George RR Martin, his fanboys, and former fanbase

[Tasty Tatty]

Yes. It's implied that Aerys had sex or raped Joanna Lannister in a few chapters as well. That he "took liberties" and was obsessed with Joanna. And that she tried to abort the child not knowing if it was from Aerys or Tywin. This is why Tyrion came out all malformed. It's like GRRM's version of a thalidomide baby or something. She desperately tried to stop being pregnant at one point. But it ended up causing the child to be damaged and it killed her as well when the delivery became violent.

It's not "implied" that he raped her, it's implied that he was inappropriate with her. Where does it say she tried to abort the child? I can't find it anywhere. That's another fan theory.

Aerys was an asshole and wanted to spite Tywin by insulting his wife and probably tried to fondle her and made nasty comments about it. That we know. I dunno why is impossible for people to accept that Tywin fathered a dwarf. Even today healthy couples end up with children with any deformity. Aerys raping Joanna wouldn't be as fitting as Tywin being indeed humbled down by having a dwarf child and the doubt of whether his beloved wife cheated on him or not. If Tywin knew for sure Tyrion was Aerys' child, Tyrion would be dead and he would know. Kings and Queens don't walk around alone, they always have escorts and maids around. People knew well whose ladies were summoned to the King's chambers.

 

[FatR]

There's a good cross-section of ASOIAF theorists and Souls theorists. It's people who try to justify their obsession with claiming of depth despite the writer having absolutely no subtlety. Like legit the fifth book Dany gets told what is going to happen to her and the people she's going to meet. There is zero tension of her fate or that Targ kid being fake.

BUT MUH DREAMS OF DRAGONS AND THE DRAGON HAS THREE HEADS!

I had say that Souls fans are substantially more delusional perhaps because of the protagonist factor forcing them to invent good endings where there is none, perhaps because the actual plot is so barebones that if you discount obvious bullshit from obvious liars, you simply won't have anything like a complete picture. But sure thing, Martin cooperated with FROM for a reason.

 

[God of Nothing]

It's not "implied" that he raped her, it's implied that he was inappropriate with her. Where does it say she tried to abort the child? I can't find it anywhere. That's another fan theory.

Aerys was an asshole and wanted to spite Tywin by insulting his wife and probably tried to fondle her and made nasty comments about it. That we know. I dunno why is impossible for people to accept that Tywin fathered a dwarf. Even today healthy couples end up with children with any deformity. Aerys raping Joanna wouldn't be as fitting as Tywin being indeed humbled down by having a dwarf child and the doubt of whether his beloved wife cheated on him or not. If Tywin knew for sure Tyrion was Aerys' child, Tyrion would be dead and he would know. Kings and Queens don't walk around alone, they always have escorts and maids around. People knew well whose ladies were summoned to the King's chambers.

the Lannisters are inbred little shits
cersei and jaime learned from their cousin-fucking father, the Alabama fuck

 

[Tasty Tatty]

There's a great video pitting ASOIAF "theorists" against mostly bullshit fan theories.

The best way to know an ASOIAF theory is absolute bullshit is that it was made by Preston Jacobs. He has no bad intentions, but he's an absolute midwit about this.

Sansa likes blue.
Jon likes Sansa
Hence, Jon is blue.

That's the level of theories. These "theorists" think Martin, who has said he's not subtle, wants us all to go after an egg hunt like we're playing Clue rather than reading a book.

For example,one of the funniest moments to me, in the fandom, was when someone comment how fans had somehow managed to make Ashara Dayne the series' ultimate whore: she danced with a lot of guys in a Tourney, meaning she slept with all of them, got pregnant by each of them, she's everybody's mother, and she's both dead and alive under so many different identities. "Fans" got this after reading only one line in the books saying she was a beautiful woman who was asked to dance by many friends.

BUT MUH DREAMS OF DRAGONS AND THE DRAGON HAS THREE HEADS!

A little kid dreams of being able to own a dragon and cried when he was told they didn't exist any more? IT MUST BE A SECRET TARGARYEN BECAUSE NO CHILD EVER WOULD DO SUCH A THING!

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

I'm sure it's been brought up before, but didn't Preston pay money to ask GRRM a question at some charity dinner, and whatever he asked him made GRRM go like "What the fuck are you talking about?"

 

[Lazy Printer]

Aegon's bastard is fighting with other children in a pit. Somehow no one finds a bunch of white haired children walking around in King's landing weird?. Sure the targaryans aren't the only valirians in Westeros, they had a entire army but white hair is a targaryan exclusive thing if i not mistaken. So heres my question what is the genetic and cultural legacy that the valirians soldiers left? Did Martin ever give any details about them? What happened to them? Sure a guy pedantic enough to ask about Aragon's tax policy would think about such details.

 

[Tasty Tatty]

I'm sure it's been brought up before, but didn't Preston pay money to ask GRRM a question at some charity dinner, and whatever he asked him made GRRM go like "What the fuck are you talking about?"

There you go knowing he's a massive autistic faggot. There are sooo many actual questions he could have asked and acts like this. Allegedly, he asked this and lure him into saying something else? I don't follow him -I have enough autism here, thank you very much- and he was never popular among the most serious fans of Martin (say, Westeros forum).

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

There you go knowing he's a massive autistic faggot. There are sooo many actual questions he could have asked and acts like this. Allegedly, he asked this and lure him into saying something else? I don't follow him -I have enough autism here, thank you very much- and he was never popular among the most serious fans of Martin (say, Westeros forum).

Like 10 years ago, Preston was okay as some guy who was just like saying out there theories and shit for entertainment value. He'd even say shit like "I'm probably wrong about all this" and shit.

Now he acts like some authority on everything, heading some Winds of Winter fanfiction project. I finally gave up on him years ago because every time I'd listen to one of his shitty podcast clips he'd have to bring up Trump or the Chuds or some other liberal shit.

If I want out there theories for entertainment I stick with Michael Talks About Stuff these days. "The Nights King created the wall by tying Others to weirwood trees" is a lot more interesting than "lol Quentyn didn't die because he had a thought about how hot fire is instead of instantly vaporizing"

 

[Tasty Tatty]

Now he acts like some authority on everything, heading some Winds of Winter fanfiction project. I finally gave up on him years ago because every time I'd listen to one of his shitty podcast clips he'd have to bring up Trump or the Chuds or some other liberal shit.

There you know what kind of person he is. Libs have a tendency to prove how smart they are. That's why they suck at interpreting art. "No, you don't get it, Martin might have said this character will do this thing, but he's fooling you because the clues I've found say that he's actually doing the opposite of what the author said... I got the clues and you didn't, I'm not wrong here!*

 

[Outer Space Traveller]

IIRC Enoch Powell’s river of blood speech was in 1970 right? Tolkien would have loved to see that.

But yeah, I can believe that, I can also believe the Tolkien estate would not want to be saddled with the Lovecraft problem of having to explain why the author was a die hard racist or fascist or whatever.

(Which tbh, makes Tolkien even more based honestly).

Not to go too offtopic, but makes me wonder if Tolkien had at least *some* sympathies to the BUF/British Union of Fascists? We know he disliked Hitler, yet from the British Nationalism, I wonder what he thought about Oswald Mosley?

Anyway: I've been following ASOIAF & GRRM for a while. I remember when someone told me to get into the series, I decided I would read the books first (Back in 2012, when the series looked promissing, and the first season had been released, and the second season would be released, and after the fifth book came out). I decided to start by reading A Game of Thrones. While it seemed captivating enough, I couldn't get past Sansa's chapters. And I remember I had given up halfway through. Years later I decided to try again, and I got all the way through A Feast for Crows. I ended up skipping it, and read parts of A Dance of Dragons. Honestly, it's sad.

After all those years, and we have had A World of Ice and Fire, a book I particularly liked (due to being a historical book). Yet I can quite see Martin is spent.

 

[TheHarbinger]

Not to go too offtopic, but makes me wonder if Tolkien had at least *some* sympathies to the BUF/British Union of Fascists? We know he disliked Hitler, yet from the British Nationalism, I wonder what he thought about Oswald Mosley?

Tolkien was the classic stupid WWI or WWII veteran. Who went into Christian Europe and slaughtered people defending their homes from multicultural and communist societies like America, England, and Russia. He could not rationalize that an "intellectual" such as himself did literally nothing but murder Whites to make room for orcs. And that he was wrong. And that men that could have grown up reading his books died beneath him in trenches so that 'diversity' could be brought to Europe. He was desperate to be seen as a hero and you can clearly see that LOTR is basically him creating a more heroic fantasy version of his experiences in war. I also find it hypocritical that he would constantly attack German culture in the press but he stole so much of LOTR from Wagner's operas.

Tolkien died basically never admitting to the public that he hated the modern world but it was obvious in his writings what groups like Hobbits and Elves represented versus groups like goblin and orcs. Lord of the Rings books have a bunch of descriptions of "swarthy" or "yellow" or "crooked nosed" people who are hanging around the Prancing Pony or other areas. It's obvious that the books lean heavily into Tolkien's views on race.

Tolkien also was extremely bitter over the bad deals he signed with various publishers. He forbid publishers from printing paperback copies of LOTR but one went ahead anyways. And sold them at huge discounts as well to compete with the hardcover. And then they cut him out of money from the sales. And his family would begin selling his works off to various companies to the point where Amazon will probably own everything Tolkien in the next few years.

 

[speedweed]

Tolkien was the classic stupid WWI or WWII veteran. Who went into Christian Europe and slaughtered people defending their homes from multicultural and communist societies like America, England, and Russia. He could not rationalize that an "intellectual" such as himself did literally nothing but murder Whites to make room for orcs. And that he was wrong. And that men that could have grown up reading his books died beneath him in trenches so that 'diversity' could be brought to Europe. He was desperate to be seen as a hero and you can clearly see that LOTR is basically him creating a more heroic fantasy version of his experiences in war. I also find it hypocritical that he would constantly attack German culture in the press but he stole so much of LOTR from Wagner's operas.

What the fuck are talking about? The British Empire and Tsardom of Russia... communist? The reason The Ring Cycle and The Lord of the Rings are similar is because they are both based on the same mythological foundation. Also, attacking German culture? He rebuked the Nazi government, he didn't "constantly attack German culture" as you say. And consider that he spent his career studying the myths, languages and histories of predominantly Germanic peoples I doubt he hated them as you suggest.

I shouldn't have responded to what is obviously bait but fuck me that was the most retarded thing I've read in this thread, goddamn.

 

[6MillionCoofs]

I think Martin himself has said that people read too much into the plot, and he's also very in-your-face about foreshadowing.

It is. I knew Bran would be King the second I read him climb the tower, several chapters after his father told him he’d have make hard choices ehen he’s King. The tower he climbed was supposed to be where the King and Queen were supposed to be and the book goes on about how Bran was the best at climbing.

Bran was the best at getting to where the King and Queen should be. Couldn’t be more obvious.

GRRM is not subtle. The fans are just by and large retarded.

 

[FatR]

Who went into Christian Europe

What is that "Christian Europe" you're talking about? The same continent whose historians hailed its disunity and propensity for internal warfare as one of its key civilizational advantages?

Also, Tolkien, cotnrary to your core assumption, did not grow up at the time where whites calling themselves nationalists considered themselves to be weaker and less fit than niggers and therefore saw diversity as a thing to be feared the most, but at the time when British were still going out across the world to culturally enrich whomever they could overpower. (Though the feelings of decay, loss of vitality and dusk of the world certainly crept into his works, as he witnessed the end of that age). Your spiel is especially funny, given that one of the first links in the long chain of events which led to the German chimpout in August of 1914 was the deep-seated belief that German Empire was too late to the colonial pie and just haven't managed to grab as much diversity to lord over as its power and resources entitled it to.

 

[Peaches the Wonder Cat]

It is. I knew Bran would be King the second I read him climb the tower, several chapters after his father told him he’d have make hard choices ehen he’s King. The tower he climbed was supposed to be where the King and Queen were supposed to be and the book goes on about how Bran was the best at climbing.

Bran was the best at getting to where the King and Queen should be. Couldn’t be more obvious.

GRRM is not subtle. The fans are just by and large retarded.

The chapter in GOT where George all but spells out that Jon Snow is the child of Lyanna and Rhaegar is incredibly not subtle. It's done well in the show, because (rumor has it) the showrunners told Sean Bean what was up. I can't believe book readers took as long as they did to get the hint.

 

[Bulk Bogan]

-bait-

This is like Gurm's bitching about Aragorn's tax policy, but somehow even gayer. Try harder next time.

Back on topic, I too am a fan of the stuff he's written set in the universe. I genuinely like the setting, or at least I want to like it, a version of it that isn't written by a guy who sucks at it more than he doesn't.

 

[Ishtar]

Tolkien was the classic stupid WWI or WWII veteran. Who went into Christian Europe and slaughtered people defending their homes from multicultural and communist societies like America, England, and Russia. He could not rationalize that an "intellectual" such as himself did literally nothing but murder Whites to make room for orcs. And that he was wrong. And that men that could have grown up reading his books died beneath him in trenches so that 'diversity' could be brought to Europe. He was desperate to be seen as a hero and you can clearly see that LOTR is basically him creating a more heroic fantasy version of his experiences in war. I also find it hypocritical that he would constantly attack German culture in the press but he stole so much of LOTR from Wagner's operas.

Tolkien died basically never admitting to the public that he hated the modern world but it was obvious in his writings what groups like Hobbits and Elves represented versus groups like goblin and orcs. Lord of the Rings books have a bunch of descriptions of "swarthy" or "yellow" or "crooked nosed" people who are hanging around the Prancing Pony or other areas. It's obvious that the books lean heavily into Tolkien's views on race.

Tolkien also was extremely bitter over the bad deals he signed with various publishers. He forbid publishers from printing paperback copies of LOTR but one went ahead anyways. And sold them at huge discounts as well to compete with the hardcover. And then they cut him out of money from the sales. And his family would begin selling his works off to various companies to the point where Amazon will probably own everything Tolkien in the next few years.

Do remember Tolkien supported Franco, so your presumption of naivety is a bit uncharitable. The man also opposed Vatican II. He was in modern terms a “little englander” at least as far as foreign policy went.

(Also Tolkien got injured at the battle of the Somme, I don’t recall if he actually killed anyone).

WW1 had a great effect on him, as it did countless writers, intellectuals, and so on in Europe. But it’s utterly false to insinuate he was some sort of liberal or something.

He wasn’t.

Tolkien as far as I know never supported Oswald Mosley. (At least not when Mosley was active, that may have changed at least privately in later decades).

Part of the reason Tolkien isn’t nearly as stagmatized as Lovecraft is because his political views are so opaque.

 

[Wendell X]

That's the level of theories. These "theorists" think Martin, who has said he's not subtle, wants us all to go after an egg hunt like we're playing Clue rather than reading a book.

In their defence, you should be able to read a book that way if it's well written and you have enough autism. The speculating about tyrion's dwarfness, for example, is because everyone is taught that in good books things don't happen because of randomness (outside of Cormac McCarthy books where chaos is the point). Preston is a useless retard, but the bigger problem is grrm is a sloppy fucker who farts out connections for laffs, so trying to 'connect the dots' is like looking for a grand design in your alphabet soup.

 

[Felis Meanis]

I don't believe we will ever see the final two books released.

If we do, however, George Martin has shown through many interviews during the last years that he's a pudgy, spiteful little man with an enormous chip on his shoulder. Should the books come out, he will probably include many not-so-subtle allusions to things that he's been bitching and ranting about for years, like "western fascism" and "toxic fandoms". After all, his so very well thought of, deep and multifaceted storytelling with Sir Patrek getting killed by Wun Wun was really about George's favorite football team beating their rivals.

Fuck off Tolkien, here's a man who truly brings class and introspection into his works. There will probably be a storyline about wights in red caps terrorizing innocent immigrant wildlings, experiencing sick glee and joy of it despite otherwise being zombies with no consciousness.
And what about taxes? Will the zombie invasion from the north impact taxes in Westeros? If so, how? After all, we have to ask the important questions that silly fucks like Tolkien was too childish to include in his storytelling, right? Maybe the accountants were the Dark Lords all along?

I was a huge, huge fan of his works, but have since soured on the little man and his antics immensely. Regardless, it will be at least interesting to see what the future holds in store for ASOIAF.

Edit:
The fat, sad fuck actually fancies himself a heroic would-be soldier in the trenches of WW2. Because he would and totally could defeat the hecking Nazis, the only true evil ever to have existed.
I swear, these fucking delusional freaks never cease to amaze.

 

[TheHarbinger]

I don't believe we will ever see the final two books released.

We will for sure. They might not be written by GRRM (thankfully even) but his publisher and HBO will put something out. Plus HBO already has plans to reboot the entire franchise in two decades time. The current Harry Potter show might as well be a test run to see how easy it will be to reboot Game of Thrones. But this time with a new ending and the show being rewritten around that eventual new ending.

Even if GRRM comes out and says that he wants the franchise to be left alone when he dies it won't matter.