GPUs & CPUs & Enthusiast hardware: Questions, Discussion and fanboy slap-fights - Nvidia & AMD & Intel - Separe but Equal. Intel rides in the back of the bus.

[Catgirl Tyranid]

I could use some advice since I don't really know where to start.

A couple decades ago I built a gaming PC with a Nvidia GTX 980 graphics card and I have never felt the need to upgrade. I still don't, I don't do much with my PC, but I'd like to wrangle together a cheap gaming PC for my wife so she can play Minecraft with me without her computer randomly shitting a brick.

With how graphics cards have improved, are there any cards that are on par with what I already have that won't break the bank? I can't justify expensive shit like I could when I didn't have a family. I don't know what CPUs the two garage sale PCs I've got for spare parts have, but how important is a good CPU for a stable low-end gaming PC?

Further, what are the opinions on buying second hand parts?

 

[4090 Chad]

I could use some advice since I don't really know where to start.

A couple decades ago I built a gaming PC with a Nvidia GTX 980 graphics card and I have never felt the need to upgrade. I still don't, I don't do much with my PC, but I'd like to wrangle together a cheap gaming PC for my wife so she can play Minecraft with me without her computer randomly shitting a brick.

With how graphics cards have improved, are there any cards that are on par with what I already have that won't break the bank? I can't justify expensive shit like I could when I didn't have a family. I don't know what CPUs the two garage sale PCs I've got for spare parts have, but how important is a good CPU for a stable low-end gaming PC?

Further, what are the opinions on buying second hand parts?

What is your budget range?

Also, to buy used your options are really eBay and Facebook marketplace.

 

[The Ugly One]

Oh yeah, besides AVX-512 getting cut from these and my current rig being hacked into running the instructions that are on the silicone, everything above the 12400 has the small cores.

Meaning that it won't fly cuz I ain't got that fixed scheduler in my OS.

Do you actually have a single application that runs faster with AVX-512 instructions enabled than it would with 4 or 8 E-cores? Obviously, not games, since they benefit more from additional processing power than a slightly richer SIMD instruction set. And Win 10 can schedule threads on E-cores; Win 11 is just a little smarter about how it schedules them.

 

[Catgirl Tyranid]

What is your budget range?

Also, to buy used your options are really eBay and Facebook marketplace.

If I spend under $200 I'd be happy, but I'm really trying to feel out if its even feasible for what I'm looking for.

 

[4090 Chad]

If I spend under $200 I'd be happy, but I'm really trying to feel out if its even feasible for what I'm looking for.

If you’re going that poverty tier, I’d recommend getting like the cheapest office PC that has like an intel 8000 series CPU in it and then spend like $100 on a 1660 super GPU. You want 16GB of ram as well.

 

[StacticShock]

I could use some advice since I don't really know where to start.

A couple decades ago I built a gaming PC with a Nvidia GTX 980 graphics card and I have never felt the need to upgrade. I still don't, I don't do much with my PC, but I'd like to wrangle together a cheap gaming PC for my wife so she can play Minecraft with me without her computer randomly shitting a brick.

With how graphics cards have improved, are there any cards that are on par with what I already have that won't break the bank? I can't justify expensive shit like I could when I didn't have a family. I don't know what CPUs the two garage sale PCs I've got for spare parts have, but how important is a good CPU for a stable low-end gaming PC?

Further, what are the opinions on buying second hand parts?

gpu for minecraft?
thefuck, it's mainly CPU if intel and RAM because java.

mobo is generally safe
people usually tell you to NEVER BUY USED PSU's but they never tell you it's because of power fluctuations tearing a new asshole on them.
used SSD's are risky in the same level as HDD's.
used gpu's aren't a problem anymore, just be mindful of the price, too cheap is always sus and you only go for it if you feel like gambling.
RAM and processors are the safest to buy used.

Also, to buy used your options are really eBay and Facebook marketplace.

from used part purchase digging it's kinda fucky wucky, you need to run a interview with the seller and even then there is nothing stopping him from omitting a detail in order to close a sale, safest thing to do is reset all profiles to prevent OC stuff.
also there is a channel that helps with used stuff about some hapa dude, can't remember the name.

 

[Catgirl Tyranid]

If you’re going that poverty tier, I’d recommend getting like the cheapest office PC that has like an intel 8000 series CPU in it and then spend like $100 on a 1660 super GPU. You want 16GB of ram as well.

I have two PC towers with hard drives ripped out that I've gotten from garage sales over the years. Whatever they have is what I've got.

gpu for minecraft?
thefuck, it's mainly CPU if intel and RAM because java.

I don't pretend to understand computer wizardry. If swapping out for a better CPU is a better path that's good to know.

But I also intend on easing her into other multiplayer games (that already run easy on my current PC) after she gets sick of minecraft. Which is why I'm wondering what's on the market now that's comparable to the GTX980 I already have.

 

[4090 Chad]

But I also intend on easing her into other multiplayer games (that already run easy on my current PC) after she gets sick of minecraft. Which is why I'm wondering what's on the market now that's comparable to the GTX980 I already have.

Check out this relative performance chart and you can see GPUs and how they compare to the 980

Chart

 

[StacticShock]

I have two PC towers with hard drives ripped out that I've gotten from garage sales over the years. Whatever they have is what I've got.

HDD's are kinda cheap especially if you go for a WD, M2's and SSD's above 1TB that currently are on the high price point.

I'm wondering what's on the market now that's comparable to the GTX980 I already have.

1660 or RX6600
but you do need high ram, especially if you want to run modpacks and give a gander on the minecraft thread about how to set it up.
i don't know how the kiwipack fared as @SillySherman hasn't said anything.

 

[The Mass Shooter Ron Soye]

@The Ugly One
Intel Confirms Nova Lake To Close The High-End Desktop CPU Gap With AMD In Late 2026, Bringing SMT Back To P-Cores With “Coral Rapids” On Servers By 2028-2029, Highlights Need To Consolidate On Xe GPUs, & 55% Server Share (archive)

• First Panther Lake Mobile SKU Launching In Late 2025
• Panther Lake Ramp & More SKUs Planned In Early 2026
• Nova Lake Aims To Bridge High-End Desktop CPU Gap With AMD
• Nova Lake Launches In Late 2026 for mobile and desktop platforms
• Intel 18A to be the main driver for at least three generations of client/enterprise products
• Diamond Rapids P-Core CPUs with up to 256 cores In 2H 2026
• Clearwater Forest E-Core CPUs with up to 288 cores In Mid 2026
• Coral Rapids P-Core To Replace Diamond Rapids By 2028-2029
• SMT Coming Back To P-Core With Coral Rapids Server Being The First To Reintroduce It
• Consolidation and Building Upon x86 CPU and Xe GPUs
• Intel 14A targets 2028-2029 timeframe, tackles TSMC's A14

I have also taken steps to correct past mistakes regarding multi-threading capabilities on our P-cores.

Hyperthreading coming back to some P-cores isn't a surprise, because they talked about it being optional. I'm surprised it's going to take them that long. I suppose "rentable units" are dead and buried.

However, Lip also states that the ramp of Panther Lake CPUs will be equally essential as the launch, since the margins on Panther Lake are going to be tight due to higher wafer costs. So once Panther Lake matures, and subsequently, the yields improve, they will get to the right "cost structure" which will be ultimately beneficial for them.

I'm wondering about how Wildcat Lake is going to do on expensive 18A. The Linux enablement shows it's real though.

18A is a foundation for at least 3 generation of our Intel client and server business products.

We may be looking at an Alder Lake / Raptor Lake / Raptor Lake Refresh type situation with Nova Lake. But they can mix Intel and TSMC chiplets if they want to. They could also choose to use 18A with backside power delivery or not.

So I think let me just look at the server market. Clearly, we still have about 55% market shares. And clearly, we have some mistakes we made on the high-end performing server area.

That should be x86 server market share. There's some discussion from a couple days ago about PassMark data being manipulated.

The discrete product family, such as "Arc," might not have been mentioned, and although there are reports that the company isn't giving up on discrete products any time soon, they might not be a major investment or might be scaled down further. We just hope that Intel continues with the Arc lineup, both for discrete products and integrated products.

 

[#lurker]

Correct me if I'm wrong but AMD built their entire architecture around 3D V-Cache. They've spent the entire lifespan of Ryzen aiming to produce the design that ended up being the 9800X3D.

X3D was for server only until they fucked around with it and realized it was beneficial for other scenarios.

(13:10 if timestamp doesn't work)

 

[Bogan]

(13:10 if timestamp doesn't work)

Yeah I was thinking of either this video or one of the ones after where they recapped that segment.

 

[Total Annihilation]

Earlier in this thread I had mentioned that I got an rtx 5070 ti; unfortunately it's caused some VRAM issues in MSFS 2024 (this could be due to VRAM leak issues, but even if so, it's demanding on VRAM in it's nature). While I was able to get the 5070 ti at msrp, I've decided to return that, and I've gotten a 9060 xt 16gb in open box condition for just under $300 (/w warranty) from a Micro Center. While, it definitely won't run in as high fidelity as the 5070 ti, I am fine with saving the money for the time being and having a GPU that can run at lower settings, whistle not having the memory issues as the 5070 ti. Granted I could have just turned down the settings for the 5070 ti, but it would have been just over double the cost for a similar performing settings that I'd run at to work just fine (50-60 fps while flying over a major metro area such as LA or NYC). I do want to note that if you have a 5070 TI you will be fine for most other games, it's just that the flight sim in this case is quite the demanding game.
My only other options were to perhaps get a 7900 xtx, or a used 4090; the 7900 xtx would be similar to the 5070 ti, but with more VRAM, and less RT performance. Used 4090 cards are close enough to a 5090 right now anyhow, and still 24gb VRAM. Lastly, I did consider a 5090, but there's no way in hell that I'm paying more than the msrp of the Founders Edition variant, and even then, I don't want to pay 2 grand for that. I'd rather wait for a 5070 ti super or 5080 super 24gb VRAM gpu next year, or just wait till 2027/28 for the rtx 6000 or AMD RNDA5 series.

 

[Fcret]

Earlier in this thread I had mentioned that I got an rtx 5070 ti; unfortunately it's caused some VRAM issues in MSFS 2024 (this could be due to VRAM leak issues, but even if so, it's demanding on VRAM in it's nature). While I was able to get the 5070 ti at msrp, I've decided to return that, and I've gotten a 9060 xt 16gb in open box condition for just under $300 (/w warranty) from a Micro Center. While, it definitely won't run in as high fidelity as the 5070 ti, I am fine with saving the money for the time being and having a GPU that can run at lower settings, whistle not having the memory issues as the 5070 ti. Granted I could have just turned down the settings for the 5070 ti, but it would have been just over double the cost for a similar performing settings that I'd run at to work just fine (50-60 fps while flying over a major metro area such as LA or NYC). I do want to note that if you have a 5070 TI you will be fine for most other games, it's just that the flight sim in this case is quite the demanding game.
My only other options were to perhaps get a 7900 xtx, or a used 4090; the 7900 xtx would be similar to the 5070 ti, but with more VRAM, and less RT performance. Used 4090 cards are close enough to a 5090 right now anyhow, and still 24gb VRAM. Lastly, I did consider a 5090, but there's no way in hell that I'm paying more than the msrp of the Founders Edition variant, and even then, I don't want to pay 2 grand for that. I'd rather wait for a 5070 ti super or 5080 super 24gb VRAM gpu next year, or just wait till 2027/28 for the rtx 6000 or AMD RNDA5 series.

How do you have VRAM problems with a 5070 ti but not a 9060 XT 16 GB? They both have the same amount of VRAM.

 

[Total Annihilation]

How do you have VRAM problems with a 5070 ti but not a 9060 XT 16 GB? They both have the same amount of VRAM.

I run flight sim at a lower graphical setting = lower VRAM use. I'd rather spend $300 vs $750 if I'm going to have to have the game ran at lower settings anyhow, given the 5070 ti will have to have it's settings lowered to a similar level of the 9060 xt to maintain a constant frame rate, versus having it ran at higher settings with the VRAM limit getting hit, thereby causing bad stutters and big frame rate drops. If the 5070 ti had say 24gb VRAM, i suspect this issue would be solved, but I've seen people having 25gb VRAM used when they're using a 5090 and it's 32gb VRAM. To summarize: This only really matters if you're a simulation autist like myself.
See this video as an example of more than 16gb VRAM being used (I had the VRAM bottleneck when running on settings even lower than the Nvidia 5070 ti's recommended settings):

 

[#lurker]

I'd rather wait for a 5070 ti super or 5080 super 24gb VRAM gpu next year,

Don't buy GPU's year to year, complete waste of money and time. Just wait a few years for the next generation of cards.

 

[The Mass Shooter Ron Soye]

See this video as an example of more than 16gb VRAM being used (I had the VRAM bottleneck when running on settings even lower than the Nvidia 5070 ti's recommended settings):

Sheesh, even the 18/20 GB cards do nothing for you.

 

[The Ugly One]

I run flight sim at a lower graphical setting = lower VRAM use. I'd rather spend $300 vs $750 if I'm going to have to have the game ran at lower settings anyhow, given the 5070 ti will have to have it's settings lowered to a similar level of the 9060 xt to maintain a constant frame rate, versus having it ran at higher settings with the VRAM limit getting hit, thereby causing bad stutters and big frame rate drops. If the 5070 ti had say 24gb VRAM, i suspect this issue would be solved, but I've seen people having 25gb VRAM used when they're using a 5090 and it's 32gb VRAM. To summarize: This only really matters if you're a simulation autist like myself.
See this video as an example of more than 16gb VRAM being used (I had the VRAM bottleneck when running on settings even lower than the Nvidia 5070 ti's recommended settings):

Seems like the solution is not to not run 4K native with 4x frame gen. Either turn frame gen off or DLSS upscaling on.

 

[Total Annihilation]

Seems like the solution is not to not run 4K native with 4x frame gen. Either turn frame gen off or DLSS upscaling on.

I was trying it with both the 5070 ti and the 9060 xt 16gb yesterday b4 and after the switch; both cards were using 15/16gb of VRAM when used on overall high settings (with DLLS and FSR set to performance) and frame gen off. Funnily enough,when I tried FSR 3 frame gen in msfs 2024 would cause the frame rate to only be 10 more fps vs frame gen off, with a lot of artifacting on the 9060 xt, otherwise I'd get 50-60 fps on it.

 

[The Ugly One]

I was trying it with both the 5070 ti and the 9060 xt 16gb yesterday b4 and after the switch; both cards were using 15/16gb of VRAM when used on overall high settings (with DLLS and FSR set to performance) and frame gen off. Funnily enough,when I tried FSR 3 frame gen in msfs 2024 would cause the frame rate to only be 10 more fps vs frame gen off, with a lot of artifacting on the 9060 xt, otherwise I'd get 50-60 fps on it.

I don't know why you'd think the same game would use less VRAM on a different card. It's not like AMD has some special proprietary compression algorithm or something. Try turning texture resolution down a notch.