Feb 28, 2022 - Chris transferred to another facility

[Second-Hand Boat Supplies]

Failure of either would render Chris unable to assist in his defense, and enough to keep him in treatment.



I think the assumption is a fairly safe one, given that his court date scheduling is in line with § 19.2-169.3

His mental state may have changed, but we can at least infer from his writings immediately before the court date, which seem to be extremely delusional not only about the universe in general, but about his prospects in court. He seemed absolutely convinced that praying to him would send him home.

You're right. I should clarify slightly to be more clear about my conclusion. We can be almost certain that Chris's mental state is bad but I was hoping that the tests used to determine that could tell us a little more about what his behavior is actually like. Initially, I thought it would because I get the feeling that older tests were much more focused on the ability to comprehend proceedings than on general ability to make rational decisions and I found writing mostly about those tests. If that was true, we would have learned something interesting because Chris being unable to answer "what do the police say you did?" or "what does the judge do?" would be a severe decline from anything we saw before.

My point was that my previous reasoning was wrong; we don't get a specific picture of Chris's behavior or nature of his incompetency. The list of possible forensic tests allows for such a wide variety of reasons to fail that we can't infer anything beyond what we already could from the transfer and six months.

 

[Ophelia]

I wonder if he could answer the questions, but chose not to, opting to be sullen and uncooperative instead. He might have been banking on how easy and swift his time spent behind bars was on prior occasions, thinking he didn’t need to answer any questions because they’d be sending him home anyway. If that’s true, he hasn’t necessarily declined much, in a sense.

I’m not saying that’s what happened, I just wonder. His ego could have made him a different kind of stupid.

 

[Second-Hand Boat Supplies]

I wonder if he could answer the questions, but chose not to, opting to be sullen and uncooperative instead. He might have been banking on how easy and swift his time spent behind bars was on prior occasions, thinking he didn’t need to answer any questions because they’d be sending him home anyway. If that’s true, he hasn’t necessarily declined much, in a sense.

I’m not saying that’s what happened, I just wonder. His ego could have made him a different kind of stupid.

That is called malingering in the forensic psych literature and supposedly they have tests to differentiate it from true lack of competence, but I found those tests equally difficult to actually find much detail about

 

[Turbocuck]

I've been looking everywhere for actual pdfs of forensic psychology instruments for competency to stand trial but so far I've found nothing that isn't tightly hidden behind a paywall. I don't feel like traveling to my local university library and hunting down the physical copy either lol. If anyone has the right login, the canonical standard is this one ( https://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/doi/abs/10.1176/ajp.128.1.105 ) So far, the best I've found is just this collection of the different possible measures available which is still very interesting. https://arizonaforensics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Forensic-Tests.pdf

The article you linked is available on Sci-hub. I've attached it.

Here's the test itself, apparently. I guess the defendant is asked to complete these sentences and is then scored on whether they say kooky things.

Spoiler: Test

 

[ANobody]

If I recall. Hundreds upon hundreds of people called at once. You really can't ignore these kinds of things.

Chris got what he deserves because he's an idiot who's finally facing real consequences. But in the end he's still human and he's still fascinating to watch. In a dark way. This is probably best for Chris. He gets 3 meals, a warm bed, and is safe from weens. As much as Chris pisses me off with the dumb shit he does. I'd hate for him to be on the streets.

Honestly don't know if he can survive it. I can see him wander off and never to be seen again. Whispers of his siting from town to town by weens and christorians alike. Until finally the state declares him as dead.

Chris doens't have the physical status or mental capacity to go somewhere isolated to die. My bet is he's found crumpled up under a freeway, dead of hypothermia or something along those lines. No big "Lovely Bones" mystery

Now that I think about it, there's no way he wasn't in contact with Barb. How would he have known of the car accident?

Oh I dunno, one of the COs told him? As they're legally obligated to do?

 

[Pointless Sperg]

My point was that my previous reasoning was wrong; we don't get a specific picture of Chris's behavior or nature of his incompetency. The list of possible forensic tests allows for such a wide variety of reasons to fail that we can't infer anything beyond what we already could from the transfer and six months.

If a practicing attorney in Virginia happens to be on the farms -- and so far there hasn't been one that's self-identified -- they can probably inform us of the competency evaluations used there. Virginia kiwis here who have attorney friends might be able to ask them.

Chris clearly has no understanding how court works though, despite having multiple cases under his belt, and he still relies on how it's portrayed in cartoons. Since he had only intensified clinging to his cartoon world reality, it would make sense that he still had no idea what was happening.

The charges that he currently faces aren't any more serious than the Snyder chargers (both are Class 5 felonies). I don't expect Chris to know what that means exactly, but what he did know is that all he had to do was sign a paper and he got to go home. (He didn't even have to plead guilty since he took an Alford plea that time). In addition he had Barb there to help wrangle him a bit.

I think he would fail *any* forensic test with his full-toontown attitude. If the world is still around in July, I guess we'll find out if they were able to break him of it. If there's another 6 month continuance, we'll know that they're giving him another round of treatment. If the case abruptly ends with no conviction, that will mean he got funny farmed.

 

[Kramer on the phone]

Is it a bad thing that I'm kind of worried about Chris?

It's not something I'm proud of, and I probably should feel ashamed, but sometimes I'll get into the mood of wondering what's happening to him and being like wow we just don't even know anymore what's going on.

For the first time in 15 years we have no idea what's going on with Chris.

get used to it, he's never coming back from that hospital. "and he never returned"

 

[FinnSven]

If a practicing attorney in Virginia happens to be on the farms -- and so far there hasn't been one that's self-identified -- they can probably inform us of the competency evaluations used there. Virginia kiwis here who have attorney friends might be able to ask them.

Chris clearly has no understanding how court works though, despite having multiple cases under his belt, and he still relies on how it's portrayed in cartoons. Since he had only intensified clinging to his cartoon world reality, it would make sense that he still had no idea what was happening.

The charges that he currently faces aren't any more serious than the Snyder chargers (both are Class 5 felonies). I don't expect Chris to know what that means exactly, but what he did know is that all he had to do was sign a paper and he got to go home. (He didn't even have to plead guilty since he took an Alford plea that time). In addition he had Barb there to help wrangle him a bit.

I think he would fail *any* forensic test with his full-toontown attitude. If the world is still around in July, I guess we'll find out if they were able to break him of it. If there's another 6 month continuance, we'll know that they're giving him another round of treatment. If the case abruptly ends with no conviction, that will mean he got funny farmed.

Its a shame that Null won’t start his own asylum in Virginia, so that Chris can be literally kiwi farmed!


For those who say I should do it myself, I live outside of the USA, I lack the, residency, education, experience, and money.

I don’t envision gaining all four of those within now and July.

 

[ANobody]

For those who say I should do it myself, I live outside of the USA, I lack the, residency, education, experience, and money.

Aren't all of those factors also true for Null tho? He lives in Serbia, has no experience in tard wrangling and isn't exactly flush with cash.

 

[Hogar Grupal]

I wonder if he could answer the questions, but chose not to, opting to be sullen and uncooperative instead. He might have been banking on how easy and swift his time spent behind bars was on prior occasions, thinking he didn’t need to answer any questions because they’d be sending him home anyway. If that’s true, he hasn’t necessarily declined much, in a sense.

I’m not saying that’s what happened, I just wonder. His ego could have made him a different kind of stupid.

What Chris has gone through with the Snyder case, he'll be the same immature adult autistic child, not learning a thing from last time.

 

[FinnSven]

Aren't all of those factors also true for Null tho? He lives in Serbia, has no experience in tard wrangling and isn't exactly flush with cash.

Yes but people from here would more likely follow and help him to set up such an institution, and he is an American citizen, I think?

 

[AnAirThatKills]

I've been looking everywhere for actual pdfs of forensic psychology instruments for competency to stand trial but so far I've found nothing that isn't tightly hidden behind a paywall. I don't feel like traveling to my local university library and hunting down the physical copy either lol. If anyone has the right login, the canonical standard is this one ( https://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/doi/abs/10.1176/ajp.128.1.105 ) So far, the best I've found is just this collection of the different possible measures available which is still very interesting. https://arizonaforensics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Forensic-Tests.pdf

The takeaway is that whatever clinician administered the test had a very wide margin within their professional judgement to decide what exactly they were testing for. Some of them focus extremely narrowly around court proceedings while others are more general tests of 'sanity'. Unfortunately, it seems like even taking our assumption about incompetency as true we can't confidently infer anything about what Chris's mental state is.

One interesting article I found along the way was this one where the authors test a treatment method to get defendants to comprehend courtroom proceedings where they have the patients play with models of the court room: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1002/bsl.775 . I wanted to mention it because means it's in the realm of possibility that they lean into Chris's interests and use a legos model of the court room to train him to stand trial. It's just such a perfect confluence of all of the story so far that I feel I have to share.


^this


Yeah, but now imagine you've been living the most disgustingly depressing and hollow life for decades. Maybe you start putting that foreign film on and indulge your fantasy a little more, imagining what it would be like. Then maybe after another year of wakeup -> sheetz -> jerk off -> sheetz -> jerkoff -> bed you imagine what your conversations would be after the movie and after a while you say your comments out loud to cope a little more. And on and on from there. As a functional person, you'd probably recognize that this isn't normal and make steps to change your situation, but Chris lacks the will, awareness, or any positive influence to make that realization.

The point isn't that Chris is just doing a normal thing; that's obviously not the case. Instead, it's that these behaviors aren't schizophrenia or hallucinations. It's cope taken to such a ludicrous extreme that the state is obligated to step in.


I know the general attitude towards GRS practitioners here and there are certainly some ridiculous cases but I absolutely do not believe any surgeon would ever accept Chris as a client for an extremely invasive elective surgery unless it's a side-hustle by an overseas, back-alley veterinarian. Chris wouldn't even be able to pretend like he would follow hygiene or wound care guidelines and would develop fatal sepsis so quickly that a jury would probably return a homicide verdict against the doctor, let alone gross malpractice.

I can provide some insight about how it would work in the UK at least. I work in the medico-legal sector and have dealt with hundreds of cases like this. In this country, competency to stand trial (known as fitness to plead/stand trial) assessments are administered by psychiatrists, not psychologists.

In England and Wales the legal test of fitness to plead is based on the ruling in R v Pritchard, which dates back to 1836.

The psychiatrist will interview the client (this can be done face to face but most often done via videolink since covid). The key criteria the psychiatrist will consider are:

1. Ability to provide instructions to solicitor (does he understand the role of his legal team)
2. Ability to plead to the indictment (able to explain the difference between a guilty and a not guilty plea.)
3. Ability to challenge jurors
4. Ability to understand evidence in the case
5. Ability to give evidence and follow the proceedings

The psychiatrist won't actually administer any psychometrics, the clinical judgment will be based on a review of the case papers, medical records (if available...) and an assessment of the defendant (which usually lasts one to two hours.)

Sometimes a psychiatrist will deem a defendant fit to plead but recommend measures are put in place, e.g. frequent breaks, avoid leading questions. If the defendant is a raging autist they may ask the court not make any adverse inferences if the defendant appears to be disinterested, etc.

If the Defence instructed expert deems the defendant unfit to plead, the Crown will instruct their own expert. If both experts disagree then a third expert is instructed and they'll usually have a joint discussion to hammer out any disagreements. If there is still disagreement there can be a fourth or even fifth expert instructed but this is exceptionally rare.

This is how it works in the UK, it may well be different in the US.

 

[Second-Hand Boat Supplies]

@AnAirThatKills I can't reply to your post but thanks for the info! The legal standard seems pretty similar in the US so maybe you can shed some light on my specific question in relation to Chris. When does delusion reach the bar of incompetency to stand trial?

The article you linked is available on Sci-hub. I've attached it.

Here's the test itself, apparently. I guess the defendant is asked to complete these sentences and is then scored on whether they say kooky things.

Spoiler: Test

View attachment 3092734

Taking items from the competency screening test linked here for an example, Where do you believe fantasies and coping mechanisms would cross the line into incompetence?
Item 19 asks the defendant to finish the sentence "When I think of being sent to prison, I_____" There are clear cut cases where the psychiatrist would rate the answer as 0/2. Something like "... get excited because prison is where there is funnel cake and livestock judging competitions and carnival rides." But I can picture Chris answering something like:

• "... get upset because I'll be kept away from the Sonichu Temple"
• "... won't. Sonichu will save me by hijacking the transport bus"
• "... don't think about it. I'm far too busy working hard on the merge."
• "... get excited because they're sending me to the sexy ladies' prison and they'll love me"
• "... get mad because that's where the judge and my lawyer will hold me down and videotape my screams and make me sit on their lap. That's why they both want to send me there.."

I purposefully ordered them in ascending order of what just my uneducated, gut feeling tells me would be likely to count as incompetency. Which ones do you think would be 0/2s or 1/2s, or even 2/2s for the first one?

Chris is 'crazy' in all of those hypotheticals but which ones are legally relevant?

 

[Bassomatic]

I think people are forgetting in the US again let us state, crazy is fine we lock em up all the time, it comes down to if you are so nuts you don't understand what and why you did what you did.

Chris tried to hide the story, bought a book how better to fuck disabled people etc, he knew better and should be found guilty of such. He's still a loony and should be housed accordingly and the jails seem to have done such. But there's no getting better, or getting off scot free just because you think pokemon are real and youre Sailor moon or what ever nonsense Chris is into this week.

 

[WolfKiller]

I sent a letter to VA DOC and got a response. No mailing address was forthcoming.

The fact that he's "currently not incarcerated within the Department" might tell us something.

 

[Second-Hand Boat Supplies]

I think people are forgetting in the US again let us state, crazy is fine we lock em up all the time, it comes down to if you are so nuts you don't understand what and why you did what you did.

Chris tried to hide the story, bought a book how better to fuck disabled people etc, he knew better and should be found guilty of such. He's still a loony and should be housed accordingly and the jails seem to have done such. But there's no getting better, or getting off scot free just because you think pokemon are real and youre Sailor moon or what ever nonsense Chris is into this week.

Yes, but that is exactly the contradiction we're trying to solve. We weren't the ones that initiated a transfer to a state hospital. The US is indeed fine with locking crazy people up but the Commonwealth of Virginia decided they weren't okay with this specific situation any longer for some reason. I want to find out what, specifically, that reason was.

Chris did know it was wrong, he did hide it, he did know what crimes and courts and attorneys are but that does not match with what we know about the continuance length and transfer.

If I were wagering just based on pure speculation, I would guess that Chris stopped cooperating with Heilberg. Heilberg could have told Chris that his options are either plea and prison or trial and more prison and Chris then refused to see reality, insisting and screaming for Heilberg to get back to work and do his job to get him off scot free. It just feels the most plausible and most direct violation of the competency standards

Edit:

@WolfKiller

I sent a letter to VA DOC and got a response. No mailing address was forthcoming.

The fact that he's "currently not incarcerated within the Department" might tell us something.

Unfortunately, it tells us nothing that we don't know. I came across this a few times in my googling about competency restoration. Due to privacy concerns, confused families often struggle to get answers and are only told "they're no longer with us." It's consistent with being sent to the state hospital. This also ties in to the theory that Chris thought he was on his way home as this official language certainly reads similar to "he's been set free" if you were a delusional slow-in-the-mind. Some documents use the term "released to the hospital" for the transfer even, although the patient is still incarcerated for all practical purposes.

 

[AnOminous]

Chris tried to hide the story, bought a book how better to fuck disabled people etc, he knew better and should be found guilty of such.

Incompetence to stand trial is the current issue, though. It doesn't matter what state he was in when he committed (or didn't commit) the crime. What matters is whether he can meaningfully assist in his own defense now.

I sent a letter to VA DOC and got a response. No mailing address was forthcoming.

The fact that he's "currently not incarcerated within the Department" might tell us something.

He's somewhere that's probably protected by HIPAA which is another bit of evidence he is in some kind of mental facility.

There are two general phases of this competency adjudication. First, Chris gets evaluated. For all we know, that just started recently.

If they did this and found him incompetent to stand trial, there are again two basic branches. One is that he's incompetent to stand trial temporarily, but with a treatment plan, medication, etc. is expected to recover sufficiently. This is what mostly happens.

The other is they find him incompetent to stand trial and it is expected to remain the case indefinitely. Those are generally put away somewhere secure. Chris won't fall in this category.

In the usual case, they'll then come back periodically to reevaluate.

I personally think (with no current direct knowledge) that Chris is competent to stand trial, but courts are generally cautious about not taking an incompetent defendant to trial. My usual example of this is Brian David Mitchell, the kidnapper of Elizabeth Smart, who got away with literally years of stringing the court along with nutty performances despite them obviously being bogus.

 

[weegrumpy]

If I recall. Hundreds upon hundreds of people called at once. You really can't ignore these kinds of things.

Chris got what he deserves because he's an idiot who's finally facing real consequences. But in the end he's still human and he's still fascinating to watch. In a dark way. This is probably best for Chris. He gets 3 meals, a warm bed, and is safe from weens. As much as Chris pisses me off with the dumb shit he does. I'd hate for him to be on the streets.

Honestly don't know if he can survive it. I can see him wander off and never to be seen again. Whispers of his siting from town to town by weens and christorians alike. Until finally the state declares him as dead.

Heh, I can imagine him being a modern day Diogene, wandering around ruckersville with a huge clay pot and shitting in the street. But instead of ranting about philosophy, he rants about the merge and being jealous

 

[Calefactorite]

Heh, I can imagine him being a modern day Diogene, wandering around ruckersville with a huge clay pot and shitting in the street. But instead of ranting about philosophy, he rants about the merge and being jealous

If this happens I want to see the attraction sign come back.

 

[Duke Nukem]

All he had to do was not fuck his mother and he would have lived in neet heaven with null managing his finances to ensure he had the temple over his head after barb died. All he had to do was scribble shit on paper and say hi to retards on video a couple times a week. He could have sat on discord rp'ing with all those faggots, playing vidya, and masturbating to cartoons in peace while never having to be a responsible adult at any time in his life.

Either way, he won't have to be a responsible adult at any time in his life.

This really is one of the Bad Endings...

The only reason Chris wanted an office job was because he had one in his "prophetic" Crystal dreams.

Or maybe he saw it in one of his "educational" pornos, the office scene is a common theme, after all.