EU High rate of army dropouts pushes German forces to ‘breaking point’ - One in four new recruits drops out within six months of joining

High rate of army dropouts pushes German forces to ‘breaking point’
Financial Times (archive.ph)
By Laura Pitel
2025-03-11 14:32:32GMT

One in four new recruits to the German armed forces drops out within six months of joining, according to the nation’s military watchdog who warned that personnel shortages were pushing troops “to breaking point”.

Eva Högl, the commissioner for the armed forces in the German parliament, said that despite some success in recruitment, poor retention meant that the armed forces had come no closer to meeting their target of having 203,000 soldiers by 2031.

Instead, the total force size had fallen slightly to just over 181,000 at a time when Germany is pledging to do more to bolster Europe’s own defences in the face of a potential US retreat from the continent.

“The Bundeswehr is shrinking and getting older,” Högl said as she presented her annual report on the state of the Bundeswehr, noting that the average age had risen to 34 years — up from 33.1 years in 2021. “This development must be stopped and reversed as a matter of urgency.

She added: “I said the troops are challenged, but they are also very overburdened. I’ll go as far as to say they’re at breaking point. When we look at where our Bundeswehr is needed — for national defence, [Nato] alliance defence, international crisis management — it is a lot. And it really is at the limit.”

Högl’s warning comes as Europe reckons with US President Donald Trump’s decision to end support for Ukraine — and faces the prospect that Washington could end its postwar commitment to providing security guarantees for the continent.

Speaking as US and Ukrainian diplomatic delegations met in Saudi Arabia to discuss ending the war with Russia, Högl said that it was “premature” to talk about sending troops to Ukraine to police a possible future ceasefire between Kyiv and Moscow.

But, adding that Europe’s largest and richest nation would want to take responsibility, she said that it was important for politicians to consider what the Bundeswehr could actually handle and what was “no longer possible”.

Högl said that, despite the alarming personnel picture, the German armed forces had made significant progress in the past few years after decades of under-investment.

She heaped praise on Boris Pistorius — the popular German defence minister who like her is a member of the Social Democrats — for his efforts to drive reform. She said that, after years of endless delays, some things were finally improving thanks to outgoing Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s 2022 announcement of a “watershed moment” (Zeitenwende) in German security and defence and the unveiling of a €100bn fund for the armed forces. Friedrich Merz, the winner of last month’s federal elections, last week announced a plan to allow unlimited borrowing to finance higher defence spending in order to continue that overhaul.

As evidence of the improvement, Högl said that the German navy’s elite diving force Eckernförde “finally have their diving practice hall” after 13 years of waiting for it.

Soldiers had received a new 110-litre backpack, she said. And the military had successfully procured 60,000 hearing protection headsets that muffled the noise of gunfire and enabled troops to communicate while shooting.

After “considerable delays” in the introduction of the new digital radio system, several battalions in 2024 successfully adopted the new tool, the report said.

However, the roughly 700 German soldiers currently serving as a part a multinational battlegroup in Lithuania — a key plank of protecting Nato’s eastern flank from Russian aggression — still did not have the system at the end of last year. Instead they were having to use a workaround involving encrypted satellite-supported communications.

Högl said that this was one of many problems that continued to blight the Bundeswehr, including lack of digitalisation, overbearing bureaucracy that “strains the patience and nerves of everyone involved” and the “disastrous state” of some barracks.

She gave the example of a defective set of hall doors at a military base in Koblenz that had caused serious injuries, including the loss of fingertips. But the replacement of the doors, which has been needed since 2017, did not take place in 2024 and was only scheduled to begin this year.
 
Also, now special forces soldiers can only remain on the KSK for a limited time before having to serve in the regular branches for a while until they're allowed back with the KSK. Not a bad idea, should keep them grounded.
It is a bad idea. Special Operations types are not simply interchangeable with line troopers. They do have a specific skillset that has to be honed and it takes a long time to do just that. And you can't just take, for example, an infantry squad leader and drop him in a SF A-Team and expect him to do that same job without the minimum year worth of Q Course, follow on specialized training (weapons, engineering, communications specialist training, etc.) , not to mention language training. Your infantry sergeant just doesn't need that to do his job and giving him all of that just to pull him back out of SF and drop him back in a line unit is just a complete waste of time and resources for everyone involved. It gets worse for officers. Planning is planning, but the knowledge base isn't the same. Your infantry officer might go from field assignment to a staff school to a non-field assignment to a command rotation and keep doing that his entire career, but your SF officer isn't going to be doing that same rotation. His career track is built to be different right from the time he gets that beret.

It's not going to be different for the other services. A SEAL officer needs different training and skills than a Surface Warfare officer, just like how a Naval Aviator needs different training and skills than a Submariner. An Air Force Pilot doesn't have the same career path as a Missile Officer or the same skill set as a Finance Officer.
 
It is a bad idea. Special Operations types are not simply interchangeable with line troopers. They do have a specific skillset that has to be honed and it takes a long time to do just that. And you can't just take, for example, an infantry squad leader and drop him in a SF A-Team and expect him to do that same job without the minimum year worth of Q Course, follow on specialized training (weapons, engineering, communications specialist training, etc.) , not to mention language training. Your infantry sergeant just doesn't need that to do his job and giving him all of that just to pull him back out of SF and drop him back in a line unit is just a complete waste of time and resources for everyone involved. It gets worse for officers. Planning is planning, but the knowledge base isn't the same. Your infantry officer might go from field assignment to a staff school to a non-field assignment to a command rotation and keep doing that his entire career, but your SF officer isn't going to be doing that same rotation. His career track is built to be different right from the time he gets that beret.

It's not going to be different for the other services. A SEAL officer needs different training and skills than a Surface Warfare officer, just like how a Naval Aviator needs different training and skills than a Submariner. An Air Force Pilot doesn't have the same career path as a Missile Officer or the same skill set as a Finance Officer.
Makes sense, yeah.
I'm not actually sure if those service limits have actually been implemented. Can't find anything on that, just mentions that the previous defense minister wanted that.
 
A fun part about the Bundeswehr is that every shot fired has to be accounted for, so soldiers during practice get a fixed amount of bullets and have to sign off on them and have to sign off on having fired them all. If they even get ammo, often they just shout BANG BANG during maneuvers. Even international ones. Which is sad.
Between this and the limited training hours, it's like children playing soldier
lmao.png
How cute. Hope they have fun picking up the slack now that USA is checking out of the building!
Difficult to have an army when you close down a special forces unit with 1400 soldiers because 20 of them think Hitler is misunderstood
Smart idea, to either throw your most trained men in prison or let them roam free like Rambo. What a bunch of retards. Hopefully they will eventually become mercs and serve under the only one that appreciates them, the almighty dollar.
Maybe all these ahmeds will pick up the slack and join the special forces, huh?
 
lso kinda hard to have an elite unit in an environment where thinking of yourself as "elite" is heavily frowned upon.
The euros have the same attitude for their militaries as america had after vietnam and before 9/11, the military is where retards go when they can't get a job. so you can be a swedish pj or a Kraut seal but everyone still looks down on you because you're a retard who couldn't get a job. Thanks to dei we're back to thinking the military is for chumps.
It is a bad idea. Special Operations types are not simply interchangeable with line troopers.
it's a good idea. one of the problems we had with our SOF units was that there wasn't enough of them to do the various raids and door kicking at the optemp necessary, the other problem is that we're taking green berets and seals and having them raid houses and compounds. spreading out the knowledge with regular infantry will help in the long run. it also prevents hsld operators from canoeing people as a form of insular tribalism.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CloverKitty
Fucking Israel has a bigger army that's probably better equipped. It really shows how insane the reliance of Europe on the USA to protect them, while Euros shittalk the USA back.

Whats always somewhat difficult to figure out is how Germany can spend so much on its military and get so little in return. The size of the fighting force is very small. They are not well paid or trained for that matter. Everything is done within the fighting part of the military on the cheap. And yet they are spending 86 billion dollars a year.
 
Whats always somewhat difficult to figure out is how Germany can spend so much on its military and get so little in return. The size of the fighting force is very small. They are not well paid or trained for that matter. Everything is done within the fighting part of the military on the cheap. And yet they are spending 86 billion dollars a year.
It basically all falls into corruption and buying the newest overpriced toys that are too over specialized to be practical.
 
I foresee conscription in Europe's future as the eurolibs desperately resort to naked force to prop up their crumbling societies.
1710824384972333.jpg
I really want this to happen just to see it blow up all in their face. conscription is always a bad idea even in the best cases, now imagine it with the current zoomer demographic where lot of them wouldn't even be german. let me see all that multi-culturalism during combat where they respect all the individual cultures (except german) and genders - everything else would be nazi of course.
plus, with current year you can't just use men, people are already itching to go into legal lawfare about it, and even if they ultimately lose you suddenly have half the population pissed off. so what you gonna do with all the women? put them in a civic service? then you have to offer it to men too. who's gonna pay for it? ironically till they abolished mandatory duty that part was big support to the struggling social services (and ofc back then only men had to do it). germany isn't so liberal (but certainly retarded) to either have mixed companies (enjoy your sudden pregnancies, one way to fix the birth rate problem I guess) or separation, and oh boy after that survivor episode they could make lots of money putting it on television, since women battalions certainly can't be put into combat, especially in eastern europe or even more hilariously in the middle east.

they can put whatever money they want into the military, that won't generate all the soldiers they'd need out of thin air. good luck putting muhammed and yevgeny on a "peace-keeping" mission in their own fucking homeland :story:

Whats always somewhat difficult to figure out is how Germany can spend so much on its military and get so little in return. The size of the fighting force is very small. They are not well paid or trained for that matter. Everything is done within the fighting part of the military on the cheap. And yet they are spending 86 billion dollars a year.
millions in consulting. for what? well that's secret since it involves the military. conveniently all the messages got deleted by von der leyen's phone when the people looked into it.

enjoy the current EU president!
 
Last edited:
It is a bad idea. Special Operations types are not simply interchangeable with line troopers. They do have a specific skillset that has to be honed and it takes a long time to do just that. And you can't just take, for example, an infantry squad leader and drop him in a SF A-Team and expect him to do that same job without the minimum year worth of Q Course, follow on specialized training (weapons, engineering, communications specialist training, etc.) , not to mention language training. Your infantry sergeant just doesn't need that to do his job and giving him all of that just to pull him back out of SF and drop him back in a line unit is just a complete waste of time and resources for everyone involved. It gets worse for officers. Planning is planning, but the knowledge base isn't the same. Your infantry officer might go from field assignment to a staff school to a non-field assignment to a command rotation and keep doing that his entire career, but your SF officer isn't going to be doing that same rotation. His career track is built to be different right from the time he gets that beret.

It's not going to be different for the other services. A SEAL officer needs different training and skills than a Surface Warfare officer, just like how a Naval Aviator needs different training and skills than a Submariner. An Air Force Pilot doesn't have the same career path as a Missile Officer or the same skill set as a Finance Officer.
You should still cycle them in occasionally just because some of those skills are usable by the line forces (engineering and weapons especially) and having those guys pass it on via direct experience is the easiest way to do it. For those unaware of vital engineering skills are for soldiers, the majority of American officers who graduate from West Point do so with engineering degrees because 90% of soldiering is building shit to make it easier on you to break the other guys' shit, and that's everything from roads to bases to even field works.
 
The euros have the same attitude for their militaries as america had after vietnam and before 9/11, the military is where retards go when they can't get a job. so you can be a swedish pj or a Kraut seal but everyone still looks down on you because you're a retard who couldn't get a job. Thanks to dei we're back to thinking the military is for chumps.
Which is dumb because a large portion of European youth are perma-students who refuse to get a job.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Chicken Neck Nelly
Remember that time America conscripted its youth to go die in the shithole jungles of Vietnam and the self-respecting American populace finally said "No, you will not make our children die for your globohomo, fuck off" and made sure the government regretted it so hard they never abused the American people for their globohomo agenda ever again? I sure don't.
 
Instead, the total force size had fallen slightly to just over 181,000 at a time when Germany is pledging to do more to bolster Europe’s own defences in the face of a potential US retreat from the continent.
The true size of the German Army is about 63,000 men.
If either of these numbers are true then all I can say is "lol, lmao". Russian has killed how many ukrainians at this point? 5x the high estimate?
 
Whats always somewhat difficult to figure out is how Germany can spend so much on its military and get so little in return. The size of the fighting force is very small. They are not well paid or trained for that matter. Everything is done within the fighting part of the military on the cheap. And yet they are spending 86 billion dollars a year.
From what I understand they cheat and put everything they possibly can under "military spending" to keep the numbers inflated. In terms of actual effectiveness i wouldn't be surprised if they're somewhere behind Belarus.

enjoy your sudden pregnancies, one way to fix the birth rate problem I guess
If they're anything like their American counterparts, they'll abort as soon as the coast is clear. What you think the German government is going to do, tell them "no" to prevent obvious abuse of the system?
 
  • Like
Reactions: CloverKitty
If either of these numbers are true then all I can say is "lol, lmao". Russian has killed how many ukrainians at this point? 5x the high estimate?

The German Defense Establishment as a whole has 181,000 people in it

The German Army has 63,000 people in it
The German Navy has 15,000 people it
The German Air Force has 28,000 people in it
The military medical service has 20,000 people in it
The German Cyber Warfare Service has about 15,000 people in it.
The German Military Logistics organization has 28,000 people in it.
(there are maybe 10,000 random people who don't fit into any of the above organizations as well)

- The 27,000 people in the air force support roughly 380 aircraft and helicopters. A 71-1 ratio.
- The 15000 people in the navy support 36 real ships. A 417-1 ratio.
 
The German Defense Establishment as a whole has 181,000 people in it

The German Army has 63,000 people in it
The German Navy has 15,000 people it
The German Air Force has 28,000 people in it
The military medical service has 20,000 people in it
The German Cyber Warfare Service has about 15,000 people in it.
The German Military Logistics organization has 28,000 people in it.
(there are maybe 10,000 random people who don't fit into any of the above organizations as well)

- The 27,000 people in the air force support roughly 380 aircraft and helicopters. A 71-1 ratio.
- The 15000 people in the navy support 36 real ships. A 417-1 ratio.
Jeez, maybe everyone is worried about ukraine because if they get through there they really could conquer europe. :story:
 
Whats always somewhat difficult to figure out is how Germany can spend so much on its military and get so little in return. The size of the fighting force is very small. They are not well paid or trained for that matter. Everything is done within the fighting part of the military on the cheap. And yet they are spending 86 billion dollars a year.
Never underestimate the ability for lefties to be given a million bucks and waste 90 grand on setting up the infrastructure to spend it.

Waste and inefficiency will always happen when you send someone to spend another person's money, but, in terms of return on investment even within that field? It's hard to pick worse than those who think financial debt is just a made-up social construct to prevent them from buying their way to socialist utopia. With other's money.
 
Last edited:
Back