General GunTuber thread

Wouldn't the threads on the breach be better off as internal ones with a threaded plug rather than an externally threaded cap? Like an Artillery piece.
Because the case is manually inserted and removed, a threaded plug would require threading on the inside, and thus the chamber to be reamed past the threads. The case would be difficult to remove.
With threading on the outside, you essentially require zero loss of "effective action length" and the case extractor groove can sit just a tad off the breach end and make it easier to pry it out.
Obviously with the threaded cap you have the potential for a case head failure to leak gas into the cap, and the wider surface area means more force applied on the threads. With a threaded plug you wouldn't get this area increase.
 
Because the case is manually inserted and removed, a threaded plug would require threading on the inside, and thus the chamber to be reamed past the threads. The case would be difficult to remove.
With threading on the outside, you essentially require zero loss of "effective action length" and the case extractor groove can sit just a tad off the breach end and make it easier to pry it out.
Obviously with the threaded cap you have the potential for a case head failure to leak gas into the cap, and the wider surface area means more force applied on the threads. With a threaded plug you wouldn't get this area increase.
What if you put a sliding breach block on it?
 
What if you put a sliding breach block on it?
That would make it just like some kinds of artillery and obviously that's a very strong design. But these guns were made to be cheap and easy to assemble with what seem like off the shelf parts, so they ended up being as safe as "cheap" gets you. Compromises were made and it's essentially a short step above a hobbyist's homemade pipegun.

In the end the best advice is check your ammo to make sure it's not counterfeit, and don't use a pipegun with hot loads if you're gonna stand next to it.
 
That would make it just like some kinds of artillery and obviously that's a very strong design. But these guns were made to be cheap and easy to assemble with what seem like off the shelf parts, so they ended up being as safe as "cheap" gets you. Compromises were made and it's essentially a short step above a hobbyist's homemade pipegun.
They look like something made out of the piping selection at a Canadian Tire, but I can't imagine that adding a Ruger No.1 style sliding block, or a Remington style rolling block would be difficult or overly expensive.
 
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They look like something made out of the piping selection at a Canadian Tire, but I can't imagine that adding a Ruger No.1 style sliding block, or a Remington style rolling block would be difficult or overly expensive.
They already sell normal bolt-action .50s which are fine and have the features you'd expect from a modern gun. These were budget guns for a market that just wanted to shoot .50 cal bullets but didn't want to make their own ghetto pipegun to do it. I doubt they cared a whole lot, otherwise the sheet metal "ears" that hold on the cap would have been better designed.
 
What if you put a sliding breach block on it?
They look like something made out of the piping selection at a Canadian Tire, but I can't imagine that adding a Ruger No.1 style sliding block, or a Remington style rolling block would be difficult or overly expensive.
All you do in that case is shift the stress around, you still need a lot of metal. So instead of a blown cap, you're risking a receiver splitting in half and flying backwards in a situation like that.

They already sell normal bolt-action .50s which are fine and have the features you'd expect from a modern gun. These were budget guns for a market that just wanted to shoot .50 cal bullets but didn't want to make their own ghetto pipegun to do it. I doubt they cared a whole lot, otherwise the sheet metal "ears" that hold on the cap would have been better designed.
The round that Scott used to deliberately blow up the gun couldn't shear off the "ears" and the receiver instead blew sideways as the cap forced its way through. That was a round that was producing at least three times the maximum pressure of a "standard" .50 BMG. The one that almost killed him was likely even more overpressure. I don't think even a Ma Deuce is built to withstand that.

Really, I'd love to see that same test done with a bolt-action .50 and a semi-auto .50. I know no one is going to do it since that test would be expensive as fuck, but I'd love to see the failure modes with quadruple-overpressure .50 BMG. Seeing an AR-50 bolt flying clean out of the back of the receiver if the lugs sheared off, or a Barrett magazine being ejected by the escaping gas and embedding itself into the dirt below, shit like that.
 
There is this video, might give a little bit of an idea of how horrifying it would be to fire one of those rounds in an M2. Take note that this is a headspace and timing purposeful failure.


Not exactly many videos of M2's failing but I sure wouldn't want to fire counterfeit slapp rounds out of one. Price aside.
 
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Just in case anyone is wondering why loading pistol powder into rifle cartridges is a bad, bad idea, this landed in my recommendations recently:


Ignore the douchy editing and focus on the burn times. Pistol powder burns substantially faster than rifle powder, which means packing a rifle caliber cartridge with rifle-sized loads of the stuff results in much higher pressure buildup, which might cause the gun to explode and send wonderful, wonderful shrapnel flying around.

1645239270408.png
 
Ohey, I found a place I can sperg out about Captain Undercut (karl).
Or if I may paraphrase any time he splurges his opinion about anything:
"Here is my uneducated opinion I pulled out of my ass based on my personal bias, and it's empirical fact and you're an idiot if you disagree"
 
His wife looks like the demon he would have shot up his high school to try summoning.
It's kind of ironic that Deviant Ollam has gotten all woke, and anything sexual in a way that's not in a approved way he finds offensive, but somehow he seems obsessed with sex workers.

Before he went woke, these were on his website.

This is an image that was taken of a presumably drunk girl having group sex in a pool at Defcon. Notice Deviant is taking the picture from behind her and I doubt she knows.

Alternate for above

Here is just some strippers.

More strippers

A few more
 
It's kind of ironic that Deviant Ollam has gotten all woke, and anything sexual in a way that's not in a approved way he finds offensive, but somehow he seems obsessed with sex workers.

Before he went woke, these were on his website.

This is an image that was taken of a presumably drunk girl having group sex in a pool at Defcon. Notice Deviant is taking the picture from behind her and I doubt she knows.

Alternate for above

Here is just some strippers.

More strippers

A few more
That's pretty typical for the woke tbh.
 
Maybe, an interrupted thread would definitely help the thing with faster cycling although an interrupted thread would be weaker. I doubt it would be weak enough to make a tremendous difference in overall strength but for faster reloading it would probably be nice.

@Smoke Manmuscle you were talking about engineering and material science earlier in the thread, what do you think?
I would need to know the threads per inch, the diameter and what the material specs are to do the math but it seems likely. For context a grade 8 bolt you buy in the hardware store is rated to break at 140,000 PSI.

The fact that the 190,000 PSI he had made failed in the same exact manner tends make me lean towards the hot round theory.
 
It's kind of ironic that Deviant Ollam has gotten all woke, and anything sexual in a way that's not in a approved way he finds offensive, but somehow he seems obsessed with sex workers.

Before he went woke, these were on his website.

This is an image that was taken of a presumably drunk girl having group sex in a pool at Defcon. Notice Deviant is taking the picture from behind her and I doubt she knows.

Alternate for above

Here is just some strippers.

More strippers

A few more
For ages, I didn't want to go to Defcon very much because it's a degenerate frat party. Now it's a trooned out degenerate frat party that you can catch all the good presentations on Youtube anyway.

I don't understand the cognitive dissonance of modern Defcon that Deviant exemplifies here. It's still supposed to be some kind of exponent of tht anarchist "temporary autonomous zone" concept but now you gotta RESPECT MY PRONOUNS and stuff. Like, an event where owning the guy across the lobby's laptop is considered good sport is not, shall we say, respect-based. And yet it's still a bunch of tech bros being bros in some corners. I'm surprised there hasn't been (much of) a purge yet.
 
Because the case is manually inserted and removed, a threaded plug would require threading on the inside, and thus the chamber to be reamed past the threads. The case would be difficult to remove.
With threading on the outside, you essentially require zero loss of "effective action length" and the case extractor groove can sit just a tad off the breach end and make it easier to pry it out.
Obviously with the threaded cap you have the potential for a case head failure to leak gas into the cap, and the wider surface area means more force applied on the threads. With a threaded plug you wouldn't get this area increase.
A breach plug could have a fixed extractor cut into it that the round needed to be slid into and the whole breach plug plus round would then be threaded into the rifle. I don't think the action length really matters for this type of rifle.

Also, the two 'safety' ears really need to be re-thought. If they had more material connecting them to the lower, say not making the cut on the lower so that the ears start from the rear and end at the breach.
 
I was listening to a stream by 3d printing gun guys and one of the mentioned that BRCC bought a ton of land near San Antonio and that's where Brandon Herrera filmed his Luty video. Most of Texas land is privately owned, so BRCC essentially has a space they can use as leverage over the youtubers who moved there recently and now have an incentive to not talk shit about them. Really activates my almonds.
A breach plug could have a fixed extractor cut into it that the round needed to be slid into and the whole breach plug plus round would then be threaded into the rifle. I don't think the action length really matters for this type of rifle.

Also, the two 'safety' ears really need to be re-thought. If they had more material connecting them to the lower, say not making the cut on the lower so that the ears start from the rear and end at the breach.
I could see that working if the fixed extractor was like half the circumference, and maybe had a sliding piece which "guillotines" the whole extractor groove. Like KAC qd mounts. Otherwise any stuck case means having to knock it out from the front.
Even with a fixed extractor in the breach plug it's important to consider that extraction in firearms is sort of a funky science. Some bolt actions and early repeaters have a camming surface that allows the motion on the bolt handle to be transferred into a few millimeters of reward travel with mechanical advantage, so the pull of the bolt back doesn't have to do all the work. It would be great if the back of the breech plug was milled to be a standard size bolt, and using a tool as a breaker bar to spin the plug would also force it rewards due to the threads, pulling the stuck case out.
 
I was listening to a stream by 3d printing gun guys and one of the mentioned that BRCC bought a ton of land near San Antonio and that's where Brandon Herrera filmed his Luty video. Most of Texas land is privately owned, so BRCC essentially has a space they can use as leverage over the youtubers who moved there recently and now have an incentive to not talk shit about them. Really activates my almonds.
The thing I've been seeing more and more of late across many areas I monitor on here. Someone scrapes together a little bit of success then tries to become the means by which people ply their trade, to either softly or explicitly abuse that.

The idea of "Oh gosh, you need a range without rules to make your content, maybe you shouldn't talk shit about my coffee XD" really gets me too.
 
I was listening to a stream by 3d printing gun guys and one of the mentioned that BRCC bought a ton of land near San Antonio and that's where Brandon Herrera filmed his Luty video. Most of Texas land is privately owned, so BRCC essentially has a space they can use as leverage over the youtubers who moved there recently and now have an incentive to not talk shit about them. Really activates my almonds.

I could see that working if the fixed extractor was like half the circumference, and maybe had a sliding piece which "guillotines" the whole extractor groove. Like KAC qd mounts. Otherwise any stuck case means having to knock it out from the front.
Even with a fixed extractor in the breach plug it's important to consider that extraction in firearms is sort of a funky science. Some bolt actions and early repeaters have a camming surface that allows the motion on the bolt handle to be transferred into a few millimeters of reward travel with mechanical advantage, so the pull of the bolt back doesn't have to do all the work. It would be great if the back of the breech plug was milled to be a standard size bolt, and using a tool as a breaker bar to spin the plug would also force it rewards due to the threads, pulling the stuck case out.
The funny thing about this is that every improvement I can think of like interrupted threads on a breach plug with a fixed extractor, slowly turns this into a multi lug rotating bolt. Which is a very different type of rifle.

I do think there are modifications to the design that don't involve a whole re-design. Watching the Kentucky ballistics video on the RN50 I noticed that the lower split when the end cap blew and the safety ears breaking off are what nearly killed him the first time. So I think that there should be two steel plates welded to the lower, one towards the rear and one were the two ears are. Making the ears stronger with more material connecting them to the lower is also a no-brainer to me. This would stiffen the lower and help to contain the end cap should it blow off and maybe deflect it should it do so.

Designing the rifle to withstand extremely out of spec rounds is pretty much imposable but the rifle needs to be less dangerous to the user when it does fail. The two biggest concerns I have is the end cap blowing off and the safety ears sharing off, both are coming back into the shooters face when they do so more needs to be done in this area.
 
The funny thing about this is that every improvement I can think of like interrupted threads on a breach plug with a fixed extractor, slowly turns this into a multi lug rotating bolt. Which is a very different type of rifle.

I do think there are modifications to the design that don't involve a whole re-design. Watching the Kentucky ballistics video on the RN50 I noticed that the lower split when the end cap blew and the safety ears breaking off are what nearly killed him the first time. So I think that there should be two steel plates welded to the lower, one towards the rear and one were the two ears are. Making the ears stronger with more material connecting them to the lower is also a no-brainer to me. This would stiffen the lower and help to contain the end cap should it blow off and maybe deflect it should it do so.

Designing the rifle to withstand extremely out of spec rounds is pretty much imposable but the rifle needs to be less dangerous to the user when it does fail. The two biggest concerns I have is the end cap blowing off and the safety ears sharing off, both are coming back into the shooters face when they do so more needs to be done in this area.
As I understand it, the ears aren't there to hold the cap in case of an off-spec detonation, they're there to ensure the cap is fully threaded in otherwise the gun won't "close" and you can't fire it. As a bonus, if the threads start stretching and the cap can't go forward enough even when threaded in, the ears will also make sure the rifle isn't operational. Their strength should not be relied on as a safety mechanism because they're made out of the same material as rest of the receiver, which is a non-pressure bearing part, and one that also swings on that pivot under the barrel.

So, instead of trying to beef up the ears, I'd go for a U-shape on the receiver that envelops the bottom half of the threaded cap. That would definitely be more material and it would mean you can't just cut the whole receiver out of a single piece of flat metal, but it should increase structural integrity of that area. Another idea is to "invert" the ears. Have a short step that the threaded cap slides into so the barrel only locks into place if the cap is fully threaded, and then the ears slope upwards away from the cap, about twice the distance they go now. The idea here being to try to deflect the cap upwards and away from the shooter's face without shearing the locking ears, because even after shearing the ears off the cap had enough energy to break half of Scott's face. A third idea would be to somehow build the "won't lock if not threaded in" function to the hammer itself and ditch the ears altogether. I'm not sure if that's possible with the mechanism they've got going on there, but it's also an option.

I imagine Serbu thought about most of these things before but decided, for whatever reason, to land on the design he's selling now. I don't know just how hard his destructive testing was, maybe he only worked with 2x overpressure instead of 3x or 4x.
 
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As I understand it, the ears aren't there to hold the cap in case of an off-spec detonation, they're there to ensure the cap is fully threaded in otherwise the gun won't "close" and you can't fire it. As a bonus, if the threads started stretching and the cap can't go forward enough even when threaded in, the ears will also make sure the rifle isn't operational. Their strength should not be relied on as a safety mechanism because they're made out of the same material as rest of the receiver, which is a non-pressure bearing part, and one that also swings on that pivot under the barrel.

So, instead of trying to beef up the ears, I'd go for a U-shape on the receiver that envelops the bottom half of the threaded cap. That would definitely be more material and it would mean you can't just cut the whole receiver out of a single piece of flat metal, but it should increase structural integrity of that area. Another idea is to "invert" the ears. Have a short step that the threaded cap slides into so the barrel only locks into place if the cap is fully threaded, and then the ears slope upwards away from the cap, about twice the distance they go now. The idea here being to try to deflect the cap upwards and away from the shooter's face without shearing the locking ears, because even after shearing the ears off the cap had enough energy to break half of Scott's face. A third idea would be to somehow build the "won't lock if not threaded in" function to the hammer itself. I'm not sure if that's possible with the mechanism they've got going on there, but it's also an option.

I imagine Serbu thought about most of these things before but decided, for whatever reason, to land on the design he's selling now. I don't know just how hard his destructive testing was.
That is what the ears are for but the way the design is now any catastrophic failure leads to the end cap and pieces of the lower (namely the ears) shooting straight back into the shooters face. Your U-shape on the lower is sort of what I'm thinking. Having the two ears be connected in the middle by a bock of steel that the end cap sits flush with (kind of like a break action). I do still think that the ears do need to be beefed up though, just to lessen the chance of them shearing off.

Stiffening the two halves on the lower can also be achieved by this welded block which is important because in the second test the ears didn't shear off but two halves of the lower did bend allowing the cap to go straight back.

This wouldn't change the primarily function of the ears but would make them and the lower better able to deal with this type of failure.
 
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