Marathon 2025 - Bungie's new AAAA Extraction shooter

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Those GamerGate grifters gave me DSP vibes.
 
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creaturestorm said:
Extraction shooters on the other hand, don't rely on maps for gameplay variety in the same way. Spawn locations, loot distribution, player behavior, and objectives are all dynamic. The map is more like a familiar stage where unpredictable runs play out differently each time, it's almosike a rogue like layered on top of a persistent environment.
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It's why people bitching that "Marathon only has 4 maps" irritate me. There are things to dislike about this game but the small map pool isn't one of them. The entire point of an extraction shooter is to play on the same maps and learn them to the point of mastery.
 
Professor Donger said:
Bungie fucked up halo 1 so badly with their procrastinating that Microsoft had to send them story writers to keep them on task and get the game done.

They did the same thing to Halo 2 as well.

Bungie has always been a bit of a fuck up studio
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Bungie certainly has had its fuckups, but back then when the whip was cracked, they managed to pull it together and deliver. Even with their flaws, there's a reason people keep coming back to the classic Halo games. Hell, even with the eleventh hour story reboot, Destiny still managed to be interesting enough to hook people in until they could start making better content (though the lingering goodwill from Halo didn't hurt either). Meanwhile, they spent years on Marathon and created something generally considered mediocre by people who played it, then spent a few more months of crunch on it and released a game that is considered okay at best.

No better place to mention it than this, but Bungie recalled Myth II when it was in the middle of shipment when it was discovered that installing the game to your root drive and then uninstalling it would wipe lots of other files on the drive. Despite the fact that this was almost certainly never going to happen (who installs a game to root?) and they could have just put out a patch and hoped that anyone who did install it that way would get the patch before uninstalling, they chose to delay the launch, recall all copies, print new CDs with the patched code, and manually repack every single box. It was a huge hit to their finances, but they felt it was the right thing to do. (And the game still proved to be very successful.)

I don't think that Bungie exists anymore.
 
Professor Donger said:
It's why people bitching that "Marathon only has 4 maps" irritate me. There are things to dislike about this game but the small map pool isn't one of them. The entire point of an extraction shooter is to play on the same maps and learn them to the point of mastery.
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I’m 60 hours in and I still haven’t done more than scratch the surface of the 3rd map. People who have no experience in extraction shooters simply don’t know what they want out of an extraction shooter. It’s like dumping salt on food you haven’t even tasted yet.
 
creaturestorm said:
I’m 60 hours in and I still haven’t done more than scratch the surface of the 3rd map. People who have no experience in extraction shooters simply don’t know what they want out of an extraction shooter. It’s like dumping salt on food you haven’t even tasted yet.
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I understand the point, I’ve played around 100 hours of Tarkov, not nearly as much as others, but enough to get the gist. My point is, that this shit show took 6 years and 250 million to make and they have fuck all to show for it other than very basic content. I get it, the terminals are cool, the maps have secrets and what not, MAYBE the story will get crazy or good, but if the game dies because of their hubris, stupidity, or the inherent small niche this genre inhabits then no one will see it or those secrets built into the maps.
creaturestorm said:
So you didnt get past the tutorial?
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Essentially.
 
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creaturestorm said:
Arena shooters need a large pool of maps to really function. What you call "extra content" was basically half the baseline expectation for games like Q3 Arena or UT.
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It's not really hard, either. The tools are easier to use than ever for the most primitive geometry, with all of the extra bells and whistles you could want for the finer details. I spent a good many years in my teens mapping for UT99 on UEd2, and it's really quite amazing what mappers like Hourences could do. Hell, even clans like ZSZ are still at it with revisions to classics like Infinity City, and it just goes to show how much time, money, and skill is being pissed down the drain with these corporatized wannabe eSports development mentalities.

Just give players a simple ass Facing Worlds II, a Deck16, or in Halo's case a Guardian and Lockout. It's been shown time and again that you can just sit down and whip up something beautifully simple in the span of an afternoon.
creaturestorm said:
I’m 60 hours in and I still haven’t done more than scratch the surface of the 3rd map. People who have no experience in extraction shooters simply don’t know what they want out of an extraction shooter. It’s like dumping salt on food you haven’t even tasted yet.
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This is a good point for this genre. A good extraction map is something the player should really be spending hours upon hours delving into, discovering every last little corner. It's a skill in and of itself, unique to its genre, and even Tarkov has shown that beyond memorizing spawns and geometry that turning each pile of seemingly-random stuff into a parkour playground is a yet another skill you'll find if you choose to dig your teeth in.
 
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Professor Donger said:
It's why people bitching that "Marathon only has 4 maps" irritate me. There are things to dislike about this game but the small map pool isn't one of them. The entire point of an extraction shooter is to play on the same maps and learn them to the point of mastery.
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It launched with 3 maps that all suck cock. The maps in arc raiders are dense and varied enough that they still feel fresh after 50+ hours.
 
creaturestorm said:
Yes, for an arena shooter.

Extraction shooter maps are more like zones in an MMO. It's the container for quests, enemies, loot, story events, and of course pvp. It's more than just Angles and geometry, there systems layered on top of it that extend into the next match a player queues for.

Tarkov had a problem of maps giving too much loot or not enough or too many boss spawns or not enough. Completely fucking up the meta and health of the game. It's not just one off death matchs, everything bleeds into everything else. There is a greater eco system.
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Yeah I added an edit to my post agreeing while you were typing this I bet :story:
 
JohnWick said:
It launched with 3 maps that all suck cock. The maps in arc raiders are dense and varied enough that they still feel fresh after 50+ hours.
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They really aren't all that dense. At least from what I played. The first map in Arc Raiders that you go on feels about as big as the first one in Marathon.
 
Professor Donger said:
They really aren't all that dense. At least from what I played. The first map in Arc Raiders that you go on feels about as big as the first one in Marathon.
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The density I'm referring to has less to do with map size and everything to do with the gameplay, loot and architecture within the map. If your map feels like a vast empty shit hole its a bad map.
 
JohnWick said:
The density I'm referring to has less to do with map size and everything to do with the gameplay, loot and architecture within the map. If your map feels like a vast empty shit hole its a bad map.
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And so far none of the maps in Marathon feel like empty shit holes? Every point of interest has something to do, enemies to fight and loot to grab. There are locked doors and consoles to mess with in a lot of them and they even have public event style things like Arc Raiders does.

Arc Raiders from what I played had an issue of the map having a lot of pois but not a whole lot of stuff in those pois to interact with.
 
Picked this up because it looked interesting. Used to be pretty into Escape from Tarkov, was good at it and regularly ran "endgame" content there. Maybe it's my prior experience but the game has felt somewhat boring. Most of the players I've ran into are braindead, they're either too aggressive or clueless for pvp like this.

How has everyone felt about the PVP in this? It's been somewhat unfulfilling for me. The game doesn't quite seem like it knows what it wants to be extraction shooter wise.

I think my experience with it can be crystalized into a rook run I did on outpost. Found two other rooks, did prox and asked if they were friendly, they said they were. UESC started shooting at us, one of them tried to stab me during the chaos of that, I downed him with a WSTR. He just started calling me a nigger over prox mic and the other rook just magdumped till he was dead. The other rook and I extracted without having to communicate too much.

That specific encounter got me wondering if this is a genre that anyone actually likes as a whole. Because in every extraction shooter I've put time into, most of the playerbases seem like they're there for reasons other than the fact that it's an extraction shooter.
 
Kris said:
Picked this up because it looked interesting. Used to be pretty into Escape from Tarkov, was good at it and regularly ran "endgame" content there. Maybe it's my prior experience but the game has felt somewhat boring. Most of the players I've ran into are braindead, they're either too aggressive or clueless for pvp like this.

How has everyone felt about the PVP in this? It's been somewhat unfulfilling for me. The game doesn't quite seem like it knows what it wants to be extraction shooter wise.

I think my experience with it can be crystalized into a rook run I did on outpost. Found two other rooks, did prox and asked if they were friendly, they said they were. UESC started shooting at us, one of them tried to stab me during the chaos of that, I downed him with a WSTR. He just started calling me a nigger over prox mic and the other rook just magdumped till he was dead. The other rook and I extracted without having to communicate too much.

That specific encounter got me wondering if this is a genre that anyone actually likes as a whole. Because in every extraction shooter I've put time into, most of the playerbases seem like they're there for reasons other than the fact that it's an extraction shooter.
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the fun is the risk, simple as, you are risking what you bring in, so it has actual value, this isn't true in any other shooter.
 
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