Legend of Zelda thread - Lorefags GTFO!

My initial problem with the Zonai stuff is fading. It does make sense that not a lot of time was spent on digging through ruins during the fucking plague. And when people did start researching, it was focused on what was in front of them (guardian/sheikah tech) and less on what was hidden away (zonai stuff) and otherwise much harder to find.

Now, a touch more Zonai stuff and mentions in BOTW would have been super. But as a retcon they did about as good as they could.

Still a minor issue but not as big as it was.
 
Please do, that kind of shit is right up my alley.
Okay this will probably be messy and poorly put together, just covering snapping and weapon merging for this post.

Each physics object has a collision mesh, obviously, but that is what gets used for all attachment calculation. Larger objects have assigned snap points, which I'll show in a bit. Small objects like the ones for weapons don't seemingly have any assigned snap points, and instead the game uses some sort of algorithm, either a smart one or just a smoothed closes vertex on the collision mesh (most likely this one, since you can see the snap preview jump around on lower poly objects).
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You can only attach on parts with collision, which is fairly obvious. Here is an example showing how it uses the collision mesh, as this lizalfos horn has no collision on the end (I would assume the world objects are automatically generated convex hulls, since they are using Havok anyway, hence why sword objects have no collision on smaller points like this sword end, but there is also another example that shows otherwise).
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What leads me to believe they are snapping to the nearest vertex is that each branch end on sticks gets a snap point, I would have to see the collision mesh itself but this seems automatic and not authored points, since its pretty loose and the lower branch doesn't really snap as strongly. Maybe its something to do with density of nearby vertices that lets them detect protruding edges.

Small objects (I will use two terms from now on, small objects being collectable items, objects intended to be merged to weapons only or objects too small for actual building, and building objects, objects with assigned snap points and intended for building.) seemingly don't hard snap to building object snap points, they are biased towards them but allow placement anywhere along the collision mesh. Will probably look more into this when I get to doing a breakdown of the building system.

Now this is not to say small objects don't have snap points. I don't think they are actual defined points but instead the origin of the mesh. I believe when it comes to weapon merging there are two types of merges, authored merges that replace the blade of a sword or the shield of a shield, and then non authored merges that just attach the object to the sword/shield using the origin as a snap point.
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Attaching a blade to a weapon will replace the blade with the new one, but leave the handle from the original base weapon. I assume there is vertex data in the base weapon mesh that is used to hide just the blade when merging weapons, since in that image the blade replaces the front of the stick base weapon, but the stick handle is unchanged. I doubt they made unique models for each weapon and a version with just the handle, that seems like too much work for a system that is seemingly designed around modularity. The blade gets attached to a specified point, which would seemingly be disconnected from the building snap points, seems to be set for the end of the handle and the bottom of the blade, unless they are just using the blade origin to snap to the handle attachment point.
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The second type of weapon merge is where the attached item simply gets snapped to the base weapon using the origin of the attached item. The origin of the item attached, in this case a sword, is whats also used when the weapon is held by link, you can see its the same spot his hand sits. I'm not sure if its a specific end of weapon point specified (in which case weapons only might have their own building attachment points and that would explain the unique behavior with the stick mentioned earlier). I believe every shield merge pretty much uses this second type, with the zonai base shield that have nothing just having the item get attached to the origin of the shield.

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Arrows just attach the item from its origin to the end of the arrow which is probably a hardcoded position since arrows are always the same.

As for weapons getting unique abilities, its most likely a data table containing every item and its list of effects (or a tag system, same idea). Each blade item would have the weapon type, telling the game what animation set to use and whether it can cut trees or break rocks or whatever, then it would contain what element that item is, if it has an element. I believe all the elements do the same thing regardless, its just enabling that flag. Then it would have the durability multiplier, I'm sure some giga autist has figured out the scaling already, or datamined it, and then the damage multiplier (or addition, didn't check if its additive or multiplicative, probably additive). There are probably a bunch of outliers for specific items like the zonai tools, but that probably hooks into the existing zonai system and just sends the item an 'activate' signal when blocking with shield or attacking.

This is just all observations, I'm sure modders have already figured out how everything actually works and all that. I'll do the building stuff later, but it doesn't seem that complex, this wasn't that complex either. It's just a modular system.
 
Sage powers are self explainatory. The sages just run off or don't appear (some caves such as Hyrule castle remove them) when you need them and Yunobo in particular is a detriment as any flying vehicle jolts downwards as he slams into it.
I hate that they take so fucking long to attack and even worse that their abilities aren't tied to a button like the champions where, I legit hadn't noticed Yunobo slamming down my air vehicles (I very rarely build vehicles) fuck that fatasss rock nigger.
Sidon should have an ability similar to Tulin, pushing you in the water so you go farther, or outright ferry you across, he literally built a statue of link riding him, why the fuck wont he let you use him as a boat?
The removal of Revali's gale was also pretty shitty as Ascension does not work outside specific contexts. If you want an easy way to climb a mountain or some weirder objects, you are shit out of luck as ascension only functions in caves and very specific flat top surfaces.
You can use Hylian Pines and a bonfire to replicate Revali's Gale, that being said Tulin should be able to do both things, no reason why he shouldn't.
Weapon durability is worse than BOTW and so is attack strength of enemies. I also feel like combat/dodging got worse
I agree with the weapon durability, its so fucking shit and all weapons nerfed just so you use the fusion mechanics, but being able to fix good weapons is somewhat nice imo
Korok puzzles got even more time consuming and they seem to appear less frequently than BOTW which is odd as there is 100 more and none are in the Depths.
I was going to call you a nigger, but on second thought you are right, Korok pizzles seem scarce, I replayed BOTW last year and I maxed out my inventory without actively looking for Koroks I would just pick rocks and run into them or do the obvious ones like ballons etc. taking the same approach so far and I'm yet to max out my inventory and I often pick a lonely rock only to find there is no Korok on it.
You cannot put the hood down unless you complete the Hateno side quest and talk to the fashion woman, even though all artwork and promotional material has Link with the hood down. You also cannot put it back up without her.
1. Go to Hateno woman
2. Have her lower your hood.
3. Buy a second hood from her
???
5. profit
But I still agree that it is dumb that you have to complete an entire sidequest chain just to unlock the ability to lower your hood
Restrictions on clothing colors and leveling remain the same as BOTW, which is really stupid. Why can't I have a blue,yellow, red, purple, or pink version of classic Link.
ackshhhhhhhhhhhhhhully you can now improve the Royak guard outfit, which you couldn't in BOTW, why only that one and not all the others, beats me, the devs made some really retarded choices with this game
 
I legit hadn't noticed Yunobo slamming down my air vehicles (I very rarely build vehicles) fuck that fatasss rock nigger.
They gave Yunobo weight, even the spirit, which makes things awful. Wanted to find video proof, but all I could find is this Reddit thread where people are saying it is worse as he also veers vehicles in different directions as he isn't located in the middle.

From my experience, I wanted the kill the rock fucker in the Fire Temple as I made a contraption to fly upwards near some broken track and Yunobo crashed the vehicle, which was the last rocket parts I could easily get.

I hate that they take so fucking long to attack and even worse that their abilities aren't tied to a button like the champions where
The worst Champion experience I had was fighting Queen Gibdo with Riju. Riju would run away and get hit by every attack making her completely unreliable throughout the fight. I loved the Wind Temple with Tulin, but my god, Fire and Thunder were god awful thanks to the mechanics. Queen Gibdo being an exercise in patience.

I was going to call you a nigger, but on second thought you are right, Korok pizzles seem scarce, I replayed BOTW last year and I maxed out my inventory without actively looking for Koroks I would just pick rocks and run into them or do the obvious ones like ballons etc. taking the same approach so far and I'm yet to max out my inventory and I often pick a lonely rock only to find there is no Korok on it.
While I am not checking every nook and cranny, I am pretty observant for Koroks. That said, I was hours into the game and only found like 100 in the like 7 regions I explored, with most not being able to go past 20 or even 10. There are more of the little shits in this game, yet they seem nonexistent. Maybe I need to check Sky Islands more, but the Sky has so little that I doubt the majority are hiding there.

But I still agree that it is dumb that you have to complete an entire sidequest chain just to unlock the ability to lower your hood
It is dumb that they tie the ability to the woman. I get buying another, but it is unnecessary that one is forced to do that to begin with. It also hurts if you want more colored hoods.
 
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One thing I will say about the weapon fusing is that I liked how you could create some pretty insane combinations with the right materials. From things like fire-spewing shields and claw scythes.

And honestly, I didn’t mind having to stop and think about what you had to create or manipulate in order to proceed once I reached those sections.
 
New issue I am noticing is the Purah Pad camera. Apparently, Nintendo made concessions to fit the images in the game, so every image taken is super blurry and low pixelated from compression. It is super apparent and wrecks the camera feature of the game, so I hope they fix it as BOTW did not have this issue.
I took a picture just today and noticed this really bad. Several of my previous pictures look just fine but this one was shot to hell and back.
 
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Minecraft style experience where you build shit,
See, I don't even really think it's a particularly great example of that. Minecraft is fun because the stuff you build is permanent and you can create anywhere, making homes, bases, services for yourself. The world is also flush with resources that you need to make these things.

Tears doesn't provide this experience at all.
You cannot put the hood down unless you complete the Hateno side quest and talk to the fashion woman, even though all artwork and promotional material has Link with the hood down. You also cannot put it back up without her.
This shit is the best example of how behind the times Nintendo is, saved only by their totally isolated hardware and loyal army of consumers that consider everything they make 10/10.

Almost every single open world RPG released in the past decade has allowed you to toggle hoods or headware in the menu with a single click. Like everything else in Tears, it's hidden behind a tedious questline where you collect a million fucking little things and talk to a bunch of shitty useless NPCs who talk forever and you have absolutely zero influence over the outcome of events.
 
Wondering if I should just do a pw generator for the Oracle games.

But more importantly— I have a dozen zoanite shields and I’d like to solicit advice on what’s good to attach to them. Or to attach to non-zoanite shields too.
I rarely use the damn thing because I don’t bother experimenting
 
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Wondering if I should just do a pw generator for the Oracle games.
I've always been too retarded to understand exactly what the passwords do or how you're intended to use them. Are you supposed to beat both games normally, then replay one with the password or what?
 
I've always been too retarded to understand exactly what the passwords do or how you're intended to use them. Are you supposed to beat both games normally, then replay one with the password or what?
You finish one game in whatever order you choose, you get a password at the end, plug that into the other game and then you continue with your existing progression. I don't think everything carries over, it's been a couple years since I last played through them on my 3ds. Using a password in the second game allows you to get the best sword and it unlocks the true ending and true final boss.
 
You finish one game in whatever order you choose, you get a password at the end, plug that into the other game and then you continue with your existing progression. I don't think everything carries over, it's been a couple years since I last played through them on my 3ds. Using a password in the second game allows you to get the best sword and it unlocks the true ending and true final boss.
It doesn't really matter which you put the password into, there's no optimal order? It basically just tacks the true final boss at the end of either game?
 
It wouldn't be as bad..if fusing weapons, shields and arrows weren't a massive fucking chore.
Even if you could just fuse weapons and shields directly in the menu it would save a bunch of time, removing the whole open menu -> select item -> drop -> close menu -> equip weapon -> fuse with item. I think they should have kept elemental arrows and just added more types for the new effects, since its really not that many and most items are just damage boosts. Make it so you can merge in menus, and merging arrows to one of the special effects just makes a new arrow under that type. So they have the elemental ones, and then homing (eyes), torch (light plants), explosive etc, they could probably leave in regular merging just for damage boosts that have no bonus effects, or let you merge special arrows with damage boost items as well.

They probably decided against something like that because it would technically mean items that boost damage AND add an effect would not work, and arrows like the small light plants and big plants would have to be different items. A solution for this would be to add a new arrow inventory, either just leave a couple slots that you can fill with crafted arrows, or let you upgrade it with those 900 or whatever koroks. Add in bulk merging in menu and you could pre-make a bunch of a specific type of arrow and they can keep the tedious single arrow merging outside of the menu for when you need something specific.

I just don't get how they could have spent a year on polish and not done any of these obvious quality of life changes, unless they are going to add these things in the paid DLC, like all the QOL stuff they put behind a paywall in BotW, like the travel medallion, Hero's path and the motorcycle.

Another weird thing is the whole unfusing of items, you can only unfuse in a menu, not with the fuse rune. So if you want to upgrade a weapon thats already fused you need to do the whole rigmarole of opening the menu and dropping the item AND need to unfuse the item from the weapon in the menu instead of allowing it in the fuse menu. They could have had a hold to replace fuse or something when fusing if they don't want people to accidentally replace powerful items.
 
I watched a video about much of TOTK's poor design elements such as the cutscenes for color changes and armor upgrades and probably stuff such as the annoying Fuse mechanics. The consensus seems to be that these elements are intentional, not oversights. Nintendo has a weird philosophy on players taking breaks and not playing for more than 2 hours at a time. During the 3DS era, they would have screens popping up to say as much. A lot of Zelda's annoying quirks are probably just that, annoying to make you put down the game. I can get and somewhat admire the intention, but there has to be a better way of going about this? I mean really, I would take Navi appearing every two hours to give you a small blurb of text rather than the game wasting my time like it does.
 
Even if you could just fuse weapons and shields directly in the menu it would save a bunch of time, removing the whole open menu -> select item -> drop -> close menu -> equip weapon -> fuse with item.
I was totally fine with this but man, fuck cooking. How did we all tolerate that shit last time around?
 
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