freshly-enslaved NCR troops and civilians for some pack mules, the Enclave dudes will buy some captured NCR rangers for their science experiments, among other things.

Once Caesar conquers the Mojave and eventually, California, the Legion will partially resemble the NCR, and they might even employ female soldiers and use drugs in the future. Caesar might settle down and create the militarized republic he wanted Aaron Kimball to make, where basically it'll be similar to the NCR in most aspects, except it's under military rule. Caesar himself admired Kimball to a certain extent, only to be disappointed when Kimball became a politician instead of seizing control of the legislature with his army:

"A man of potential, held back by the craven political context he inhabits. You realize he was a general? 'The Hero of the Mojave,' they called him. A title he earned by extirpating lesser tribes that dared attack NCR citizens. His responses were swift and draconian. President Tandi, the 'founding mother,' coddled hostile tribes... but her successors were less naive, so they gave Kimball free rein. And after a respectable military career, what does he do? Become a politician. What better way to stunt the growth of leaders, not to mention whole cultures? A leader shouldn't have to kowtow to those who serve him. With so much energy wasted on those below, how is he ever to move forward? Had he taken the government by force, used his army to stage a coup, things would be very different. I'll just have to do it for him."

Considering that Caesar himself was an NCR citizen, turning the Legion into a militarized version of the NCR was probably going to be his endgame. Caesar admired Kimball for his decisive actions against hostile tribes, and he only turned against the man because Kimball became a political whore. Had Kimball taken control of the government by force with the military, Caesar would have probably allied with him instead. You'd get no Legion-NCR war, just two military dictators trading with each other in the west while hunting down what's left of the Western Brotherhood of Steel and using House as a go-between for both their factions.

So 20 years down the line, you'd see a more cosmopolitan Legion, one that has probably adapted the use of technology like power armor and riot gear, and one that would have some of the NCR's advantages, while having none of its weaknesses. It would also have the side effect of making the Legion more stable once he dies, the generals would probably just elect a new leader the moment he kicks the bucket. Someone like Vulpes or the Courier, perhaps.
 
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One thing that kinda irks me is that you couldn't just up and take over the Legion completely. I mean, it's a society where might makes right. Gimme a dialogue option to tell Caesar "This is MY Legion now, old man!" and have it out in the arena. At which point you would have to go off Lanius as well. Then you end up needing to elect a new Legate from the Praetorian or perhaps Vulpes Inculta could be persuaded into the job through speech checks.

"But wouldn't that fuck up the plot?"

Not necessarily. because it could just insta-neg your rep with the NCR to villified and prevent it from ever going higher. Mr. House refuses to speak with you and Yes Man is found out and disabled by him. Now you HAVE to go the Legion route. But now you can make the Legion what you want it to be.

You're given a quartermaster who can be given materials and caps to upgrade the legion to wear proper armor and guns. It would take a lot of caps and scrap, but every bit makes the Legion stronger until your legionaries are wearing a standard of armor that is twice the strength of the NCR.

But a lot of this would rely on them having fleshed out the Legion territories, because I would want you to have to quest around as the new Caesar building shit up and putting down the inevitable disquiet your sudden seizure of power has caused. You'd also get a Praetorian companion to accompany you in your travels.

You can make proclamations as Caesar, changing the laws of the Legion to suit your own tastes. Free the slaves or keep them, allow women into the Legion or not, choose what to do with or to the various factions.

How to keep the NCR a threat? While you've been dicking around reinforcing you own hold on the Legion the NCR has brought in a fuckload of reinforcements. The heavy troopers of the NCR have finished mopping up the threats to the NCR's food supply and have been transferred to the frontlines, and accompanying them are several platoons of freshly trained NCR soldiers. Now you're going to be wading through a LOT more enemy soldiers.

Thinking about fighting alongside the Brotherhood? Think again. While you were busy elsewhere Hardin (or another ranking Paladin if Hardin is somehow dead) discovered McNamara's indiscretion and ousted him, And he views you as a threat. Good luck getting to that self destruct button, you're going to have to fight anyway. In fact, that bunker could be very valuable, and perhaps taking it would get you some power armor for your troops, as well as a sole surviving paladin to train them and a bunch of scribes and a knights to help maintain the equipment.
The Brotherhood of Steel Mojave chapter becomes the 78th "Tribe" conquered by the legion under your command.

Veronica would then have to be hunted down and dealt with. You corner her and can choose what to do, kill, enslave, or convince. If you've made certain decisions in your Legion she can be made to see that your vision of things is very much in line wit her sensibilities.
"Veronica, I've freed the slaves. Women have more rights. The Brotherhood survives, but as part of my Legion. Their technology will finally be used to help everyone!"

Boone? Well, he could have been part of it the whole time. Maybe HE is the Praetorian companion, you give him that honored position for helping you kill Caesar, or as recompense for his wife,

Cass? She'll definitely love the hell out of you when you have McLafferty and the Van Graffs crucified for torching caravans like common raiders.

Arcade? He's probably gonna be the hardest, because you're still an authoritarian dictator leading a heavily militarized state. But there can be options. Debate that faggot into submission. Or use the Confirmed Bachelor perk (male only) to seduce him into supporting you. Or just order him to be enslaved after you beat him to unconsciousness.

It would be pretty fun, ngl.
 
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One thing that kinda irks me is that you couldn't just up and take over the Legion completely. I mean, it's a society where might makes right. Gimme a dialogue option to tell Caesar "This is MY Legion now, old man!" and have it out in the arena. At which point you would have to go off Lanius as well. Then you end up needing to elect a new Legate from the Praetorian or perhaps Vulpes Inculta could be persuaded into the job through speech checks.

"But wouldn't that fuck up the plot?"

Not necessarily. because it could just insta-neg your rep with the NCR to villified and prevent it from ever going higher. Mr. House refuses to speak with you and Yes Man is found out and disabled by him. Now you HAVE to go the Legion route. But now you can make the Legion what you want it to be.

You're given a quartermaster who can be given materials and caps to upgrade the legion to wear proper armor and guns. It would take a lot of caps and scrap, but every bit makes the Legion stronger until your legionaries are wearing a standard of armor that is twice the strength of the NCR.

But a lot of this would rely on them having fleshed out the Legion territories, because I would want you to have to quest around as the new Caesar building shit up and putting down the inevitable disquiet your sudden seizure of power has caused. You'd also get a Praetorian companion to accompany you in your travels.

You can make proclamations as Caesar, changing the laws of the Legion to suit your own tastes. Free the slaves or keep them, allow women into the Legion or not, choose what to do with or to the various factions.

How to keep the NCR a threat? While you've been dicking around reinforcing you own hold on the Legion the NCR has brought in a fuckload of reinforcements. The heavy troopers of the NCR have finished mopping up the threats to the NCR's food supply and have been transferred to the frontlines, and accompanying them are several platoons of freshly trained NCR soldiers. Now you're going to be wading through a LOT more enemy soldiers.

Thinking about fighting alongside the Brotherhood? Think again. While you were busy elsewhere Hardin (or another ranking Paladin if Hardin is somehow dead) discovered McNamara's indiscretion and ousted him, And he views you as a threat. Good luck getting to that self destruct button, you're going to have to fight anyway. In fact, that bunker could be very valuable, and perhaps taking it would get you some power armor for your troops, as well as a sole surviving paladin to train them and a bunch of scribes and a knights to help maintain the equipment.
The Brotherhood of Steel Mojave chapter becomes the 78th "Tribe" conquered by the legion under your command.

Veronica would then have to be hunted down and dealt with. You corner her and can choose what to do, kill, enslave, or convince. If you've made certain decisions in your Legion she can be made to see that your vision of things is very much in line wit her sensibilities.
"Veronica, I've freed the slaves. Women have more rights. The Brotherhood survives, but as part of my Legion. Their technology will finally be used to help everyone!"

Boone? Well, he could have been part of it the whole time. Maybe HE is the Praetorian companion, you give him that honored position for helping you kill Caesar, or as recompense for his wife,

Cass? She'll definitely love the hell out of you when you have McLafferty and the Van Graffs crucified for torching caravans like common raiders.

Arcade? He's probably gonna be the hardest, because you're still an authoritarian dictator leading a heavily militarized state. But there can be options. Debate that faggot into submission. Or use the Confirmed Bachelor perk (male only) to seduce him into supporting you. Or just order him to be enslaved after you beat him to unconsciousness.

It would be pretty fun, ngl.
You pretty much do take over the Legion eventually. Caesar puts your face on the money, which for those of you who haven't read about Roman history and politics, was the Imperial way of saying that someone is the next heir to the throne. Granted, you don't take over the Legion ingame, but it's implied down the line that you eventually succeed Caesar. Especially since by that time, you do have an impressive resume with them. You've annihilated camp after camp of profligate troops, you've assassinated both the ruler of New Vegas AND the NCR President, you've eradicated a Brotherhood of Steel chapter all by yourself, and you spearheaded the Legion's assault and led them to their most important victory. That makes you more impressive than even Lanius, so I can see Caesar putting you ahead of Lanius in terms of succession policy.

And of course, if you wanted to take over and make your own faction, Yes Man is always there. Cass likes it, Arcade likes it, Veronica likes it so long as you don't kill the Brotherhood, Boone and the others don't really care, and it's the ideal ending the game points to, with both of the flawed superpowers chased out of the land while the local towns prosper alongside New Vegas.
 
You pretty much do take over the Legion eventually. Caesar puts your face on the money, which for those of you who haven't read about Roman history and politics, was the Imperial way of saying that someone is the next heir to the throne. Granted, you don't take over the Legion ingame, but it's implied down the line that you eventually succeed Caesar. Especially since by that time, you do have an impressive resume with them. You've annihilated camp after camp of profligate troops, you've assassinated both the ruler of New Vegas AND the NCR President, you've eradicated a Brotherhood of Steel chapter all by yourself, and you spearheaded the Legion's assault and led them to their most important victory. That makes you more impressive than even Lanius, so I can see Caesar putting you ahead of Lanius in terms of succession policy.
Yeah, but I think brute forcing your way in would be a lot more satisfying.

And of course, if you wanted to take over and make your own faction, Yes Man is always there. Cass likes it, Arcade likes it, Veronica likes it so long as you don't kill the Brotherhood, Boone and the others don't really care, and it's the ideal ending the game points to, with both of the flawed superpowers chased out of the land while the local towns prosper alongside New Vegas.
The Independent ending should be the cannon one.
 
Yeah, but I think brute forcing your way in would be a lot more satisfying.
I suppose, but that's what the Yes Man ending is for. I brute-forced my way to kill Caesar and his top generals, then I defeated both the Legion and the NCR.

The Independent ending should be the cannon one.
It's probably the one ending Obsidian likes best, but I'd rather have the House Ending be canon so they can use him again in a future Fallout game.
 
I don't want a House that isn't voiced by Rene Auberjonois.
Fuck, I just remembered he was dead.

I'm pretty sure there could be good imitators out there. If not, then maybe a House ending where someone ended up supplanting him and leading the western factions against the east coast BoS.
 
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So in my current playthrough of New Vegas, having learned of Mr House and his relationship with the NCR and Legion, I actually might end up helping him win the war at Hoover Dam. The NCR are snakes that cheat and steal anything that they can get their hands on (not all of them mind you, just some) and their plans were to completely backstab Mr House and forfeit the treaty they made with him. The Legion don't want to backstab anyone because they were never friends with the Strip in the first place, but I don't like how they do things. Mr House might actually be a better payoff in the long term for Vegas because he actually has experience and background that seems way more promising than the flimsy stuff NCR is trying to peddle.
 
lets hope you can SNEED this time.

i will repeat myself. the frontire was NOT a bad mod. the main NCR storyline was cringe at times and felt more like a tech demo just to show what crazy shit modders can do with the games engine but, the frontire map itself is beautiful and one of the most fun places to explore with alot of secrets, story and characters.

i doubt even besheda no longer has it in them to create something this good and the modders, DID IT FOR FREE!
 
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You pretty much do take over the Legion eventually. Caesar puts your face on the money, which for those of you who haven't read about Roman history and politics, was the Imperial way of saying that someone is the next heir to the throne. Granted, you don't take over the Legion ingame, but it's implied down the line that you eventually succeed Caesar. Especially since by that time, you do have an impressive resume with them. You've annihilated camp after camp of profligate troops, you've assassinated both the ruler of New Vegas AND the NCR President, you've eradicated a Brotherhood of Steel chapter all by yourself, and you spearheaded the Legion's assault and led them to their most important victory. That makes you more impressive than even Lanius, so I can see Caesar putting you ahead of Lanius in terms of succession policy.

And of course, if you wanted to take over and make your own faction, Yes Man is always there. Cass likes it, Arcade likes it, Veronica likes it so long as you don't kill the Brotherhood, Boone and the others don't really care, and it's the ideal ending the game points to, with both of the flawed superpowers chased out of the land while the local towns prosper alongside New Vegas.
Doesn't Boone turn on you on any non-NCR playthrough? I know I remember him bitching at me for the Yes Man and Mr. House routes.
 
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