Magic The Gathering

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

What was investigate on the Storm Scale, again? Tireless Tracker made me really appreciate the mechanic, and I feel like more investigate cards in white could help the color with card draw in EDH if done right.

Monarch should be an Evergreen White EDH mechanic.

Inn

Speak for yourself, Maddness is a Trash mechanic, and Ixalan had more cool DFCards than both Innistrad Sets together, Hell the 6 Flip Planeswalkers are better than every werewolf but 1.

RTR were awesome

RTR was the worst of the 3 set blocks, the Guild Mechanics that time around were real bad.

RtRtZendikar is one of those bangers.

It won't be, Zendikar 1 was carried by the Fetch Lands, Zendikar 2 is the worst of the 2 block sets by a country mile. Allies vs Eldrazi makes for an extremely awful block just because Allies were Trash and The Eldrazi are one of the worst ideas in both Lore and Mechanics. Drana was the only good thing to come out of that set.

Next up, SOI/EMN - as established above, some pretty fucking swell mechanics

Shadows was a horridly overrated Block, Werewolves still suck, Madness largely sucked, Flashback sucked this time, and Meld was the single worst mechanic in the history of the game.

Next comes the Kaladesh block,

Artifact blocks always end up being overpowered fucking bullshit, they need to fucking STOP DOING ARTIFACT FOCUSED SETS.

Amonkhet fucking sucks

Amonkhet was okay, Embalm/Eteranalize while being "Flashback for creatures" is a fun mechanic, and the first 5 Gods were all cool (The free Recursion on the Hour cards was the only real bad part of the set) It is probably the best of the 2 set blocks (There is one Major thing that fucks Ixalan)

Ixalan is a middling but overall underrated little block,

Ixalan is one half a really cool and awesome block, Explore, the double faced stuff..shit it turned Jace from an emosoy boy male feminist wannabe..to a Muscular Pirate (fully trained) Mind Mage who woo'd the Gorgon Assassin who wanted to kill him at the start of the block and told Liliana to get fucked because she was a toxic Karen, I am really sad that the bullshit they did with War of the Spark and Liliana made me stop paying attention to the lore..because I wanted to see Jace, Toxic Masculinity Sculptor be the real man in the setting.

Dominaria is a smash hit

Dominaria was amazing. Sagas should be an Evergreen mechanic.

RtRtR sets are overall pretty solid. War shits the bed and has so many bad fucking ideas crammed into a single set that it's baffling,

Ravnica 3 was pretty Meh to be honest The Guild Mechanics were still so meh, why does every guild need new mechanics every new Ravnica block. Keep the fucking ones that work and get rid of the bad ones by the time you Get to Ravnica 10 "The Shock lands are over 50 dollars again we gotta go here to reprint them", the Standard was carried by Ixalan and Dominaria cards..using the Shocklands (really Shocklands should just be in Core sets now, Good mana makes the game so much better)

War..has 2 problems.
3 Mana Teferi..should have had it's passive and active reversed...and Nissa, but Nissa isn't the only moment of "FAST MANA tm" that has been a problem in the game recently.

but Eldraine was (barring Oko and OUaT) genuinely really neat

Not really, Food is a terrible mechanic, Adamant was a terrible mechanic..and you have a Block focused on "Casting spells with 3 of a single kind of mana." right after a Multi Colored block, it is going to be hilarious to see Cat-Oven completely vanish after Mayhem Devil rotates.

Also Fires of Invention, Fires of Invention was a terrible fucking idea.

Theros is pretty middling with boring mechanics and fucking Uro

Escape would be okay if Uro didn't have the life gain, you could get under it. (except underworld breach but..well Yawgmoth's will..)

Ikoria..well Companion showing up with 10 companions was a terrible idea, If you dump like 50 of them in the game and say "Okay basically every deck can have one in some fashion" it would have gone over well. Lurrus would have still broken every format in the game but he could be banned.

I've said this several times, but it is true. The move away from the 3 block format has absolutely destroyed the game. 600 new cards for the game every year made a bottle neck on power creep. With 4 300 cards block every year (all of which has to have specific mechanics in them for limited, Ramp, Removal, Counterspells) they can't remotely keep power creep in check.

They also keep printing way to much crap that subverts the basic balance concepts of the game.

Nissa, Fires of Invention, Wilderness Reclamation, and Winota break Mana costs, Growth Spiral, Sea Dasher, Spectral Sailor, Omen of the Sea break the Tempo of the game.

PS you bitch about Teferi? Imagine a format where Wilderness Reclamation had NO ACTUAL COUNTER CARD. Teferi is a good card, but a Creature Heavy meta could counteract him easily. The only cards in the game that deal with Wilderness Reclimation..are Teferi and Dovin's Veto and even with those in existence Wilderness Rec is still the top deck in Standard.

 

[Rich Evans Apologist]

I'll say that I'm mostly looking at this more from a limited / kitchen-table-EDH perspective than a constructed one, which probably explains a lot of the variance here. This might also be why I hated Amonkhet.

I fully agree on Wilderness Rec, Fires, so-on, even acknowledging that I don't delve a ton into competitive. And I also really am not a fan of stapling enchantments onto planeswalkers even if only some of the cards were atrocious for it. I suppose I more mean to drive home - folks might disagree on which sets are complete turds, but they seem to do well for a little bit and then fuck up spectacularly in waves. I do agree that changing up the block set structure has definitely aided this. I don't mind the idea of, from time to time, just doing a one-of set here and there -- but this freeform style is really just not working. Maybe going back to core sets will make them walk back some of their other dumb block decisions.

 

[Flexo]

Speak for yourself, Maddness is a Trash mechanic, and Ixalan had more cool DFCards than both Innistrad Sets together, Hell the 6 Flip Planeswalkers are better than every werewolf but 1.

Madness wasn't in the original Innistrad. There was also more flip cards in it than just werewolves. Delver of Secrets for example.

Flashback sucked this time

Flashback wasn't in Shadows.

The Guild Mechanics were still so meh, why does every guild need new mechanics every new Ravnica block. Keep the fucking ones that work and get rid of the bad ones by the time you Get to Ravnica 10

Selesnya had "convoke" in 2 ravnica sets.

Which ones would you consider as working? Dredge? From Ravnica 1, other than convoke, "bloodthirst" was the only other mechanic to really be worth keeping - and they brought that back for a core set. The rest were either broken or dumb.

Ravnica 2 was the only other ravnica set that had anything worth salvaging with maybe Detain, Bloodrush, Evolve and Overload. What else did you want to stick around?

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Madness wasn't in the original Innistrad

My mistake, Innistrad was a long time ago.

There was also more flip cards in it than just werewolves.

It is however the Signature card of Werewolves.

Delver of Secrets for example.

Delver is probably the best DFCard from the original innistrad and I still would not consider it a fantastic card. It takes The Volume of good Instants/Sorceries that Legacy has to make it playable.

Selesnya had "convoke" in 2 ravnica sets.

Convoke was actually a good and usable mechanic.

Which ones would you consider as working? Dredge? From Ravnica 1, other than convoke, "bloodthirst" was the only other mechanic to really be worth keeping - and they brought that back for a core set. The rest were either broken or dumb.

Of the Guild mechanics that have been done? The ones I would keep?

Azorius - Addendum
Dimir - Surveil
Rakdos - Spectacle
Gruul - Riot
Selsnya - Convoke
Orzhov - Haunt
Golgari - Scavenge
Simic - Evolve
Izzet - Overload
Boros - Mentor.

Of the ones I would replace even after that? i would get rid of Undergrowth, Haunt, and Evolve. I would 100% give Simic some fixed version of Mutate (maybe something like Bronzehide Lion Has) Orzhov should have a Tax mechanic of some sort, Maybe like Nightmare Shepard has, except an opponent can pay an amount to prevent it.

Golgari? I actually haven't gotten a clue. Delve would actually properly thematic for what the Guild is..but Delve is OP, Scavenge would work if you combined it with other counters, like if Sluiceway Scorpion gave it's +1/+1 counters and a Deathtouch Counter...and if you let it be played as an instant.

 

[Flexo]

Azorius - Addendum
Dimir - Surveil
Rakdos - Spectacle
Gruul - Riot
Selsnya - Convoke
Orzhov - Haunt
Golgari - Scavenge
Simic - Evolve
Izzet - Overload
Boros - Mentor.

Excellent choices.

Though just going to point out, of the ones you picked, only 3 were NOT in Ravnica 3. (Scavenge, Evolve, Overload)

It is funny that MaRo rates as a failure them not innovating enough with the guild mechanics. By now it seems like WotC should just make Ravnica the core set every year (like you said, constant shock lands) with consistent mechanics and guilds to intro players.

Golgari? I actually haven't gotten a clue. Delve would actually properly thematic for what the Guild is..but Delve is OP, Scavenge would work if you combined it with other counters, like if Sluiceway Scorpion gave it's +1/+1 counters and a Deathtouch Counter...and if you let it be played as an instant.

Scavenge with keyword counters would actually be pretty awesome and open up some interesting avenues.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

It is funny that MaRo rates as a failure them not innovating enough with the guild mechanics. By now it seems like WotC should just make Ravnica the core set every year (like you said, constant shock lands) with consistent mechanics and guilds to intro players.

I have been saying that since "Core sets went away" since effectively Ravnica became the new Dominaria when we went on the "MULTIVERSE TOUR" tm after Time Spiral. If I were in Charge of how sets worked What I would do is

January - Big Set of a block : This is when Rotation happens, Blocks Rotate after 2 years.
April - Small Set of the block 1
July - Small Set of the Block 2
August-December : Supplimental stuff. BattleBond, Conspiracy. (*COUGH COUGH WHY IS COMMANDER NOT RELEASED RIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS COUGH COUGH*)

Core sets I would have basically as supplemental products that get released in the latter part of the year. They would largely be the same year to year unless a new "Core" Card shows up that becomes a core of the game.

Think Murder vs Hero's Downfall.

Though just going to point out, of the ones you picked, only 3 were NOT in Ravnica 3. (Scavenge, Evolve, Overload)

Well Like I said they should take the ones that work and are Thematic.

 

[cuddle striker]

I have been saying that since "Core sets went away" since effectively Ravnica became the new Dominaria when we went on the "MULTIVERSE TOUR" tm after Time Spiral. If I were in Charge of how sets worked What I would do is

January - Big Set of a block : This is when Rotation happens, Blocks Rotate after 2 years.
April - Small Set of the block 1
July - Small Set of the Block 2
August-December : Supplimental stuff. BattleBond, Conspiracy. (*COUGH COUGH WHY IS COMMANDER NOT RELEASED RIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS COUGH COUGH*)

Core sets I would have basically as supplemental products that get released in the latter part of the year. They would largely be the same year to year unless a new "Core" Card shows up that becomes a core of the game.

Think Murder vs Hero's Downfall.


Well Like I said they should take the ones that work and are Thematic.

it's better than the system they're trying now. the old block pattern was fine.

I really liked shadowmoor, ixalan. the smaller sets with genuinely interesting stuff. I'm not the target audience for the new sets, though- I'm playing legacy, I don't make Hasbro any direct money. I was interested in edh until they started in to monetize it. it was the perfect way to pull out the weird old shit that there's no other place for- until they started printing for it. now it's becoming fairly bland.

if I'm not playing vintage I really think jank is the interesting stuff. early on, all the type 2 decks seemed so slapped together for interesting reasons; when type 1/2 got squashed into vintage/legacy/modern/standard was when I started to see the meta get really stale.

and now, of course standard is going to be the same two or three "solved" decks. modern horizons helped shake modern around a little which was good to see.

I'm still salty about DRS getting banned. best 1 mana planeswalker ever.

and yeah they go in waves- great set, a few mediocre ones, a pile of shit, then a great one. they pull back and overcompensate pretty often.

 

[Flexo]

it's better than the system they're trying now. the old block pattern was fine.

I really liked shadowmoor, ixalan. the smaller sets with genuinely interesting stuff. I'm not the target audience for the new sets, though- I'm playing legacy, I don't make Hasbro any direct money. I was interested in edh until they started in to monetize it. it was the perfect way to pull out the weird old shit that there's no other place for- until they started printing for it. now it's becoming fairly bland.

if I'm not playing vintage I really think jank is the interesting stuff. early on, all the type 2 decks seemed so slapped together for interesting reasons; when type 1/2 got squashed into vintage/legacy/modern/standard was when I started to see the meta get really stale.

and now, of course standard is going to be the same two or three "solved" decks. modern horizons helped shake modern around a little which was good to see.

I'm still salty about DRS getting banned. best 1 mana planeswalker ever.

and yeah they go in waves- great set, a few mediocre ones, a pile of shit, then a great one. they pull back and overcompensate pretty often.

MaRo claimed repeatedly they had a "problem" with the 3rd set in a block. He said he thought they solved it by going to 2 sets a block, but then apparently felt the "problem" was still in the smaller set, so then just dropped the block idea altogether.

Best I can figure, maybe the 'problem' was something about it growing stale or the players getting bored with a world by the time set 3 rolls around?

Maybe it was all about the draft. Who can say, I do mostly LCG style games nowadays.

 

[Urbanmech]

Maybe it was all about the draft. Who can say, I do mostly LCG style games nowadays.

Has anyone figured out how to deal with the bloat in LCG's yet? Remember they killed A:Netrunner within 8 months due to not thinking ahead about the bloat.

 

[Flexo]

Has anyone figured out how to deal with the bloat in LCG's yet? Remember they killed A:Netrunner within 8 months due to not thinking ahead about the bloat.

L5R is threatening to do rotation.

LotR may do better at it if for no other reason than the expansions and stuff are half or more of "enemy" cards that you don't deck build with.

The new Marvel Champions game seems like it is closest to them actually solving it where about every other release is an "enemy" set you challenge and play against rather than new cards for decks.

VS is at least interesting in that you can choose what you want to get cards of (i.e. I've gotten the AvP and Buffy sets, not bothered much with Marvel) so I think it may be a bit better.

At least, if I'm understanding your meaning about "bloat."

 

[Urbanmech]

L5R is threatening to do rotation.

LotR may do better at it if for no other reason than the expansions and stuff are half or more of "enemy" cards that you don't deck build with.

The new Marvel Champions game seems like it is closest to them actually solving it where about every other release is an "enemy" set you challenge and play against rather than new cards for decks.

VS is at least interesting in that you can choose what you want to get cards of (i.e. I've gotten the AvP and Buffy sets, not bothered much with Marvel) so I think it may be a bit better.

At least, if I'm understanding your meaning about "bloat."

Yea thats what I meant. I mean LOTR is coop so its not so much a factor as other games. I mean you'd figure by now FFG would have it figured out not only for the bloat but the buying anxiety a huge amount of expansions cost for a new person to get into the LCG as it goes on.

 

[Flexo]

Yea thats what I meant. I mean LOTR is coop so its not so much a factor as other games. I mean you'd figure by now FFG would have it figured out not only for the bloat but the buying anxiety a huge amount of expansions cost for a new person to get into the LCG as it goes on.

Marvel shows that they seem to have finally figured it out. You only need 1 core set. After that you can buy a character pack if you want or keep playing with what you have.

Here's another thing they've changed. The game has 4 "colors." When you build your deck, you take the total cards specific to your character, and then add any single color and neutral cards you wish. When a new character pack comes out, their ready deck is focused around 1 color (though the other 3 will get 1 new card each). So if you like a particular color for a deck, you can concentrate on picking up the characters that come with that color.

Arkham horror is also a new LCG, but I haven't looked into it more how its distributed.

 

[Fervent Champion]

Any ideas on what will be banned tomorrow? My guess is that Astrolabe is gone in modern and something from Inverter is going in Pioneer, either Inverter itself or Dig. I'm hoping they hit something from Tron in Pauper since that deck has been too dominant for too long. I've got no idea what they'll do with historic.

 

[Stab You in the Back]

$116 for ONE pack of Double Masters VIP edition on Amazon, $92 on ebay.

The pack contains 4 rares.

 

[Polyboros2]

$116 for ONE pack of Double Masters VIP edition on Amazon, $92 on ebay.

The pack contains 4 rares.

Yeah that's insane from what we know now:

33 Magic cards plus 2 double-sided tokens: 2 foil showcase rares or mythic rares; 2 foil rares or mythics; 8 foil uncommons; 9 foil commons; 12 full-art basic lands (2 are foil); 2 foil double-sided tokens​

​

For reference the Core 2021 collector's booster going for $22 on Amazon right now has 4 to five rares, all either foil, extended art, or showcase. Double Masters is definitely going to have a better pool to draw from, but there is no way it's going to be as good to make that worth while. Especially when you can get 9 packs and 18 rares for that price. 18 chances to pull a regular frame Atraxa is much better than 4 chances and you're probably going to get garbage.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

$116 for ONE pack of Double Masters VIP edition on Amazon, $92 on ebay.

The pack contains 4 rares.

Money Grab Masters.

something from Inverter is going in Pioneer, either Inverter itself or Dig

RIP Pioneer.

 

[Flexo]

RIP Pioneer

Nope. Apparently they just unbanned Oath of Nissa.

No other changes for Pioneer. (does anyone else just hate that name? they should make 3 sets standard and call THAT pioneer, then call current standard... "extended" lol)

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Nope. Apparently they just unbanned Oath of Nissa.

No other changes for Pioneer. (does anyone else just hate that name? they should make 3 sets standard and call THAT pioneer, then call current standard... "extended" lol)

Yeah Rip Pioneer, the format hasn't even been firing off in MTGO because Dimir Inverter is such a miserable deck to play against.

 

[Flexo]

Yeah Rip Pioneer, the format hasn't even been firing off in MTGO because Dimir Inverter is such a miserable deck to play against.

Ah ok. I had read your post backwards.

It was a dumb format anyway. Name never made any sense.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

It was a dumb format anyway.

You can complain about the specific starting point, but until Theros the format was fun as hell, I had a fun ass Dimir deck that was actually viable..mostly control with Thief of Sanity, Gonti Lord of Luxury and Scarab God as win conditions.