Off-Topic Losing people to transgenderism support thread - Support group for trans widows and other people who lost loved ones to troonism

[teriyakiburns]

The problem is the fundamental difference of the "deception."

A homophobe is not someone who thinks homosexual sex does not exist. Homophobes don't think that gay people are not actually gay.
The mechanical reality of homosexuality can be observed. There is no anal force field that curves dick away.
Homosexuality isn't a lie. You can disagree with it, or discourage it, but it can and does happen.

It's pointless to conflate that with what kind of lie transgenders tell. Your mind can be changed one day and you could quit objecting to homosexuality, but having a different take on transgenderism will not make gender identity or transition real.

A lot of the arguments against homosexuality take the same form as those supporting it, being either arguments from nature, or from morality, or from popularity. They're primarily concerned with two things: the motivating cause of the behaviour, and the "rightness" of it, but they never stray too far from the physical nature of homosexuality itself. A homosexual man generally understands that he's a man who wants to have sex with other men. There might be a question about why, but that why is not going to require the creation of an entire framework of irrational beliefs.

On the other hand, arguments for transgenderism quickly descend into mysticism, arguing about the nature of an unseen, invisible, inner nature or soul, or innate knowledge of "being" something other than the outward physical expression. They believe, against all evidence to the contrary, that they're actually the opposite sex on the inside, with all of the metaphysical trappings that go along with that claim of innate knowledge. That's the difference in my mind: transgenderism is a statement of faith about unknown and unknowable things.

The same could be said for arguments made by paedophiles and zoophiles, who claim to have innate knowledge of the inner motivations and desires of children and animals, far beyond anything their victims can outwardly express. Probably worthy of a separate post, if I can actually pull this into some sort of coherent framework.

 

[Punitive Castration]

A lot of the arguments against homosexuality take the same form as those supporting it, being either arguments from nature, or from morality, or from popularity. They're primarily concerned with two things: the motivating cause of the behaviour, and the "rightness" of it, but they never stray too far from the physical nature of homosexuality itself. A homosexual man generally understands that he's a man who wants to have sex with other men. There might be a question about why, but that why is not going to require the creation of an entire framework of irrational beliefs.

On the other hand, arguments for transgenderism quickly descend into mysticism, arguing about the nature of an unseen, invisible, inner nature or soul, or innate knowledge of "being" something other than the outward physical expression. They believe, against all evidence to the contrary, that they're actually the opposite sex on the inside, with all of the metaphysical trappings that go along with that claim of innate knowledge. That's the difference in my mind: transgenderism is a statement of faith about unknown and unknowable things.

The same could be said for arguments made by paedophiles and zoophiles, who claim to have innate knowledge of the inner motivations and desires of children and animals, far beyond anything their victims can outwardly express. Probably worthy of a separate post, if I can actually pull this into some sort of coherent framework.

That's exactly right. Your morals can justify or reject something but they only change how you relate to reality. They don't modify reality.

To wind back to the topic- this is something I struggle with dealing with the most proximate troon in my life. I've been very open so far with my friends but trying to avoid making broader statements. ex
"Steve made that." "Huh? Don't you mean Becky?" "I don't know a Becky. Steve made it." "She changed her name to Becky." "No. Steve, he made it." It keeps my boundaries clear while not welcoming judgement.

Specifically because if I try to leverage this with grander statements of fact: ex "Nothing has changed, Steve cannot become a woman" or "I don't believe in that stuff" they interpret it as a moral debate instead of simply offering facts back and forth. It becomes "good" or "polite" to believe in the tenets of the faith instead of simply working on what is true.

That's the difference between transphobia and homophobia to me. I don't think the friends I've done this to read me as a transphobe for doing it, they must think I'm just lazy or that maybe it's more common than they previously realized to sandbag troons in private (which is what I'd like to encourage)

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

The problem is the fundamental difference of the "deception."

A homophobe is not someone who thinks homosexual sex does not exist. Homophobes don't think that gay people are not actually gay.
The mechanical reality of homosexuality can be observed. There is no anal force field that curves dick away.
Homosexuality isn't a lie. You can disagree with it, or discourage it, but it can and does happen.

It's pointless to conflate that with what kind of lie transgenders tell. Your mind can be changed one day and you could quit objecting to homosexuality, but having a different take on transgenderism will not make gender identity or transition real.

Plenty of "homophobes" think that gayness as a trait is not real in the way activists say it is real. They question "born this way" and the idea that it is a natural variation that should be accepted as within the range of normal for human sexuality. They will argue that homosexuality is a behavior that is learned through child abuse, social pressure and social contagion, and political manipulation.

 

[smegma enthusiast]

I have Questions about why our leaders aren't putting their feet down harder about this bs.

Better to be straight and trans than gay.

 

[Aunt Carol]

Better to be straight and trans than gay.

*more lucrative

 

[DumbDude42]

and I have Questions about why our leaders aren't putting their feet down harder about this bs.

scared of drawing negative media attention probably

 

[LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV]]

Better to be straight and trans than gay.

t, Iran

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender_rights_in_Iran#Forced_surgery_for_homosexual_people

 

[The Ugly One]

I try not to talk in any detail about family on here, but suffice to say, an adolescent family member's good friend from our close-knit little community* has trooned out. We suspected it was happening for a long time but we saw them at a gathering this weekend and the kid had that pervert pencil thin stache and a concave chest- obviously started T and got the teetus yeetus. The kid may have turned 18 this year- lockdown means I see everyone in my life less and time feels distorted, but that sounds right. But even if she hadn't, her parents are fucking idiots and I'm sure they would have easily been conned into it.

I probably should have said "former friend" because my family member had drifted apart from this girl already due to being incredibly based and grossed out by the friend's increasing genderblob traits. Oh and yes if you were wondering, the gender trender girl is an autist too. The mom is one of those dumb bimbos obsessed with having a son to a pathological degree. The dad is a cipher to me but I wouldn't be surprised if he has some nasty skeletons in his closet. They have always generated insane amounts of drama and distress, all their kids have obvious Issues, I can't even describe the worst of it because it might be googlable. They are flaming libtards despite the community overall being very quaint and backwards in the best of ways. IDEK why they don't just go the fuck away.

I am sick to death of troons befouling everything and every place. This was one place on earth where I could go and not have to walk on eggshells around fucking troons. Now this troon is there, and because everyone knew her as a little girl, it's expected to tiptoe and be nice. Fuck that.

*a quite conservative religious community and I have Questions about why our leaders aren't putting their feet down harder about this bs.

The reason even conservative religious communities are falling to the LGBQWERTY onslaught is there's always that one guy who says, "Is it really expressing Christian love to treat these people with anger and contempt? They need the love of Christ, just like everyone else, and are sinners, just like us. Jesus ate with the prostitutes and sinners, you know. How would he treat an Alphabet Person? Can we, as the Christian community, really say we're without sin here? Perhaps it's the un-Christlike hatred we've shown these people over generations that has resulted in this backlash, and we need to search ourselves first before passing judgement." Then they turn anyone who was a little weak-kneed against anybody who is trying to keep the wolves out of the fold for being "un-Christlike."

Source: Personal experience

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

Better to be straight and trans than gay.

That is neither the official stance of our faith nor the candid personal opinion of the leaders. (Source: am pretty close to a couple of the leaders in our locale and we regularly shoot the shit about politics.) Nor is it the reality of most of the ROGD teens- a lot of them are trans AND gay. It's not this clean lezzer to straight brodude brainwashing that terfs imagine it to be. Same with the male ones, they become transbians, not Blaire White wannabes. I know believing this allows folks to continue casting conservative religious people as The Real Baddies but it's not based in present reality.

t, Iran

View attachment 3226998

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender_rights_in_Iran#Forced_surgery_for_homosexual_people

Yeah we are not Persian Muslims nor do we have the same norms or expectations that they do.

The reason even conservative religious communities are falling to the LGBQWERTY onslaught is there's always that one guy who says, "Is it really expressing Christian love to treat these people with anger and contempt? They need the love of Christ, just like everyone else, and are sinners, just like us. Jesus ate with the prostitutes and sinners, you know. How would he treat an Alphabet Person? Can we, as the Christian community, really say we're without sin here? Perhaps it's the un-Christlike hatred we've shown these people over generations that has resulted in this backlash, and we need to search ourselves first before passing judgement." Then they turn anyone who was a little weak-kneed against anybody who is trying to keep the wolves out of the fold for being "un-Christlike."

Source: Personal experience

This is the one, right here. Especially because this Youth was with us since infancy, everyone sees her as "our little girl" (despite her wanting to be seen as a sassy gay boy or whatever) and we have to Be Nice and treat her with kid gloves even as it becomes apparent that her mind cancer is spreading to the other kids.

 

[BroccoliBrain]

A gay guy friend who lived in a conservative town and would come to me about transitioning

This is complete proof that the culture of gender identity politics pushes gay people further into the closet.

Here's another tranny story for you all, also with gays:

Spoiler

I was hired at this tuition place, the way we inducted students was on a roll on, roll off enrollment. There was a clear gender divide because most of them came in not knowing each other so they would make same-sex friends and that was at a rate of 100%. No negatives came with that, the entire class got along just fine, they mingled together during breaks and lunches but otherwise stayed in their own lane. After I worked there for quite some time, we had an obnoxious Aiden with a more quiet gay friend who she immediately outed when she was being a hyperactive lil shit and virtue signalling loudly enough for everyone in the room to hear. Friend looked mortified.

We eventually began getting all our referrals from one area who wouldn't stop dumping people on us so that meant the Aiden arrived with her friend group with all the drama that came with it. I saw no one else more often in the office than her to air out her grievances to sigh and wring her hands about some petty drama. She would come in looking distraught at something only to tell us basically nothing substantial, things we couldn't act upon under safeguarding for lack of evidence/nothing even happened yet. Pretty much every few days we'd see her come in and listen to her say watch out for this girl, that girl said stuff to me in the past, etc. Total male behaviour! She was also a fucking retard who kicked over chairs whenever she was upset as a way to display her masculinity, seriously, she'd explain to us while cooling off in the office that 'being trans', being on all the testosterone made her constantly angry and distressed, and she was half convinced, half milking her parent's 'homophobia' for being transphobic too. She couldn't wait for the day she'd be old enough to move out and cut contact with them to live with her girlfriend.

You're probably assuming where this is going since I mentioned the class gender divide, and you'd be right. She only hung out with the girls and behaved like one as soon as she was laughing and joking with them, not a speck of manhood in her. Girls are nothing, nothing like teenage boys. Not once did I see her talk or attempt to fit in with the guys who didn't know or care about her identity. I've told this story to a female friend and what she has to say about this was, "oh what a varied group of personalities!". I don't fucking know how badly you can miss the point or ignore the reality in front of you, just to feel pity for the odd tranny who passes. But that friend is from a culture where teenagers aren't even allowed to date or be seen together like that (yet her circle has been pozzed by online woke Amerishit through fandoms) so she probably thinks she's being impartial.

Anyway, we actually had a girl who was transitioning more conventionally to a man. I'm firmly blackpilled and gender critical now so I refuse to call her a 'real' transperson like there is such a thing, but she didn't do it for the clout. She was a butch lesbian who went on that T and was lucky enough to be at the age where it looked like 'he' was just a late bloomer. Everyone who joined before she passed better were aware she seemed to be female but they (chavs!) didn't really give a damn and she walked among the guys with no problem, no bullying. I feel bad for whatever her lesbian girlfriend must've felt during that time and for herself because it seemed to come from her very homophobic household. The point of this long story is basically, yeah there are transtrenders, and either way the entire thing is homophobic and makes people throw away their family and friends.

Oh, and this was the job where I met the 5'10 chaser-baiter, he was flaming as fuck and spent the whole LGBT section of the programme telling them how his dick would be inverted soon and how surgeries work for most of that damned powerpoint, coming in daily wearing clubbing skankwear when he was volunteering around these under 18's. He nearly started a fight by being a catty provocative bitch to one of the boys with a bad temper, bragging about keeping a knife (because he's such a vulnerable lay-dee?) in his purse; my boss never ever let that faggot go even after that because he was once one of them and she's old school gay so she probably didn't have the heart to.

 

[Ultrapenguin]

*a quite conservative religious community and I have Questions about why our leaders aren't putting their feet down harder about this bs.

I was going to say, I realize people (sensibly) don't want to reveal that much about where they live, but idk, I'm shocked reading about people for whom the tranny shit is not only a real life issue, but who've even known multiple personally. Where the hell is this a regular occurrence?
In the last 5 years I think I've encountered one MtF irl, that's it. I was suspicious a couple times, but if they were they weren't being obtrusive about it. And there are plenty of open homos and dykes who get along fine, so it's not like it's a repressive environment.

Honestly, I don't think conservative areas are the most likely to not have trannies. I think moderate areas are, because no matter which direction the culture is tilted people are still being conditioned to being unable to think independently and not in terms of labels.

When you've got dudes with Trump 2020 flags still up or confederate flags in their garages living next door to ultra liberal single mother teachers with "hate has no home here" signs in their front yard and girls in college, everyone learns to be polite to each other and nobody is going to make you think anything. Then younger people aren't going to feel the need to escape to these internet cults if they don't politically align or they have weird interests.

Too much trust on other academics, too much trust on the ability for soy-ence to make impossible things possible, an environment surrounded by educated people who are way too polite, a higher proclivity to fall for appeals to authority like "a phd sociologist said so, so it must be true and i'm dumb to question their authority", too much time lost in abstract theory they forget the pragmatic reality.

Is also very difficult to convince someone smart that they are being retarded, smart people get used to being right so much they can't accept when they aren't, instead they'll use their smarts to shield their ego and shit gets worse.

Spoiler: Insufferable academia soapboxing

Absolutely, the problem is that in academia people don't acknowledge how much of what they do is imaginary, and how it drives stuff like the tranny nonsense.

With blue collar trades, if you say "Power boxes in the US are split phase, so you can run 240V appliances" and I say "No they're 120V" you can shrug and walk away if I refuse to listen and it doesn't matter how I feel about it, I can think you're the biggest asshole in the world, you'll still be the one getting demonstrably better outcomes. Same deal with any trade. You can think independently and not need to care what anyone else says.

On the other hand, in academia so often truth really is nothing but popular opinion, and universities increasingly exist and thrive not for the object value they provide, but because they've become the ultimate social gatekeepers and self-perceived arbiters of truth; think the right thoughts, fall in line, go into debt to enrich us, and we'll give you our royal seal, declaring you fit for inclusion in the system and granting you the (increasingly unrealized) possibility of having a livable income.

In tech everything you do is built off of and subject to others, and none of your equipment can possibly be replicated without the blessing of corporations. It will irreparably break or become obsolete very quickly, you will not amass lifelong tools and expertise, you will have nothing of your trade to pass to your children, you're always on a short leash.

That's what it all comes down to. This isn't a matter of superficial partisan idpol bullshit, it's a matter of having faith in your faculties as a human being, or feeling out of control of the world around you and desperately turning to transhumanist thought in a bid to regain some sense of autonomy and hope even if it's just over yourself and your body.
Unfortunately that sense of control is increasingly being ripped away from people because we've handed so much of our power over to those who are unaccountable to us that even if you try to do differently or try to get your hypothetical kids to do differently, your only option is to be a broke social recluse: you will participate on their terms, or you will not participate at all.

There's no easy or comfortable answer, people would take it if there was; all you can do is worry about yourself and hope people will eventually take back some control.

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

I was going to say, I realize people (sensibly) don't want to reveal that much about where they live, but idk, I'm shocked reading about people for whom the tranny shit is not only a real life issue, but who've even known multiple personally. Where the hell is this a regular occurrence?
In the last 5 years I think I've encountered one MtF irl, that's it. I was suspicious a couple times, but if they were they weren't being obtrusive about it. And there are plenty of open homos and dykes who get along fine, so it's not like it's a repressive environment.

Honestly, I don't think conservative areas are the most likely to not have trannies. I think moderate areas are, because no matter which direction the culture is tilted people are still being conditioned to being unable to think independently and not in terms of labels.

When you've got dudes with Trump 2020 flags still up or confederate flags in their garages living next door to ultra liberal single mother teachers with "hate has no home here" signs in their front yard and girls in college, everyone learns to be polite to each other and nobody is going to make you think anything. Then younger people aren't going to feel the need to escape to these internet cults if they don't politically align or they have weird interests.

My close-knit conservative community is geographically nested inside an overall extremely woke and leftist area of the country. This specific troon was sent to public school by her politically pozzed if religiously conservative parents. (How they square that circle? Never been able to figure it out. But they aren't the only family in our group who tries.) I have zero doubt that school is where she picked up the troonery- after all it's where most kids are getting it.

Besides that they have an utterly fucked up family dynamic that was going to result in something going wrong with the kids no matter how wholesome our religious network could try to be as a counterweight. If she hadn't learned about troonery at school it would have been drugs or sluttery or something else. To the credit of our community, we have bent over backwards over the years to learn about the various mental conditions in this family and accommodate them. But sometimes your best efforts can never be enough to counter the sheer volume of batshittery.

As with most religions we have our minority faction that wants to turn everything on its head and "reform" our ancient ways. They don't have a real vote or sway on the institutional level but they are emotionally influential to women and soft headed men in my observation.

 

[DumbDude42]

My close-knit conservative community is geographically nested inside an overall extremely woke and leftist area of the country. This specific troon was sent to public school by her politically pozzed if religiously conservative parents. (How they square that circle? Never been able to figure it out. But they aren't the only family in our group who tries.) I have zero doubt that school is where she picked up the troonery- after all it's where most kids are getting it.

Besides that they have an utterly fucked up family dynamic that was going to result in something going wrong with the kids no matter how wholesome our religious network could try to be as a counterweight. If she hadn't learned about troonery at school it would have been drugs or sluttery or something else. To the credit of our community, we have bent over backwards over the years to learn about the various mental conditions in this family and accommodate them. But sometimes your best efforts can never be enough to counter the sheer volume of batshittery.

As with most religions we have our minority faction that wants to turn everything on its head and "reform" our ancient ways. They don't have a real vote or sway on the institutional level but they are emotionally influential to women and soft headed men in my observation.

orthodox jew? i can't think of other conservative religious communities that routinely live in enclaves inside otherwise liberal areas, only orthodox jews manage to survive inside places like NYC without completely succumbing to corrupting influences (reform jews in the case of judaism)

 

[Aunt Carol]

Especially because this Youth was with us since infancy, everyone sees her as "our little girl" (despite her wanting to be seen as a sassy gay boy or whatever) and we have to Be Nice and treat her with kid gloves even as it becomes apparent that her mind cancer is spreading to the other kids.

Within the details given, it sounds like neither she nor the rest of the family are serious about your shared faith.

If she's nearly a man now, age-wise, is she putting in the effort to become an upstanding male member haw of the adult congregation? How would a boy her age be treated if he were acting the same way?

A conservative religious enclave sounds like there are probably strong traditional responsibilities for an adult male or female to shoulder. Staying a flighty and emotionally-unstable child forever is a disease of modern anomie, not people with a strong ethnic or religious culture.

Not that teenagers need to be serious at all times, but if she's not working on her relationship with God/prepping for her mission/helping raise the barn to the same degree other kids her age are, that's special treatment beyond the trans thing, and more incentive for other kids to troon out for a shot at specialness.

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

orthodox jew? i can't think of other conservative religious communities that routinely live in enclaves inside otherwise liberal areas, only orthodox jews manage to survive inside places like NYC without completely succumbing to corrupting influences (reform jews in the case of judaism)

Within the details given, it sounds like neither she nor the rest of the family are serious about your shared faith.

If she's nearly a man now, age-wise, is she putting in the effort to become an upstanding male member haw of the adult congregation? How would a boy her age be treated if he were acting the same way?

A conservative religious enclave sounds like there are probably strong traditional responsibilities for an adult male or female to shoulder. Staying a flighty and emotionally-unstable child forever is a disease of modern anomie, not people with a strong ethnic or religious culture.

Not that teenagers need to be serious at all times, but if she's not working on her relationship with God/prepping for her mission/helping raise the barn to the same degree other kids her age are, that's special treatment beyond the trans thing, and more incentive for other kids to troon out for a shot at specialness.

I try very hard not to powerlevel about this because it's a small and somewhat skittish community. But yes there are expectations for adult men and women to carry their weight and do their part. It's not as segregated or rigid as some trad communities and personally, as someone who is more eccentric than not in many ways, I have found it to be fairly accommodating of individual needs and quirks. But the way we are able to Have Nice Things is by having grownups willing to put in the effort and do their duty. If a young woman should decide she does not want to be a wife and mother, there are still plenty of niches available to her. We have women in the community who are loud, assertive, opinionated, who have careers with a high profile out in the world. We don't even have a dress code that is rigidly enforced- there is an urban goat farmer lady who regularly turns up in flannels. Troon girl could just join the ranks of these women but frankly she is too troubled to have a career and too brittle and narcissistic to settle with just being another humble servant of God who dresses frumpy sometimes.

The special duties reserved for men in the community will never be opened to her no matter how much hair she grows. (A lot of those special duties involve things like dropping what you are doing to go care for someone in trouble, or staying up all night and not eating and reading out loud until you're hoarse.) She can insist and playact but everyone knows the difference. And when she dies it will be the grannies and clergy wives who collect her body from the funeral home and dress it for burial, not the men.

 

[Sealbaby]

from what i can tell, up until fairly recently (like 20 years ago) almost all male trannies were homosexuals. straight male trannies of the "become the gf" kind seem to be a fairly recent development

This is a common misconception, but actually, 'transbians' have been around since at least the 19th century. Havelock Ellis and Magnus Hirschfeld described it as 'eonism', after the behaviour of the Chevalière d'Éon:

"As I view it, the Eonist is embodying, in an extreme degree, the aesthetic attitude of imitation of, and identification with, the admired object. It is normal for a man to identify himself with the woman he loves. The Eonist carries that identification too far, stimulated by a sensitive and feminine element in himself which is associated with a rather defective virile [i.e. penetrative, aggressive, active] sexuality on what may be a neurotic basis." - Havelock Ellis

The thing is, though, that open 'transbians' were denied HRT and surgery until roughly 1989, when Ray Blanchard set up a clinic to allow them to get hormones and surgery. He argued (IIRC) that transbians/AGPs are not only trutrans but the MAJORITY of male trans people.

Before Blanchard, numbers of ostensibly HSTS people were artificially inflated by AGPs lying to access hormones and surgery.

So that is why people mistakenly think that there's been a change in the relative numbers of AGP vs HSTS.

 

[tygressofaera]

The reason even conservative religious communities are falling to the LGBQWERTY onslaught is there's always that one guy who says, "Is it really expressing Christian love to treat these people with anger and contempt? They need the love of Christ, just like everyone else, and are sinners, just like us. Jesus ate with the prostitutes and sinners, you know. How would he treat an Alphabet Person? Can we, as the Christian community, really say we're without sin here? Perhaps it's the un-Christlike hatred we've shown these people over generations that has resulted in this backlash, and we need to search ourselves first before passing judgement." Then they turn anyone who was a little weak-kneed against anybody who is trying to keep the wolves out of the fold for being "un-Christlike."

Source: Personal experience

Got scolded by a brother just recently because I'd allegedly been too harsh against a pronoun pin wearer who was invited to church. And when I say "harsh" I mean, asking basic questions about it. Like, "what is that? What does it mean?" and then being frank about the fact that I thought it was silly. Was told "Christ would not do this." Still heated about this. So ridiculous. Christ did not hand out a generic love and kindness message, that was never the model. We were never commanded to love everyone. Everyone can be saved, but sin is still sin. Homosex is a sin, crossdressing is a sin. Sinners receive sharp rebukes. Saved people who sin receive sharp rebukes. I hate this generic feel good message nonsense.

Thread tax:
Pretty much every weird or nerdy female friend I had in high-school is now a they/them. They're also unhappy, fat, potato shaped people with no aspirations, histrionic, have a laundry list of exaggerated illness both physical and mental. Most of them are addicted to social media. And they all say the same thing, over and over. I can guess what hobby they've taken up based on what hobby is popular. They're bugwomen.

 

[The Ugly One]

Got scolded by a brother just recently because I'd allegedly been too harsh against a pronoun pin wearer who was invited to church. And when I say "harsh" I mean, asking basic questions about it. Like, "what is that? What does it mean?" and then being frank about the fact that I thought it was silly. Was told "Christ would not do this." Still heated about this. So ridiculous. Christ did not hand out a generic love and kindness message, that was never the model. We were never commanded to love everyone. Everyone can be saved, but sin is still sin. Homosex is a sin, crossdressing is a sin. Sinners receive sharp rebukes. Saved people who sin receive sharp rebukes. I hate this generic feel good message nonsense.

Thread tax:
Pretty much every weird or nerdy female friend I had in high-school is now a they/them. They're also unhappy, fat, potato shaped people with no aspirations, histrionic, have a laundry list of exaggerated illness both physical and mental. Most of them are addicted to social media. And they all say the same thing, over and over. I can guess what hobby they've taken up based on what hobby is popular. They're bugwomen.

A friend of mine trooned out in middle age. If I said much about him, it'd get pretty close to power leveling, so suffice to say that he always had a sense of self-importance that real life never validated, largely because he refused to pay his dues to get where he thought he belonged due to thinking that the usual path was beneath someone of his talents. He seems to have reinvented himself as a troon, primarily to get attention, but he's still a complete loser.

Related to your post because I've noticed a pretty common theme is trooning out as an alternative to actually fixing yourself. Instead of losing weight, learning how to meet people, figuring out why you're in dead-end jobs, etc, just change gender! Magically become your idealized fantasy of the opposite sex just by a trip through the clothing department!

 

[LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV]]

I try very hard not to powerlevel about this because it's a small and somewhat skittish community. But yes there are expectations for adult men and women to carry their weight and do their part. It's not as segregated or rigid as some trad communities and personally, as someone who is more eccentric than not in many ways, I have found it to be fairly accommodating of individual needs and quirks. But the way we are able to Have Nice Things is by having grownups willing to put in the effort and do their duty. If a young woman should decide she does not want to be a wife and mother, there are still plenty of niches available to her. We have women in the community who are loud, assertive, opinionated, who have careers with a high profile out in the world. We don't even have a dress code that is rigidly enforced- there is an urban goat farmer lady who regularly turns up in flannels. Troon girl could just join the ranks of these women but frankly she is too troubled to have a career and too brittle and narcissistic to settle with just being another humble servant of God who dresses frumpy sometimes.

The special duties reserved for men in the community will never be opened to her no matter how much hair she grows. (A lot of those special duties involve things like dropping what you are doing to go care for someone in trouble, or staying up all night and not eating and reading out loud until you're hoarse.) She can insist and playact but everyone knows the difference. And when she dies it will be the grannies and clergy wives who collect her body from the funeral home and dress it for burial, not the men.

Lol, cults

 

[tygressofaera]

A friend of mine trooned out in middle age. If I said much about him, it'd get pretty close to power leveling, so suffice to say that he always had a sense of self-importance that real life never validated, largely because he refused to pay his dues to get where he thought he belonged due to thinking that the usual path was beneath someone of his talents. He seems to have reinvented himself as a troon, primarily to get attention, but he's still a complete loser.

Related to your post because I've noticed a pretty common theme is trooning out as an alternative to actually fixing yourself. Instead of losing weight, learning how to meet people, figuring out why you're in dead-end jobs, etc, just change gender! Magically become your idealized fantasy of the opposite sex just by a trip through the clothing department!

That's how I see it too, but not only is it an alternative, it's an excuse to not do more. One of the women I know uses her transgender status as an excuse not to do anything. She lives with her mother and brother, both of whom she hates and claim are abusive. She's in her mid 20's, no education, no employment, and spends all day obsessed with a pokemon character. When a suggestion is made that she make some effort in getting out of her living situation, she says she's utterly terrified of doing anything because of transphobia. If she rents a room in an apartment, her roommates might be transphobic. If she rents on her own, she'll be afraid a transphobe will follow her home. If she gets a job, she might be exposed to transphobia. She won't just walk to the corner store because of transphobia. Her mother and brother commit acts of transphobia against her every day.

This woman is a "trans man" but looks like your typical dangerhaired chubbo woman. There is absolutely no way any person would look at her and think they beheld a tranny, just a retarded woman. When you ask her (as I have) why she doesn't risk facing transphobia in a job setting when she already faces transphobia at home, she shuts down. She just stops talking. But, really, it makes no sense. If one option-- getting a job and renting your own place-- has the potential to not have transphobia, and your current living situation does absolutely have transphobia, which one would you pick? But I already know why she won't leave her current living situation, it gives her a lot of material to complain online and get asspats.