Grand Jury speculation thread

What will the next legal development be?

  • Grand Jury declares Chris fit for trial

    Votes: 458 30.3%
  • Grand Jury declares Chris a brokebrain and unfit for trial

    Votes: 203 13.4%
  • CONTINUANCE!

    Votes: 220 14.6%
  • Plea deal

    Votes: 122 8.1%
  • The US collapses, Chris escapes from jail and becomes a cult-leader

    Votes: 208 13.8%
  • The Merge occurs

    Votes: 301 19.9%

  • Total voters
    1,512
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Not trying to be an ass, but no. That's not how courts work. Continuances happen all the time and depending on the trial.
Well, you are right, of course that not how courts work but if there's a reason and there's something is getting in a way of court, to not have it to reach a trial, like COVID for example, which got in the way, then the process gets postponed or in this case, a continuance, which suggests that's somethings going on. Courts are funded out of taxpayers money, (unless it's funded some other way) and I should be surprised if people are getting angry or upset about how long it's taking.

but because it's Chris we're talking about and how bizarre and unprecedented the crime is, I think it's going to be much more worst on Chris. It wasn't even the internet and the trolls that did that. It was Chris in his mom's house, with what he did (if not Isabella, if any of that is true).

I was talking about it in a perspective of a law makers. They write the law and they write it for a reason. I'm pretty sure the courts enforce what the law say but because of situations like these (like any unprecedented crimes), it gets taken to a higher senior position to see what's best for the situation for everyone's safety. It's for us, not for Chris. The incest law was written because the suspect went on to violate someone younger then them. Not written for a situation like this, but it's still incest. For the courts, it's tough to deal with that. So my best guess, they're going to want more time to think about what's best and they have Chris, alive in jail. It's not going to be 10 years, someone like Chris expects. I'm saying, it really may be double that and that's not me trolling!

Edit: The other idea may be, that they may charge him for something, put him in prison but then add more the law books and summon him again and charge him for another crime, to better explain what he has done, with the evidence they have. That's another possibility.
 
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Chris did, or what he's been accused of doing, on someone with dementia. Incest laws were designed on suspects who do that to their kids and this happens. Then another continuance? It's taking up courts time and just because the law is written in such a way, doesn't mean they're going to apply that on everyone. I really don't think so.

No, the law is written to cover all incest with immediate family, including adults, including fucking your parents. They couldn't even prosecute him if the law didn't explicitly include fucking your mother as part of the statute.

Moreover, it has a clause for fucking minor offspring, making it a more serious Class 3 felony instead of a wobbler Class 5 felony.

B. Any person who engages in sexual intercourse with his daughter or granddaughter, son or grandson, or father or mother is guilty of a Class 5 felony. However, if a parent or grandparent engages in sexual intercourse with his child or grandchild, and such child or grandchild is at least 13 years of age but less than 18 years of age at the time of the offense, such parent or grandparent is guilty of a Class 3 felony.

The reason for this is because this is not a statute built around harm caused to another, but a crime against human morals and decency. There are separate laws for crimes against a victim. That's why the incest statute doesn't bother with kids under 13 -- there are rape laws to cover that (below age 13, minors are assumed incapable of consent, rather than just being disallowed consent).

Under this statute, fucking your 12 year old kid is actually LESS BAD than fucking your 17 year old kid, but it doesn't matter as there are other penalties. This statute explicitly makes it a moral issue rather than a harm issue.

I think Chris is going to get double the time for the crime because how it's eating up courts time. I'm talking about 20 damn years in prison, not the "maximum" ten! I seriously think that because of the how severe the crime is and how it's taking up the courts time.

They can't do that. They can't sentence someone to a longer sentence than statute allows. That would violate the constitution in numerous way. If the max is 10 years, the max is 10 years. For a Class 5 felony (and remember he's not even charged in a felony court yet, so right now he's only facing 1 year) that is the explicit maximum punishment.

I recall that he says most don't even go to trail. Defendants usually set up a plea deal. The point of the Defendant is to make sure their client is given a fair and reasonable trail. This mean mitigating the possible punishments.

Some pedantic corrections:

Trial, not trail. And yes, 94% of state convictions and 97% of federal convictions come from plea agreements, not trials.

The "defendant" is the person/entity accused of the crime. The defense attorney is the person who has the defendant as a client. Collectively they are referred to as the defense.

Then Chris has the possibility of walking free with time served unless they put the pressure and charge him with a class 5 felony. Since a class 5 misdemeanor you can only be held for a year max.

Class 1 misdemeanor. Class 5 and Class 6 felonies (the lowest grade felonies -- the worst crimes like murder are Class 1 felonies), are the felonies that can be downgraded to the worst misdemeanor -- Class 1.

There is no Class 5 misdemeanor. The least severe misdemeanors in Virginia are Class 3 and Class 4, which are only punishable by small fines -- i.e. they're basically infractions but unlike an infraction they act as a negative mark on your criminal record.

Which would be harder to nail. Nonetheless with time served so in the end. He'd get anywhere from no time, to at most 9 years. Plus Virginia has a "get out jail" (joking) with autism allowing reduced sentences or punishment. If his lawyer is good enough, which he probably is as he willing took up Chris's case. He could get his sentence suspended or deferred. So if Chris manages to not break anything during probation he could walk as well.

It's not really "walking" when your sentence is satisfied with time served. You still have a criminal record (in this case a pretty fucking gross one) and you still spend a bunch of time in jail, it's just you served your time in advance.

Edit: The other idea may be, that they may charge him for something, put him in prison but then add more the law books and summon him again and charge him for another crime, to better explain what he has done, with the evidence they have. That's another possibility.

That's called ex post facto and is explicitly banned by the constitution. It was one of the factors behind the American Revolution, because at the time the English government could still apply ex post facto laws. Americans hated the idea of changing the law to punish someone for something that previously wasn't punishable.

It has since been banned by the European Convention on Human Rights, and in most nations of the world under other international conventions.

You CAN come back and charge someone with another crime at a later date, if the crime is already on the books, but that is against policy by the principle of single event in most jurisdictions, including Virginia. Furthermore, plea agreements always include a proviso that any other charges involved in the incident will not be brought.

EDIT: For instance, right now they can add more charges to Chris' case, like the crime against nature statute that bans oral/anal intercourse with family members (it is a separate statute from the main incest law, which only concerns penis in vagina). However if Chris makes a plea agreement, it will include a non-prosecution agreement for all other potential charges in the matter.

If instead Chris is found guilty at trial for incest, they still will not come back and recharge him with oral as that is against the policy of the courts, *unless* new evidence comes to light that was not known of during the course of the trial.

In addition, if they convict him of misdemeanor incest they cannot come back and re-try him for felony incest as that is the same statute with the same evidentiary requirements, which would make it double jeopardy.

EDIT 2: Also criminal indemnification does not mean civil indemnification -- so for instance even after a plea deal, Barb or her other heirs could still sue Chris for damages, but that would be pointless as Chris has no money.

EDIT 3: Technically the UK can still pass ex post facto laws, as they are not banned entirely, but they are bound by international treaty to not criminally punish people with them worse than they could have been under existing law. So for instance they could still pass an ex post facto law that opened you up to a civil lawsuit, though that would be frowned upon by the legal establishment.

The US constitution, on the other hand, flat out bans ex post facto laws entirely.
 
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Ahhh, okay, I suppose the law definition of incest does cover it in the broadest way. I stand corrected. I suppose I see why, it does really test everyone's patience seeing Chris sit in jail until his trial. (I'll get that word, right)
 
Write me down for a small fine a timed served.

It be my guess that by the time Fatty's trial is concluded he will have been in the pen for about a year. So he'll walk away once this shit slowly flows through the justice system.

Now I do want to make an addendum that I think Fatty will get a restraining order that prohibits him from living with or speaking to Barb so he'll be uber fucked until she dies as the Temple and all its vast treasures will be off limits to him upon pain of going back into jail.

whether Chunky actually listens to a restraining order is anyone's guess. This is the man child whose first order of business when arrested for incest was to question the judge when he could have the new toys he just bought with stolen money back.

So....who the fuck knows
 
Ahhh, okay, I suppose the law definition of incest does cover it in the broadest way. I stand corrected. I suppose I see why, it does really test everyone's patience seeing Chris sit in jail until his trial. (I'll get that word, right)
Tbh, the trial really isn't taking that long in the actual grand scheme of things. For example, the McMartin Preschool trial took 7 years, cost over $15 million, and resulted in literally no convictions. That is an extreme example, but the point stands. Moreover, the judge is the one that grants continuances of the case, which are requested by the attorneys for either side, and requesting multiple continuances in order to pursue a plea deal, get discovery of evidence in the case, or inadequate time to prepare analyze all the evidence in the case is not uncommon. It's been about 7 months, and it's in the defense's best interest to stall here.
 
I think Chris is going to get double the time for the crime because how it's eating up courts time. I'm talking about 20 damn years in prison, not the "maximum" ten! I seriously think that because of the how severe the crime is and how it's taking up the courts time.
wow! you really meant that so fucking much!! 1st i was, like maybe he means it. then i was like, OH SHIT HE MEANS IT ALOT!

stfu
 
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With the continuance has been said (I know this was one of the first comments but it really had me thinking!), I think the reason it's taking much longer, is because of the bizarre situation of Chris and the victim. With family courts, unlike the straightforward court, we all know about, they have to take into consideration how to handle the suspect and victim. Not just throw someone like Chris in a cold jail cell.

Barbara is becoming 80, with what I've read elsewhere, the family on Barbara's end are helping, so clearly the courts are keeping in contact with Barbara and her family. She can go at any moment but at the same time, I don't think the courts should rush to reach a verdict.

With Chris and with the continuance, it does suggest that the court are having a hard time getting somewhere with Chris and his crime and I don't think it's going to be good for Chris. I keep reading how his crimes make him face up to 10 years in prison but sometimes, you'll have to think why they give people who commit incest (on their kids) 10 years and not 20? I don't think the courts want to put the victim in a position where they feel bad for getting someone in prison, so they

Chris did, or what he's been accused of doing, on someone with dementia. Incest laws were designed on suspects who do that to their kids and this happens. Then another continuance? It's taking up courts time and just because the law is written in such a way, doesn't mean they're going to apply that on everyone. I really don't think so.

I think Chris is going to get double the time for the crime because how it's eating up courts time. I'm talking about 20 damn years in prison, not the "maximum" ten! I seriously think that because of the how severe the crime is and how it's taking up the courts time.
The justice system eats up its own time. They aren't going to punish Chris for their own inefficiencies, especially since Chris's cases are always long and drawn out, but ended with slaps on the wrists.
 
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since this christian love day is chris' 40 birthday, how long do y'all think he'll live given his general unhealthiness?
 
Chris did, or what he's been accused of doing, on someone with dementia. Incest laws were designed on suspects who do that to their kids and this happens. Then another continuance? It's taking up courts time and just because the law is written in such a way, doesn't mean they're going to apply that on everyone. I really don't think so.
I think Chris will be nailed because Virginia's statute clearly defines fucking your parents is a felony. Not "wobbling" because the perpetrator is a tard. Not "wobbling" because the perp thinks he's Jesus. Not "wobbling" because the perp is a manchild. You fuck your parents in Virginia, and that's a class 5 felony.

This is something the "legal experts" on here don't seem to want to acknowledge. It's really clear that if you fuck your parents in VA, you get a felony, because oops, the law as written, as I've posted before, says "you fuck your parents, you get a felony".

The other thing that the "legal experts" on here won't touch like Chris won't touch employment is that Chris got charged two days after the whole event came to light. LEOs in VA know all about Chris because he has a lengthy record, in addition to the ween nonsense. Would they just hammer Chris with a felony before Barb's even out of evaluations? No. They know they need to get Chris, but since this is so out of their realm, they have to charge him with something, hence the misdemeanor.

Remember, the "legal experts" on here claimed over and over that the courts just wanted to be done with Chris, and February would be the last one where they'd deal with Chris, stamp a "time served: six months", adjudicate him guilty and bounce him.

Except... that didn't happen. Much like Chris's goddess prophecies, that fell right into the toilet.

What I think is happening is what I always believed, that courts want to make sure every T is crossed and every I is dotted, which means True & Honest evaluations to make sure that Chris isn't legitimately mentally ill and that he's of sound mind. Now it runs into an issue because Barb might not be cooperating in explicitly saying that Chris fucked her, however, on the flipside, we see family coming in and helping Barb. That's not a good look if you had to defend Chris because it shows that Barb needs help in everyday life, while the dude you're defending is claiming he "healed her" with his penis.

Sure, some podunk court wants to get Billy Boozer out of their hair on his fifth DUI, but if Billy wrecks his car into a daycare, then fucks some of the kids, ehhhh... the court case is going to go a little slower. And the more complicated something is, the longer it's going to take, especially with the government in charge.

I understand the tard law that Rob Bell introduced, but how does this apply to Chris? What? Does talking to magic hedgehogs make you subject to government placement? Does spouting that you're Jesus suddenly make the government shit out a place to live and job?
 
I think Chris will be nailed because Virginia's statute clearly defines fucking your parents is a felony. Not "wobbling" because the perpetrator is a tard. Not "wobbling" because the perp thinks he's Jesus. Not "wobbling" because the perp is a manchild. You fuck your parents in Virginia, and that's a class 5 felony.

This is something the "legal experts" on here don't seem to want to acknowledge. It's really clear that if you fuck your parents in VA, you get a felony, because oops, the law as written, as I've posted before, says "you fuck your parents, you get a felony".

It's written that way because it's baked into the definition of Class 5 and Class 6 felonies. There are no misdemeanors that "wobble up". They don't have to specify that they are wobblers in the statutes because *all* Class 5 and Class 6 felonies are wobblers. The fact that they are wobblers is the only reason it can even be in J&DR court. They would not have been able to arraign him in J&DR otherwise.

EDIT: For an example where they actually specify without using the "Class", in Virginia manslaughter (both voluntary and involuntary) are Class 5 felonies, but there is a DUI enhancement which directly specifies the punishment instead of referring to the Class system.
 
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It's written that way because it's baked into the definition of Class 5 and Class 6 felonies. There are no misdemeanors that "wobble up". They don't have to specify that they are wobblers in the statutes because *all* Class 5 and Class 6 felonies are wobblers. The fact that they are wobblers is the only reason it can even be in J&DR court. They would not have been able to arraign him in J&DR otherwise.

EDIT: For an example where they actually specify without using the "Class", in Virginia manslaughter (both voluntary and involuntary) are Class 5 felonies, but there is a DUI enhancement which directly specifies the punishment instead of referring to the Class system.
"Wobblers don't wobble up, they always wobble down"

Well, we'll see what the future holds. As you're well aware from your extensive experience with Chris, you know that there's always surprises.
 
"Wobblers don't wobble up, they always wobble down"

Well, we'll see what the future holds. As you're well aware from your extensive experience with Chris, you know that there's always surprises.

Oh believe me, it's still quite possible that they bring him up on a felony charge, it's just that so far they have shown no inclination to. If he pops up in circuit court we'll know that happened.
 
Curiously I wonder when's the next court date. I haven't seen it updated on the CWCki and don't know exactly where to find it. I'm assuming the dates are already booked and they're trying to find a spot.
 
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Anyone can call the courthouse.

Just remember to call the combined general/J&DR number 434-985-5225 or 434-985-5224, You will get Clerk Amber L. Knight, or Deputy Clerks Mary Shifflett or Chastity Hall. I'm not sure which one is more helpful but different people will probably give you different responses in terms of how helpful they will be.

Ahhh, okay, I suppose the law definition of incest does cover it in the broadest way. I stand corrected. I suppose I see why, it does really test everyone's patience seeing Chris sit in jail until his trial. (I'll get that word, right)

It's interesting how inclusive it is, in that the law is actually not about incest, but "persons forbidden to marry". The enhancement to Class 5 felony is the explicit incest part. Interestingly, it makes it a felony to fuck your parent, but not your grandparent (but still a felony to fuck your grandchild). Fucking your grandparent is still limited to being a misdemeanor.

So, given that it makes it illegal to fuck anyone you aren't allowed to marry, before Loving v. Virginia in 1967, this "incest" law also made it illegal for a white woman to fuck a black man, etc.

Also, as I mentioned in another post, it's not really "broad" in how it covers incest. It only covers penis-in-vagina (as "sexual intercourse" is defined in Virginia case law). Another statute bans oral/anal sex. But the statutes are so specific about conduct that there is absolutely no law that I can find that makes it illegal for Chris to make out with Barb, finger her, bang her with a dildo, etc., as long as it was consensual.

Barb could give hand jobs to Chris all day and it would be perfectly legal.
 
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